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***Russell Wilson Bandwagon***

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2 hours ago, stlrams said:

So 8 of 10 teams didn't make the playoffs last year..  Guess Seattle isn't interested in making playoffs any time soon..

Just looking at the 35 highest paid QBs (tossing out the 6th round rookies and recycled back-ups), the bottom 10 in salary were

Mahomes, Watson, Rosen, Daniels, Allen, Fitz, Tyrod, Wentz, Winston, Mariotta...so I see 3 teams that made the playoffs from that group and 1 of those teams was actually led by their more expensive back-up. 

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3 hours ago, stlrams said:

So 8 of 10 teams didn't make the playoffs last year..  Guess Seattle isn't interested in making playoffs any time soon..

It's the nature of the salary cap and the value of the QB. Seattle won their SB with a cheap Wilson and a great D. Their only hope now is drafting incredibly well because they, like a few other teams, paid the QB to stay and wont be able to afford to pay as many other top players. CLE & KC are in the same boat once their QBs get to their next contract.

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22 minutes ago, lod001 said:

It's the nature of the salary cap and the value of the QB. Seattle won their SB with a cheap Wilson and a great D. Their only hope now is drafting incredibly well because they, like a few other teams, paid the QB to stay and wont be able to afford to pay as many other top players. CLE & KC are in the same boat once their QBs get to their next contract.

It was good drafting more than anything. From 2009-2012, Seattle drafted 8 Pro Bowlers: QB, LT, C, 2 Safeties, 2 LBs, CB. Since that 2012 draft when they took Wilson, they have drafted 2 Pro Bowlers: KR and a Punter. 

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Add .....highest paid player in the NFL to his already long list of accomplishments. What an amazing talent.

And he's done it without that really stud WR, no Rice, Moss, Julio, Antonio, etc etc.

Comparing his first seven seasons to Brady, Brees, Peyton, Rodgers, we see just how great he's been.

Do wonder if that bit about the wife wanting to live in NY was a ploy, hmmm?

Edited by ZenoRazon
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4 hours ago, fruity pebbles said:

What were they supposed to do? Cause they weren’t sniffing the playoffs without him either. To be fair, GB is a perennial  playoff team, Atl just came off a Superbowl, Jimmy got hurt and half those QBs are just plain bad.

My point is its very difficult to build a winning team when you tie up a lot cap money in one player.  To be fair, GB is a terrible team excluding Rogers.  Just look a their record when he is hurt...

Edited by stlrams

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2 hours ago, lod001 said:

It's the nature of the salary cap and the value of the QB. Seattle won their SB with a cheap Wilson and a great D. Their only hope now is drafting incredibly well because they, like a few other teams, paid the QB to stay and wont be able to afford to pay as many other top players. CLE & KC are in the same boat once their QBs get to their next contract.

Knowing this, would you consider trading him and starting over?

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2 hours ago, Andy Dufresne said:

As one of the top performers in one of the world's top businesses, he's still probably underpaid.

Pretty sure he is happy though.  Still have to pay other players and stay under cap.

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7 minutes ago, stlrams said:

My point is its very difficult to build a winning team when you tie up a lot cap money in one player.  To be fair, GB is a terrible team excluding Rogers.  Just look a their record when he is hurt...

So be clear about what you think Seattle should have done:

  1. This deal.
  2. Trade him, knowing they almost certainly could not get back true value and knowing this means starting over at QB (and with what?).
  3. Extend this decision point by 1-4 seasons by having him play out this season ($25.3M cap hit), then franchising him 0-3 times, understanding that giving him another deal later would require a bigger deal due to QB market inflation.

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3 hours ago, ZenoRazon said:

Add .....highest paid player in the NFL to his already long list of accomplishments. What an amazing talent.

And he's done it without that really stud WR, no Rice, Moss, Julio, Antonio, etc etc.

Comparing his first seven seasons to Brady, Brees, Peyton, Rodgers, we see just how great he's been.

Do wonder if that bit about the wife wanting to live in NY was a ploy, hmmm?

He turned Doug Baldwin into a Pro Bowler. He’s had some of the worst all around offensive talent around him the last few years. I think he’s probably the best QB in the NFL right now and it’s a shame we might never seen him in his prime with an offense that just lets him loose. He’s going to be the highest paid player in the NFL this year and lead the league in handoffs.

 

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11 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

He turned Doug Baldwin into a Pro Bowler. He’s had some of the worst all around offensive talent around him the last few years. I think he’s probably the best QB in the NFL right now and it’s a shame we might never seen him in his prime with an offense that just lets him loose. He’s going to be the highest paid player in the NFL this year and lead the league in handoffs.

 

To do what he's done in that system with the talent he hasn't had is really amazing.  NOBODY....else could have done what he did.

I don't think people really get how HISTORICALLY great he has been in his seven seasons. The guy owns a number of NFL records, many of them were firsts.

He is the best passer/runner/leader we have seen. His numbers totally dwarf all the old legends (after seven seasons) but......different game back then....but he still has the far superior numbers. He's out played all these current guys at the same stage of the career. And, he walked right in and took over.

I totally agree with you, I also think Wilson is the best QB in the NFL right now today.

Edited by ZenoRazon
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1 hour ago, Just Win Baby said:

So be clear about what you think Seattle should have done:

  1. This deal.
  2. Trade him, knowing they almost certainly could not get back true value and knowing this means starting over at QB (and with what?).
  3. Extend this decision point by 1-4 seasons by having him play out this season ($25.3M cap hit), then franchising him 0-3 times, understanding that giving him another deal later would require a bigger deal due to QB market inflation.

Either 2 or 3 will work out better then the route they took imo.  Especially now that it appears Seattle offense is a run first thus devaluing the qb position. 

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6 hours ago, Just Win Baby said:

So be clear about what you think Seattle should have done:

  1. This deal.
  2. Trade him, knowing they almost certainly could not get back true value and knowing this means starting over at QB (and with what?).
  3. Extend this decision point by 1-4 seasons by having him play out this season ($25.3M cap hit), then franchising him 0-3 times, understanding that giving him another deal later would require a bigger deal due to QB market inflation.

When you have a great Hall of Fame to be QB you do all you can to make him happy, the Seahawks did the right thing, so....1.

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9 hours ago, ZenoRazon said:
16 hours ago, Just Win Baby said:

So be clear about what you think Seattle should have done:

  1. This deal.
  2. Trade him, knowing they almost certainly could not get back true value and knowing this means starting over at QB (and with what?).
  3. Extend this decision point by 1-4 seasons by having him play out this season ($25.3M cap hit), then franchising him 0-3 times, understanding that giving him another deal later would require a bigger deal due to QB market inflation.

When you have a great Hall of Fame to be QB you do all you can to make him happy, the Seahawks did the right thing, so....1.

I agree. IMO the posters saying silly stuff like "Guess Seattle isn't interested in making playoffs any time soon" are showing ignorance about the NFL QB market/situation.

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So I've read that the deal is structured something like this:

  • $65M signing bonus (guaranteed)
  • 2019 salary $5M (guaranteed) = 2019 cap hit $18M - reduced 2019 cap hit by $7.3M
  • 2020 salary $18M (guaranteed) = 2020 cap hit $31M - approximately equal to the 2020 QB franchise tag
  • 2021 salary $19M (guaranteed) = 2021 cap hit $32M - less than Wilson's 2021 QB franchise tag would have been on a second consecutive tag
  • That leaves $50M unaccounted for, so possibly something like:
    • 2022 salary + roster bonus = $23M = 2022 cap hit of $36M - considerably less than Wilson's 2022 QB franchise tag would have been on a third consecutive tag
    • 2023 salary + roster bonus = $27M = 2023 cap hit of $40M - could trade/release him prior to this season with $13M in dead money in 2023

IMO this looks like a good deal for Seattle, all things considered:

  • The team has Wilson - the best QB in franchise history and the face of the franchise - under contract through 2023. He will be 35 at the end of that season, so they have him under contract for the majority of his prime.
  • The team gets immediate cap relief for 2019.
  • His cap hits in 2019-2021 are collectively lower than if they allowed him to play out his original contract this year and then franchised him in 2020 and 2021.
  • This preserves the franchise tag for the team to use on other players if desired from 2020-2022.
  • The team can move on for a relatively low dead money hit before 2023 if desired ($13M will be a lower percentage of the cap by then). Or they can extend him again before that season to possibly reduce his $40M cap hit.
  • The only season that might be particularly tough under this contract is 2022. But the QB market will also be reset at a higher level by then, and I predict that cap hit will not be out of line with upper tier QBs by that time.

:thumbup: 

Edited by Just Win Baby
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15 minutes ago, Just Win Baby said:

So I've read that the deal is structured something like this:

  • $65M signing bonus (guaranteed)
  • 2019 salary $5M (guaranteed) = 2019 cap hit $18M - reduced 2019 cap hit by $7.3M
  • 2020 salary $18M (guaranteed) = 2020 cap hit $31M - approximately equal to the 2020 QB franchise tag
  • 2021 salary $19M (guaranteed) = 2021 cap hit $32M - less than Wilson's 2021 QB franchise tag would have been on a second consecutive tag
  • That leaves $50M unaccounted for, so possibly something like:
    • 2022 salary + roster bonus = $23M = 2022 cap hit of $36M - considerably less than Wilson's 2022 QB franchise tag would have been on a third consecutive tag
    • 2023 salary + roster bonus = $27M = 2023 cap hit of $40M - could trade/release him prior to this season with $13M in dead money in 2023

IMO this looks like a good deal for Seattle, all things considered:

  • The team has Wilson - the best QB in franchise history and the face of the franchise - under contract through 2023. He will be 35 at the end of that season, so they have him under contract for the majority of his prime.
  • The team gets immediate cap relief for 2019.
  • His cap hits in 2019-2021 are collectively lower than if they allowed him to play out his original contract this year and then franchised him in 2020 and 2021.
  • This preserves the franchise tag for the team to use on other players if desired from 2020-2022.
  • The team can move on for a relatively low dead money hit before 2023 if desired ($13M will be a lower percentage of the cap by then). Or they can extend him again before that season to possibly reduce his $40M cap hit.
  • The only season that might be particularly tough under this contract is 2022. But the QB market will also be reset at a higher level by then, and I predict that cap hit will not be out of line with upper tier QBs by that time.

:thumbup: 

He won't be in the top half of the QBs salary wise by then.  I actually think 19 and 20 will be the tough years and then cap growth and other QBs cashing in thins will favor Seattle after that.

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57 minutes ago, BassNBrew said:

He won't be in the top half of the QBs salary wise by then.  I actually think 19 and 20 will be the tough years and then cap growth and other QBs cashing in thins will favor Seattle after that.

2019 cannot really be viewed as a tough year... this contract lowered his 2019 cap hit by $7.3M... he is now set to have around the #18 cap hit at QB in 2019... and that is before any other QB contract changes are put in place this offseason.

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2 hours ago, Just Win Baby said:

2019 cannot really be viewed as a tough year... this contract lowered his 2019 cap hit by $7.3M... he is now set to have around the #18 cap hit at QB in 2019... and that is before any other QB contract changes are put in place this offseason.

You are correct. I Meant 20 and 21

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On ‎4‎/‎16‎/‎2019 at 2:56 PM, stlrams said:

Knowing this, would you consider trading him and starting over?

It's a tough call. It's really sad for the game that it's now like this. Your window of opportunity is now predicated on drafting a real franchise QB and hoping to win I all before you have to pay him. It's not on great drafting over a span of years anymore. Another thing that has hurt is ham & egger QBs getting paid big $ and driving up the price of the better ones. Flacco.

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While I recognize that the top players gotta get their money, I certainly won't feel sorry for Wilson when he's frequently hit/sacked behind a bargain basement OL while trying to find open WR's who the 'hawks can't afford to pay...

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On 4/17/2019 at 8:50 AM, Just Win Baby said:

So I've read that the deal is structured something like this:

  • $65M signing bonus (guaranteed)
  • 2019 salary $5M (guaranteed) = 2019 cap hit $18M - reduced 2019 cap hit by $7.3M
  • 2020 salary $18M (guaranteed) = 2020 cap hit $31M - approximately equal to the 2020 QB franchise tag
  • 2021 salary $19M (guaranteed) = 2021 cap hit $32M - less than Wilson's 2021 QB franchise tag would have been on a second consecutive tag
  • That leaves $50M unaccounted for, so possibly something like:
    • 2022 salary + roster bonus = $23M = 2022 cap hit of $36M - considerably less than Wilson's 2022 QB franchise tag would have been on a third consecutive tag
    • 2023 salary + roster bonus = $27M = 2023 cap hit of $40M - could trade/release him prior to this season with $13M in dead money in 2023

IMO this looks like a good deal for Seattle, all things considered:

  • The team has Wilson - the best QB in franchise history and the face of the franchise - under contract through 2023. He will be 35 at the end of that season, so they have him under contract for the majority of his prime.
  • The team gets immediate cap relief for 2019.
  • His cap hits in 2019-2021 are collectively lower than if they allowed him to play out his original contract this year and then franchised him in 2020 and 2021.
  • This preserves the franchise tag for the team to use on other players if desired from 2020-2022.
  • The team can move on for a relatively low dead money hit before 2023 if desired ($13M will be a lower percentage of the cap by then). Or they can extend him again before that season to possibly reduce his $40M cap hit.
  • The only season that might be particularly tough under this contract is 2022. But the QB market will also be reset at a higher level by then, and I predict that cap hit will not be out of line with upper tier QBs by that time.

:thumbup: 

Pretty close on the numbers above. Forgot that 2019 will include the remainder of his previous signing bonus plus the remainder of previous restructuring, where he converted salary to bonus to pro-rate it. That stuff totals to $8.2M in 2019, so his 2019 cap hit is $26.2M. 2020 and 2021 are as above. 2022 is $1M more and 2023 is $1M less.

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A lot of people overlook this guy when discussing the elite QBs in the league. Honestly, the dude might have better arm talent than Tom Brady. It for sure seems to be better than Rivers and Ryan, and probably even Big Ben at this point since Ben is a bit careless. Honestly, if everyone is at their best, then maybe only Aaron Rodgers have more arm talent than Russ.

Edited by the lone star

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