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Kyle Rudolph

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58 minutes ago, Stompin' Tom Connors said:

Would love to see Rudolph come to the Raiders as he's an accomplished blocker and Carr can likely use his hands in this offense to make it that much more dynamic (and the fact that our RB backfield is unproven and shallower with the loss of Crowell).

I am not sure what Rudoplph's cap hit would be though -- the Raiders might still have space, but was under the impression that Rudolph's contract wasn't the lightest to carry, and there may not be a confident ROI depending on the hit.

Right now oak has ~$27mil before the rookies get signed, and as you mentioned Crowell got hurt so they may look to add a veteran back because unlike the rest of the entire world I don't really see Jacobs as an every down back. Further, I don't think Richard/Washington are a real compliment to Jacobs skill set. So unless Warren comes on very strong beyond having a good pre-season game or two I think they SHOULD sign another guy. Which doesn't mean they will, but I imagine they will.

The Vikings are in a pretty bad salary cap situation so despite the fact they should be in win-now mode they have reason to part ways with Rudolph and lean on Smith/Conklin imo. Rudolph has a $7.6mil cap hit and the Vikings save all that money by parting ways with Rudolph(in the last year of his contract). That's a fair chunk of change but like I said in my earlier post I wouldn't be surprised if Rudolph was a pro-bowler in oak. Carr has always liked his receivers close to the line of scrimmage. At 29yo I can even envision a scenario where they give him a contract extension if the cap hit for 2019 is a little too high. 

I'm just talking out loud here but MIN also parted ways with one of their starting S's and Joseph has been in Gruden's doghouse seemingly since the day he arrived so it would also make sense if that was part of the compensation in the trade. If they just spent a first round pick on Abram and a fair amount of money for Joyner I'm not sure Joseph has much playing time in his future in oak anyway. They might be able to secure a pro-bowl TE for Joseph and a conditional pick based on Rudolph pans out. Seems like a win-win for both sides to me.

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5 minutes ago, BoltBacker said:

I'm just talking out loud here but MIN also parted ways with one of their starting S's and Joseph has been in Gruden's doghouse seemingly since the day he arrived so it would also make sense if that was part of the compensation in the trade. If they just spent a first round pick on Abram and a fair amount of money for Joyner I'm not sure Joseph has much playing time in his future in oak anyway. They might be able to secure a pro-bowl TE for Joseph and a conditional pick based on Rudolph pans out. Seems like a win-win for both sides to me.

Interesting thoughts. You are right about Joseph seemingly stalled in his development but to be fair, there was literally zero help at all in the Raiders secondary for a few years running now. I hope we keep Joseph as his style as a roamer fits perfectly with Joyner's box safety skills, and using Abrams as both a box safety and maybe even in pass rush.

Joseph is still rough but I'm a believer that with the added support, he could take that leap this year -- I hope we keep him as our secondary now looks like it has some solid potential to actually make a difference.

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1 hour ago, Stompin' Tom Connors said:

Would love to see Rudolph come to the Raiders as he's an accomplished blocker and Carr can likely use his hands in this offense to make it that much more dynamic (and the fact that our RB backfield is unproven and shallower with the loss of Crowell).

I wish Rudolph was an average blocker

1 hour ago, Stompin' Tom Connors said:

I am not sure what Rudoplph's cap hit would be though -- the Raiders might still have space, but was under the impression that Rudolph's contract wasn't the lightest to carry, and there may not be a confident ROI depending on the hit.

He is being over payed. Really good timing with his contract. I have been wishing the Vikings would cut him to save cap space for 3 years now.

I think the Vikings are asking him to take a pay cut now. They can use the "our hands are tied" reasoning here because its true. The reason their cap situation is so tight right now is because of the Vikings rewarding their players with big contracts that pay them for their past performance.

Contracts keep going up. Rudolphs agent will try to get a new deal for him, I would assume he is seeking more money than he is being paid right now.

The Vikings may just agree to a restructure if Rudolph is willing. On a personal level Rudolph is a team leader and has value to them because of that.  He is overpayed for what he does on the field though. I think the Vikings playing Smith and Morgan with no Rudolph should improve their overall blocking because Rudolph is a weak link there.

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47 minutes ago, Biabreakable said:

I wish Rudolph was an average blocker

Great thoughts overall. To this point, I was under the impression that he had vastly improved after 2015 in this department, and had earned efficiency grades of 97 in pass-blocking in 2016 (moving him from 45th to 16th overall in this stat for that season), and ranked 7th in 2017 in overall run+pass block efficiency.

I don't have a subscription to PFF to check what his blocking efficiency was, but for a guy that plays that many downs, and has a solid receiver skill-set, that kind of efficiency seems really solid and above average, making Rudolph overall a pretty valuable commodity in both aspects of the game (receiving, blocking).

There is no question over the last season he was utilized way less as a receiver and was more primarily out there for blocking (as opposed to running decoy routes). If he was a below-average blocker, not sure why the team would utilize him on so many snap counts (4th overall) as opposed to a guy like David Morgan whose game leans more to being a blocking TE than a receiver.

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4 minutes ago, Stompin' Tom Connors said:

Great thoughts overall. To this point, I was under the impression that he had vastly improved after 2015 in this department, and had earned efficiency grades of 97 in pass-blocking in 2016 (moving him from 45th to 16th overall in this stat for that season), and ranked 7th in 2017 in overall run+pass block efficiency.

I don't have a subscription to PFF to check what his blocking efficiency was, but for a guy that plays that many downs, and has a solid receiver skill-set, that kind of efficiency seems really solid and above average, making Rudolph overall a pretty valuable commodity in both aspects of the game (receiving, blocking).

There is no question over the last season he was utilized way less as a receiver and was more primarily out there for blocking (as opposed to running decoy routes). If he was a below-average blocker, not sure why the team would utilize him on so many snap counts (4th overall) as opposed to a guy like David Morgan whose game leans more to being a blocking TE than a receiver.

I don't know how Pff grades him I just know from watching every game that Rudolph fails a lot of blocks. He is worse at run blocking than he is at pass blocking.

Last season the Vikings ran a lot of 3 WR sets and teams would show pressure forcing Rudolph to chip or help with the protection. His chips are weak. Lots of them he is turning his head for his pass route before he even makes contact with the chip. He doesn't sustain blocks and gets blown up blocking in line.

David Morgan didn't play much last year and IIRC he had some sort of injury he was recovering from. There is no doubt he is a better blocker than Rudolph, but when he is on the field teams know that and adjust their defense. He gets wide open on play action some times because no one is trying to cover him. Hes slow though and not as reliable of a receiver as Rudolph is.

Being curious I looked up his Pff grade

64.1 overall which is average. He is a better receiver than he is a blocker, ergo below average blocker.

You may be right that Rudolph has improved his blocking since 2015 but he was so bad at it, I don't think that is saying much. I did find this which shows he was a poor run blocker in 2013 2015 and 2016 by their standards. Poor would be the worst grade they give.

As far as the Vikings trading Rudolph for a safety or whatever, I am all for it. They need the cap space anyways. To get anything for him would be more than I expect. 

As far as the Vikings interest in safety, they have a lot of depth there. They are actually talking about possibly moving Javon Kearse to LB because they like their safeties so much.

 

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57 minutes ago, Biabreakable said:

As far as the Vikings interest in safety, they have a lot of depth there. They are actually talking about possibly moving Javon Kearse to LB because they like their safeties so much.

I thought they were only moving Kearse because he was so big he was already a S/LB hybrid when on the field? I think those guys were all the rage when Thomas Davis and Kam Chancellor were going to pro-bowls a few years ago but more than a few guys have gotten stuck in a no-mans-land if they aren't as talented as those two guys.

I'll admit I don't know a great deal about Jordan Martin other than he wasn't drafted. A lot of contributors/depth around the league weren't drafted so that's not always a death knell but it may speak to his perceived upside.

Derron Smith is an AAF refugee that didn't play in the NFL in 2018.

Epps was just drafted at pick #191 and sometimes those guys need injuries to others just to make the team. Most of the sources I pay attention to had him outside of their top 300 players. The fact they drafted Epps was one of the reasons I thought they may be in the market for safety help.

Drafting Joseph in the middle of the 1st round was definitely a reach in 2016 but I'd still say he's an upgrade over that group. He's also 25yo so the penny could drop with a fresh start surrounded by a ton more talent than oak had last season on defense. It's pretty difficult to grade any of those raider DB's based on the pass rush they were generating last season.

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NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reports the Vikings have broken off extension talks with TE Kyle Rudolph.

Rudolph and the Vikings had been working toward an extension but have reportedly reached an impasse. After selecting LSU's Irv Smith 50th overall in last month's draft, Rudolph's days in Minnesota could be numbered. Rapoport confirmed the long-time Viking is already drawing trade interest. The eight-year vet tallied 64 catches last season, which ranked seventh in the league among tight ends. He's due $7.5 million in 2019, the final year of his current contract.

SOURCE: Ian Rapoport on Twitter

May 10, 2019, 1:53 PM ET

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will be interesting to see what happens with him. I think he'll stay in Minnesota and not have that much fantasy value... I can only see a few teams trading for him - Pats, Seahawks and maybe Titans.

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Speaking Monday, Kyle Rudolph said he was hoping for a quick resolution to his status with the Vikings.

"We’re in a tough situation as a team," Rudolph said, philosophically. "Can’t keep everybody, can’t pay everybody. Those guys, I know, are working really hard to figure out something." The reality is, Rudolph's fate was sealed when the Vikings used a second-round pick on Alabama TE Irv Smith. An extension is not coming down the pipe. Due $7.5 million this season, Rudolph will be a candidate for release absent a trade.

SOURCE: Andrew Krammer on Twitter

May 13, 2019, 1:30 PM ET

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This should be interesting.  It is highly unlikely that Smith Jr. is ready to contribute in year one.  Almost no rookie tight ends are ready to start in their first year.  Smith is talented, but he's not even 21... 

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4 minutes ago, kittenmittens said:

This should be interesting.  It is highly unlikely that Smith Jr. is ready to contribute in year one.  Almost no rookie tight ends are ready to start in their first year.  Smith is talented, but he's not even 21... 

I dont see Rudolph getting released. I'm also doubting he gets traded.

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Just now, cloppbeast said:

I dont see Rudolph getting released. I'm also doubting he gets traded.

Me too, the Vikings are in win mode and they can't/shouldn't trust a rookie TE to take over.

They do have cap issues, should be interesting to see what they do.  I wonder if they try to restructure Rudolph? 

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46 minutes ago, kittenmittens said:

Me too, the Vikings are in win mode and they can't/shouldn't trust a rookie TE to take over.

They do have cap issues, should be interesting to see what they do.  I wonder if they try to restructure Rudolph? 

They were talking to him about that but they have reached an impasse.

Rudolph asking for more money guaranteed which puts the Vikings in a bind next year. They likely were light on their offer there.

I dont think Rudolph is in their plans beyond this season.

I'm hoping they can trade him.

There are ways to free up money to sign Bradbury but Rudolph's contract is too high right now. That's a lot of savings should they move him

If they just cut him they won't get a comp pick. If Rudolph can command a new contract with good money next year the Vikings might be able to get a 3rdbor 4th round comp pick for him or any team that trades for him could if they dont keep him.

So I think that is the price. 3rd or 4th round pick type value.

Trading Rudolph for a cheaper TE might be another option for them to consider. That type of deal rarely happens though.

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Vikings Feeling the Salary Cap Squeeze, OBJ Back in Cleveland, Rookie Standouts in Minicamps

Excerpt:

Quote

As of Monday morning, the Vikings have $664,266 in cap space... and first-round pick Garrett Bradbury still hasn’t signed yet. It’s clear that Minnesota has some work to do in that area—especially because every team needs to sock away some cap space for in-season injury contingencies—and the obvious place to make some space is with TE Kyle Rudolph, who has been available via trade for about a month. His $7.625 million number for 2019 ($250,000 of it tied to per-game roster bonuses) makes him both tricky to move and, without any dead money on his contract, an easy place for the Vikings to find breathing room, if they have to cut someone. Rudolph, of course, is a beloved figure in that organization, and he brings a lot to the table beyond being a really good player. But something is eventually going to have to give on that roster. And unless someone comes and blows the Vikings away with a trade offer for one of their corners, Rudolph will remain the obvious place for the team to find relief.

 

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3 hours ago, cloppbeast said:

I dont see Rudolph getting released. I'm also doubting he gets traded.

I don't see him staying in MIN at that cap #, and I don't see him willing to accept less $ than the mediocre FA TE's just signed for a month or two ago. 

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Posted (edited)

I have this gut feeling that Rudolph or Brate will end up in New England this year.

Edited by TripItUp

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1 hour ago, TripItUp said:

I have this gut feeling that Rudolph or Brate will end up in New England this year.

As a Rudolph dynasty owner, I really really really really hope your gut is right on this one...

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2 hours ago, TripItUp said:

I have this gut feeling that Rudolph or Brate will end up in New England this year.

Brate or Rudolph would help them so much...

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Sitting on him in 2 leagues waiting to see if I win the lottery or get kicked in the jimmies.

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The Vikings signed Garrett Bradbury their 1st round pick today.

We still do not know how they can afford to do this. There must be another move on the way.

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If they cut him does he become a FA or does he have to go through waivers?

 

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9 minutes ago, Flying Elvis said:

If they cut him does he become a FA or does he have to go through waivers?

 

My understanding is, if a player has accrued 4 years of service, he bypasses waivers and immediately becomes UFA.

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Thanks. I know that's a rule just wasn't sure if / when it applies (preseason vs. in-season) to a player. 

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55 minutes ago, Biabreakable said:

The Vikings signed Garrett Bradbury their 1st round pick today.

We still do not know how they can afford to do this. There must be another move on the way.

They restructured Kendricks' contract.

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19 hours ago, TripItUp said:

I have this gut feeling that Rudolph or Brate will end up in New England this year.

The Patriots aren't likely to be interested in a tight end that doesn't run block well. 

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Just now, kittenmittens said:

The Patriots aren't likely to be interested in a tight end that doesn't run block well. 

A. Hernandez wasn't a great blocker, so I disagree.  Yes they prefer a Gronk like guy, but those are so very rare.

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1 minute ago, Mingooch said:

A. Hernandez wasn't a great blocker, so I disagree.  Yes they prefer a Gronk like guy, but those are so very rare.

That was 10 years ago. 

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Kyle Rudolph has to be onw of the most over rated TEs in the last half decade. He is a constant underproducer.

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54 minutes ago, Casting Couch said:

Kyle Rudolph has to be onw of the most over rated TEs in the last half decade. He is a constant underproducer.

He was TE 5, TE 7, and TE 8 the last three years on a PPG basis in my PPR leagues. That's really not all that horrible.

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Profootballtalk reports the Vikings have not asked Kyle Rudolph to take a pay cut.

PFT also reports the Vikes have offered Rudolph a five-year extension, one that would give him a "new-money average among the highest paid tight ends in the league." As PFT alludes to, that might end up little more than an accounting trick to lower Rudolph's $7.625 million cap number for 2019. Divorce still seems to be the most likely outcome here.

SOURCE: Profootballtalk on NBCSports.com

May 17, 2019, 12:12 AM ET

 

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10 minutes ago, Faust said:

 

Yeah, I'm pretty sure we all know that translates roughly to an offer with weak guarantees that helps the team this year so they can play him, pay him less, then cut him on the cheap. 

Stand your ground, Kyle! It's not even June. Tom Brady will wait patiently. 

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Posted (edited)

Yea, Kyle should have taken that and now they probably want to move forward with Irv

Edited by zeeshan2

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19 hours ago, TripItUp said:

Called it earlier in this thread.  :coffee:

Maybe, maybe not as far as Rudolph to N.E. He's due $7.3 million this year, and the Pats don't have much more cap space than Minnesota does. He's a decent receiver, but his blocking leaves a lot to be desired. PFF only rated him as the #35 TE in 2018 (#13 in 2017). I'm not convinced NE would want to pay him that much (and then have him become a free agent after this year). Who knows what BB would do? Maybe they would trade for him and give up a late round pick in the hopes of getting a better compensatory pick the following year if he signed elsewhere. And I am not fully convinced that we have seen the last of Gronk. I tend to think NE will leave some cap room for Gronk if he wants to make a late season return.

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Rapoport: Vikings not expected to address Kyle Rudolph situation anytime soon

Quote

Rapoport reiterates that Rudolph has a deal on the table, as has been widely reported, and says that there are numerous teams interested in trading for Rudolph. However, he cites the team’s selection of Irv Smith Jr. in the second round of this year’s draft in talking about why it’s unlikely we see anything happen anytime soon. Apparently, Rapoport seems to think that the Vikings want to see how far behind Rudolph. . .if at all. . .Smith is when the team gets to camp before doing anything major with Rudolph.

 

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Vikings signed Kyle Rudolph to a contract extension.

Rudolph announced the deal himself on Twitter, writing his home "will always be in Minnesota!" The terms of the contract are not yet known, but Rudolph was reportedly offered a five-year extension earlier this offseason. With the contract situation resolved, Rudolph will return as the No. 1 option at tight end, although he could lose some work to second-round rookie Irv Smith.

SOURCE: Kyle Rudolph on Twitter

Jun 10, 2019, 11:28 PM ET

 

Quote

ESPN's Adam Schefter reports Kyle Rudolph's extension is a four-year, $36 million contract.

Rudolph announced the deal himself on Twitter, but the terms of the contract were not known. The tight end was entering the final year of his deal, but this extension will tie him to the Vikings through the 2023 season. The $9 million new money average surpasses the $7.3 million per year Rudolph earned on his last deal and makes him the fourth-highest paid tight end in the game.

SOURCE: Adam Schefter on Twitter

Jun 11, 2019, 12:11 AM ET

 

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The devil is always in the details(guaranteed money) but on the fact of things it really makes you wonder why they didn't make this decision earlier.... like before the NFL draft.

Instead of drafting Mattison to backup Cook they could have had Sanders/Henderson/Harris which all would have been a pretty big upgrade. Of course, I also think they could have had a better RB by simply drafting Justice Hill instead of Mattison but my opinion may be in the minority as he is a very different style of runner.

OR they could have drafted Dieter at OG to actually have some quality and depth on OL for the first time since.... my lifetime?

OR in a draft with deep quality at WR they could have complimented Diggs/Thielen with a big WR like Metcalf/Arcega-Whiteside.

OR they could have even taken Grier as a developmental QB if they are starting to worry they made the wrong decision with Cousins. Having recently watched the pre-playoff game with CHI it really makes you wonder if they should be developing a guy just in case. Really, I don't understand why more teams aren't developing a second QB.

It just seems like they could have gone so many different directions in the draft if they had made these hard decisions/negotiations BEFORE the draft. And please don't explain to me that they needed a blocking TE. Yeah, every team in the NFL has a blocking TE on the roster.... they just don't generally burn the 50th overall pick on a blocking TE. They generally sign for the vet minimum or get drafted on day 3, and often not early on day 3 of the draft. Conklin was a recent 5th rounder so I guess they are dedicated to being REALLY deep at TE.

If this all sounds like a diatribe from a Rudolph dynasty owner that was hoping to spin the wheel and have him land in a better destination(Oak/NE).... it is. The assumption of rational roster management by NFL teams often times will come back to bite you. He's been "Good" in MIN and I expect that to continue, I just think he could have been great in some other places.

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2 hours ago, BoltBacker said:

The devil is always in the details(guaranteed money) but on the fact of things it really makes you wonder why they didn't make this decision earlier.... like before the NFL draft.

Instead of drafting Mattison to backup Cook they could have had Sanders/Henderson/Harris which all would have been a pretty big upgrade. Of course, I also think they could have had a better RB by simply drafting Justice Hill instead of Mattison but my opinion may be in the minority as he is a very different style of runner.

OR they could have drafted Dieter at OG to actually have some quality and depth on OL for the first time since.... my lifetime?

OR in a draft with deep quality at WR they could have complimented Diggs/Thielen with a big WR like Metcalf/Arcega-Whiteside.

OR they could have even taken Grier as a developmental QB if they are starting to worry they made the wrong decision with Cousins. Having recently watched the pre-playoff game with CHI it really makes you wonder if they should be developing a guy just in case. Really, I don't understand why more teams aren't developing a second QB.

It just seems like they could have gone so many different directions in the draft if they had made these hard decisions/negotiations BEFORE the draft. And please don't explain to me that they needed a blocking TE. Yeah, every team in the NFL has a blocking TE on the roster.... they just don't generally burn the 50th overall pick on a blocking TE. They generally sign for the vet minimum or get drafted on day 3, and often not early on day 3 of the draft. Conklin was a recent 5th rounder so I guess they are dedicated to being REALLY deep at TE.

If this all sounds like a diatribe from a Rudolph dynasty owner that was hoping to spin the wheel and have him land in a better destination(Oak/NE).... it is. The assumption of rational roster management by NFL teams often times will come back to bite you. He's been "Good" in MIN and I expect that to continue, I just think he could have been great in some other places.

You are all over the place with this post

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