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Matt Waldman

Josh Gordon Everything Thread

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I'm thinking to a team that is in total rebuild mode I should be able to get a WR2 for him. I'm probably over valuing him though. I tend to do that to my players. I see him as a WR2 with WR1 upside in 2016.

Never say never, doesn't hurt to shop but IMO that would be a tough sell. Good Luck!

I have asked 4 teams in my league that are basically out of it for this year about Gordon. Zero interest. Literally zero. They dont even want to use a roster spot 20 per team, 12 team league) on him.

I've been trying to get Gordon on both a contender and a retooling team with zero luck. Both 16tm leagues

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I've been trying to get Gordon on both a contender and a retooling team with zero luck. Both 16tm leagues

This is how I imagine the market will be.. The people still holding will be dug in after holding for so long, and people looking to acquire will be wanting him for next to nothing.

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I've been holding. I got offered Eric Decker last week and decided to turn it down. I think its a fair but I'd rather hold onto the upside/age of J Gordon. 28yr old wr3's are replaceable, young wr1's not so replaceable.

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I've been trying to get Gordon on both a contender and a retooling team with zero luck. Both 16tm leagues

This is how I imagine the market will be.. The people still holding will be dug in after holding for so long, and people looking to acquire will be wanting him for next to nothing.

Bought him for Rueben Randle in one league, which was a price I was easily willing to pay.

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No way I trade him. Holding til the end now. He'll either become a star or flame out. I see no middle ground so I'll hold for the upside.

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I've been trying to get Gordon on both a contender and a retooling team with zero luck. Both 16tm leagues

This is how I imagine the market will be.. The people still holding will be dug in after holding for so long, and people looking to acquire will be wanting him for next to nothing.

Exactly this. The owner holding Gordon in most leagues is, after so much drama and value fluctuation, the one who is least risk-averse in that particular league. No reason at all to dump him for pennies now -- nothing has changed for months and nothing will change until TC opens next year -- barring another (+) test or an arrest, of course.

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I drafted Cooper this year. Have K.Benjamin back and heals and Gordon comes back with a chip on his shoulder. Wow, could be an interesting core of receivers next year.?

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Dropped last week in my 10tm 25 roster spots league. I'm picking him up. Seems like there is no consensus on his value. If you can get him cheap, buy!

Edited by Detroit Revival

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Does anybody know what the process is if/when he is reinstated? Is it probationary again, or is he reinstated w/o any conditions? I don't mean a 3rd strike rule, but rather, is he going to be restricted from drinking? (stupid rule by the way)

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Rotoworld:

According to the Cleveland Plain Dealer, "sources close to the situation" believe new Browns coach Hue Jackson "is just the man to get the most out of" suspended WR Josh Gordon.

A former wide receivers coach, Jackson got the best out of Chad Johnson and T.J. Houshmandzadeh before coaxing career years out of Darrius Heyward-Bey and Denarius Moore in Oakland. In his return to Cincinnati, Jackson coached A.J. Green to an 80.6 yards-per-game average and 16 touchdowns in two seasons. We don't doubt Jackson will do his part. It's up to Gordon to do his.
Jan 13 - 10:05 PM

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Rotoworld:

According to the Cleveland Plain Dealer, "sources close to the situation" believe new Browns coach Hue Jackson "is just the man to get the most out of" suspended WR Josh Gordon.

A former wide receivers coach, Jackson got the best out of Chad Johnson and T.J. Houshmandzadeh before coaxing career years out of Darrius Heyward-Bey and Denarius Moore in Oakland. In his return to Cincinnati, Jackson coached A.J. Green to an 80.6 yards-per-game average and 16 touchdowns in two seasons. We don't doubt Jackson will do his part. It's up to Gordon to do his.
Jan 13 - 10:05 PM

Good job Hue on the bolded, not many coaches could have accomplished that.

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Rotoworld:

According to the Cleveland Plain Dealer, "sources close to the situation" believe new Browns coach Hue Jackson "is just the man to get the most out of" suspended WR Josh Gordon.

A former wide receivers coach, Jackson got the best out of Chad Johnson and T.J. Houshmandzadeh before coaxing career years out of Darrius Heyward-Bey and Denarius Moore in Oakland. In his return to Cincinnati, Jackson coached A.J. Green to an 80.6 yards-per-game average and 16 touchdowns in two seasons. We don't doubt Jackson will do his part. It's up to Gordon to do his.
Jan 13 - 10:05 PM

Good job Hue on the bolded, not many coaches could have accomplished that.

And the "career year" bar on DHB and Denarius Moore was set pretty low.

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so did everyone give up on the "Josh Gordon in 2015" thread?

keep holding your breath, guys.

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Seems odd to get excited about him at this point without any clue who may be trying to throw him the ball.

Can't be worse than Campbell and Weeden in 2013 when he had 87-1646-9. I hope not anyway

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I have held this young man through all of his transgressions. Gave him a place to stay while the rest of the fantasy world gave up on him. Now he is all grow'd up and ready to take care of his papa. Many have tried to buy low. Many will try to buy high. The true believers will be rewarded for their faith. The doubters and pessimists will look on with envy and hate. Sold all of my 2016 first round draft picks so I could corner the 2017 market. Why? Because I have the best prospect coming out. The return of Josh Gordon. Keep the faith Soulfly. Many of us have been there from the beginning.

Edited by georg013

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so did everyone give up on the "Josh Gordon in 2015" thread?

keep holding your breath, guys.

Well it is 2016 after all...

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Last offseason I gave up a future 2nd (pick 24 this year) to get him, and have held on to him this whole time. The investment ended up being more than just pick 24 since the FFPC has 20 man rosters, so I was basically at 19 all year while everyone else had that 20th to work with for waivers and whatnot.

Either way, still happy I held on, but I will most certainly be looking to trade him if/when he becomes a hot commodity again. When will that be? When will the right time to sell be? Probably if he is able to get reinstated before the season and puts up a good game or two.

At that point the selling begins. I am not overly optimistic I find a taker anywhere near a "stud" price though. Unfortunately Soulfly isn't in my league.

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He is eligible for reinstatement in February.

Been clean from weed for 2+yrs, and has obviously pissed clean for booze since the last time too. Give me ONE reason he wont be instantly reinstated?

He is in phenomenal shape, has been supportive of his team, and has the agent of all agents doing his PR work behind the scenes.

Barring another screw-up, his instant reinstatement is a formality.

Hue + Goff tossing the ball ... Oooo lawd.

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He is eligible for reinstatement in February.

Been clean from weed for 2+yrs, and has obviously pissed clean for booze since the last time too. Give me ONE reason he wont be instantly reinstated?

He is in phenomenal shape, has been supportive of his team, and has the agent of all agents doing his PR work behind the scenes.

Barring another screw-up, his instant reinstatement is a formality.

Hue + Goff tossing the ball ... Oooo lawd.

Umm, has anyone said he WON'T be reinstated right away (if he stays clean)?

Also, no idea why you are saying he is in phenomenal shape. Two reasons. One, how do you know? And two, being in shape isn't the same as football shape.

The "Barring another screw up" is being severely minimized in all your pom pom sessions.

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Probably if he is able to get reinstated before the season

He is eligible for reinstatement in February.

:no:

"being in shape isn't the same in being in football shape"

the guy is in shape, dont know how else you want me to put this to you. he will be reinstated in February. He will have 6 months to get into your beloved "football shape" if that makes you any happier.

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Im betting he dont get reinstated. Just a hunch

Does anyone know if he has stayed clean?

We already know the risk of losing his career isnt a reason for him to stop.

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Im betting he dont get reinstated. Just a hunch

Does anyone know if he has stayed clean?

We already know the risk of losing his career isnt a reason for him to stop.

I'd imagine if he had failed any tests, we'd know about that.

Unless he fails a test, I don't see how he wouldn't get reinstated (assuming he applies for reinstatement, which I'd guess he will).

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Im betting he dont get reinstated. Just a hunch

Does anyone know if he has stayed clean?

We already know the risk of losing his career isnt a reason for him to stop.

Under the drug/alcohol protocol's, I believe I remember hearing he is testing weekly, or something asinine.

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Im betting he dont get reinstated. Just a hunch

Does anyone know if he has stayed clean?

We already know the risk of losing his career isnt a reason for him to stop.

I'd imagine if he had failed any tests, we'd know about that.

Unless he fails a test, I don't see how he wouldn't get reinstated (assuming he applies for reinstatement, which I'd guess he will).

Blackmon didn't get reinstated. We don't have any idea what the criteria are for it. And if Gordon did fail a test, there wouldn't be any reason for the NFL to take action until the current suspension resolves. This book is hardly written.

He's got a ton of talent, no question. He's shows signs of being situation proof with his 2013 season. He's got a coach and presumably a shiny new 1.02 draft pick QB that should feed him the ball on a consistent basis. He has little true competition for the ball. But he's also in a zero tolerance scenario, with a miles-long history of not making the right decisions.

This is the definition of a risk/reward scenario. I'm treating this like I do a trip to Harrah's. I'll spend what I can afford to lose and hope for the best. If I don't hit fine, I can still pay the bills.

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Im betting he dont get reinstated. Just a hunch

Does anyone know if he has stayed clean?

We already know the risk of losing his career isnt a reason for him to stop.

I'd imagine if he had failed any tests, we'd know about that.

Unless he fails a test, I don't see how he wouldn't get reinstated (assuming he applies for reinstatement, which I'd guess he will).

Blackmon didn't get reinstated. We don't have any idea what the criteria are for it. And if Gordon did fail a test, there wouldn't be any reason for the NFL to take action until the current suspension resolves. This book is hardly written.

He's got a ton of talent, no question. He's shows signs of being situation proof with his 2013 season. He's got a coach and presumably a shiny new 1.02 draft pick QB that should feed him the ball on a consistent basis. He has little true competition for the ball. But he's also in a zero tolerance scenario, with a miles-long history of not making the right decisions.

This is the definition of a risk/reward scenario. I'm treating this like I do a trip to Harrah's. I'll spend what I can afford to lose and hope for the best. If I don't hit fine, I can still pay the bills.

We heard a lot of negative reports about Blackmon during his suspension: arrested for marijuana possession (that he pleaded NC to), another DUI in December, and multiple "sightings" and/or rumors of him being seen in bars during his suspension.

When he applied for reinstatement, he had the MJ charge on his record-it's no surprise that he didn't get reinstated.

I haven't heard anything negative with regards to Gordon; when he is able to apply for reinstatement, if he gets denied, we'll probably find out why, but I dont' think that is happening.

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I dont think Blackmon even applied or reinstatement... He has gone scary looney

He applied, and was denied, and it was BELIEVED to be due to a failed test, although he had pled NC to a MJ charge during his suspension, as well

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I am participating in a dynasty mock draft set up by thriftyrocker where Josh Gordon was drafted with the 35th overall pick. In the previous mock Gordon went at pick 66

That is a pretty big swing in draft position. I would feel a lot more comfortable taking a chance on Gordon in round five than I am at the end of round 3 where I think there are still some high quality options.

Projecting a best case scenario where Josh Gordon is reinstated does not have any further issues, becomes the featured WR for the Browns in 2016 and performs well for the next 3-5 years, how much are people expecting him to do in Hue Jacksons offense?

Most of the data for Josh Gordon is from 2013 where the Browns threw the ball 681 times with only 348 rushing attempts. Norv Turner did not have much else to work with besides Gordon and he averaged 11.4 targets per game in his 14 games that season.

The last two seasons of Hue Jackson as the OC

In 2015 the Bengals had 505 passing attempts 467 rushing attempts.

AJ Green was on pace for 144 targets 9 targets per game in 13 games.

In 2014 the Bengals had 503 passing attempts 492 rushing attempts.

AJ Green had 132 targets in 16 games. 8.25 per game. If Dalton did not miss games this may have been slightly higher and his numbers likely better in those games.

If the Browns only throw the ball around 500 times (following recent Bengals offense) and Josh Gordon has 20% to 30% of those targets, this would be a range of 100-125-150. Josh Gordon has a career catch rate of 53.3% this would be 53-67-80 receptions 795-1005-1200 yards 6-7TD

Something that concerns me is that Gordon did not play nearly as well in 2014 as he did in 2013 without Norv Turner. His yards per reception fell from being above 16 as a rookie and 2013 to 12.6 and there was no improvement in his catch rate.

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I believe we wouldnt know of a failed test until he applies for reinstatement and the judgement is revealed much like we found out about Blackmon.

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I believe we wouldnt know of a failed test until he applies for reinstatement and the judgement is revealed much like we found out about Blackmon.

Yeah but we do know that he hasn't had any issues with the law since mid-2014 so unlike Blackmon he at least has been smarter about that so far.

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I believe we wouldnt know of a failed test until he applies for reinstatement and the judgement is revealed much like we found out about Blackmon.

Yeah but we do know that he hasn't had any issues with the law since mid-2014 so unlike Blackmon he at least has been smarter about that so far.

Agree, so its still a gamble at this point. To be gone a year, it is never a given that a person will be reinstated.

Great talent, not so great noggin.

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I believe we wouldnt know of a failed test until he applies for reinstatement and the judgement is revealed much like we found out about Blackmon.

Yeah but we do know that he hasn't had any issues with the law since mid-2014 so unlike Blackmon he at least has been smarter about that so far.

Agree, so its still a gamble at this point. To be gone a year, it is never a given that a person will be reinstated.

Great talent, not so great noggin.

If it is true that his last suspension did come from having a beer on the team plane then I am inclined to side with Gordon on this one. I could be entirely wrong about this but I think he learned his lesson and understands that the NFL is his best opportunity for a life changing payday and is doing everything he can to try and earn that payday. What happens after he gets it is another story.

Edited by Chaka

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He is eligible for reinstatement in February.

Been clean from weed for 2+yrs, and has obviously pissed clean for booze since the last time too. Give me ONE reason he wont be instantly reinstated?

He is in phenomenal shape, has been supportive of his team, and has the agent of all agents doing his PR work behind the scenes.

Barring another screw-up, his instant reinstatement is a formality.

Hue + Goff tossing the ball ... Oooo lawd.

Umm, has anyone said he WON'T be reinstated right away (if he stays clean)?

Also, no idea why you are saying he is in phenomenal shape. Two reasons. One, how do you know? And two, being in shape isn't the same as football shape.

The "Barring another screw up" is being severely minimized in all your pom pom sessions.

Bottom line is if you can get him at a bargain or even "reasonable" price, you have a lot of time to let some of these things work themselves out.

My price was a $1. I guess I'll just skip the Tequilla upgrade on my next Margherita and I'm even...

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He is eligible for reinstatement in February.

Been clean from weed for 2+yrs, and has obviously pissed clean for booze since the last time too. Give me ONE reason he wont be instantly reinstated?

He is in phenomenal shape, has been supportive of his team, and has the agent of all agents doing his PR work behind the scenes.

Barring another screw-up, his instant reinstatement is a formality.

Hue + Goff tossing the ball ... Oooo lawd.

Umm, has anyone said he WON'T be reinstated right away (if he stays clean)?

Also, no idea why you are saying he is in phenomenal shape. Two reasons. One, how do you know? And two, being in shape isn't the same as football shape.

The "Barring another screw up" is being severely minimized in all your pom pom sessions.

Bottom line is if you can get him at a bargain or even "reasonable" price, you have a lot of time to let some of these things work themselves out.

My price was a $1. I guess I'll just skip the Tequilla upgrade on my next Margherita and I'm even...

Well sure, but anyone who has him at this point has either traded for him and/or has held him for a while. Not many people are going to get Gordon for anything close to a reasonable price, except for maybe leagues with small rosters.

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If you wanted Gordon from me, youd be paying top tier #1 WR prices for him

And I still wouldnt sell.

I am pretty sure nobody in your league would even approach you about him.

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If you wanted Gordon from me, youd be paying top tier #1 WR prices for him

And I still wouldnt sell.

I am pretty sure nobody in your league would even approach you about him.

they know better. Ive had an offer here and there to see how serious I was. Offers that it seem most of you wouldve taken in a heartneat

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If you wanted Gordon from me, youd be paying top tier #1 WR prices for him

And I still wouldnt sell.

I am pretty sure nobody in your league would even approach you about him.

they know better. Ive had an offer here and there to see how serious I was. Offers that it seem most of you wouldve taken in a heartneat

Do tell. What were the offers?

That is bad posting Soulfly, making us ask like this

:no: :no: :no::thumbdown::no: :no: :no:

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