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Right now, who's more Hall of Fame worthy: Eli or Ben? (1 Viewer)

Right now, who's more Hall of Fame worthy: Eli or Ben?

  • Eli Manning

    Votes: 83 50.3%

  • Ben Roethlisberger

    Votes: 82 49.7%
  • Total voters
    165
Ghost Rider

Ghost Rider

Footballguy
I thought this would be an interesting question. If you think neither is deserving right now, that really isn't the point, since I would argue that both are borderline at best HOFers right now. The question is, right now, who is more Hall of Fame worthy?

Tough call, as Eli has the edge in passing yards, TD passes, SB MVP awards and winning with lesser defenses, but Ben doesn't turn the ball over as much, has a better W/L record and has a much better career YPA and passer rating.

Ultimately, I'll give the edge to Eli. He has more memorable, clutch playoff moments, and the two SB MVP awards to zero for Ben is a major edge for him. You could argue that Ben should have been the MVP in the Steelers 2nd SB win, but even with that, Eli would still be one up on him.

 
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'Ghost Rider said:
I thought this would be an interesting question. If you think neither is deserving right now, that really isn't the point, since I would argue that both are borderline at best HOFers right now. The question is, right now, who is more Hall of Fame worthy?

Tough call, as Eli has the edge in passing yards, TD passes, SB MVP awards and winning with lesser defenses, but Ben doesn't turn the ball over as much, has a better W/L record and has a much better career YPA and passer rating.

Ultimately, I'll give the edge to Eli. He has more memorable, clutch playoff moments, and the two SB MVP awards to zero for Ben is a major edge for him. You could argue that Ben should have been the MVP in the Steelers 2nd SB win, but even with that, Eli would still be one up on him.
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The two SB MVPs, his name and playing in New York give Eli much more of an edge.

However the biggest clutch play that either of them made was the tackle Ben made in the playoff game against the Colts. If he doesn't make that play the Steelers don't go on to win the SB and Jerome Bettis retires in shame.

 
'Zeff said:
Both are locks.
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Except that that wasn't the question. ;)
'Godsbrother said:
However the biggest clutch play that either of them made was the tackle Ben made in the playoff game against the Colts. If he doesn't make that play the Steelers don't go on to win the SB and Jerome Bettis retires in shame.
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Debatable. Someone could easily say that Eli breaking away from the potential sack and heaving the ball down field, giving Tyree a chance to make that miracle catch, was more clutch than Ben making a tackle, since if Eli gets sacked there, the Giants don't go on to win the SB.
 
Eli played well in both SBs, Ben played poorly in his first one. I'd give the edge to Eli, but both are terrific.

 
I think playing in NY helps Eli big time, just like playing in Pittsburgh helps Ben big time, but Eli is a MANNING, and that will certainly help his case.

 
big ben will not get in because of his off the field stuff. It's not fair maybe but the HOF is often about strength of character.

 
'Ghost Rider said:
'David Yudkin said:
If neither one played another down, I doubt either would get in.
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'Ghost Rider said:
If you think neither is deserving right now, that really isn't the point, since I would argue that both are borderline at best HOFers right now. The question is, right now, who is more Hall of Fame worthy?
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:wall:
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If neither one would be in right now, then we will have to consider how each will do in the future. Are you asking who will be more deserving when they are done playing? If so, can we make up our own guesstimates for each one over the next 8 years?
 
'David Yudkin said:
If neither one would be in right now, then we will have to consider how each will do in the future. Are you asking who will be more deserving when they are done playing? If so, can we make up our own guesstimates for each one over the next 8 years?
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Are you kidding? Did you not read the entire OP? It is simple: RIGHT NOW, which of the two do you think is more Hall of Fame worthy? It's a simple question. Good grief. :wall: :wall: :wall:
 
'Ghost Rider said:
'David Yudkin said:
If neither one would be in right now, then we will have to consider how each will do in the future. Are you asking who will be more deserving when they are done playing? If so, can we make up our own guesstimates for each one over the next 8 years?
Click to expand...
Are you kidding? Did you not read the entire OP? It is simple: RIGHT NOW, which of the two do you think is more Hall of Fame worthy? It's a simple question. Good grief. :wall: :wall: :wall:
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You should have had a "neither" option for people who don't think either is HOF worthy at this point though.
 
'Ghost Rider said:
'Zeff said:
Both are locks.
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Except that that wasn't the question. ;)
'Godsbrother said:
However the biggest clutch play that either of them made was the tackle Ben made in the playoff game against the Colts. If he doesn't make that play the Steelers don't go on to win the SB and Jerome Bettis retires in shame.
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Debatable. Someone could easily say that Eli breaking away from the potential sack and heaving the ball down field, giving Tyree a chance to make that miracle catch, was more clutch than Ben making a tackle, since if Eli gets sacked there, the Giants don't go on to win the SB.
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Certainly debatable but let me say that I could see Ben breaking away from a potential sack a whole lot easier than I can see Eli making that game-saving tackle.
 
'Ghost Rider said:
'David Yudkin said:
If neither one would be in right now, then we will have to consider how each will do in the future. Are you asking who will be more deserving when they are done playing? If so, can we make up our own guesstimates for each one over the next 8 years?
Click to expand...
Are you kidding? Did you not read the entire OP? It is simple: RIGHT NOW, which of the two do you think is more Hall of Fame worthy? It's a simple question. Good grief. :wall: :wall: :wall:
Click to expand...
Right now, who is more HOF worthy, Beanie Wells or Shonn Greene?
 
'Ghost Rider said:
'Zeff said:
Both are locks.
Click to expand...
Except that that wasn't the question. ;)
'Godsbrother said:
However the biggest clutch play that either of them made was the tackle Ben made in the playoff game against the Colts. If he doesn't make that play the Steelers don't go on to win the SB and Jerome Bettis retires in shame.
Click to expand...
Debatable. Someone could easily say that Eli breaking away from the potential sack and heaving the ball down field, giving Tyree a chance to make that miracle catch, was more clutch than Ben making a tackle, since if Eli gets sacked there, the Giants don't go on to win the SB.
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This play has always aggravated me. The ever softening NFL rulebook is far more responsible for that throw/catch than either Manning or Tyree. If NFL defenders weren't limited to playing patty-cake with a 6 inch square on a QB's chest, NE (as much as I hate them) walks off that field undefeated. Every single one of those defenders was more worried about making the sack without drawing a roughing penalty than stopping the play, a real and true tragedy in the game today.

 
'Godsbrother said:
'Ghost Rider said:
I thought this would be an interesting question. If you think neither is deserving right now, that really isn't the point, since I would argue that both are borderline at best HOFers right now. The question is, right now, who is more Hall of Fame worthy?

Tough call, as Eli has the edge in passing yards, TD passes, SB MVP awards and winning with lesser defenses, but Ben doesn't turn the ball over as much, has a better W/L record and has a much better career YPA and passer rating.

Ultimately, I'll give the edge to Eli. He has more memorable, clutch playoff moments, and the two SB MVP awards to zero for Ben is a major edge for him. You could argue that Ben should have been the MVP in the Steelers 2nd SB win, but even with that, Eli would still be one up on him.
Click to expand...
The two SB MVPs, his name and playing in New York give Eli much more of an edge.

However the biggest clutch play that either of them made was the tackle Ben made in the playoff game against the Colts. If he doesn't make that play the Steelers don't go on to win the SB and Jerome Bettis retires in shame.
Click to expand...
I'd put his pinpoint TD pass to Santonio Holmes to win SB 43 up there with any of Eli's clutch moments or any other QB for that matter. I think the bottom line for most is what they remember...Eli's SB wins came as big underdogs to the Pats, Ben's wins came as big favorites over SEA and AZ and a loss to an even opponent in GB. Both are HOF locks, will be interesting to see which wins their next SB first.
 
'Ghost Rider said:
'Zeff said:
Both are locks.
Click to expand...
Except that that wasn't the question. ;)
'Godsbrother said:
However the biggest clutch play that either of them made was the tackle Ben made in the playoff game against the Colts. If he doesn't make that play the Steelers don't go on to win the SB and Jerome Bettis retires in shame.
Click to expand...
Debatable. Someone could easily say that Eli breaking away from the potential sack and heaving the ball down field, giving Tyree a chance to make that miracle catch, was more clutch than Ben making a tackle, since if Eli gets sacked there, the Giants don't go on to win the SB.
Click to expand...
Eli's throw to Manningham in this past Super Bowl is in the same class of "clutch-ness" as both of these plays as well...
 
How would Eli Manning have looked had he been playing in the SB when he was 23 years old?

Can't hold it against Ben that he was a hell of a lot better player out of the gates than Manning was. Did Ben play poorly in SB XL? No doubt about it. But how many 23 year olds take their teams to the SB to begin with? How many played as Ben did when as a 23 year old he won three straight road playoff games with a QB rating well over 100?

I hate when comparisons are painted with such broad strokes. It's all about the big picture to me and considering all the details.....the hows and whys, not just numbers on a sheet of paper.

 
I don't see Big Ben getting another shot at a Super Bowl. That defense is aging badly and could take years to rebuild. Roeth himself takes a beating and will not have as long of a career as other top QBs. The offense line was in shambles last year. Playoff team? Yea, probably. I would be surprised if he won another one, though. There's also a major concern for Ben with his off-the field antics. Perhaps if he spent less time riding his motorcycle helmetless at 100 mph and more time donating money/time to charities he would be in a better position for HoF nomination. Even if all of the sexual assault complaints were fake, he was still in a position where that kind of stuff happens (night clubs, regularly).

Eli, on the other hand, has one of the top young defenses in the league. Also has two very young, stud WRs, a great coach, and a front offense that develops talent properly. The Giants are going to be damn good for the next 4-5 years and I could easily see another two appearances, possibly another title. Eli is going to be in the HoF ... Ben is not.

 
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'Ghost Rider said:
'David Yudkin said:
If neither one would be in right now, then we will have to consider how each will do in the future. Are you asking who will be more deserving when they are done playing? If so, can we make up our own guesstimates for each one over the next 8 years?
Click to expand...
Are you kidding? Did you not read the entire OP? It is simple: RIGHT NOW, which of the two do you think is more Hall of Fame worthy? It's a simple question. Good grief. :wall: :wall: :wall:
Click to expand...
I guess I would have to say both (since I can't say neither). Apparently there is no shortage of people that think because they won 2 SBs that automatically makes them HOFers. That's their best selling points. Beyond that, both of their resumes are thin for HOF induction.Put another way, if either of these two do DID NOT win 2 SBs, I really doubt anyone would be suggesting that they were HOFers.
 
'David Yudkin said:
'Ghost Rider said:
'David Yudkin said:
If neither one would be in right now, then we will have to consider how each will do in the future. Are you asking who will be more deserving when they are done playing? If so, can we make up our own guesstimates for each one over the next 8 years?
Click to expand...
Are you kidding? Did you not read the entire OP? It is simple: RIGHT NOW, which of the two do you think is more Hall of Fame worthy? It's a simple question. Good grief. :wall: :wall: :wall:
Click to expand...
I guess I would have to say both (since I can't say neither). Apparently there is no shortage of people that think because they won 2 SBs that automatically makes them HOFers. That's their best selling points. Beyond that, both of their resumes are thin for HOF induction.Put another way, if either of these two do DID NOT win 2 SBs, I really doubt anyone would be suggesting that they were HOFers.
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If both careers ended today, who would receive more HoF votes in 5 years? Assume neither will get enough to actually get inducted.
 
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'finito said:
You should have had a "neither" option for people who don't think either is HOF worthy at this point though.
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That would defeat the purpose of this thread.
'pinequick said:
Eli's throw to Manningham in this past Super Bowl is in the same class of "clutch-ness" as both of these plays as well...
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Agreed.
'David Yudkin said:
Put another way, if either of these two do DID NOT win 2 SBs, I really doubt anyone would be suggesting that they were HOFers.
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Agreed. Which is what made this an intriguing question to me...neither would be in based on their resume sans the Super Bowls, but both have won two SBs, and we all know how much stock people put into Super Bowls when it comes to quarterbacks and the Hall of Fame.
'BroadwayG said:
If both careers ended today, who would receive more HoF votes in 5 years? Assume neither will get enough to actually get inducted.
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That is a great way to put it! :thumbup: :thumbup:
 
Aside from those unwilling to answer the question as framed, there are still people mixing two concepts in their answers.

The question Broadway posed, which will get more votes if their careers ended today, is different than the poll question, which asks which is more worthy.

Things like the Manning name and playing in New York factor into the first question but not the second.

I voted Eli.

 
'David Yudkin said:
'Ghost Rider said:
'David Yudkin said:
If neither one would be in right now, then we will have to consider how each will do in the future. Are you asking who will be more deserving when they are done playing? If so, can we make up our own guesstimates for each one over the next 8 years?
Click to expand...
Are you kidding? Did you not read the entire OP? It is simple: RIGHT NOW, which of the two do you think is more Hall of Fame worthy? It's a simple question. Good grief. :wall: :wall: :wall:
Click to expand...
I guess I would have to say both (since I can't say neither). Apparently there is no shortage of people that think because they won 2 SBs that automatically makes them HOFers. That's their best selling points. Beyond that, both of their resumes are thin for HOF induction.Put another way, if either of these two do DID NOT win 2 SBs, I really doubt anyone would be suggesting that they were HOFers.
Click to expand...
Jim Plunkett, Tobin Rote, Jack Kemp and Tommy Thompson each won two championships, and none of them are IMO deserving of being in the HOF.
 
Eli has 2 rings, never gets into trouble, wins in the hardest market in the country...HoF but I also think Ben will get in but i would vote Eli 1st.

 
'Frenchy Fuqua said:
'Godsbrother said:
'Ghost Rider said:
I thought this would be an interesting question. If you think neither is deserving right now, that really isn't the point, since I would argue that both are borderline at best HOFers right now. The question is, right now, who is more Hall of Fame worthy?

Tough call, as Eli has the edge in passing yards, TD passes, SB MVP awards and winning with lesser defenses, but Ben doesn't turn the ball over as much, has a better W/L record and has a much better career YPA and passer rating.

Ultimately, I'll give the edge to Eli. He has more memorable, clutch playoff moments, and the two SB MVP awards to zero for Ben is a major edge for him. You could argue that Ben should have been the MVP in the Steelers 2nd SB win, but even with that, Eli would still be one up on him.
Click to expand...
The two SB MVPs, his name and playing in New York give Eli much more of an edge.

However the biggest clutch play that either of them made was the tackle Ben made in the playoff game against the Colts. If he doesn't make that play the Steelers don't go on to win the SB and Jerome Bettis retires in shame.
Click to expand...
I'd put his pinpoint TD pass to Santonio Holmes to win SB 43 up there with any of Eli's clutch moments or any other QB for that matter. I think the bottom line for most is what they remember...Eli's SB wins came as big underdogs to the Pats, Ben's wins came as big favorites over SEA and AZ and a loss to an even opponent in GB. Both are HOF locks, will be interesting to see which wins their next SB first.
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And that scenario is what will always give Eli the edge. He and the Giants of that year will always have a reserved spot in the minds of sports fans (and voters). There is just no way you can ever take that out of play when considering Eli for the HOF and with 2 wins and a solid career, playing in NY and the last name Manning, I'd say Eli could retire today and would be in the HOF within his first 5 years of eligibility. I'd say he's a fair shake at playing in another SB in the future.Ben, on the other hand, was never the MVP of the SB, had some character baggage (not that's its fair, but it will be thought of). I'm not sure ben will ever play in another SB for the Steelers. I think this team is much closer to going through a transition than continually competing for a SB.

 
'Shutout said:
And that scenario is what will always give Eli the edge. He and the Giants of that year will always have a reserved spot in the minds of sports fans (and voters). There is just no way you can ever take that out of play when considering Eli for the HOF and with 2 wins and a solid career, playing in NY and the last name Manning, I'd say Eli could retire today and would be in the HOF within his first 5 years of eligibility. I'd say he's a fair shake at playing in another SB in the future.Ben, on the other hand, was never the MVP of the SB, had some character baggage (not that's its fair, but it will be thought of). I'm not sure ben will ever play in another SB for the Steelers. I think this team is much closer to going through a transition than continually competing for a SB.
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:goodposting: Plus, most remember Eli being super clutch during both Super Bowl runs, while when many remember the Steelers' 05 run, they remember Ben stinking it up in the Super Bowl. Yes, he was awesome in the three AFC playoff games, but a lot of people forget that, and perception can sometimes be everything, so fair it or not, Ben was regarded as an afterthought by many on the Steelers' 05 Super Bowl team.
 
'Ministry of Pain said:
Eli has 2 rings, never gets into trouble, wins in the hardest market in the country...HoF but I also think Ben will get in but i would vote Eli 1st.
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Wow! What a difference a year makes. A year ago people were talking about "good Eli" vs "bad Eli". He did have an excellent year in 2011, though. (How many for Ben?)
 
Big Ben has been rather pedestrian the last couple of seasons and I don't think he will get in based on what he has done so far. If Eli can put together several more seasons like last year he has a good chance.

 
If neither played another down Eli would get in

1. 2 superbowls wins

2. the best play ever in a super bowl and another bigtime play on the game winning drive.

3. 2 COME FROM BEHIND WINS IN THE 4th quarter of SUPER BOWL VS Tom Brady and Bill

4. Beat the 18-0 Patriots in maybe the biggest upset in Super Bowl history.

5. He is a Manning and his brother will get in and the NFL loves feel good stories.

6. 1 OF 5 2 time Super Bowl MVP QB'S

Ben Roethlisberger would NOT

1. Yes 2 Super Bowl wins but played pretty bad in the first win. Did have a great throw to win it in the second.

2. Off the the field problems

3. Average numbers for most of his career.

He needs another Super Bowl win.

 
'David Yudkin said:
'Ghost Rider said:
'David Yudkin said:
If neither one would be in right now, then we will have to consider how each will do in the future. Are you asking who will be more deserving when they are done playing? If so, can we make up our own guesstimates for each one over the next 8 years?
Click to expand...
Are you kidding? Did you not read the entire OP? It is simple: RIGHT NOW, which of the two do you think is more Hall of Fame worthy? It's a simple question. Good grief. :wall: :wall: :wall:
Click to expand...
I guess I would have to say both (since I can't say neither). Apparently there is no shortage of people that think because they won 2 SBs that automatically makes them HOFers. That's their best selling points. Beyond that, both of their resumes are thin for HOF induction.Put another way, if either of these two do DID NOT win 2 SBs, I really doubt anyone would be suggesting that they were HOFers.
Click to expand...
Well to get into the Super Bowl is amazing in it's self, while it should not be the sole reason it is a reason especially if you are a 2 time MVP with two late come from behind wins in them games. Eli deserves the Hall IMO. He is a big part of the history of the game, really think about it. Had it not been for Eli and his great play in the biggest games of his career and what every player plays for Tom Brady would be without a doubt the best QB of all time as I write this. No questions asked. Eli has played a big part and his foot print is forever stamped in NFL LORE. 30 years from now Eli will be talked about and he is a pretty damn good QB that was doubted early in his career but as it stands now he is ELITE and should be feared as much as any QB in the game and is. That is HALL OF FAME ####. Not numbers but how you play in the playoffs is just as big as numbers. He has above average numbers as well though. NOT A GIANTS HOMER AT ALL!!
 
I voted Eli. More memorable performances in the postseason. Much better image. Perception of Ben that the SB winning teams were carried by a super defense.

That said, both to me are 'pretty good' QBs and I never really thought of either as a HOF candidate.

 
Football is a team sport...unless you are talking about Eli Manning. Then it doesn't matter how crappy the guy plays, you get carried by the defense and play 2 good quarters of football and you are a HOFer.

Seriously, the guy beat a couple of the worst defenses that have seen the playoffs in the Packers and Patriots. I think the Giants team had a lot more to do with those super bowls then him by far. He's Phil Simms, give me a break.

 
Eli Manning is a lock for the HOF now IMO.

Roethlisberger won't make it into the HOF without another Super Bowl win cause of all of his problems. Needs another one for people to forget the problems.

 
'Mustang Man said:
If neither played another down Eli would get in1. 2 superbowls wins2. the best play ever in a super bowl and another bigtime play on the game winning drive.3. 2 COME FROM BEHIND WINS IN THE 4th quarter of SUPER BOWL VS Tom Brady and Bill4. Beat the 18-0 Patriots in maybe the biggest upset in Super Bowl history.5. He is a Manning and his brother will get in and the NFL loves feel good stories.6. 1 OF 5 2 time Super Bowl MVP QB'SBen Roethlisberger would NOT1. Yes 2 Super Bowl wins but played pretty bad in the first win. Did have a great throw to win it in the second.2. Off the the field problems3. Average numbers for most of his career.He needs another Super Bowl win.
Click to expand...
That final drive in sb xliii against the Cards was epic. If both careers ended now, I vote Ben in first by a hair.
 
I'm a Steeler fan but the answer to this has got to be Eli. He had better performances in his Super Bowls, some of which were the best plays ever by a QB in a Super Bowl. He has more 4th quarter comebacks, more passing yds and more TDs to date in his career.

 
As memorable as those few playoff moments were, its not like teams truly fear Eli Manning on a weekly basis. Fans don't get pumped at the thought of their team defeating Eli Manning as they might Peyton Manning or Tom Brady. Ben is probably more feared around the league as a guy who is more likely to make astounding plays in the mud when everyone is playing poorly.

The fear factor says Ben by a nose.

 
For the record, Eli was leading this poll 80-33 at the time of the bump. I suspect Ben will catch up within a half hour.

 
Serious question -- has anyone ever played his way out of the Hall of Fame? I think Eli would have had a better argument had he retired after the 2012 season.

 
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At this point if I had to say one, it would be Eli based on some of the points made earlier (name, market, etc) But honestly don't consider either a HoF QB. But since they've been starting to make it look like the Hall of Very Good, they both might have a chance. I've never considered either to be elite or even in the top 5 QB list at any point in their careers. I don't see that changing as both are aging, their game looks like it's getting worst not better and their teams are not elite anymore.

 
jbz said:
At this point if I had to say one, it would be Eli based on some of the points made earlier (name, market, etc) But honestly don't consider either a HoF QB. But since they've been starting to make it look like the Hall of Very Good, they both might have a chance. I've never considered either to be elite or even in the top 5 QB list at any point in their careers. I don't see that changing as both are aging, their game looks like it's getting worst not better and their teams are not elite anymore.
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Ben is imo one of the best game managing QBs in the history of the NFL, and definitely in this decade of ridiculous over the top passing play. He's had to put up with a lot of ####, tough division defenses, terrible OLine.

IDK whether that makes him a HOFer, but imo I think he is.

 
Raider Nation said:
For the record, Eli was leading this poll 80-33 at the time of the bump. I suspect Ben will catch up within a half hour.
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Man, people have completely soured on Eli. As I head off to bed, Big Ben is on a 38-2 run. :lmao:

And this is immediately following Ben having a dreadful game on national television.

 
Peyton and Eli must be gold around the dinner table. A top 5 QB of all-time, maybe higher, cannot really talk trash without his little brother saying I have more rings and you can only dream of tying me.

A pre-game show with Archie, Peyton and Eli could be gold down the road. Archie only 65. Mix in Ray Lewis. :thumbup:

 
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