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Le'Veon Bell

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Is Michael Bush a relatively close comp? He seems to be the same type of player to me.

The way I look at things they're fairly similar, yes. Bush was 13 pounds heavier at the same height and his NCAA performance was better than Bell's though, so if not for the injury I think he'd have been a considerably better prospect than Bell.

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I believe the comp. I would make to him is Jamal Lewis. The feet are not as nimble but he might be a a tad faster (yet not as quick to wiggle). Probably has more flexibility than Lewis.

I think for Bell it will come down to where he lands. Put him in St. Louis and I'm really starting to watch. Put him in New York as a complement with a specialized role and I don't think he will evolve much past that.

Lewis had a lot more power.
That is because Lewis had sub 4.4 speed. The comparison is not close.

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I think Gerhart is a good comparison. I also think Gerhart could have been a productive fantasy back in the right circumstances.

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ZWK, here's how I got to Chris Wells as the best comp... this is broken out into pieces for clarity. It's too much to do for every guy I'm writing up, but thought it would be useful to see one...I started with players who were Tall, Big and had negative receiving metrics. LaGarrette BlountEric SheltonBrandon JacobsKevin JonesChris WellsT.J. DuckettLe'Veon BellDarren EvansJohn ClayMusa SmithToby GerhartJackie BattleCedric Humes Daniel ThomasAnthony ThomasTim HightowerGreg Jones Straight away I can look at that list and determine there's no one there I'd be willing to part with a worthwhile asset to acquire. In fact, I could stop here and feel comfortable that I'm not missing out on the next big thing if I pass on Bell. I'm not interested in role players or guys who might finish as RB20 if two guys in front of them get hurt and they have 400 carries.Eliminating the players who are not just big, but are huge/oversized (which Bell is not) we lose...LaGarrette BlountEric Shelton (borderline)Brandon Jacobs----------------T.J. DuckettGreg Jones Which leaves us with...Kevin JonesChris WellsLe'Veon BellDarren EvansJohn ClayMusa SmithToby GerhartJackie BattleCedric Humes Daniel ThomasAnthony ThomasTim HightowerNow eliminating the players who also qualify as fast (which Bell is not) we drop...Musa SmithJackie BattleKevin JonesLeaving us with...Chris WellsLe'Veon BellDarren EvansJohn ClayToby GerhartCedric Humes Daniel ThomasAnthony ThomasTim HightowerHowever, some of these guys were drafted very late (which Bell is not expected to be)... so eliminating those with an adjusted draft position outside the top 100, we can cut...Cedric Humes (224)Darren Evans (UDFA)John Clay (UDFA)Which leaves us with... Chris WellsLe'Veon Bell------------Toby GerhartDaniel ThomasAnthony ThomasTim Hightower (I eliminated small school players the first time)However, only Wells and Bell have rushing metrics in positive territory, which is how I arrived at Beanie as his best comp. Shelton makes it to the end as well if you don't cut him with the oversized guys. But looking at that again now I think he's a better fit with the massive guys (judgment call).And since Bell's rushing metric is worse than Wells', and he's both slightly smaller and slower than Wells I don't even think he has Beanie's upside.Note that you don't have to buy the health argument here at all to avoid Bell. The odds are pretty high that he's not going to be a lead back for very long even if he's healthy.That's the long version of what happens very quickly with a few keystrokes otherwise.

I think Bell will be a three down back, so he should not be compared with guys who don't catch the ball. Daniel Thomas should not be on that list either. I think he is somewhere in between Daniel Thomas and Steven Jackson, but definitely closer to Jackson. Dorsey Levens if I had to pick an old school comp.

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I believe the comp. I would make to him is Jamal Lewis. The feet are not as nimble but he might be a a tad faster (yet not as quick to wiggle). Probably has more flexibility than Lewis.

I think for Bell it will come down to where he lands. Put him in St. Louis and I'm really starting to watch. Put him in New York as a complement with a specialized role and I don't think he will evolve much past that.

Lewis had a lot more power.
Lewis did have more power but this is a comparison, not a copy off a fax machine. Lewis was extremely powerful in delivering the blows from the shoulders and Bell is a bit more fluid there and that is where he loses the punch at the finish. However, those same traits might make Bell a bit more dynamice over the course of a career. Lewis really had some years where he plodded, due to the ankle issue and jail time which prevented his ability to rehab properly.

Overall, though, what you lose in raw power might be there to be made up in upper body nimbleness and that's not a bad thing. More than anything, the part I wanted to draw out is that he has that comparative big size but lighter feet and despite a slower 40 than a lot of backs (several people have made mention here of looking slow), he might still offer a lot. Jamal timed in the high 4.5's himself but he wasn't hurting once he hit that second level because of the power he had. Bell isn't Lewis but he's in that conversation. Again, location will be KEY, IMO.

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Is Michael Bush a relatively close comp? He seems to be the same type of player to me.

I don't think Bush is. He has more power but a lot less control of his feet underneath him.

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I believe the comp. I would make to him is Jamal Lewis. The feet are not as nimble but he might be a a tad faster (yet not as quick to wiggle). Probably has more flexibility than Lewis.

I think for Bell it will come down to where he lands. Put him in St. Louis and I'm really starting to watch. Put him in New York as a complement with a specialized role and I don't think he will evolve much past that.

Lewis had a lot more power.
That is because Lewis had sub 4.4 speed. The comparison is not close.
I'm sure you googled that and saw all the hits about him doing that once but he actually timed out at 4.58 at the combine.

[*]http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=60760&draftyear=2000&genpos=rb

I don't want to derail this into something about 40 times and what people do once or at pro days, etc and I will agree that JLEW played faster than his timed speed but putting all that to the side for a second, I'm saying to look at a comparison (not a copy off a copying machine) of size and especially in this case, the footwork and how they keep their feet under them and move laterally. If you look at those two things, I think you can find something to talk about.

People trying to compare him to Blount just because they both have highlights of hurdling people every once in a while is a waste of time. Look at their play...on the field...beyond a two minute highlight.

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I think Bell will be a three down back, so he should not be compared with guys who don't catch the ball. Daniel Thomas should not be on that list either. I think he is somewhere in between Daniel Thomas and Steven Jackson, but definitely closer to Jackson. Dorsey Levens if I had to pick an old school comp.

He's no way closer to Jackson:

Alabama has a incoming freshman that's virtually a Steven Jackson clone, and Bell is nowhere near him:

.

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Players with comparable height/BMI averages to Bell (who is 6'1/230):

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/psl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=combined&year_min=1920&year_max=2012&season_start=1&season_end=-1&age_min=0&age_max=99&draft_round_min=0&draft_round_max=99&league_id=&team_id=&is_active=&is_hof=&handedness=&pos_is_rb=Y&c1stat=height_in&c1comp=gt&c1val=72&c2stat=height_in&c2comp=lt&c2val=74&c3stat=bmi&c3comp=gt&c3val=29.3&c4stat=bmi&c4comp=lt&c4val=31.3&order_by=rush_yds

                                                             Ht            Game        Rush                     Rk                Player From   To          Draft  Tm  Lg     Ht  Wt  BMI     G  GS     Att   Yds  Y/A  TD   Y/G1             Jim Brown* 1957 1965            1-6 CLE NFL    6-2 232 29.8   118 118    2359 12312 5.22 106 104.32         Franco Harris* 1972 1984           1-13 TOT NFL    6-2 230 29.5   173 166    2949 12120 4.11  91  70.13            Fred Taylor 1998 2010            1-9 TOT NFL    6-1 234 30.9   153 137    2534 11695 4.62  66  76.44          John Riggins* 1971 1985            1-6 TOT NFL    6-2 230 29.5   175 157    2916 11352 3.89 104  64.95           Corey Dillon 1997 2006           2-43 TOT NFL    6-1 225 29.7   150 132    2618 11241 4.29  82  74.96            Ahman Green 1998 2009           3-76 TOT NFL    6-0 217 29.4   148  97    2056  9205 4.48  60  62.27        Herschel Walker 1986 1997          5-114 TOT NFL    6-1 225 29.7   187 138    1954  8225 4.21  61  44.08            Roger Craig 1983 1993           2-49 TOT NFL    6-0 222 30.1   165 133    1991  8189 4.11  56  49.69           Gerald Riggs 1982 1991            1-9 TOT NFL    6-1 230 30.3   129  73    1989  8188 4.12  69  63.510        Willis McGahee 2004 2012           1-23 TOT NFL    6-0 228 30.9   130  89    1957  8097 4.14  63  62.311         Stephen Davis 1996 2006          4-102 TOT NFL    6-0 230 31.2   143 102    1945  8052 4.14  65  56.312          Chris Warren 1990 2000           4-89 TOT NFL    6-2 228 29.3   162  91    1791  7696 4.30  52  47.513           Mike Pruitt 1976 1986            1-7 TOT NFL    6-0 222 30.1   152 112    1844  7378 4.00  51  48.514         George Rogers 1981 1987            1-1 TOT NFL    6-2 228 29.3    92  78    1692  7176 4.24  54  78.015        Antowain Smith 1997 2005           1-23 TOT NFL    6-2 232 29.8   131  75    1784  6881 3.86  54  52.516         Larry Johnson 2003 2011           1-27 TOT NFL    6-1 228 30.1    85  55    1427  6223 4.36  55  73.217      Deuce McAllister 2001 2008           1-23 NOR NFL    6-1 232 30.6    97  76    1429  6096 4.27  49  62.818         James Stewart 1995 2002           1-19 TOT NFL    6-1 224 29.6   101  69    1478  5841 3.95  48  57.819       Michael Pittman 1998 2008           4-95 TOT NFL    6-0 218 29.6   151  81    1392  5627 4.04  25  37.320             Jim Nance 1965 1973  4-4519-151AFL TOT TOT    6-1 235 31.0   101  66    1341  5401 4.03  45  53.521      John Brockington 1971 1977            1-9 TOT NFL    6-1 225 29.7    95   9    1347  5185 3.85  30  54.622            Kevin Mack 1985 1993           1-11 CLE NFL    6-0 224 30.4    99  82    1291  5123 3.97  46  51.723         Dorsey Levens 1994 2004          5-149 TOT NFL    6-1 230 30.3   144  58    1243  4955 3.99  36  34.424        Marion Motley* 1946 1955                TOT TOT    6-1 232 30.6   106  46     828  4720 5.70  31  44.525          Marv Hubbard 1969 1977         11-277 TOT TOT    6-1 225 29.7   103  58     951  4544 4.78  23  44.126         Rob Carpenter 1977 1986           3-84 TOT NFL    6-1 224 29.6   118  61    1172  4363 3.72  29  37.027              Jim Otis 1970 1978          9-218 TOT NFL    6-0 220 29.8   116  16    1160  4350 3.75  19  37.528        Tony Galbreath 1976 1987           2-32 TOT NFL    6-0 228 30.9   170  58    1031  4072 3.95  34  24.029         Mike Anderson 2000 2007          6-189 TOT NFL    6-0 230 31.2    98  51     919  4067 4.43  37  41.530           Alan Ameche 1955 1960            1-3 CLT NFL    6-0 218 29.6    70   0     964  4045 4.20  40  57.831         Edgar Bennett 1992 1999          4-103 TOT NFL    6-0 217 29.4   112  76    1115  3992 3.58  21  35.632       Leonard Russell 1991 1996           1-14 TOT NFL    6-2 240 30.8    85  71    1164  3973 3.41  29  46.733        Anthony Thomas 2001 2007           2-38 TOT NFL    6-2 228 29.3    87  43    1044  3891 3.73  23  44.734        Randy McMillan 1981 1986           1-12 CLT NFL    6-0 219 29.7    88  88     990  3876 3.92  24  44.035         Hoyle Granger 1966 1972    4-635-37AFL TOT TOT    6-1 225 29.7    83   0     805  3653 4.54  19  44.036        James R. Jones 1983 1992           1-13 TOT NFL    6-2 229 29.4   135  91    1010  3626 3.59  26  26.937        Tom Woodeshick 1963 1972   8-1024-28AFL TOT NFL    6-0 225 30.5   115   4     836  3577 4.28  21  31.138        DeShaun Foster 2003 2008           2-34 TOT NFL    6-0 222 30.1    79  42     927  3570 3.85  11  45.239         Cullen Bryant 1973 1987           2-31 TOT NFL    6-1 234 30.9   153  71     849  3264 3.84  20  21.340            Amos Marsh 1961 1967                TOT NFL    6-0 218 29.6    95  27     750  3222 4.30  25  33.9

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1r74G2Mm2xQReally excited to see the numbers this guy puts up at the Combine. People keep saying this is a weak draft class? I see more than a few players who are upgrades to players on existing teams.Bell dominates. He can run over or around you. He's got a sick spin-move.6 foot 2.244 lbs.

Can't run over people any more. New rules.

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I believe the comp. I would make to him is Jamal Lewis. The feet are not as nimble but he might be a a tad faster (yet not as quick to wiggle). Probably has more flexibility than Lewis.

I think for Bell it will come down to where he lands. Put him in St. Louis and I'm really starting to watch. Put him in New York as a complement with a specialized role and I don't think he will evolve much past that.

Lewis had a lot more power.
That is because Lewis had sub 4.4 speed. The comparison is not close.
I'm sure you googled that and saw all the hits about him doing that once but he actually timed out at 4.58 at the combine.

[*]http://www.nfldrafts...=2000&genpos=rb

I don't want to derail this into something about 40 times and what people do once or at pro days, etc and I will agree that JLEW played faster than his timed speed but putting all that to the side for a second, I'm saying to look at a comparison (not a copy off a copying machine) of size and especially in this case, the footwork and how they keep their feet under them and move laterally. If you look at those two things, I think you can find something to talk about.

People trying to compare him to Blount just because they both have highlights of hurdling people every once in a while is a waste of time. Look at their play...on the field...beyond a two minute highlight.

Didnt have to google what I remember. Lewis was three inches shorter at 240, so their body types aren't even similar. Nor is their running style. Lewis basically chopped his feet until he saw something and then exploded with what looked like sub 4.4 speed. Given his dimensions it made him much more dificult to tackle him once he got going. Bell is much more agile and creative than Lewis. Steven Jackson is the closest comp.

Edited by Nero

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If Bell were faster and a much better football player his comps would include Steven Jackson and Larry Johnson. But I'm pretty sure he's neither (which is probably why he's slated to be a 3rd or 4th round pick instead of a late first).

Messing around with this again just now, you could also argue that Bell is a bigger but less skilled version of Desean Foster. I don't think that's as useful as the others, but if you were dead set on being optimistic about Bell you could say that he's Foster + meaningful size, and that Bell's added development potential from getting to the NFL at 21 could also help him.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1r74G2Mm2xQReally excited to see the numbers this guy puts up at the Combine. People keep saying this is a weak draft class? I see more than a few players who are upgrades to players on existing teams.Bell dominates. He can run over or around you. He's got a sick spin-move.6 foot 2.244 lbs.

Can't run over people any more. New rules.
Not even close to being right.But I'm assuming this was a joke?

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There's a whole thread devoted to fighting trolls about the new rule changes. Let's keep this one for discussing Bell.

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looks really slow and strong ...90% of his carries he bullies his way through smaller weaker players who wont make it to the NFL.

reminds me of Lamar Blount

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looks really slow and strong ...90% of his carries he bullies his way through smaller weaker players who wont make it to the NFL.reminds me of Lamar Blount

Lamar?

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looks really slow and strong ...90% of his carries he bullies his way through smaller weaker players who wont make it to the NFL.

reminds me of Lamar Blount

:unsure:

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looks really slow and strong ...90% of his carries he bullies his way through smaller weaker players who wont make it to the NFL.

reminds me of Lamar Blount

:unsure:
Lamar, you big dummy! No, wait, that's Lamont! (I realize about 5% of this forum is old enough to get that reference but you just don't get too many chances to reference Sanford & Son these days.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1r74G2Mm2xQReally excited to see the numbers this guy puts up at the Combine. People keep saying this is a weak draft class? I see more than a few players who are upgrades to players on existing teams.Bell dominates. He can run over or around you. He's got a sick spin-move.6 foot 2.244 lbs.

Can't run over people any more. New rules.
Not even close to being right.But I'm assuming this was a joke?
We're gonna find out.

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looks really slow and strong ...90% of his carries he bullies his way through smaller weaker players who wont make it to the NFL.

reminds me of Lamar Blount

:unsure:
Lamar, you big dummy! No, wait, that's Lamont! (I realize about 5% of this forum is old enough to get that reference but you just don't get too many chances to reference Sanford & Son these days.
'LIZABETH!

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I believe the comp. I would make to him is Jamal Lewis. The feet are not as nimble but he might be a a tad faster (yet not as quick to wiggle). Probably has more flexibility than Lewis.

I think for Bell it will come down to where he lands. Put him in St. Louis and I'm really starting to watch. Put him in New York as a complement with a specialized role and I don't think he will evolve much past that.

I like Bell a lot in this draft, but Jamal Lewis coming out of college was a lot faster than Bell. Lewis was a freak size/speed ratio.
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I believe the comp. I would make to him is Jamal Lewis. The feet are not as nimble but he might be a a tad faster (yet not as quick to wiggle). Probably has more flexibility than Lewis.

I think for Bell it will come down to where he lands. Put him in St. Louis and I'm really starting to watch. Put him in New York as a complement with a specialized role and I don't think he will evolve much past that.

Lewis had a lot more power.
That is because Lewis had sub 4.4 speed. The comparison is not close.
I'm sure you googled that and saw all the hits about him doing that once but he actually timed out at 4.58 at the combine.

[*]http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=60760&draftyear=2000&genpos=rb

I don't want to derail this into something about 40 times and what people do once or at pro days, etc and I will agree that JLEW played faster than his timed speed but putting all that to the side for a second, I'm saying to look at a comparison (not a copy off a copying machine) of size and especially in this case, the footwork and how they keep their feet under them and move laterally. If you look at those two things, I think you can find something to talk about.

People trying to compare him to Blount just because they both have highlights of hurdling people every once in a while is a waste of time. Look at their play...on the field...beyond a two minute highlight.

Lewis ran 4.37 on his pro day.

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I like Bell, but he's no Jamal. Not even close. Jamal was an absolute beast when he came out.

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Personally, I've labeled Bell as a mix of Arian Foster/Rashad Jennings/Anthony Dixon.

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Thanks for going into more detail, wdcrob. I'm more curious about your model & methodology here than about Bell in particular; I also see Bell as most likely a backup-caliber RB (I have him ranked 8th in a weak class, and think that Gerhart was a better prospect).

I'm hesitant to rate a player based on only a small number of comparisons, because there is always going to be some noise. I actually think that Wells & Gerhart would have a reasonable chance of being solid starters, if Wells could stay healthy and Gerhart could get a shot. And I don't see any particularly strong reason to think that the next similar prospect (Bell or whoever else) will be continually injured, or stuck behind a superstar.

I also wonder what sets Arian Foster or Stevan Ridley apart from guys like Bell. Bell is taller than them, but only by an inch or two.

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I believe the comp. I would make to him is Jamal Lewis. The feet are not as nimble but he might be a a tad faster (yet not as quick to wiggle). Probably has more flexibility than Lewis.

I think for Bell it will come down to where he lands. Put him in St. Louis and I'm really starting to watch. Put him in New York as a complement with a specialized role and I don't think he will evolve much past that.

Lewis had a lot more power.
That is because Lewis had sub 4.4 speed. The comparison is not close.
I'm sure you googled that and saw all the hits about him doing that once but he actually timed out at 4.58 at the combine.

[*]http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=60760&draftyear=2000&genpos=rb

I don't want to derail this into something about 40 times and what people do once or at pro days, etc and I will agree that JLEW played faster than his timed speed but putting all that to the side for a second, I'm saying to look at a comparison (not a copy off a copying machine) of size and especially in this case, the footwork and how they keep their feet under them and move laterally. If you look at those two things, I think you can find something to talk about.

People trying to compare him to Blount just because they both have highlights of hurdling people every once in a while is a waste of time. Look at their play...on the field...beyond a two minute highlight.

Lewis ran 4.37 on his pro day.
combine numbers are the only ones that are reliable

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only by an inch or two

Depending on who you toss as an outlier on the low end, two inches is 25% of the entire range (66"-74") for a RB's height. Just like .06 is roughly 15% of the typical 40 range for RBs (~4.30 to 4.70).

Those differences seem small because that's how we're used to thinking of them, but the entire premise of what I'm doing is that these aren't minor differences. Or, more specifically, that some of these differences are in fact not just relevant, but decisive. And when you isolate the decisive differences (so that they are the only difference between two groups of players) you can see them pretty clearly.

I'll eventually get to a whole post on RBs like Foster. They're a really unique case that sort of highlights the nature of these decisive variables. They may also highlight a flaw with my rushing metric, but without NCAA charting data I'm not sure I can fix it. Knowing about it seems to be enough though.

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only by an inch or two

Depending on who you toss as an outlier on the low end, two inches is 25% of the entire range (66"-74") for a RB's height. Just like .06 is roughly 15% of the typical 40 range for RBs (~4.30 to 4.70).

Those differences seem small because that's how we're used to thinking of them, but the entire premise of what I'm doing is that these aren't minor differences. Or, more specifically, that some of these differences are in fact not just relevant, but decisive. And when you isolate the decisive differences (so that they are the only difference between two groups of players) you can see them pretty clearly.

I'll eventually get to a whole post on RBs like Foster. They're a really unique case that sort of highlights the nature of these decisive variables. They may also highlight a flaw with my rushing metric, but without NCAA charting data I'm not sure I can fix it. Knowing about it seems to be enough though.

Maybe I should wait for your future post, then. Foster is in the same height range as the Bell comparables that you listed (over 6', and taller than Gerhart or Daniel Thomas), so there must be something more going on than just height. Interesting that Alfred Morris seems like a similar type of back as Foster (they're among the few successful big slow backs), when he is almost 3 inches shorter.

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I believe the comp. I would make to him is Jamal Lewis. The feet are not as nimble but he might be a a tad faster (yet not as quick to wiggle). Probably has more flexibility than Lewis.

I think for Bell it will come down to where he lands. Put him in St. Louis and I'm really starting to watch. Put him in New York as a complement with a specialized role and I don't think he will evolve much past that.

Lewis had a lot more power.
That is because Lewis had sub 4.4 speed. The comparison is not close.
I'm sure you googled that and saw all the hits about him doing that once but he actually timed out at 4.58 at the combine.

[*]http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=60760&draftyear=2000&genpos=rb

I don't want to derail this into something about 40 times and what people do once or at pro days, etc and I will agree that JLEW played faster than his timed speed but putting all that to the side for a second, I'm saying to look at a comparison (not a copy off a copying machine) of size and especially in this case, the footwork and how they keep their feet under them and move laterally. If you look at those two things, I think you can find something to talk about.

People trying to compare him to Blount just because they both have highlights of hurdling people every once in a while is a waste of time. Look at their play...on the field...beyond a two minute highlight.

Lewis ran 4.37 on his pro day.
combine numbers are the only ones that are reliable
Not in this case, because Lewis was a lot faster than 4.58.

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What does Le'Veon Bell do better than Latavius Murray?

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What does Le'Veon Bell do better than Latavius Murray?

He's more nimble, but that's part of the problem. He doesn't use his size or weight effectively at all. I do like Murray as a late round flier in a similar mold.

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What does Le'Veon Bell do better than Latavius Murray?

Break tackles! I must admit, Murray was not even on my radar. Seems to have pretty good agility, but seems to lose all power when he has to make a move and goes down too easily. He is a supersized speed back. I'd still prefer Bell, but Murray's pro day suggest he is definitely someone I need to keep tabs on, so thank you. Edited by Nero

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If Bell were faster and a much better football player his comps would include Steven Jackson and Larry Johnson. But I'm pretty sure he's neither (which is probably why he's slated to be a 3rd or 4th round pick instead of a late first).

What are you basing your speed for SJAX And LJ on? Neither ran at the combine which negates an apples to apples comparison. SJAX may not have been 100% healthy during his pro day but both of his runs were over 4.5. I don't see much difference between a combine 4.6 and pro day 4.5+. LJ ran a sub 4.5 at his pro day and I've no doubt he's faster than Bell just not sure if that's much of a difference.

Either way I don't expect Bell to be running by a lot of people. His assets are he led the nation in yards after contact and had the highest percentage of non negative running plays in the nation. So maybe he lacks break away speed but that's suggestive of a guy keep the chains moving kind of RB. What really assists his value is he's got good hands and is regarded as one of the better blocking backs so he's got a solid chance to be in the game on passing downs.

Personally I see his upside as Eddie George. Again, that's upside.

I do believe he'll get picked in the second round of the NFL draft. I also believe both he and Jonathan Franklin take some of the biggest post NFL draft fantasy rookie rankings of the RB position.

I say all that and I still don't love the guy or anything. To use a Mayock expression I'm not pounding the table for him for him or anything because nothing he does jumps out at you but I see things in his game which suggest he can be a solid every down NFL RB.

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from Rotoworld:

Pass happy NFL teams are excited about Michigan State RB Le'Veon Bell's blocking and receiving skills, according to former scout Daniel Jeremiah.

Jeremiah believes Bell is "a good fit for the pro game." That comfort in and agility in space is nice, but we worry that Bell takes too long to get going and might need to be given the second level to succeed. regardless, Bell could be selected on the draft's second day.
Edited by Faust

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bump for steelers' fans looking for bell fodder. seems like he's somewhere between TJ Duckett and Steven Jackson....a comparison to Jamal Lewis?? c'mon now.

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I'll freely admit I don't do in depth scouting like a lot of guys around here but from the highlight clips he looked to me like he was a fairly upright runner and did not seem very shifty. I have not read the scouting report on him.

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How about Merrill Hoge throwing him under the bus when he announced the pick..... "Wouldn't have been my pick..." what a tool to ruin this guys moment!

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How about Merrill Hoge throwing him under the bus when he announced the pick..... "Wouldn't have been my pick..." what a tool to ruin this guys moment!

:lol:

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How about Merrill Hoge throwing him under the bus when he announced the pick..... "Wouldn't have been my pick..." what a tool to ruin this guys moment!

:lol:

I don't think he was throwing him under the bus, I think people read that wrong. He said that because he's always preaching about the need for a factor back. So when he said this is not even my pick he was not bashing Bell I think he was more or less commenting on the irony of how much emphasis he puts on the RB position. That's how I read it anyway.

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How about Merrill Hoge throwing him under the bus when he announced the pick..... "Wouldn't have been my pick..." what a tool to ruin this guys moment!

:lol:

I don't think he was throwing him under the bus, I think people read that wrong. He said that because he's always preaching about the need for a factor back. So when he said this is not even my pick he was not bashing Bell I think he was more or less commenting on the irony of how much emphasis he puts on the RB position. That's how I read it anyway.

You are correct.

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Got the Bell write up done today.

I'd compared him to Wells in another thread where I was arguing that Wells couldn't stay healthy because the combo of a bad build (tall) with poor vision is a death sentence for RBs, but at the time wasn't arguing for Wells was a good Bell comp. But I should have been.

IMO Bell's a slower, less explosive version of Wells. With his size he could be useful in a limited role, but I'd be shocked if he can stay on the field.

I dont recall Bell missing significant time in college due to injury.

Just the opposite with Beanie.

Looks like Wells played 36/39 games at Ohio State? Was he nicked up a lot?

Regardless, I'm not really looking at college games missed data -- just what's happened to similar players in the NFL.

hmmm, that number is surprising with Beanie, I thought it was much worse

Pretty sure he left a lot of games early with various "dings". I could be misremembering though.

No your memory is working just fine. Wells showed he was damaged goods before even coming into the Nfl and worse he has poor work ethic and a lack of motivation to play through minor injuries. Despite physical abilities that one looks for Wells was a bad prospect because of the intangibles that came with him.

I hate the comparison of Wells to Bell. I do not consider them similar players in any way. Bell is much bigger, more powerful and more elusive than Wells without the poor work ethic and injury history.

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Very happy an over rated back on rival college team was over drafted by rival pro team. Easier to avoid.

Problem is squeelers nailed the rest of the draft.

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How about Merrill Hoge throwing him under the bus when he announced the pick..... "Wouldn't have been my pick..." what a tool to ruin this guys moment!

:lol:

Hoge has always been a tool but he nailed this one. Bell isn't powerful, quick, or elusive. They drafted a decent pass blocker

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How about Merrill Hoge throwing him under the bus when he announced the pick..... "Wouldn't have been my pick..." what a tool to ruin this guys moment!

:lol:

Hoge has always been a tool but he nailed this one. Bell isn't powerful, quick, or elusive. They drafted a decent pass blocker

Bell has the 11th best 3 cone time for all RB in the combine since 2006. To say he is not elusive is exactly the kind of comment I would expect out of a clueless guy like Hodge however who never really recovered from all of those concussions.

EAST LANSING — The most important scouting reports and breakdowns of NFL prospects belong to the 32 teams that have picks in the upcoming NFL draft.

But it's worth listening to scouting reports from outsiders, particularly a former NFL director of scouting and player personnel with the Super Bowl-winning San Francisco 49ers of 1994-95 (49-26 over San Diego).

Vinny Cerrato, who concluded his decorated NFL executive career after a nine-year stint as vice president of football operations for the Washington Redskins in 2009, recently gave his scouting breakdown of former Michigan State star LeVeon Bell for Baltimore radio station 105.7 FM The Fan.

After running through Bell's NFL combine numbers, which included his size (6-foot-1, 230 pounds), his 40-yard dash time (4.6 seconds), vertical leap (31 1/2 inches), broad jump (9-10) and 3-cone time (6.75 seconds, "excellent,'' Cerrato said), the former NFL executive broke down Bell's strengths and weaknesses on the football field.

"His strengths: he has good size, he's strong, he's got quickness in the hole, good feet, power, good vision, good slide step, has make-you-miss ability,'' Cerrato said. "Will drop pads and move the pile. He's tough, he can break tackles, strong stiff arm, has a little burst.

"Weakness: outside speed. He runs tall, needs to work in pass protection, not an East-West runner. Will dance too much at times getting the ball upfield,'' he said. "In summary … good size, excellent quicks and phenomenal lateral agility.''

Cerrato then gave his prediction for how Bell will be used by an NFL team.

"He will be a first- and second-down back that needs work in pass pro (-tection), and has some receiving production, but all short drop-off routes,'' he said. "I like him inside, can drop pads and run with power. He's a big back that can play like a small back.

Not an outside runner.''

Cerrato concluded with his NFL Draft projection for Bell and re-emphasized the key points on his scouting report.

"I said he'll be third round (pick), he's got a chance to be late-second (round) pick,'' Cerrato said. "He's not an outside guy, he's a first- second-down guy, you have to have a complimentary back. The thing he can do, he's got excellent feet and quickness in the hole, he can jump cut, he can lateral step and make you miss in the hole.

"He's got to learn to drop his pads, because he's going to get crushed. He's not a great route runner. He'll catch short routes. He does not have outside speed, he cannot get the edge.''

http://www.mlive.com/spartans/index.ssf/2013/04/former_49ers_super_bowl_direct.html

Edited by Biabreakable

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How about Merrill Hoge throwing him under the bus when he announced the pick..... "Wouldn't have been my pick..." what a tool to ruin this guys moment!

:lol:

Hoge has always been a tool but he nailed this one. Bell isn't powerful, quick, or elusive. They drafted a decent pass blocker

We do agree Hoge has always been a tool but you are reading this 100% wrong. He was not putting Bell down, not even the slightest. The reverse in fact.

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Coming around on him as a Steeler fan. I thought he was Dwyer all over again, but on http://youtu.be/1r74G2Mm2xQ 2nd look, I'll say Mendenhall if he knew when to use the circle button.

I was higher on him than most because he's nimble for his size, but he doesn't make much happen on his own or go outside. He'll excel with good blocking up the middle since he doesn't waste much time hitting the hole and has some moves to make people miss. I don't think the Steelers expect him to be the next Bettis but he's a solid RB for what they need.

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