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Game of Thrones, tv only, books don't exist, no backstory...NERDS already ruining a series that hasn't started (3 Viewers)

Ghost Rider said:
Most would rather just piss and moan.  The backlash to this last season just shows how awful the internet can be. 
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As someone with a Breaking Bad icon, you should know how a final season and series finale is done.  People wouldn't piss and moan about GoT if it was good. 

Those pissing and moaning about the pissing and moaning just don't have high standards for the final season of a show that was setting the bar pretty high.  

 
Captain Cranks said:
As someone with a Breaking Bad icon, you should know how a final season and series finale is done.  People wouldn't piss and moan about GoT if it was good. 

Those pissing and moaning about the pissing and moaning just don't have high standards for the final season of a show that was setting the bar pretty high.  
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The last season was not great and had some clear flaws. I have said that, but this idea that it was terrible, awful, etc. is just way over the top.  There were a crap load of great GoT moments in Season 8. 

Also, it is unrealistic to expect other shows to be as close to flawless as Breaking Bad was from start to finish.  Even The Sopranos, which I'd also put in the GoT category, had a choppy last season (or two if we want to count 6a and 6b as two).  It is not easy to do that many seasons and never have hiccups.  

 
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Ghost Rider said:
The last season was not great and had some clear flaws. I have said that, but this idea that it was terrible, awful, etc. is just way over the top.  There were a crap load of great GoT moments in Season 8. 

Also, it is unrealistic to expect other shows to be as close to flawless as Breaking Bad was from start to finish.  Even The Sopranos, which I'd also put in the GoT category, had a choppy last season (or two if we want to count 6a and 6b as two).  It is not easy to do that many seasons and never have hiccups.  
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Yeah the whole vito story line was awful as was the actually ending of sopranos....i dd like the phil vs tony war though.....

 
Lena  Headey (Cersei)  refused to do any scenes with Jerome Flynn (Bronn).   Seems they use to date and evidently had a bad breakup.  They don’t even speak to each other.

 
Ilov80s said:
Tywin, Robert, Cersei, and Tyrion might be the 4 best characters on the show- I could watch endlessly 
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and Joffrey bought an awful lot of mustard, as well ... gotta hand it to that kid Gleeson, he was a pitch perfect villainous lil' ####  :thumbup:

Dance and Headey and Dinklage are Grade-A heavyweights, their scenes together are some of the finest acting one could hope to ever see on any screen or stage - they were magnificent.

... and Bobby B, greatest King the realm ever saw - need we say more?  :hifive:

 
Ilov80s said:
Tywin, Robert, Cersei, and Tyrion might be the 4 best characters on the show- I could watch endlessly 
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I can't put Robert on that list (he was great, but wasn't around long enough), but I agree that Tywin, Cersei and Tyrion were all incredible characters.  Those damn Lannisters. :lol:  

 
sho nuff said:
Watched Return of the Jedi last night...wondering if a board like this or Twitter was around how many would have complained about Boba Fett getting such a lame death by Han accidentally activating his rockets sending him into the sarlacc pit
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That would have been buried under the Ewok travesty.

TBH, I didn't get that bent about Boba Fett's death, and I had 2 Boba Fett action figures that you got by sending in the Proof of Purchase 'tags' from other merchandise.

 
otb_lifer said:
empty Sunday night ... it was a helluva run.

recalling the power of the earlier writing - the show had unparalleled brilliance; the latter seasons just don't compare  :shrug:

i'm not TIRED!

pops laying it down

jugglers and singers require applause

favorite scene of the lot
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That scene with Robert and Cersei was incredible.  Probably the first time in 17 years they spoke honestly with each other.

Cersei's "Our marriage " still cracks me up, but it is also very sad

 
Charlie Steiner said:
That would have been buried under the Ewok travesty.

TBH, I didn't get that bent about Boba Fett's death, and I had 2 Boba Fett action figures that you got by sending in the Proof of Purchase 'tags' from other merchandise.
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And talk about poor planning...hiding Luke from his father and the empower by placing him with...Skywalkers? Yeah great plan there.  Big power the dark side is they couldn’t figure that one out. 

 
sho nuff said:
Watched Return of the Jedi last night...wondering if a board like this or Twitter was around how many would have complained about Boba Fett getting such a lame death by Han accidentally activating his rockets sending him into the sarlacc pit
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Would’ve been a nightmare and the same people complaining about everything else now probably love that movie. 

 
Capella said:
Well I’m hoping here I pick up some skills for how to write scripts for a mega-huge tv show. 
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I’m not sure what you’re getting at?  One can’t have an opinion about the quality of the writing if they have not written a screenplay themselves?

 
zoonation said:
I’m not sure what you’re getting at?  One can’t have an opinion about the quality of the writing if they have not written a screenplay themselves?
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No. Somebody said in here last week that half the people in this thread could have written a better season. 

 
Definitely a bit disappointed in the story the last season or two.  Just felt like too many interesting storylines were left unresolved or brought to abrupt endings.  Everything else remained good, but part of the appeal of GoT was all the intriguing hints and side plots and too many of those were abandoned or didn't have satisfying payoffs.  I'm sure plenty of people have come up with better ideas, but a few threads could have been tied together by connecting the Night King, Faceless Men and Lord of Light.  Maybe something like the NIght King represents death and seeks to make all living things die.  The Lord of Light represent Life and seeks to spread life.  The Faceless Men represent balance between life and death...they kill those who are supposed to die and allow life for those who are supposed to live...life and death are two sides of the same coin.  Instead of Arya killing the Night King just being her stabbing a bad guy to death, she could be using Faceless Man abilities to bring balance back to the world and send the Night King back north for another few thousand years. 

The idea of "power resides where men believe it to be" could have been tied into this too.  When too many people despair, the Night King's influence grows.  When too many are overoptimistic, the Lord of Light becomes too strong.  So whatever actions Arya took could have been something that gave people hope and reduced the Night King's power that way.

The point of the Three Eyed Raven could have been that by seeing that past, Bran was able to see that no matter how bad or how good things look at any time, they cycle back and forth around some balance.  So his sharing of what he saw in the past could have also brought enough hope to people to limit the power of the Night King.

 
Capella said:
Would’ve been a nightmare and the same people complaining about everything else now probably love that movie. 
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I was thinking about this thread while watching S1 of the Sopranos a few days ago on a flight...I mean, both of the hired hit men basically handed their guns to Tony in his truck...they couldn’t have stood back 10 feet and fired away? I chuckled and kept enjoying.

 
gump said:
I was thinking about this thread while watching S1 of the Sopranos a few days ago on a flight...I mean, both of the hired hit men basically handed their guns to Tony in his truck...they couldn’t have stood back 10 feet and fired away? I chuckled and kept enjoying.
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Exactly. 

Heck, we could point at the episode in S2 of Game of Thrones where Littlefinger clearly recognizes Arya when talking to Twyin, and even though he reacts to seeing her and his eyes follow her as she crosses the room, Tywin, a guy who never missed a thing, didn't notice despite the fact that he was looking right at Littlefinger the entire time.   But, oh wait, that is Season 2, and the writers never did a thing wrong when using the book material,  according to some. 

 
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Finished watching last two episodes. I was very disappointed. This season and much of the last pale in comparison to the previous. They were some of the most interesting TV I had watched. Rich in detail and texture.

I've heard that Martin didn't know how it was going to end yet and maybe that's part of the problem with this version of the ending. So much time and money spent and they missed the landing.

I think a good ending is the hardest part of any story, book or movie.

 
Ghost Rider said:
Exactly. 

Heck, we could point at the episode in S2 of Game of Thrones where Littlefinger clearly recognizes Arya when talking to Twyin, and even though he reacts to seeing her and his eyes follow her as she crosses the room, Tywin, a guy who never missed a thing, didn't notice despite the fact that he was looking right at Littlefinger the entire time.   But, oh wait, that is Season 2, and the writers never did a thing wrong when using the book material,  according to some. 
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I think the main criticisms of the writing that so many people have are not in the lack of attention to momentary details, but rather huge narrative plot holes and lack of cohesion generally.  

 
beer 30 said:
As always, well done MoCS  :thumbup: . These rereads are going to be interesting to be sure but be careful not to focus too much on what the show has shown us. That’s my fear, that I’m going to read these again through the glasses of GoT’s the show as opposed to GoT’s the story.
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Thanks. You are so right. I rewatched the part of the TV show that is the book Prologue. Man, it is sooo different in most all the things that I wrote about in the Reread thread. After that experience, I fully understand why some of my opinions make little sense. 

Thus, I'm going to try to keep my book comments out of here unless I see something that relates to the show. I'll post some about it maybe in the book thread, but only as a spoiler-tag.

I forget who but one of the contributors in this thread summed it up well, GRRM gave them the ending and a rough outline how to get there but I think they used a lot of latitude. They made it a Hollywood story as opposed to a GoT’s story.
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Yeah. I agree here too. I still liked it a lot though. I may rewatch bits and pieces during the read to compare some things. But I am going to do my best to follow your idea. I want to read it through the book first and then see how the show did it. 

 
zoobird said:
Definitely a bit disappointed in the story the last season or two.  Just felt like too many interesting storylines were left unresolved or brought to abrupt endings.  Everything else remained good, but part of the appeal of GoT was all the intriguing hints and side plots and too many of those were abandoned or didn't have satisfying payoffs.  I'm sure plenty of people have come up with better ideas, but a few threads could have been tied together by connecting the Night King, Faceless Men and Lord of Light.  Maybe something like the NIght King represents death and seeks to make all living things die.  The Lord of Light represent Life and seeks to spread life.  The Faceless Men represent balance between life and death...they kill those who are supposed to die and allow life for those who are supposed to live...life and death are two sides of the same coin.  Instead of Arya killing the Night King just being her stabbing a bad guy to death, she could be using Faceless Man abilities to bring balance back to the world and send the Night King back north for another few thousand years. 

The idea of "power resides where men believe it to be" could have been tied into this too.  When too many people despair, the Night King's influence grows.  When too many are overoptimistic, the Lord of Light becomes too strong.  So whatever actions Arya took could have been something that gave people hope and reduced the Night King's power that way.

The point of the Three Eyed Raven could have been that by seeing that past, Bran was able to see that no matter how bad or how good things look at any time, they cycle back and forth around some balance.  So his sharing of what he saw in the past could have also brought enough hope to people to limit the power of the Night King.
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Whoa. This is great. 

I'm going to think more about it.

I really like:

The idea of "power resides where men believe it to be" could have been tied into this too.  When too many people despair, the Night King's influence grows.  When too many are overoptimistic, the Lord of Light becomes too strong.  So whatever actions Arya took could have been something that gave people hope and reduced the Night King's power that way.
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I especially like how you use the bold.

The point of the Three Eyed Raven could have been that by seeing that past, Bran was able to see that no matter how bad or how good things look at any time, they cycle back and forth around some balance.  So his sharing of what he saw in the past could have also brought enough hope to people to limit the power of the Night King.
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Yeah. And the bold is kind of like what Gandalf did. At one point it is explained (somewhere) that Gandalf's main purpose was to inspire and bring hope to the forces of good. Yeah - he could have nuked the opposing army like he did the balrog, but he didn't.

Instead, he used his power only when necessary and mostly to inspire hope. He needed to let the others achieve the victory - so that the new Age of Men would replace him and the elves and other forms of magic in Middle Earth.

This is a huge part of why I see Bran as the Merlin/Gandalf type. Also, both of those guys either deny using "magic" or don't understand why that term is used in regards to what they do (Galadriel also). Thus, for Bran to sit on the Throne, it also means that Gandalf and magic have not left the world in the show ending. That is a twist that I did not expect, but love.

As for the rest,  I need to think a lot more.

If you have any other thoughts, I'd love to hear them.

 
zoonation said:
I think the main criticisms of the writing that so many people have are not in the lack of attention to momentary details, but rather huge narrative plot holes and lack of cohesion generally.  
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It is both.  They did a great job bringing page to life, but when they had to come up with original material, it lacked in some regards.  And it was more noticeable as they veered further from the books (entire Dorne plot) and even more so when they went well past them (Seasons 7 and 8).  

 
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Ghost Rider said:
Exactly. 

Heck, we could point at the episode in S2 of Game of Thrones where Littlefinger clearly recognizes Arya when talking to Twyin, and even though he reacts to seeing her and his eyes follow her as she crosses the room, Tywin, a guy who never missed a thing, didn't notice despite the fact that he was looking right at Littlefinger the entire time.   But, oh wait, that is Season 2, and the writers never did a thing wrong when using the book material,  according to some. 
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That whole Arya as Tywin's cup-bearer and Little finger showing up at Harrenhall did NOT happen in the books.

 
Ghost Rider said:
Exactly. 

Heck, we could point at the episode in S2 of Game of Thrones where Littlefinger clearly recognizes Arya when talking to Twyin, and even though he reacts to seeing her and his eyes follow her as she crosses the room, Tywin, a guy who never missed a thing, didn't notice despite the fact that he was looking right at Littlefinger the entire time.   But, oh wait, that is Season 2, and the writers never did a thing wrong when using the book material,  according to some. 
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I just assumed Tywin knew.   :shrug:  

 
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