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Dave Gerczak - FFPC

2013 Footballguys Players Championship: $250,000 Grand Prize

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Of course they can raise it-- there is no imaginary law that says that they can not raise the prizes (you just say that due to strong participation we have decided to raise the prize pool-- look at other contests and you will see that it is done to keep payouts at a certain rate even if its not stated that way). As mentioned I'll be staying away from this contest next year and possibly stick to the main-- although Ill have to sign up late to make sure this same thing doesn't happen in that contest. You may notice that almost all of the other tournaments around say that they will close entries entirely at XXX entries -- simple solution but the operators would rather make this as large as possible. Again, I have the utmost respect for the team but at some point you have to say that this is really just a lottery especially with the percentage payout and yes I'll be saying the same thing even if I finish in the top 5 places.

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I for one did not know about that law where u cant raise the prize $, so I stand corrected on that. What about those 'entries' into the following year FFPC? Do those fall in line with actual prize $? Just curious. Can they not be added as secondary prizes ? BTW, im not a disgruntled owner by any stretch will be 5-1, 4-2 and 3-3 after this week. Just wanted to throw that out there as im not just a bitter owner channeling a bad seasons' frustration to this board.

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keep in mind, i don't know the law. i'm just taking this from experience and hearsay from ffpc and nffc.

the supposed law is that you can't promise to escalate prizes to a certain amount once a certain amount of entries are reached. you can, however, indiscriminately add prizes such as future entries if you choose to reward the contestants for creating a larger than expected prize pool. adding football guys entries has happened in the past. i don't know if you can add new cash prizes in the mix.

this is why most contests cap the number of entrants in order to guarantee a payout percentage (most contests are at least 80%.)

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Well said heropretend and that is exactly my issue -- why go into an open ended contest as to participation levels where the payout could end up being well below what other contests have as their payout percentage when you can go into a capped one where you know that the payout is 80%+. I'd love to hear from the operators to see what the final percentage payout ended up being for this year and if they might consider putting some type of cap to entries in for next year. Also, I don't want to be completely negative in these posts as the operators have done a lot of great things especially with the escrow payments and in making quick payments when the contests end each year and the customer service has generally been decent with any types of league issues. If they are willing to put in some type of entrant cap next year and I can calculate that we are getting a decent percentage payout then I would be willing to reconsider and join in again next year.

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The money issue aside, the air of the posts made by FFPC reps read as "This is how it is, go #### yourself if you don't like it."

Whether people are getting duped out of equity is one question, that you don't understand that Customer Service is job #1 is another and I find it hilarious.

Instead of, "Hey, sorry about the misunderstanding, we're doing our best" you decided to go on the defensive.

Good luck offering a duplicatable service in a saturated market while ####ting on your customers, you'll need it.

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The money issue aside, the air of the posts made by FFPC reps read as "This is how it is, go #### yourself if you don't like it."

Whether people are getting duped out of equity is one question, that you don't understand that Customer Service is job #1 is another and I find it hilarious.

Instead of, "Hey, sorry about the misunderstanding, we're doing our best" you decided to go on the defensive.

Good luck offering a duplicatable service in a saturated market while ####ting on your customers, you'll need it.

If that is how you view my posts, then there is nothing I can say to you to make you change your mind. What I can tell you is, if I wanted my posts to be interpreted as a "This is how it is, go #### yourself if you don't like it", then I would have been much more clear in my words. But that was not my intention. I was responding to inquiries about the prize structure, which I don't view as an issue of customer service. So I can't simply respond they way you want me to to this inquiry, which you suggest to be "Hey, sorry about the misunderstanding, we're doing our best". Had I done that, it would have been disingenuous and not my style. Sorry.

I did however tried to explain that our prize structure is what it is for a number of complex reasons. I also understand that not everyone will accept these reasons and are OK with that. All we can do is do our best in putting out a great contest, with the biggest prize structure we can and offer our participants the best experience, topping that off with first class customer service. We feel we have done that year in and year out with the FFPC and the Footballguys Players Championship and will continue in 2014 and beyond.

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Alex- to assist us in evaluating the contest, can you please provide us with a percentage payout. I think this will go a long way in determining the competitiveness. Thanks

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Alex- to assist us in evaluating the contest, can you please provide us with a percentage payout. I think this will go a long way in determining the competitiveness. Thanks

WHY don't you ask this question of Joe & David - this IS the FBGPC

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Alex- to assist us in evaluating the contest, can you please provide us with a percentage payout. I think this will go a long way in determining the competitiveness. Thanks

Payout percentage according to our calculations are right at around the 78-80% range. If you want to figure out the exact payout percentage, that is something that we will let you determine on your own, if that is important to you. Our prizes are stated, including cash prizes, next year's free entries, all the FBG 1-year (for early bird registration), 3-year and lifetime subscriptions, medals for league championships and custom trophy for the overall champion. Also keep in mind that only about half of the 5820 entries are $350 while the other half came as part of the 3-pack for $1000 deal.

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how do u win the league? Win the playoffs ? So, a top seeded team for the regular season who also is #1 in total pts could lose the first round of the playoffs(1 game=very high variance), and not receive any $ ?? No reward for dominating the regular season? Sounds like a horrible deal if this is true. Can't seem to find where League winners are detailed on the site, hough.

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You have to come in either 1st or 2nd so in other words you have to win the first week to get paid. Payouts are $1,500 for first and $500 for second.

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Prize payouts aside, let's discuss owners who abandon teams after 6 or 7 weeks and other owners get to play teams with starting rosters filled with injured players with viable bench players who could be played.

Example, team is 3-7, decides this week to play Aaron Rodgers at QB, had other choices on bench but has abandoned the team and the opposing owner gets an easy win and goes on to the playoffs.

Abandoned teams are my bigger issue and how unfair it becomes in weeks 8-11 as the games get bigger and bigger. I think a Commish should step in and at least fill out a starting roster. It's not fair to other owners who play a full team in early weeks.

I Commish many leagues and the same ones for years now, would never allow it to happen in much smaller stakes leagues.

Nice job Alex on the FFPC, looking forward hopefully to a deep playoff run.

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Prize payouts aside, let's discuss owners who abandon teams after 6 or 7 weeks and other owners get to play teams with starting rosters filled with injured players with viable bench players who could be played.

Example, team is 3-7, decides this week to play Aaron Rodgers at QB, had other choices on bench but has abandoned the team and the opposing owner gets an easy win and goes on to the playoffs.

Abandoned teams are my bigger issue and how unfair it becomes in weeks 8-11 as the games get bigger and bigger. I think a Commish should step in and at least fill out a starting roster. It's not fair to other owners who play a full team in early weeks.

I Commish many leagues and the same ones for years now, would never allow it to happen in much smaller stakes leagues.

Nice job Alex on the FFPC, looking forward hopefully to a deep playoff run.

Here's what I posted in another thread on this subject:

Team abandonment is not a new issue to us, and obviously an old issue in the FF hobby. We've discussed, debated and considered various actions or programming to try and "fix" the problem. There has not been anything we could come up with within our technological abilities which we thought would fix the abandonment issue without creating more problems. Keep in mind that this cannot be a league by league or team by team fix. We have hundreds of leagues within our contests and any "fix" has to function across all leagues and take a lot of things into consideration.

With that said, we have not just thrown up our hands altogether. We are in the process of building our new league management software which will go live for 2014 season and we hope the new technology will allow us more ability to find a solution, at least a partial one, to improve team abandonment.

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Here's another suggestion for this tournament.

I think weighting the scores in weeks 14-16 as 75% of the tournament is a bit unfair. When u consider teams at the top of leaderboard made it there as the top teams over 11 weeks. And only to have that average count as 25% ???

I would propose making the regular season point average as 50% and taking the average scores from weeks 14-16 as the other 50%. Then using those 2 #'s as the cumulative score

You can theoretically have an average team blow up for 3 weeks and take the grand prize.

Tournament leader has an average 169 pts/game. That will be just a 1 week total of the 4 weeks used for the final #. So a team who averaged say 129/game would have to outscore that guy by 40 pts only over a 3 week stretch to move ahead of him?? Doesnt that seem odd. The leader AVERAGED 40 pts per game more then this other team. That is an additional 440 pts over the course of the season. To lose that edge for 1 sub-par week in weeks 14-16, i dont know, just doesnt seem right. I realize they have the regular season standings prizes, but its 1-5th place only. You can be a mediocre team, come in 25th overall place, and you're getting more $ then the #1 overall season pts leader who led 5,800 teams in total pts. I like this tournament but it can def stand for some adjusting of the prize structure.

Any thoughts Alex?

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Looks like the winner had 17 teams nice return on his investment.Had Eli as his QB I wouldn't have guessed that.

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Just goes to show how much crazy luck you need to win this thing. This guy started NE defense over Arizona? Zona was coming off games of 24 and 15 Pts while NE last 2 games were 1 and 6 Pts respectively. Ummm what the?? ...and that 1 move will net him another 215k. Man oh man. .

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I played around with the numbers a bit for the tournament and came up with a payout of 76%.This is based on an average cost of $345 per entry (I knocked down $5 since Ill guess 1/4 to 1/3 of people went with 3-packs and this of course assumes no further discounts for some of the largest players). This brings the total to a little over $2M in entry costs. The prizes then are 966,000 for the leagues assuming 483 leagues for 966,000 + 532,500 in cash prizes or entries into next years FBG leaving 502,500 out of a little over 2M for profit or a payout of roughly 76%. Note I didn't value the FBG subscriptions since I think many already have it but maybe you could add another percentage point if those were added.

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Looks like Coots has won this bad boy. BWaz needs a 36 point effort from old man Tony Gonzales against the Niners. Not happening.

Of note, in Coots draft of the winning team he did not select a quarterback until the 13th round! His QB's were Eli Manning, EJ Mannuel, and Josh McCown.

Yea but he wasn't a great team during the reg season either. Averaged 148 pts/game which is solid but nothing spectacular. It's a case of a decent team going on a 3-week mega tear. What this competition is all about I suppose. I'd guess he was around 300-400th place going into the championship rds. I'd still like to know why he opted for NE defense over Az. Ha

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I am amazed at all the hate and complaining about this contest in this forum. This is my 4th year competing in this competition and I have loved every minute of it.

This is a well run competition.

The best there is.

Great job guys!

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Excellent job in changing the contest for next year to limit entries. I think this is a great move and gives us much more clarity on potential # of entries. Thanks for listening!!

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Just to clarify, those who won leagues and chose the option for the 3 free entries are already included in the capped # correct? Would seem obvious but I just want to confirm. Thx

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Just to clarify, those who won leagues and chose the option for the 3 free entries are already included in the capped # correct? Would seem obvious but I just want to confirm. Thx

Yes, absolutely. All entries will count towards the total contest cap.

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