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Matt Waldman

Josh Gordon Everything Thread

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15 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Something must have severely annoyed Belichick in his play. Wrong routes, blocking, something.

Or, brother, he was washed. Cause he looked washed, sad as it is to say it. 

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17 minutes ago, Walking Boot said:

Would be wild if he and Antonio Brown both went into the Hall of Fame as Patriots. Assuming AB doesn't go in as a Raider.

Wait. Did you just suggest Gordon could someday be in the NFL Hall of Fame? I guess he could buy a ticket. 

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Josh Gordon believes he’s close to returning to play, source says. So his IR designation today means he’s likely done with the #Patriots but could be available for teams as a free agent soon. Very interesting.

https://twitter.com/MikeGarafolo/status/1187114054122397697

So let's talk potential landing spots - assuming the Pats don't just sit on him ROS to play keep away. Honestly, I'm not sure why they wouldn't - his salary isn't an issue, right? So why let him walk onto a contender that might be short on WR help right now?

Anyway, assuming the do cut him reasonably soon, here are the teams I think are starving (or at least fairly hungry) for WR help right now, in order:

1. Raiders

2. Packers

3. Eagles

4. Niners

5. Ravens

6. Broncos

7. Giants

 

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8 minutes ago, LawFitz said:

https://twitter.com/MikeGarafolo/status/1187114054122397697

So let's talk potential landing spots - assuming the Pats don't just sit on him ROS to play keep away. Honestly, I'm not sure why they wouldn't - his salary isn't an issue, right? So why let him walk onto a contender that might be short on WR help right now?

Anyway, assuming the do cut him reasonably soon, here are the teams I think are starving (or at least fairly hungry) for WR help right now, in order:

1. Raiders

2. Packers

3. Eagles

4. Niners

5. Ravens

6. Broncos

7. Giants

 

I just heard a discussion about this on the radio. NE apparently has moved on from Gordon. That’s a topic of its own. For whatever reason, they are choosing to move on. 

By putting him on IR, they can set things up that they waive him AFTER the trade deadline. Based on that timeline, he won’t become available to all teams until AFTER he clears waivers. The waiver order is based on team record, so start with the bottom feeders and see who claims him. Since Gordon only had a $2 million salary, and he allegedly will be healthy enough to play, someone will want him. If he is claimed and someone adds him, I believe that team will also have to take on his contract. So basically it would amount to NE trading Gordon without actually trading him to recoup $1 million in cap space. But the bottom line is Gordon WILL NOT be able to pick his destination unless he goes unclaimed. 

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Rotoworld said he was done until next year. Take that with all the grains of salt you want, and it doesn't sound right, but here's the blurb:

Josh Gordon WR, New England Patriots

Patriots placed Josh Gordon (knee) on injured reserve, ending his 2019 season.

Gordon's injury-riddled season comes to a disappointing close as he finishes with merely 20 catches for 287 yards and one score. The team will also reportedly waive him once he's healthy, closing his Patriots career with 60/1,087/4 over 17 regular season games. This transaction explains why the Patriots felt the need to invest a second-rounder in Mohamed Sanu prior to Tuesday's trade deadline. New England will move forward with some combination of Julian Edelman, Jakobi Myers and Sanu primarily working from the slot while Phillip Dorsett stays locked in on the outside. No. 32 overall pick N'Keal Harry also has an easier path to opportunity upon his (pending) Week 11 return. 29 in April, another suitor is fully expected to take a flier on Gordon's incomparable athleticism next year.

Source: Field Yates on Twitter

Oct 23, 2019, 4:22 PM ET

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1 minute ago, rockaction said:

Rotoworld said he was done until next year. Take that with all the grains of salt you want, and it doesn't sound right, but here's the blurb:

Josh Gordon WR, New England Patriots

Patriots placed Josh Gordon (knee) on injured reserve, ending his 2019 season.

Gordon's injury-riddled season comes to a disappointing close as he finishes with merely 20 catches for 287 yards and one score. The team will also reportedly waive him once he's healthy, closing his Patriots career with 60/1,087/4 over 17 regular season games. This transaction explains why the Patriots felt the need to invest a second-rounder in Mohamed Sanu prior to Tuesday's trade deadline. New England will move forward with some combination of Julian Edelman, Jakobi Myers and Sanu primarily working from the slot while Phillip Dorsett stays locked in on the outside. No. 32 overall pick N'Keal Harry also has an easier path to opportunity upon his (pending) Week 11 return. 29 in April, another suitor is fully expected to take a flier on Gordon's incomparable athleticism next year.

Source: Field Yates on Twitter

Oct 23, 2019, 4:22 PM ET

He would be done until next year if NE kept him. But that doesn’t sound like the plan. See my post above. 

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Just noticed the Gordon owner in my league dropped him.

Key question: Is he worth picking up?

He hasn't exactly lit it up this season.

I could actually see him retiring.

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1 minute ago, Anarchy99 said:

He would be done until next year if NE kept him. But that doesn’t sound like the plan. See my post above. 

Gotcha. Still a little confused, but thanks. 

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Just now, kyoun1e said:

Just noticed the Gordon owner in my league dropped him.

Key question: Is he worth picking up?

He hasn't exactly lit it up this season.

I could actually see him retiring.

I think you just answered your own question. 

He’s been a WR 4/5 this year, hurt, and has to find a new team.  Unless you have a bunch of bench space I wouldn’t.

I’m dropping and not looking back. 

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I got Gordon as a throw in in a deal I just made, before the news that he could still play this year.  He is on my IR for now.

I would deal him but not likely anyone wants him

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2 hours ago, pantherclub said:

Is soulfly dead?

i was never able to really figure out exactly whose alias that was. 
 

but yeah, as Josh Gordon goes, so goes Soulfly. 
 

RIP. 

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There is no way Josh Gordon gets cut.  When he signs with another team, the Patriots can qualify for a compensatory pick.  Wide receivers often get paid way more than people expect.  No one has any idea how much Gordon will get on the free agent market.  The Patriots aren't going to miss out on that potential free pick.

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Bill Belichick might want to sign Gordon to a long term contract.  He isn't going to show his hand and act interested in signing him.  Belichick will look at what the market offers Gordon.  It could be as low as $3 or $4 million per year or it might be as high as $10 million per year.

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On 8/29/2019 at 9:47 AM, Soulfly3 said:

Id honestly be FLOORED if he didnt hit 70 catches if he plays the season. 

That's my floor for him. 

This is just one of dozens of crazy ### predictions about Gordon.  Why people get laser focused about certain players (Murray included) and their fantasy stats I will never understand.  It reminds me of 6th graders on the play ground talking about their favorite players

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12 hours ago, Anarchy99 said:

I just heard a discussion about this on the radio. NE apparently has moved on from Gordon. That’s a topic of its own. For whatever reason, they are choosing to move on. 

By putting him on IR, they can set things up that they waive him AFTER the trade deadline. Based on that timeline, he won’t become available to all teams until AFTER he clears waivers. The waiver order is based on team record, so start with the bottom feeders and see who claims him. Since Gordon only had a $2 million salary, and he allegedly will be healthy enough to play, someone will want him. If he is claimed and someone adds him, I believe that team will also have to take on his contract. So basically it would amount to NE trading Gordon without actually trading him to recoup $1 million in cap space. But the bottom line is Gordon WILL NOT be able to pick his destination unless he goes unclaimed. 

This is 'essentially' correct.

Putting him on IR and holding him for another week is a cap move where NE is hoping some team will claim him thus freeing up much needed cap space.

This is a very-thorough in-depth article by Over The Cap which goes into every detail but here is the crux of this move. 

The Patriots, CBA Loopholes, and Josh GordonPosted on October 23, 2019 by Jason Fitzgerald

Quote

 

.. Gordon was just a restricted free agent in 2019 and signed a one year tender with the Patriots for $2.025 million.

... if Gordon was released today he would be a free agent that was free to sign with any of the 31 other teams in the NFL and also collect the balance of his salary, about $1.08 million, from New England...

... the Patriots will have their chance to get $952,000 in cap relief by holding onto him an extra week and keeping their fingers crossed that someone claims him.

Gordon is not expensive and it would make sense that someone takes a shot on him for that amount of money. While someone may not look at a bad team as a likely destination I think for a “tanking” team it makes sense. Gordon will be a UFA next year so the $952K investment could lead to something like a 6th round draft pick or at least some kind of protection for some other compensatory picks. So I don’t think you can discount a team like the Bengals who rarely spend in free agency and could gain draft capital or even the cap starved Falcons with the move. Who know maybe the Jets would do it if they trade Robby Anderson. So it is probably a good move by New England in that regard as it could block them from sending Gordon to a contender that they could meet in the playoffs.

Now you can also trade players off IR but I believe that is only players with a major injury and it does not sound like Gordon would fit that bill. So I would think this is all about creating a roster spot for one week and hoping they can get cap relief from another team, preferably a non-playoff one, rather than also opening a trade market. It’s a pretty shrewd move if that is the gameplan, though if I was Gordon Im not sure how thrilled I would be with it.

 

Go to the link for the full read that explains in more detail.

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The bigger question is why doesn’t NE want him anymore. They have been trying to trade for receiving help at WR or TE (allegedly), so why give up on Gordon?

I did read somewhere that besides his injury, NE was not happy with his play and production on the field. Who knows if there’s underlying issues bubbling under the surface. 

Kind of crazy that Brady beating the drum for veterans to throw to and the Pats have parted ways with Thomas, Brown, and Gordon. I still think the natural acquisition would be to go get Amendola back, but not sure how feasible that would be. 

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Just now, Anarchy99 said:

The bigger question is why doesn’t NE want him anymore. They have been trying to trade for receiving help at WR or TE (allegedly), so why give up on Gordon?

I did read somewhere that besides his injury, NE was not happy with his play and production on the field. Who knows if there’s underlying issues bubbling under the surface.

I watched Gordon especially on almost every play he was out there for NE this year. The number of times that Brady held the ball more than two seconds for him never to come open or stop running the route entirely was all-too frequent in NE's world this year. Just an observation. 

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So, is this guy worth holding to in the hopes he signs elsewhere?

FWIW, i have him in a short-bench league (12-team) and need to find a QB for LJax this week. It was between Gordon, Mike Williams, and Robby Anderson as to who I’d be dropping, but considering IF he were to sign /get claimed/ get traded elsewhere, it’d be:

  • After he was actually healthy enough to play
  • Need to learn a new playbook (not terribly hard for a WR of his style and the fact NE supposedly has the hardest playbook to learn 
  • Would likely go to a worse situation with a worse team/QB/ etc...

aside from deeper leagues where there’s more bench spots to stash and/ or lesser available talent, I’m really looking for a reason to hold here. 

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23 minutes ago, 4th&inches said:

So, is this guy worth holding to in the hopes he signs elsewhere?

FWIW, i have him in a short-bench league (12-team) and need to find a QB for LJax this week. It was between Gordon, Mike Williams, and Robby Anderson as to who I’d be dropping, but considering IF he were to sign /get claimed/ get traded elsewhere, it’d be:

  • After he was actually healthy enough to play
  • Need to learn a new playbook (not terribly hard for a WR of his style and the fact NE supposedly has the hardest playbook to learn 
  • Would likely go to a worse situation with a worse team/QB/ etc...

aside from deeper leagues where there’s more bench spots to stash and/ or lesser available talent, I’m really looking for a reason to hold here. 

NE is said to be moving on from Gordon because he wasn't very productive, looked slow/overweight, and wasn't getting separation. Add on that he is dinged up, needs to get on a another team, learn a new system, build chemistry with a new QB, and will likely have a downgrade at QB. That's also assuming he has no other off-field issues. He ends his time in NE with 60-1007-4 in 17 games but was trending the wrong way. He had to join the Patriots without training camp or practice last year. And he had no training camp with them this year either. This will be the third time he will have to jump into the fray without any prep time, any practice time, or forced to try to learn the playbook overnight. I would suggest that the 2019 version of Josh Gordon (20-287-1 in 6 games) is more likely to show up than the one from the 2013 Browns no matter which team he ends up on.

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ESPN's Josina Anderson reports Josh Gordon (knee, IR) expects to be medically cleared in 1-2 weeks.

The Patriots sent Gordon to IR as a procedural move. His knee injury isn't season ending and he's likely going to be released with a settlement. Gordon is worth stashing for the chance he lands in a starting role with another team. Assuming he gets cleared, that could happen in the next two weeks.

SOURCE: Josina Anderson on Twitter

Oct 26, 2019, 11:12 AM ET

 

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1 minute ago, Faust said:

Gordon is worth stashing

In the league where you get points for being slow and coverable, running the wrong routes with a case of the drops?

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Based on waiver priority, this feels like a Redskins pickup to me. They pick 3rd after Dolphins and Bengals. I'd be shocked if the Bengals put in a claim, never know with Miami. 

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1 minute ago, Bigboy10182000 said:

I’d be shocked if anyone claimed him to be honest. 

Really? I'd be shocked if the Saints didn't put in a claim for him. I'd also be more shocked if he made it that far in the waiver order.

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3 minutes ago, Bigboy10182000 said:

I’d be shocked if anyone claimed him to be honest. 

Why? He's cheap and teams could get a compensatory pick down the road.

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2 minutes ago, Moniker said:

Really? I'd be shocked if the Saints didn't put in a claim for him. I'd also be more shocked if he made it that far in the waiver order.

I'd love for the saints to get him. I'm sure he will be claimed.

When will we find out?

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1 minute ago, Max Power said:

I'd love for the saints to get him. I'm sure he will be claimed.

When will we find out?

End of day tomorrow.

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Patriots to release Josh Gordon from injured reserve, which would send receiver to waivers

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Josh Gordon's tenure with the New England Patriots is over. The Patriots reportedly plan to release Gordon from injured reserve Thursday, which will subject the former Pro Bowl wide receiver to waivers before he can become a free agent. The Cincinnati Bengals will have the first priority to claim Gordon with an 0-8 record with the Miami Dolphins second at 0-7 and the Washington Redskins third at 1-7. 

Per ESPN's Adam Schefter, Gordon hopes to land in a "good, supportive situation." 

The Patriots did plan to waive Gordon off injured reserve when he was fully healthy, ending an eventful 17-game stint with the team. His first season with the Pats ended prematurely after he was suspended by the league, finishing with 40 catches for 720 yards and three touchdowns. Gordon was reinstated prior to Week 1 and finished with 20 catches for 287 yards and a touchdown in six games before New England placed him on injured reserve with a knee injury.

Gordon reportedly had two bone bruises in that knee prior to the game against the Giants and exacerbated it when he went down during the game, missing a following game against the New York Jets. 

Gordon has 240 catches for 4,113 yards and 20 touchdowns in seven NFLseasons with the Cleveland Browns and the New England Patriots, averaging 17.4 yards per catch. Gordon led the NFL in receiving yards in 2013 with 1,646, a year which he finished with 87 catches and nine touchdowns. He made the All-Pro team and earned his lone Pro Bowl selection. Gordon has been suspended five times by the NFL, two games in 2013 for violating the league's substance-abuse policy, 10 games in 2014 for the same violation and the entire 2015 and 2016 seasons for a third offense. He was finally reinstated in Week 13 of the 2017 season and played the final five games for Cleveland. Gordon played one game for the Browns in 2018 before the team decided to deal him after he "violated the team's trust," which led to his trade to the Patriots.  

If Gordon is claimed by a team off waivers (which is highly likely), that team would take on the final nine weeks of his deal which is $1.072 million, per ESPN's Field Yates. Gordon would be a free agent after the season, so a team would have him for the remainder of this season and the exclusive negotiating rights before he hits free agency into March. If Gordon goes unclaimed, he can sign with any team. 

Teams will certainly be interested in Gordon, especially if they can make a playoff run with him on the roster. The Super Bowl contenders may not be able to claim Gordon, but a fringe playoff team could certainly entertain his services. 

 

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19 minutes ago, Anarchy99 said:

Why? He's cheap and teams could get a compensatory pick down the road.

 

Quote

Albert Breer @AlbertBreer

The Patriots held on to Josh Gordon past the trade deadline, subjecting him to waivers. And a reason for doing that was to keep him from contenders.

So why would a non-contender claim him? Bc if he walks as a UFA in March, such a team could get a comp pick for, in essence, free.

 

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Rotoworld take:

Quote

Patriots waived WR Josh Gordon.

Gordon is being cut loose from injured reserve, presumably with a settlement. Since it's after the trade deadline, the 28-year-old is subject to waivers. The Dolphins, Bengals and Redskins have the top three claims. In theory, interest will be robust. In practice, Gordon keeps resurfacing to high expectations then failing to deliver. He will undoubtedly get claimed, but it is probably long past time for the fantasy community to recalibrate its Gordon expectations. Provided there is one, we should know Gordon's new home by Friday.

RELATED: 

New England Patriots

SOURCE: Adam Schefter on Twitter

Oct 31, 2019, 3:38 PM ET

 

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A lot has changed on the fantasy landscape since JG was fantasy royalty . . . here are the Top 30 WR's from 2013:

01 - Josh Gordon
02 - Demaryius Thomas
03 - Calvin Johnson
04 - A.J. Green
05 - Brandon Marshall
06 - Dez Bryant
07 - Antonio Brown
08 - Eric Decker
09 - Alshon Jeffery
10 - DeSean Jackson
11 - Jordy Nelson
12 - Terrelle Pryor
13 - Andre Johnson
14 - Pierre Garcon
15 - Vincent Jackson
16 - Anquan Boldin
17 - Larry Fitzgerald
18 - Keenan Allen
19 - Julian Edelman
20 - T.Y. Hilton
21 - Wes Welker
22 - Marvin Jones
23 - Torrey Smith
24 - Michael Floyd
25 - Riley Cooper
26 - Mike Wallace
27 - Brian Hartline
28 - Marques Colston
29 - Victor Cruz
30 - Golden Tate

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2 minutes ago, Anarchy99 said:

A lot has changed on the fantasy landscape since JG was fantasy royalty . . . here are the Top 30 WR's from 2013:

01 - Josh Gordon
02 - Demaryius Thomas
03 - Calvin Johnson
04 - A.J. Green
05 - Brandon Marshall
06 - Dez Bryant
07 - Antonio Brown
08 - Eric Decker
09 - Alshon Jeffery
10 - DeSean Jackson
11 - Jordy Nelson
12 - Terrelle Pryor
13 - Andre Johnson
14 - Pierre Garcon
15 - Vincent Jackson
16 - Anquan Boldin
17 - Larry Fitzgerald
18 - Keenan Allen
19 - Julian Edelman
20 - T.Y. Hilton
21 - Wes Welker
22 - Marvin Jones
23 - Torrey Smith
24 - Michael Floyd
25 - Riley Cooper
26 - Mike Wallace
27 - Brian Hartline
28 - Marques Colston
29 - Victor Cruz
30 - Golden Tate

Thanks. To add more context, which of these guys are around the same age as JG?

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The saga continues :popcorn:

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Has there ever been a comparable scenario to this in the past?

Uber-talented player who had one amazing season, only to have year after year after year of off-field issues and injury & being released & then signed & play a single good game & on and on and on create to such a roller coaster ride of hope and disappointment?

I can’t think of anything even remotely close to this.

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Just now, Hot Sauce Guy said:

Has there ever been a comparable scenario to this in the past?

Uber-talented player who had one amazing season, only to have year after year after year of off-field issues and injury & being released & then signed & play a single good game & on and on and on create to such a roller coaster ride of hope and disappointment?

I can’t think of anything even remotely close to this.

Antonio Brown aspires to be the heir apparent you are seeking...

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If he slips past the Jets, I think the next most likely claim spot would be the Raiders. That might actually be the absolute best case #1 overall destination for his ROS fantasy outlook. The offense is actually not terrible this year but has been absolutely decimated by injuries and a famous clown at WR. Gordon could step into a meaningful role right away, assuming his tank isn't fumey at this point.

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I'm not high that teams are clamoring for this guy but we'll see. I understand why teams might want to take a look but he requires maintenance and babysitting that teams might want to pass on. Won't be shocked if he does fall down to a late grab by a playoff contender. 

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Teams could essentially buy themselves a compensatory pick for a $1 million. Someone will pick him up earlier than the true contenders. My guess is on one of the 3-4 teams (CHI, OAK, PIT).

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17 minutes ago, Anarchy99 said:

Teams could essentially buy themselves a compensatory pick for a $1 million. Someone will pick him up earlier than the true contenders. My guess is on one of the 3-4 teams (CHI, OAK, PIT).

Bears can't use the ones they have now, Oakland and Pittsburgh I can see. 

I don't see Gordon doing much better than 50-60 yds a week no matter where he ends up. 

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1 hour ago, Arodin said:

Antonio Brown aspires to be the heir apparent you are seeking...

Not remotely the same. lol

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17 minutes ago, Ministry of Pain said:

Bears can't use the ones they have now, Oakland and Pittsburgh I can see. 

I don't see Gordon doing much better than 50-60 yds a week no matter where he ends up. 

50-60 yds is a rate of 800-960 yds over a full season. That actually is pretty decent production. But I doubt he gets that much. NE is desperate for receivers and they didn’t want him. That tells me his numbers won’t be that great going in cold somewhere else. 

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