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QB Russell Wilson, PIT (5 Viewers)
- Thread starter ImTheScientist
- Start date
ImTheScientist
Footballguy
Yup. I live ~20 min from VMAC.http://www.seahawks.com/team/facilities/vmac.html <-------- vmac
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werdnoynek
Footballguy
true, i am assuming. however, it's hard not to considering we're talking about competative people, playing a competative sport (many for most of their lives), for a self described openly competative team, in the competative NFL... i think we get the point. if they don't want competition, they shouldn't and likely wouldn't be where they are today.
werdnoynek
Footballguy
abe, how many leagues do you own flynn in?
Crazysight
Footballguy
If he keeps it up against the starters I'm gonna be on board this train. I have a feeling he will.
bonesman
Footballguy
Well here's your problem.
Abraham
Footballguy
One. He's my 3rd qb in a 24 team dynasty best ball. Brady is my starter so I'm not all that wedded to Flynn. I just wonder how it is that a guy who has done very little wrong (visibly) is being cast aside so quickly.
mad sweeney
Footballguy
I don't see what that has to do with your comment about the locker room.true, i am assuming. however, it's hard not to considering we're talking about competative people, playing a competative sport (many for most of their lives), for a self described openly competative team, in the competative NFL... i think we get the point. if they don't want competition, they shouldn't and likely wouldn't be where they are today.
mad sweeney
Footballguy
Again, the visibly part is key. The minute amount we've seen of Wilson is awesome but it's with and against a completely different skill set of players. No one on this board or in the media have seen anywhere near enough of Wilson with and against first teamers to justify exhorting their opinion over Carroll's.
Hooper31
Footballguy
I'm guessing you know the answer to this.If you thought Wilson gave your team a better chance to win games, would you be starting Flynn?
werdnoynek
Footballguy
my logic in order:1. players like competition.2. coach says open competition.3. players compete.4. best player wins and gets the job.5. players like coach because best player wins and gets the job and he does what he says.I don't see what that has to do with your comment about the locker room.true, i am assuming. however, it's hard not to considering we're talking about competative people, playing a competative sport (many for most of their lives), for a self described openly competative team, in the competative NFL... i think we get the point. if they don't want competition, they shouldn't and likely wouldn't be where they are today.
werdnoynek
Footballguy
beat me to it.
cr8f
Footballguy
This is an interesting story to watch. If he does get the job I see someone interviewing Flutie and asking if he really had a chance.
If Wilson does well maybe they'll give Flynn a shot playing all out(his plays have been conservative) to see how he does with the 1's in the last game.
Wilson has been more exciting to watch but they haven't given Flynn many dynamic plays either.
Wilson hasn't even played the game yet. Is he being cast aside?
If Wilson does well maybe they'll give Flynn a shot playing all out(his plays have been conservative) to see how he does with the 1's in the last game.
Wilson has been more exciting to watch but they haven't given Flynn many dynamic plays either.
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Abraham
Footballguy
Of course not. The player that helps you win more should play. My view is that we dont yet have enough evidence to know that Wilson is the better choice. Its not like he's competing with Kevin kolb (who i have in the same ledgue) here. Flynn has not been bad that we have seen. My feeling is that if Flynn were bad in practice then Jackson would be the guy Wilson were overtaking. Regardless, it is good that Wilson is getting a start. I expect Tennessee to blitz the heck out of him as they have been using their front seven depth all through camp to bang on the passer. It should be a real test for Wilson and despite my owning Flynn I am excited to see what happens.
cr8f
Footballguy
mad sweeney
Footballguy
Where's the part where if Flynn starts then the competition is proved false and he loses the locker room?my logic in order:1. players like competition.2. coach says open competition.3. players compete.4. best player wins and gets the job.5. players like coach because best player wins and gets the job and he does what he says.I don't see what that has to do with your comment about the locker room.true, i am assuming. however, it's hard not to considering we're talking about competative people, playing a competative sport (many for most of their lives), for a self described openly competative team, in the competative NFL... i think we get the point. if they don't want competition, they shouldn't and likely wouldn't be where they are today.
Crazysight
Footballguy
Wilson has a better arm than Flutie ever did, who had no better than an average arm, though Flutie was definitely a gamer all the same. Flutie was pretty quick as well, but i doubt he was as fast as Wilson.
bonesman
Footballguy
Kansas City?
werdnoynek
Footballguy
good posting. as wisco homer (pack & badger fan) i'm rooting for both of them. when seattle drafted wilson, i honestly didn't think there would be much of a competition this soon. i think flynn will be a successful QB in the league, but i think that wilson is going to be a better QB when it is all said and done. in my eyes, he can make all the throws flynn can but can also make plays with his legs. flynn may know more of the nuances of the NFL and the QB position at this level, but i think wilson is smart enough to pick it up on the go if he has to.
werdnoynek
Footballguy
there's that possiblity, but i was talking about wilson, not flynn. my original post started with - if wilson ends up winning the job...Where's the part where if Flynn starts then the competition is proved false and he loses the locker room?my logic in order:1. players like competition.2. coach says open competition.3. players compete.4. best player wins and gets the job.5. players like coach because best player wins and gets the job and he does what he says.I don't see what that has to do with your comment about the locker room.true, i am assuming. however, it's hard not to considering we're talking about competative people, playing a competative sport (many for most of their lives), for a self described openly competative team, in the competative NFL... i think we get the point. if they don't want competition, they shouldn't and likely wouldn't be where they are today.
Hooper31
Footballguy
Verbatim from Pete Carroll. This is why Wilson is starting this Friday.
Abraham
Footballguy
He said Wilson is starting because he has been the better qb through camp? I missed that . All I saw was him saying both players have been good and he is treating this like a competition even of outsiders don't understand it. Yes, kc.
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Sabertooth
Footballguy
I have a 10 team keeper coming up in an hour. This is a 2QB league. I will post where he went.
ImTheScientist
Footballguy
Ya, ummm..... that game was a week ago bro.
Hooper31
Footballguy
He has said several times that they don't have enough information to make a decision yet. They are gathering information. They don't have enough evidence.He said Wilson is starting because he has been the better qb through camp? I missed that . All I saw was him saying both players have been good and he is treating this like a competition even of outsiders don't understand it. Yes, kc.
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Yenrub
Footballguy
It seems like you are looking for some type of boogie man or just fishingNo one is talking about Cousins vs. RG3 because the Redskins have made it clear from the moment they traded all those draft picks that RG3 was going to be the face of their franchise. The Redskins never gave anyone the illusion that they were going to have an open QB competition. Fantasy wise that makes Cousins virtually irrelevant for the 2012 season, dynasty wise he probably a good stash option.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Seattle should have been on Hard Knocks, would have been a lot more interesting.
mad sweeney
Footballguy
Not sure what I'm replying to then. I thought there was a part in there about Pete losing the locker room if he didn't start Wilson. Must've misread or something from a different post. Sorry.there's that possiblity, but i was talking about wilson, not flynn. my original post started with - if wilson ends up winning the job...Where's the part where if Flynn starts then the competition is proved false and he loses the locker room?my logic in order:1. players like competition.2. coach says open competition.3. players compete.4. best player wins and gets the job.5. players like coach because best player wins and gets the job and he does what he says.I don't see what that has to do with your comment about the locker room.true, i am assuming. however, it's hard not to considering we're talking about competative people, playing a competative sport (many for most of their lives), for a self described openly competative team, in the competative NFL... i think we get the point. if they don't want competition, they shouldn't and likely wouldn't be where they are today.
mad sweeney
Footballguy
They asked. Carroll said no.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Is Wilson the week 1 starter?
werdnoynek
Footballguy
solorca
Footballguy
Nah, I have Ryan and Locker already. I doubt I would NEED Wilson, but I think he's an interesting pick that could pay off (it's a two person keeper league) if he happens to get the start. I have Mcfadden, Murray, Lynch, Rodgers at RB and Marshall, Harvin, Nicks, Stevie at WR where we only start 2/2 and a flex...so I have the depth to take a shot on the guy.It's unlikely he wins the job, but if he does, he could be a valuable trade piece. Honestly, I doubt anyone would grab Hillman off the wire anyway, and if they do, I'll just pick up Turbin instead, who is also available.did you only have 1 QB?
Doug Flutie had a cannon for an arm. The only knock on him, like Wilson, was his height. Off topic, he was also an incredible all around athlete- capable of doing monster slam dunks in basketball.
I understand the Redskins gave up the farm and have to be committed to RGIII. My point was the way the preseason performances of Cousins and Wilson are being interpreted. Whether either of them should have a chance to start or not, they have both been playing against backup players.
I understand the Redskins gave up the farm and have to be committed to RGIII. My point was the way the preseason performances of Cousins and Wilson are being interpreted. Whether either of them should have a chance to start or not, they have both been playing against backup players.
Tau837
Footballguy
Tau837
Footballguy
With all due respect, this is not my recollection. I recall Wilson saying repeatedly that his dream was to have opportunities to play professionally in both sports. Most people felt all along that his best chance was in baseball, but that doesn't mean that's what his focus was.I agree that if he played well in minor league baseball during the spring and summer before his year at Wisconsin, he might have taken a different path. But that has more to do with circumstances. It was not expected that the Rockies would take him in the 4th round the year they did. That created a circumstance where his professional baseball opportunity occurred a year before his professional football opportunity. Had he taken off in baseball, who knows?That said, there is no question that he has always been a much better football player than baseball player.
Tau837
Footballguy
Tau837
Footballguy
This is an interesting choice of words. Wilson has physical tools and no personal red flags... beyond no red flags, he is off the charts on the personal/intangibles/off field side of things. Yet you seem down on him. How do you reconcile this?Or does a couple inches of height trump all other physical tools for you?
urbanhack
Fight The Power!
omally
Footballguy
I remember him always being wishy washy about a career in football, but he was firm about wanting a career as a professional baseball player, and I felt he was more committed to following the baseball path while at State. I think he figured out once he played in the minor league that he was better suited for football. His athletic talents always reflected more in football, but I guess he had to not do so great in the minors to realize that. Everything worked itself out, and I look forward to him doing well in the NFL. It's nice too that TJ Graham is getting some buzz in Buffalo.
JetMaxx
Footballguy
Thanks to ITS for posting the highlights of Wilson vs Denver. What impressed me the most was that he was under duress more often than not but looked to throw as he avoided the rush rather than just pulling the ball down and taking off, an option that his athletic ability would easily afford him. For a rookie QB with legit running ability, that tells me volumes. He is a passer first, runner second...a nuance that is nearly impossible to teach at the highest level.
Downside is that he missed a few deep throws that were there. I would have loved to see him hit the one long pass to the go WR on the right side on the formation. The WR slowed slightly but Wilson didn't put into the window. However, in this instance and others, every pass that missed is nearly there, just a yd or so off. It really is amazing. I would love to see the coaches tape because it seems like he doesn't make a bad read the entire time.
Everyone is hanging on Wilson's performance as a starter, and rightly so. It's a stage. Pressure is on. Can he handle it? I admire Carroll for giving him the chance despite the FA signing of Flynn.
Downside is that he missed a few deep throws that were there. I would have loved to see him hit the one long pass to the go WR on the right side on the formation. The WR slowed slightly but Wilson didn't put into the window. However, in this instance and others, every pass that missed is nearly there, just a yd or so off. It really is amazing. I would love to see the coaches tape because it seems like he doesn't make a bad read the entire time.
Everyone is hanging on Wilson's performance as a starter, and rightly so. It's a stage. Pressure is on. Can he handle it? I admire Carroll for giving him the chance despite the FA signing of Flynn.
Abraham
Footballguy
It's interesting you think I am down on Wilson. I dont recall ever saying anything negative about him other than I'd like I see him do a few things I had not yet seen and that I don't believe Seattle is a great environment for development and fantasy production. I've certainly never said anything about his height. That does bring up an interesting point. Based on this thread you would think that Wilson belonged in the conversation with luck and griffin. The consensus seems to be that his height made his draft stock drop. But drew brees height made him drop as well...to the top of the second round. There is obviously something else at play with Wilson being passed over 74 times during the draft other that his height. What was it?Im not asking as if draft spot is a validation of talent. I'm genuinely curious as to why such an exciting and well rounded player fell.
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Hooper31
Footballguy
Other than Scientist (who is not the most objective fan) I don't see this argument being made. Yes, there are some that are high on him, but I don't see it as a consensus that he belonged in that conversation.
It may very well be that Wilson wasn't worthy of a higher pick. Or perhaps many teams missed out on a solid player.
Hey Nostradamus!
Footballguy
An inch and a half shorter, a round and a half later?Given the wide consensus that he would have been top 10 if he was 6'2", I don't really know what else it would be. Brees was short, but not completely-unheard-of short. At 5' 10 5/8", Wilson (if he succeeds as a starting QB) really would be breaking the conventional wisdom.
Tau837
Footballguy
I think the simple answer is bias due to his height. Here is an old post I made on Wilson:
I think the bolded is really the issue. The community in general chose to lump him into the "too short to succeed" category rather than the "we've never seen a player like this and better think carefully about rushing to judgment" category.You ask about Brees vs. Wilson. Brees is listed at 6'0". Same for Vick. Wilson is listed as 5'11", but that's rounding... he's more like 5'10 3/4" or something like that. I literally believe it is a difference of about 2 inches in height that made the difference between Wilson being a top 10 pick and being picked where he was.
ImTheScientist
Footballguy
It was only his height .... And he should be and if starts will be in the same conversation with luck and rg3. If he starts week 1 he will win ROY.
ImTheScientist
Footballguy
Not yet.
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