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Tannehill's upside (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter yankdog
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Kitrick Taylor
Footballguy
Carolina has the 5th ranked pass d in the league. Tannehill threw for 310 yards against them a month ago.
Pittsburg has the 8th ranked pass d, and Tannehill threw for 3TDs against them a couple weeks ago.
Buffalo comes in with the 6th best pass d in the league. If anything, I'd question how good they really are. They've padded their numbers recently against Glennon, Geno Smith, and Henne (without Shorts and Blackmon). They also got down against Pittsburg, and the Steelers ran the ball more than they passed it.
Fact is, Tannehill has been playing pretty well of late, and this isn't the Seattle defense we're talking about.
glumpy
breeze
My league scoring in nonstandard but relatively should give similar results...Going into this week's game and looking at Tannehill on the waiver wire...
Scoring average: First four games 18.99ppg, Second four 18.86ppg, Next set of three 29.39, Last three 32.51. Distinct jumps in progression.
Average score in those first 8 games 18.925--Buffalo home game is the outlier at 24.26 with none of the others close.
Jeeeez. I'm going up against the owner who just last week broke the historical league scoring record. Have been holding onto Kaepernick just for this game looking for some revival of last years playoff scoring with Crabtree and Manningham back on the field in a great matchup. This call is going to take a leap of faith!
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Kitrick Taylor
Footballguy
Of course it's good and bad. He's a young QB that didn't even play the position for the entirety of his college career.
I've seen your pessimism here and in the game threads MOP, and I guess I just don't get it. He's not Brees, Brady, Rodgers or Manning at this point. Those guys weren't what they are now in their second seasons' either. I know the game is a bit different today, but Tannehill is on pace to match most of Peyton Manning's second season numbers. (Tannehill isn't throwing to Marvin Harrison in the prime of his career either. Nor does he have Edgerrin James lining up behind him.)
Also, going into this season, Tannehill was an afterthought compared to the rest of the QBs that emerged in 2012. Luck, RG3, Wilson and Kaepernick were all considered to be vastly superior options. Tannehill has clearly outplayed RG3 and Kaepernick this year, and is playing on about the same level as Luck is IMO. At this point, only Wilson is playing better amongst those QBs.
John 14:6
Jesus is Lord!
It depends on who else you have. I'd have to go with Henne, McGloin, or Pryor, so Ryan's staying in for me.
Todem
Footballguy
He has really come on of late. Once the OL settled in (incredibly they are playing far better now than the first half of the year) you can see hwo this offense is now starting to really click.
I felt before the season started two things had to get better. OL and running game. Well....both have slowly gotten better. Our running game is not good...but it's not bad either. I wish we would commit to it more at times.....but at least we have been able to keep teams honest of late.
Tannehill still needs to develop more pocket awareness, still needs to trust his feet more and learn how to have better footwork in the pocket and must focus on his passes over 20 yards this off-season. I am positive this Summer he and Wallace will be working very hard to get the vertical passing game in gear. The kid can make all the throws, he is calm as a cucumber and it is obvious to me....we have the best QB since Marino on our team. Finally we really have some hope to build around.
Amazingly this team could be 11-3 or 6-8 right now based on 4-5 plays the entire season. Football is a game of inches in the truest sense.
Tannehill is playing well, the team is on a roll and I expect them to win out and finish 10-6. I am still not a huge fan of Philbin and Sherman.....I think if this team had better coaching they would be that much better going forward. Ireland to me.....has earned his keep with this off-season and some other key additions that people are forgetting about
Wake
Odrick (finally)
Vernon
Jones
Hartline
Clay
Grimes
Tannehill
Pouncy
McKinne (great trade for this team)
Wallace ( he is a good WR.....he has been wide open a lot this season and I expect next year will be an All-Pro)
Starks
Dion Jordan (will be an unstopable beast IMO....special talent no question)
Patterson - although out he was a solid pick up
Gibson - was a very good pick up....too bad he is out and has a serious injury
Matthews - proving every week to be a viable slot WR
Miller - a guy who IMO has been under utilized by this coaching staff. He still has some huge plays to give us this season and hopefully it will come. I believe in this kid as a HR hitter.
So.....Ireland has done some very good things the past couple of seasons in getting talent in here.
I felt before the season started two things had to get better. OL and running game. Well....both have slowly gotten better. Our running game is not good...but it's not bad either. I wish we would commit to it more at times.....but at least we have been able to keep teams honest of late.
Tannehill still needs to develop more pocket awareness, still needs to trust his feet more and learn how to have better footwork in the pocket and must focus on his passes over 20 yards this off-season. I am positive this Summer he and Wallace will be working very hard to get the vertical passing game in gear. The kid can make all the throws, he is calm as a cucumber and it is obvious to me....we have the best QB since Marino on our team. Finally we really have some hope to build around.
Amazingly this team could be 11-3 or 6-8 right now based on 4-5 plays the entire season. Football is a game of inches in the truest sense.
Tannehill is playing well, the team is on a roll and I expect them to win out and finish 10-6. I am still not a huge fan of Philbin and Sherman.....I think if this team had better coaching they would be that much better going forward. Ireland to me.....has earned his keep with this off-season and some other key additions that people are forgetting about
Wake
Odrick (finally)
Vernon
Jones
Hartline
Clay
Grimes
Tannehill
Pouncy
McKinne (great trade for this team)
Wallace ( he is a good WR.....he has been wide open a lot this season and I expect next year will be an All-Pro)
Starks
Dion Jordan (will be an unstopable beast IMO....special talent no question)
Patterson - although out he was a solid pick up
Gibson - was a very good pick up....too bad he is out and has a serious injury
Matthews - proving every week to be a viable slot WR
Miller - a guy who IMO has been under utilized by this coaching staff. He still has some huge plays to give us this season and hopefully it will come. I believe in this kid as a HR hitter.
So.....Ireland has done some very good things the past couple of seasons in getting talent in here.
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matuski
Footballguy
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
Todem
Footballguy
He has stunk up the joint today.....really #### the bed today.
Kid can't hit a deep ball to save his life......3 times today 3 times he has missed easy TD's IMO. Killing us and long term must be solved or we are looking for another QB. Seriously.....he can;t hit a big pass downfield. At all.
We have a Porsche (Wallace) and can't use him. He is not getting premium gasoline with Tannehill throwing the deep ball......Wallace is not the issue.
Tannehill is. Pains me to say that....but if watch the games....it's obvious. He can't throw a good deep ball if his life depended on it.
Kid can't hit a deep ball to save his life......3 times today 3 times he has missed easy TD's IMO. Killing us and long term must be solved or we are looking for another QB. Seriously.....he can;t hit a big pass downfield. At all.
We have a Porsche (Wallace) and can't use him. He is not getting premium gasoline with Tannehill throwing the deep ball......Wallace is not the issue.
Tannehill is. Pains me to say that....but if watch the games....it's obvious. He can't throw a good deep ball if his life depended on it.
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Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Let's put the anointing oils away for another year, maybe next season we can look forward to something.
He was sacked 7 times! I don't know what we'd be anointing him, but I'm ready to declare him a legitimate NFL QB rather than a 1st round gamble on a project. I'd love to have him on the Texans. What he's done with probably the worst offensive line in the league has been impressive. I'm very interested to see what kind of moves they make in that department next year. That will be critical to his continued progress.Ministry of Pain said:
Catbird
Footballguy
I'm with ya', Ninja. The center OL is just empty turnstiles. Disappointed with this game - no doubt - but I like the trend. He's still a kid without much QB experience. At least the 'deer in the headlights' look is gone. I agree the deep ball looks like his weakness, but he has both the arm strength and accuracy. I think that becomes a strength. Give him another year and even decent blocking and he won't be MIA's problem.
Todem
Footballguy
He must develop better footwork in the pocket. 25-35% of the teams sacks are on him. Locking on to one target, not moving up or to the side in the pocket. It's not all on this sub par OL. Tannehill is still developing. I like him a lot. But he still must work on that and his 30 plus yards pass accuracy which has been abysmil.
We have left lots of easy TD's on the field due to his complete lack of accuarcy on the deep pass. Seriously it has been bad.
With a big improvement to this OL he should improve a lot next year and continue to build. But if he cannot throw a good deep ball....heck any ball over 30 yards.....he will not be a franchise QB. Won't happen in a league that is pass happy and where the big plays are there every week with the disgusting new defensive or shall I say lack of defense due to the ridiculous rules in place.
Also....with no running game it's hard to drop back and pass knowing a full on pass rush is coming. And add to that a clueless coaching staff who does not roll him out, does not call screens or draws.....nadda. Putrid!!!!
We have left lots of easy TD's on the field due to his complete lack of accuarcy on the deep pass. Seriously it has been bad.
With a big improvement to this OL he should improve a lot next year and continue to build. But if he cannot throw a good deep ball....heck any ball over 30 yards.....he will not be a franchise QB. Won't happen in a league that is pass happy and where the big plays are there every week with the disgusting new defensive or shall I say lack of defense due to the ridiculous rules in place.
Also....with no running game it's hard to drop back and pass knowing a full on pass rush is coming. And add to that a clueless coaching staff who does not roll him out, does not call screens or draws.....nadda. Putrid!!!!
KCitons
Footballguy
How concerned are other Tannehill owners that the changes in OC(s) could be a problem?
I'm worried the Dolphins bring in a new OC with an old Head Coach. Also a new GM that could possibly want his own Head Coach in a year or two. Then the new Head Coach could want a different OC at that time. This would translate to Tannehill having 3 OC's in his first five years.
Not a lot of stability for a young QB. This type of scenario usually leads to QB failure.
I'm worried the Dolphins bring in a new OC with an old Head Coach. Also a new GM that could possibly want his own Head Coach in a year or two. Then the new Head Coach could want a different OC at that time. This would translate to Tannehill having 3 OC's in his first five years.
Not a lot of stability for a young QB. This type of scenario usually leads to QB failure.
Kitrick Taylor
Footballguy
While I agree that the Dolphins are not doing this the correct way, I'm not quite as pessimistic.
When Philbin left Green Bay a couple of years ago, Aaron Rodgers couldn't say enough good things about him. I was listening to his local radio show, and it was far more than the typical, yeah he's a great coach kind of thing. I think the reason Philbin is still there is he's a very good coach, and he's very good with QBs.
I think the hope is that Tannehill takes another step forward this offseason, and leads the Dolphins to a string of playoff appearances. That will keep Philbin and his system in place. An improved offensive line, an offseason to work on timing with Mike Wallace, and the Dolphins could have a pretty nice offense.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
This is just an excuse and one that I'm not convinced has any major effect on a QB.
QBs that stink with multiple OCs typically still stink when they get a stable one. QBs that are good with a stable OC are typically still good when they get a change in them.
I think this is a cause and effect thing in a lot of ways. Teams commit harder to a franchise QB than they do to an OC. So when a QB plays poorly their first move is generally to change OCs, meaning bad QBs generally see more OCs. When a QB is good it makes the whole offense look good, and the OC sticks around, meaning good QBs typically have a more stable OC.
babydemon90
Footballguy
Well, the OC is Lazor, who helped engineer a 2 INT season out of Foles, so I don't see that as a negative...
Todem
Footballguy
IMO.....with Lazor's hiring. Lamar Milers value may sky rocket. This kid can play. And this type of wide open offense is exactly what he needs to get the ball in space.
I love this hire for Tannehill and the Dolphins. I hope and pray the new GM is a true big time talent evaluator who can get some OL in here as well as bring in another back to compliment Miller. Thomas is not the answer long term here. He was a an Ireland guy and IMO is really on the bubble this upcoming summer. And although Miller is an Ireland guy......he is far more talented and suited for Lazor's scheme than Thomas.
Tannehill must get Wallace the ball next season. He was running free often. I really hope things get better.
I love this hire for Tannehill and the Dolphins. I hope and pray the new GM is a true big time talent evaluator who can get some OL in here as well as bring in another back to compliment Miller. Thomas is not the answer long term here. He was a an Ireland guy and IMO is really on the bubble this upcoming summer. And although Miller is an Ireland guy......he is far more talented and suited for Lazor's scheme than Thomas.
Tannehill must get Wallace the ball next season. He was running free often. I really hope things get better.
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Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
Will the team run a Chip offense or an Al Groh one? He (Lazor) was last an OC under him at Virginia. What type of offense did they run?
Was just wondering this, too. And was he the true OC at Virginia or was the head coach the guy who determined the exact type of offense they ran?
Right now I'm hesitant to draw any conclusions from this. Tannehill might be more gifted than Foles, but the Miami o-line is <<<<< Philly o-line and Miller <<< McCoy. Good luck, Mr. Lazor.
FUBAR
Footballguy
I'd be surprised if they didn't address both the line and RB this year. OL is their biggest need, by far. Miller clearly isn't McCoy but does he have to be?
No, while I stayed away from Miller this year, I think he's a viable NFL RB. If they improve the line and his price is right, he'll be on my radar.
It seems they've got some needs on defense, too, so it'll be interesting to see what positions they address. Plus, they've got some people to re-sign. Their combo of Thomas and Miller might get a second go round.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
msudaisy26
Footballguy
ShaHBucks
Footballguy
What a pain in the ### diva Mike Wallace is. You're not that special buddy.
Would you entertain cutting Mike Wallace? He could cost 17.2M next season(2.2M in bonuses) + his contract through 2017, or you can bite the bullet and take a onetime cap hit of 8.8M while spending the rest of the 6.6M elsewhere.
Would you entertain cutting Mike Wallace? He could cost 17.2M next season(2.2M in bonuses) + his contract through 2017, or you can bite the bullet and take a onetime cap hit of 8.8M while spending the rest of the 6.6M elsewhere.
What people do in the privacy of their own home is their own business, but I hope they can find sometime to work on some pass plays this offseason as well.
FUBAR
Footballguy
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
What would Tannehill's stock do if say Dan Marino were named Vice President of the team in a role similar to John Elway running things in Denver. Would you feel like Tannehill would have someone in a leadership role around him that you could trust better? Would Marino make a difference in any way to you? Curious what you all think would happen if anything at all.
Time Kibitzer
Footballguy
It would change nothing.Ministry of Pain said:
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
False Start
Footballguy
Unreal isn't it? The problem is the people running the team, not the QB. Ireland hired Philbin, thats all that needs to be said.
Yeah at the very least it's certainly up for debate. The writer must have Tannehill on his dynasty team or something.
Time Kibitzer
Footballguy
If Tannehill is the Dolphin's greatest strength then they're absolutely screwed.
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
The problem is that they've been starting over every 2 years for the last 10.
Tannehill may not be THE problem, but he hasn't been part of the solution either. He's an average QB who's upside is probably in the above average range. Maybe a Joe Flacco, at best.
He's a liability at the end of games as well. At least someone like Tony Romo gives fans some hope by throwing some risky passes that steadily move the team downfield until one of them eventually goes awry. With Tannehill it's like he's not even trying. If you need 80 yards in 2 minutes to win the game, Tannehill will get you 12 yards in 1:47 before you finally are forced to try and repeat the Stanford band play as your only shot at winning.
Louche
Footballguy
Tannehill ended the season with two very bad games and a lot of people seem to judge his season on that and his difficulties connecting with Mike Wallace, but at the start of the season and around weeks 11-14 he had some very good games and some 4th quarter drives and clutch throws that made people get quite excited about him. If you go back and read what pundits were saying about him then you would think he was the next big thing. PFF rated him as the 7th best QB this season, and with all the issues MIA had with their protection I would certainly agree that throwing Tannehill's name out there as if he is one of their main problems and hinting at Matt Moore as a better option...the only reason I can find for it is that they are trying to light a fire under him for motivational purposes. They have much, much bigger issues to sort out on their roster. Not to talk about their dysfunctional coaching this season. Their offense was terribly unbalanced and became very predictable. Their run blocking was awful but their running game was actually not that bad. The problem was that Sherman leaned so heavily on the pass, even when they had the lead in the third and fourth quarter, and when you become predictable and pass on 63 % of the plays while struggling with your pass protection....it doesn't really put your QB in a good situation. There was a bit of criticism that Tannehill needed to take some of the blame for those sacks himself, and having watched all the games there were certainly times where one felt he held on to the ball for too long - but the numbers don't really back that up. He was the 6th fastest QB in average time to pass attempt, and the average time to sack was 6th fastest. He spent an average of 5.04 seconds to scramble which I would say shows impressive composure considering how many sacks he took. One would think he would get more skittish taking all that punishment. I think the jury is definitely still out on Tannehill, he still has a lot to prove even though he at times has shown some things to be excited about, but to pinpoint him as one of the weaknesses of that team...? Doesn't make sense.
Louche
Footballguy
I'm not saying that Tannehill is Mr.Clutch, but some of his finest moments this season came in the fourth quarter in his game winning drives against ATL, PIT and NWE. His biggest weaknesses appears to be his pocket presence and deep ball accuracy. Outside of that it's difficult to judge as long as his supporting cast is as dysfunctional as it has been.
Kitrick Taylor
Footballguy
It still amazes me how quick people are to judgement even on QBs. Tannehill put up respectable numbers this year behind what may have been the league's worst offensive line. He also had little running game help, and his chemistry with his best WR was crap.
Check out what Brett Favre, Drew Brees, Eli Manning, Steve McNair and Philip Rivers were doing, even on a per attempt basis, at similar points of their careers. Saying he "Maybe a Joe Flacco at best" is a joke. Fact is, we don't know if he's gonna wash out of the league in a few years or be a Hall of Famer. The QB position just is a vastly different position to evaluate than RBs or WRs.
MoveToSkypager
Footballguy
No it isn't. I think people would be over the moon if he had a career like Joe Flacco. Of course he won't, since Joe Flacco is a better QB than Tannehill at any point in their careers.
Baeddel Moon
Footballguy
Let's take a look at 2013's Joe Flacco and 2013's Ryan Tannehill.
Ryan Tannehill - 3913 yd, 24 TD, 17 Int, along with 200~ rushing yards and a rushing TD
Joe Flacco - 3912 19 TD, 22 Int, along with 130 yards rushing and a rushing TD.
Hey, look at that, 2013 Tannehill had better numbers than 2013 Flacco! Both players lost safety blanket TEs in the preseason, had o-lines that were bottom 10 in football, and completely ineffective running games. Seems like a pretty fair comparison in any case. Tannehill is a high end QB2 at the moment, because of the upside. Tannehill could still flame out and be someone's backup in a year or two, but I'm pretty confident I can get Flacco level production from the wire.
