BigTex
Don't mess with Texas
They might not but it remains to be true. AJ need someone that can sling it deep.............being from Ft. Worth I'm a Dalton fan but he is what is he.
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RB Giovani Bernard, TB (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Kleck
- Start date
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
How does Dalton's #'s stack up against Drew Brees after 2 yeras in the league? I'm not saying it to be sarcastic or implying that Dalton will be the next Brees but I'm just curious.
Markus P Dub
Footballguy
Is Cobb for Gio an ok deal? I'm desperate at RB and have WR depth to let Cobb go. Non ppr.
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Caesar
Footballguy
Bengals homer here. I think part of the reason we are seeing Gio in there so much on goal line situations is how versatile he makes the offense. Put BJGE in at the goal line and teams cheat guys in the box. Sure, it leaves Green 1on1 on the outside for the mostly predictable fade route, but that option is less recognizable if the DB is thinking he has to watch for the RB in the flat. Something he never worries about with BJGE.
I just see Gio as making the offense less predictable and for Cincinnati, that is something they have struggled with.
Kid is fun to watch and I was very excited to see him drafted back in April.
I just see Gio as making the offense less predictable and for Cincinnati, that is something they have struggled with.
Kid is fun to watch and I was very excited to see him drafted back in April.
Banger
Footballguy
they should. The playoffs will be huge and if he has another dud the writing will be on the wall.
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Faust
MVP
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Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
Giovani Bernard played on 50 snaps while BenJarvus Green-Ellis played 18 in Sunday's loss to the Browns.
zamboni
Footballguy
Interesting - it was clear based on the number of touches that Bernard was in there more, but didn't think it was that lopsided. Notably, the game was pretty close throughout, so one can't point to the team being in true catch-up mode where Bernard would get most of the work in the passing game.
It seems clear that the shift to Bernard has happened. While I doubt it, I do wonder in the short term if Marvin will throw a bone to BJGE next week by giving him much more work against his old team.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
I think BGE's final straw was that piss-poor attempt of a run on the 4th and 1. If he cant help there, he's worthless.zamboni said:
BigTex
Don't mess with Texas
I'm not going to get into comparing QBs because that's not what I do. IMHO they need an upgrade at that position and IMHO Dalton is not that guy to take them to the next level. This is a different era from even when Brees first came on the scene and there's absolutely no comparison at this point so I'm not going there.
msudaisy26
Footballguy
Matt Ryan threw a horrible deep ball until he started working on it after Julio got there. Give the kid time. It took Brees 4 years before he broke out and he looked horrible and lost the 2 years he started. He had weapons too, Gates, LT, David Boston. Boston was on the down side but still decent.
Mr. Retukes
Footballguy
Brees' one bad year was 2003, when Gates was a raw rookie who hadn't played football since high school. I wouldn't count that as one of Brees' "weapons".
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BigTex
Don't mess with Texas
1. It has nothing to do with Matt Ryan.msudaisy26 said:
2. You are waaaaayyyy of the mark and missing two real facts about Brees and that entire situation.
3. Let's respect that fact that this thread is officially about Gio. If you wish to start another thread about Dalton then let it be.
Let's just end this so we can move one.
1. There was nothing wrong with Brees, he just happen to be on a horrid team that drafted on of the best running backs in the game.
2. With that being said the LT had more carries than Brees had passing attempts EVERY year he was in SD........why? Because at that time the NFL run first sport and it there's was one running back carrying the load with an average back coming in to give him a breather or two.
3. Around the time Brees hit NO the game began to change to a QB league.........i.e. Pass oriented (which began around 2004 with 5 QB throwing over 4,000yds) Brees went to NO with Sean in 2006 and was the #1 pass QB in the NFL. That same year four other QBs threw for over 4,000 and the NFL being a copycat league began to change the way they ran their offense and slowly every year the value of running backs began to decline.
4. Can't fault Brees for having the best running back in the NFL who had more carries than Brees had pass attempts every year (again it was a different era).
5. SD was a run first Offense, NO is a pass first, this is a fact so let's end this and continue with our love for Gio.
Giddy Up,
Tex
5. Brees blew up not because he wasn't good before he went to NO it was just a different style of game and coaching.
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and you wouldn't be alone in that thinking. I guess the 2013 class wasn't so bad after all.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
It is not completely barren of value and Bernard is likely the best prospect besides Eifert. But make no mistake the 2013 draft class is one of the worst I have seen for skill players in a long time. There are many WR who could emerge from this draft class but none of them are sure fire things either.
Bob Magaw
Footballguy
bernard is a little stick of dynamite...
the comps invoked earlier (westbrook and rice) have been pretty apt...
i think he doesn't run a 4.4, but neither did westbrook...
he has very good functional, playing speed...
and not the same thing, but powerful in combination, electric quickness and cutting ability...
probably not as strong as westbrook or able to break tackles, but gio is quicker and even shiftier than I remember westbrook being.
his outstanding receiving ability is also westbrook/rice-like (also faulk and reggie bush at his best, who were/are more dangerous because of their ability to not only catch out of the backfield, but line up, run routes and catch like a WR).
the comps invoked earlier (westbrook and rice) have been pretty apt...
i think he doesn't run a 4.4, but neither did westbrook...
he has very good functional, playing speed...
and not the same thing, but powerful in combination, electric quickness and cutting ability...
probably not as strong as westbrook or able to break tackles, but gio is quicker and even shiftier than I remember westbrook being.
his outstanding receiving ability is also westbrook/rice-like (also faulk and reggie bush at his best, who were/are more dangerous because of their ability to not only catch out of the backfield, but line up, run routes and catch like a WR).
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cheese
Footballguy
I have been as impressed as anyone with Gio's start, but I'll play devil's advocate for you if that's what you're looking for.
In redraft, you just cannot rule out BJGE. I think this stays a time share and if I had to guess, I would say last week's snap distribution was either gameplan specific or tied to Ben's fumble. The Bengals still do not having passing to RBs (or even letting them run routes) as a key component to their offensive scheme. He's done well with the opportunities he's gotten in the passing game, but those opps are going to be limited indefinitely by the Gruden/Marvin regime IMO. I think the comparisons to Westbrook are dead on (way more than Rice IMO), but Westbrook played in an offense that catered to his skill set. I just can't see the Bengals suddenly overhauling what they do on offense to align with Gio.
Dynasty, sky's the limit. Kid can ball and the offense is there to help him put up big stats.
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Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
This is his breakout week if you're in a PPR IMO. I'm expecting 20+ for Gio this week. First 100 yard game
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
zamboni
Footballguy
I don't think we can say for sure. All we know is that the staff likes/trusts him and have said during pre-season that he can be a 3-down back.
As for this weekend, he may not get 20+ carries, but against New England where they may be in catchup mode, he may get a lot of touches as a receiver.
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Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
Phantom Knight
Footballguy
Yes, cheese, thanks for posting... Was looking for what Gio's limits/downsides might be. I am hoping that you prove to be wrong in in your thoughts about Gruden/Marvin and that sooner rather than later, they will begin to adapt the offense to take advantage of Gio's skill set.
I play almost exclusively dynasty/keeper so my thoughts are more towards next year and beyond as Gio is currently on my bench. I have received some interesting offers for Gio, but so far have not accepted any as I am thinking I may want to keep him myself.
T with T
Footballguy
yes good analysis I see what he was saying CIN doesn't do alot of routes to rbs and I think they may need to wake up and try to get GIO more in the Jamaal charles, reggie bush, darren sproles type of receiving game. He has the skills to be a great wr they need to get him more involved in the passing game quick, but like you say is Marvin gonna do that, probably not... 2-4 catches a game isn't bad with 15+ carries. I guess Im hoping for that he is my RB1
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
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zamboni
Footballguy
I was hoping it wouldn't work out this way yesterday, but seemed clear that the team was committed to feeding BJGE yesterday (19 touches to 15 for Gio). Not sure if it was because they were playing the Pats, or the weather had some effect, but BJGE is not going away anytime soon. Even though he averaged his typical 3.5 YPC, the Bengals winning a hard fought game against a big time conference opponent will likely keep BJGE very much in the game plan. Seems like the stated 50/50 split - give or take - is what we can expect going forward.
QuizGuy66
Footballguy
Gio's fumble did not help his cause yesterday. When the Bengals are ahead and in sock-it-away mode they are going to have BJGE on the field. I do think that facing the Patriots was a factor with Law Firm's increased role yesterday (the Bengals have had pretty look fortune when they have a back facing their old club - see Benson, Cedric a few years ago). I also think that BJGE looked very good yesterday and that probably made it easier to have him work more. The Pats injuries on the line probably was something in Law Firm's favor as well encouraging more up the gut stuff. Ultimately it's going to be horse for courses with these two at this point.
-QG
-QG
Hu-Tang Clan
Footballguy
I've started him the last 4 weeks.fbelange said:
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
There will be bumps in the road, folks. You have to know this... he's a rookie.
Also, I suspect the game called for a lot of BJGE hammering away at the soft belly of the Pats' defense without Vince Wilfork. It won't be like that every week.
Also, I suspect the game called for a lot of BJGE hammering away at the soft belly of the Pats' defense without Vince Wilfork. It won't be like that every week.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
And all of that said, his "terrible day" still yielded about 9 points in a PPR league. This should be as bad as it ever gets.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
And 13 for 61 still looks pretty good to me. I think the weather combined with BGE's running style is why he got extra carried.
zamboni
Footballguy
Didn't know about the fumble - went to game log and it came about midway through the 4th quarter after he had 4 straight touches with solid yardage picked up. Good to see that Marvin was giving him clock-killing responsibilities - hopefully the fumble doesn't cause team brass to lose any confidence in him in those situations.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
Well I can tell you it did. Bernard was gone the rest of the game.
It also concerned me that BJGE was getting there short yardage and goaline carries again even though Bernard has been fantastic at them and BJGE hasn't really been that good. BJGE has ended up being successful a few times, but it's been mostly a result of being force fed at the goaline rather than doing a great job converting.
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
mere blitzianity
Footballguy
Guys, everyone needs to chillax and realize he will still have some big moments this year. Actually, I see him having a nice game against the Bills this week.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
PFF has Bio ranked as their number 3 overall RB through 5 weeks. That's a pretty good indication that he's doing something good with the ball just about every time he touches it.
zamboni
Footballguy
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Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
Raider Nation
Devil's Advocate
JustinHawkins
Footballguy
He looks really good. Very fluid and quick too
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