Hernandez convicted of first-degree murder; found deceased in his cell. (1 Viewer)

Sarnoff said:

Anarchy99 said:

Phenix said:

Again folks, innocent until proven guilty. It is still not out of the realm of possibility he was set up. While I do not think he was, it is more possible now that facts are coming out.

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Set up by whom? If anything, it's starting to sound more like he is a thug, been involved in multiple infractions, hangs out with goons, and he was the one that called up the boys to deal with a problem.

If you are saying that the cops are trying to make him the fall guy and pin him for this and that he wasn't the shooter. Per the laws of MA, it doesn't matter if he pulled the trigger or not. No matter how you slice it, there is no way that AH is INNOCENT. If people want to say there is a chance he is found not guilty that's different. But I don't see how anyone could suggest that he played no role in this and did nothing wrong.

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In the court of public opinion, of course it matters whether he pulled the trigger or not. Everyone is jumping to the conclusion that he did, but there's no proof of that. And if the prosecution can't prove it was AH that fired the fatal bullet, he'll always be able to say "I'm not a killer". While he may be legally guilty of accessory to murder, or conspiracy to murder, or whatever, he'll never be "a killer". It's something the public implicitly understands as separate from the legal realm. And it'll be remembered that he didn't do it.

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cstu said:

Shutout said:

FantasyMan said:

KellysHeroes said:

this is OJ Simpson part 2.

He'll get off on the murder charges and probably get probation for the weapons. The Pats will be forced to pay him the millions they owe him. Hernandez will lose a civil suit from Llyod's family and live the rest of his life in scrutiny like OJ.

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This is nothing like the Simpson case, other than both he and Hernandez used to play in the NFL.

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In some ways it is. If you look at it purely from a perspective of how much obvious evidence seems to be pointing Hernandez's way and, as a result, so many people are simply williling to say their opinion is that he is guilty, it is really not that different. It was the same way with OJ. More so in fact. Look at some of the evidence in Oj's case that looked like a no-brainer, yet he was not convicted.

1. The 9-1-1 call and the history of Simpson's violence directed at Nicole Brown.

2. Hair evidence: (1) hairs consistent with that of Simpson found on cap at Bundy residence, (2) hairs consistent with that of Simpson found on Ron Goldman's shirt.

3. Fiber evidence: (1) cotton fibers consistent with the carpet in the Bronco found on glove at Rockingham, (2) fibers consistent with the carpet from the Bronco found on cap at Bundy residence.

4. Blood evidence: (1) killer dropped blood near shoe prints at Bundy, (2) blood dropped at Bundy was of same type as Simpson's (about 0.5% of population would match), (3) Simpson had fresh cuts on left hand on day after murder, (4) blood found in Bronco, (5) blood found in foyer and master bedroom of Simpson home, (5) blood found on Simpson's driveway, (6) blood on socks in OJ's home matched Nicole's.

5. Glove evidence: (1) left glove found at Bundy and right glove found at Simpson residence are Aris Light gloves, size XL, (2) Nicole Brown bought pair of Aris Light XL gloves in 1990 at Bloomingdale's, (3) Simpson wore Aris Light gloves from 1990 to June, 1994.

6. Shoe evidence: (1) shoe prints found at Bundy were from a size 12 Bruno Magli shoe, (2) bloody shoe impression on Bronco carpet is consistent with a Magli shoe, (3) Simpson wore a size 12 shoe.

7. Other evidence: (1) flight in Bronco, (2) strange reaction to phone call informing him of Nicole Brown's death, etc.

For those of us old enough to remember that trial and how it seemingly just piled on obvious evidence day after day after day, this case with Hernandez isn't at all any more damning. I mean, if you can say we found hair, blood and clothing from the victims and the perp cross-contaminated over every venue of the crime scene and personal areas, and you don't convict, then you have to see Kelly's take on it as plausible.

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Many people didn't trust DNA evidence in 1994. If the murders happened today there's no question in my mind he would have been found guilty.

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Sarnoff said:

Anarchy99 said:

Phenix said:

Again folks, innocent until proven guilty. It is still not out of the realm of possibility he was set up. While I do not think he was, it is more possible now that facts are coming out.

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Set up by whom? If anything, it's starting to sound more like he is a thug, been involved in multiple infractions, hangs out with goons, and he was the one that called up the boys to deal with a problem.

If you are saying that the cops are trying to make him the fall guy and pin him for this and that he wasn't the shooter. Per the laws of MA, it doesn't matter if he pulled the trigger or not. No matter how you slice it, there is no way that AH is INNOCENT. If people want to say there is a chance he is found not guilty that's different. But I don't see how anyone could suggest that he played no role in this and did nothing wrong.

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In the court of public opinion, of course it matters whether he pulled the trigger or not. Everyone is jumping to the conclusion that he did, but there's no proof of that. And if the prosecution can't prove it was AH that fired the fatal bullet, he'll always be able to say "I'm not a killer". While he may be legally guilty of accessory to murder, or conspiracy to murder, or whatever, he'll never be "a killer". It's something the public implicitly understands as separate from the legal realm. And it'll be remembered that he didn't do it.

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Phenix said:

Maurile Tremblay said:

Phenix said:

The writing on the wall is this guy will get off on reasonable doubt!

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You and I are reading entirely different walls.

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Nah, just don't trust the legal system to do the right thing here.

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Phenix said:

nirad3 said:

This is still being discussed?

Dude is a gangsta' who just happened to be incredibly talented at football. You can't remove the thug from a thug.

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What?! So people from the ghetto who were once thugs will never be anything else? Is that your blanket statement?

I'm shocked people are still so ignorant.

Yes, I think Hernandez did it, but that does not make your statement any less dumb.

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Greg Russell said:

"Innocent until proven guilty" is trying to close the gap with "freedom of speech" for mostly annoyingly misused legal phrase.

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Ortiz statement to police raises several hearsay questions
Posted by Mike Florio on July 12, 2013, 12:01 AM EDT
Ortiz AP

It’s one thing for police to have statements from Carlos Ortiz that can be used to support the issuance of a search warrant. It’s quite another to be able to use those statements at trial.

Many of you instantly recognized that Ortiz’s explanation to police that Ernest Wallace told Ortiz that Hernandez told Wallace that Hernandez shot Odin Lloyd entails multiple levels of hearsay.

Let’s start this foray into trial procedure by assuming Ortiz will testify in the prosecution of Hernandez. Would testimony from Ortiz that Wallace said Hernandez said he shot Odin be admissible?

As the case often is with matters that eventually will be decided by a judge, the answer is “maybe.”

Hernandez’s statement falls within the exclusion to the definition of hearsay, since the statement (“I shot Lloyd”) is being used against Hernandez. But Hernandez said it to Wallace, not to Ortiz. So when Wallace tells Ortiz that Hernandez told Wallace that Hernandez shot Lloyd, it potentially becomes hearsay.

Actually, there’s a chance that Wallace’s connection to Hernandez brings the entire statement within the exclusion to the hearsay rule. Section 801(d)(2)(E) of the Massachusetts Rules of Evidence says that “[a] statement of a coconspirator or joint venturer made during the pendency of the cooperative effort and in furtherance of its goal when the existence of the conspiracy or joint venture is shown by evidence independent of the statement.”

In English, this means that if the effort to kill Lloyd and clumsily cover it up became a joint venture between Wallace and Hernandez, anything Wallace says about the joint venture isn’t hearsay. The pressure point would be whether telling Ortiz that Hernandez said he shot Lloyd constitutes a statement made “in furtherance of [the] goal” of the joint venture.

Coincidentally, Bristol County, Massachusetts District Attorney Sam Sutter recently used the term “joint venturer” when discussing the situation.

Another level of hearsay arises if, for whatever reason, Ortiz doesn’t repeat what he said to police in court. His own statements to investigators, made out of court and without an opportunity by Hernandez’s lawyer to cross-examine him, also become hearsay — unless it’s determined that he’s another “joint venturer,” even though his agenda on the night in question appeared primarily to be sleep.

Complicating matters in this context is the Confrontation Clause of the Constitution, which gives a criminal defendant the right to interrogate anyone giving testimony against the defendant. The statements Ortiz made to police about the events of the evening and Wallace’s comments about Hernandez’s confession are more likely to be admissible if Ortiz is not available to testify at trial; one issue that would need to be researched under Massachusetts law is whether invoking the Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination makes the witness unavailable.

In the end, the judge presiding over the case will have to decide whether to allow the statement in to evidence. Factors that shouldn’t matter but that definitely will include whether the judge believes based on all of the other evidence that a conviction is likely without the statement being admitted. Since allowing the statement to go to the jury could be what lawyers and judges call “reversible error” (in English, grounds for overturning the conviction on appeal), there’s no reason to do it if the evidence otherwise appears to be overwhelming.

It’s a very common dynamic at trial. If, all of a sudden, one side starts winning all of the evidentiary rulings, it’s a strong clue that the judge thinks the other side is poised to win the case. For Hernandez, despite the information made available to the media, it’s still way too early to tell how this one would play out in a court of law.

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KellysHeroes said:

Greg Russell said:

"Innocent until proven guilty" is trying to close the gap with "freedom of speech" for mostly annoyingly misused legal phrase.

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but a person is innocent until proven guilty, until he has his day (year) in court he is an innocent man in a 10' by 7' cell. And for those that don't like it you can move to another country that has another legal system to you liking.

Freedom of speech is a whole other issue these days with people being arrested for threatening and damaging statements on social media.

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ghostguy123 said:

KellysHeroes said:

Greg Russell said:

"Innocent until proven guilty" is trying to close the gap with "freedom of speech" for mostly annoyingly misused legal phrase.

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but a person is innocent until proven guilty, until he has his day (year) in court he is an innocent man in a 10' by 7' cell. And for those that don't like it you can move to another country that has another legal system to you liking.

Freedom of speech is a whole other issue these days with people being arrested for threatening and damaging statements on social media.

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"innocent until proven guilty", for the 10 billionth time, is nothing more than a persons right to have a trial in which prosecution must prove they are guilty before they are sentenced to a jail term.

If Hernandez goes into court with a gun hidden in his pants, and shoots 5 people with the judge, lawyers, and jury sitting there watching him, along with 20 different cameras catching him in the act............................yes technically he is "innocent until proven guilty" of that crime. But is he innocent?? In the eyes of the LAW, yes he is until he is convicted in court of that crime, but in terms of the actual definition of the word, no he is not innocent.

Freedom of speech is the most taken for granted idea of all time, and something I care not to discuss at all. According to many, many idiots I have talked to, they view freedom of speech as being able to say anything you want, anywhere you want, with no consequences of any kind. It's too bad that when that law was written, they didn't have the soothsaying ability to know how low the average IQ of people would turn out to be.

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Aaron Hernandez's in-home security system is a major focus in the investigation into the death of Odin Lloyd. Not only did Hernandez intentionally destroy the system before turning it over to police, but it's believed the system could contain footage critical to the case.

Why did Hernandez have such a complicated security system? According to a police report obtained by the Boston Herald, it was for personal protection -- Hernandez's, fiancee Shayanna Jenkins, told police that "there had been several recent break-in attempts at their residence."

"Shayanna Jenkins further stated that this video surveillance system would allow for the viewing of both the front of their residence as well as the street," the police report reads. "Shayanna Jenkins went on to say that the video surveillance system records and plays the video on their home entertainment system."

There's no telling why Hernandez was, according to his fiancee, the target of multiple break-ins at his house. And it's perhaps telling that he didn't involve the local authorities in the matter of these attempted break-ins (or likely didn't -- surely the police would've known about the alleged break-ins before Jenkins told them if Hernandez had called the cops).

It's even more telling that, according to the police report, Hernandez had a security system expert visit his house in May and show him how to cut off portions of the security system to avoid being recorded.

"He showed Hernandez how to disconnect specific cameras from the recording device," a police report says according to the Herald. "[He] went on to say that he clearly labeled the connections so that Aaron Hernandez could more easily disconnect cameras at locations within his home where and when he wanted to avoid surveillance recordings."

Like almost all the evidence that we've seen in this case, the alleged facts surrounding this police report only present a pile of circumstantial information. But having a series of unreported (?) break-ins that causes you to install a high-powered security system that you get a tutorial on how to shut off at certain times and places ... none of that in and of itself is that damning.

And maybe Hernandez simply wanted to engage in some ... personal activities without having them recorded. But the confluence of events surrounding his home -- and the additional "flop house" that Hernandez had -- certainly isn't a good look.

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KellysHeroes said:

As for Freedom of speech, i'm sure the IQ's back then were just as low as people now, but they didn't have the outlets that we have now. If you say something on the internet or on camera or on tape it can be seen or heard by everybody and it can be researched and found even after many yrs. You go on facebook and/or twitter and say I'm going to do xxxxx to this very important person or thing and the cops or black suits will be at you door in a matter of hours.

Theres always been consequences to your speech (your employer could fire you for example if you demostrate extreme views on certain issues and you can suffer social backlash like when Mendy spoke up on his views of 9-11 and the war aferwards) but now more and more we're seeing peoples rights being taken away due to typing some stupid sentence and hitting enter on social media. Thats getting a little a crazy imo.

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DaveL said:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/07/14/pouncey-twins-show-their-support-for-hernandez/

oh geez...Pouncey twins wearing "Free Hernandez" hats

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Faust said:

Pro Football Hall of Fame removes Aaron Hernandez photo

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The lessons of Aaron Hernandez.

There are so many. But I'll write about three of them.

1. If I were New England owner Robert Kraft and coach Bill Belichick, I'd be asking my security people (and I am sure these questions are being asked now), "Are you telling me you knew nothing about Aaron Hernandez off the field? You're telling me your moles in the Boston Police didn't tell you anything about Hernandez a year ago, when a car Hernandez rented was the car of interest in a double murder in Boston? You're telling me you never heard anything about Hernandez and the people he was associating with -- because he sure wasn't hanging with Tom Brady?'' I know the Patriots can't tail 53 guys. Or one. But the organization seemed to have dropped all suspicion in the last couple of years about a guy so many teams questioned before the 2010 draft -- a guy who had very few close friends on the team, and who always seemed to go his own way when he left the facility. Kraft has to know that if Belichick is going to continue to draft from college football's All-Risk Team, he'd better improve the quality of private eyes he employs.

2. Since Scott Pioli left the organization in 2009, Belichick doesn't have anyone to argue him off troubled players. Not that Pioli won all the time. "But,'' someone with knowledge of the Patriots front office told me, "there's no one there with Scott's balls anymore. Bill needs someone to challenge him, and I don't think he has that now." Would Pioli have challenged Belichick on Hernandez, or on Alfonzo Dennard, the seventh-round corner who will have to leave camp in August to go to a probation trial in Nebraska and who last week was arrested for DUI? I don't know, and there's no guarantee those picks wouldn't have been made anyway. But this isn't the first time I've heard the Pioli thing.

3. Belichick had better give the Urban Meyer guys a harder look in the future. He's had either trouble of some kind or abject disappointment with Florida picks Hernandez, Chad Jackson, Jermaine Cunningham, Brandon Spikes and Jeff Demps.

I still think the Patriots are going to be a double-digit-win team this year; tight end Daniel Fells should be athletic enough to provide Tom Brady a trusted alternative -- if not one as athletic or versatile -- to Hernandez. But in New England's world, making hay in the weak AFC East isn't what matters. Beating Baltimore and Denver and Pittsburgh and Houston is. And with the mayhem of the last month, winning the AFC is very much in doubt.

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Faust said:

Peter King MMQB Excerpt:

The lessons of Aaron Hernandez.

There are so many. But I'll write about three of them.

1. If I were New England owner Robert Kraft and coach Bill Belichick, I'd be asking my security people (and I am sure these questions are being asked now), "Are you telling me you knew nothing about Aaron Hernandez off the field? You're telling me your moles in the Boston Police didn't tell you anything about Hernandez a year ago, when a car Hernandez rented was the car of interest in a double murder in Boston? You're telling me you never heard anything about Hernandez and the people he was associating with -- because he sure wasn't hanging with Tom Brady?'' I know the Patriots can't tail 53 guys. Or one. But the organization seemed to have dropped all suspicion in the last couple of years about a guy so many teams questioned before the 2010 draft -- a guy who had very few close friends on the team, and who always seemed to go his own way when he left the facility. Kraft has to know that if Belichick is going to continue to draft from college football's All-Risk Team, he'd better improve the quality of private eyes he employs.

2. Since Scott Pioli left the organization in 2009, Belichick doesn't have anyone to argue him off troubled players. Not that Pioli won all the time. "But,'' someone with knowledge of the Patriots front office told me, "there's no one there with Scott's balls anymore. Bill needs someone to challenge him, and I don't think he has that now." Would Pioli have challenged Belichick on Hernandez, or on Alfonzo Dennard, the seventh-round corner who will have to leave camp in August to go to a probation trial in Nebraska and who last week was arrested for DUI? I don't know, and there's no guarantee those picks wouldn't have been made anyway. But this isn't the first time I've heard the Pioli thing.

3. Belichick had better give the Urban Meyer guys a harder look in the future. He's had either trouble of some kind or abject disappointment with Florida picks Hernandez, Chad Jackson, Jermaine Cunningham, Brandon Spikes and Jeff Demps.

I still think the Patriots are going to be a double-digit-win team this year; tight end Daniel Fells should be athletic enough to provide Tom Brady a trusted alternative -- if not one as athletic or versatile -- to Hernandez. But in New England's world, making hay in the weak AFC East isn't what matters. Beating Baltimore and Denver and Pittsburgh and Houston is. And with the mayhem of the last month, winning the AFC is very much in doubt.

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QuizGuy66 said:

Faust said:

Pro Football Hall of Fame removes Aaron Hernandez photo

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Kinda funny that the HOF would have that photo considering endzone celebrations are so frowned upon in the No Fun League.

-QG

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Faust said:

Pro Football Hall of Fame removes Aaron Hernandez photo

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Stat of the WeekThere's been much discussion about the spate of offseason arrests in the NFL, highlighted by the Aaron Hernandez murder charge, of course. And, of course, one arrest is too many. But it's probably unrealistic to think that men with more money, on average, than the general public wouldn't get into some trouble, regardless how much preaching the league does about it. The question is, is the NFL's rate of arrest much higher than the general public's?

I looked up the FBI's arrest data and used it as a means of comparison against the San Diego Union-Tribune's database of NFL player arrests. The paper lists 40 since Jan. 1 this year, but I believe it's 42.

Now, where I think there's been a bit of statistical confusion is in the interpretation of total number of NFL players. I've seen some people list 53 per team, and thus 1,696 total. That's not an accurate number of NFL players; you'd have to add eight more per team in-season, plus players on injured-reserve ... so you'd probably have to estimate about 65 per team. But wait. In the offseason, teams employ up to 90 players per team, including undrafted rookie free agents. Cleveland's Ausar Wolcott, for instance, charged with attempted murder for punching a man outside a New Jersey nightclub in June, and then cut, was an undrafted free agent. So if you use 90 per team, the NFL control group rises to 2,880, almost 1,200 more than if you'd measure it by in-season active-roster players only.

So let's use the larger number, and to be mathematically fair, let's use a one-year period: July 15, 2012 to July 14, 2013, which was Sunday. By my count, there have been 55 arrests of NFL players in that year.

Number of arrests of NFL players in the last year: 55.

Estimated number of players currently under contract in NFL: 2,880.

Percentage of players arrested in the last year: 1.9 percent.

Now for the general population. Look at the last year the FBI has complete stats for, 2010.

Number of arrests of American adults: 11,479,500.

Estimate number of American adults living in 2010: 235,205,700.

Percentage of American adults arrested in 2010: 4.9 percent.

The numbers would be skewed almost any way you did it. The pool of NFL players for an eight-month period is less than 2,880, obviously, because undrafted free agents are not signed until April and thus there wouldn't be the huge pool for the entire 12-month period -- probably only about five months. But if you cut the difference in half and used, say, an estimate of 2,200 players, you'd still be at a significantly lower percentage of arrests compared to America at-large. And you also would be more accurate to compare one control group, football players, to males aged 21 to 35 in the larger society.

My point is, we know the arrests are an ugly part of football the league and the Players Association need to constantly work to reduce. But it's not so easy to simply say, "Too many players are getting arrested." Compared to what, exactly?

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Ramblin Wreck said:

Faust said:

Pro Football Hall of Fame removes Aaron Hernandez photo

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Yet a child rapist like Lawrence Taylor still exists in the HOF. That's odd to me.

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Ramblin Wreck said:

Faust said:

Pro Football Hall of Fame removes Aaron Hernandez photo

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Yet a child rapist like Lawrence Taylor still exists in the HOF. That's odd to me.

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Maurile Tremblay said:

Ramblin Wreck said:

Faust said:

Pro Football Hall of Fame removes Aaron Hernandez photo

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Yet a child rapist like Lawrence Taylor still exists in the HOF. That's odd to me.

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"Child rapist" is a bit harsh. He had consensual sex with a sixteen-year-old girl who told him she was nineteen (where the legal age is seventeen).

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Steed said:

Just saw that Carlos Dunlap got an extension and thought it was funny Paul Brown came out and said he wiped Hernandez off his board yet they took Dunlap that same year. He was AHern's teammate and had a DUI on his resume.

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Steed said:

Just saw that Carlos Dunlap got an extension and thought it was funny Paul Brown came out and said he wiped Hernandez off his board yet they took Dunlap that same year. He was AHern's teammate and had a DUI on his resume.

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Greg Russell said:

Steed said:

Just saw that Carlos Dunlap got an extension and thought it was funny Paul Brown came out and said he wiped Hernandez off his board yet they took Dunlap that same year. He was AHern's teammate and had a DUI on his resume.

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I see what you're saying here, but I guess just being AH's teammate wasn't enough to completely kill someone's draft stock.

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Yenrub said:

Steed said:

Just saw that Carlos Dunlap got an extension and thought it was funny Paul Brown came out and said he wiped Hernandez off his board yet they took Dunlap that same year. He was AHern's teammate and had a DUI on his resume.

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Maybe Paul Brown believes that you can never have enough pass rushers

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QuizGuy66 said:

Yenrub said:

Steed said:

Just saw that Carlos Dunlap got an extension and thought it was funny Paul Brown came out and said he wiped Hernandez off his board yet they took Dunlap that same year. He was AHern's teammate and had a DUI on his resume.

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Maybe Paul Brown believes that you can never have enough pass rushers

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Paul Brown rising from the dead and resuming control of the team would explain how my Bengals have made the playoffs 3 of the last 4 years.

-QG

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Greg Russell said:

QuizGuy66 said:

Yenrub said:

Steed said:

Just saw that Carlos Dunlap got an extension and thought it was funny Paul Brown came out and said he wiped Hernandez off his board yet they took Dunlap that same year. He was AHern's teammate and had a DUI on his resume.

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Maybe Paul Brown believes that you can never have enough pass rushers

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Paul Brown rising from the dead and resuming control of the team would explain how my Bengals have made the playoffs 3 of the last 4 years.

-QG

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Honestly, if he can rise from the dead, I'm going to set my expectations for him to be a lot higher than just making the playoffs. I mean, Tebow did that, and won a playoff game. And Tebow hasn't even risen from the dead. Yet.

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Greg Russell said:

QuizGuy66 said:

Yenrub said:

Steed said:

Just saw that Carlos Dunlap got an extension and thought it was funny Paul Brown came out and said he wiped Hernandez off his board yet they took Dunlap that same year. He was AHern's teammate and had a DUI on his resume.

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Maybe Paul Brown believes that you can never have enough pass rushers

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Paul Brown rising from the dead and resuming control of the team would explain how my Bengals have made the playoffs 3 of the last 4 years.

-QG

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Honestly, if he can rise from the dead, I'm going to set my expectations for him to be a lot higher than just making the playoffs. I mean, Tebow did that, and won a playoff game. And Tebow hasn't even risen from the dead. Yet.

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Anarchy99 said:

Greg Russell said:

QuizGuy66 said:

Yenrub said:

Steed said:

Just saw that Carlos Dunlap got an extension and thought it was funny Paul Brown came out and said he wiped Hernandez off his board yet they took Dunlap that same year. He was AHern's teammate and had a DUI on his resume.

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Maybe Paul Brown believes that you can never have enough pass rushers

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Paul Brown rising from the dead and resuming control of the team would explain how my Bengals have made the playoffs 3 of the last 4 years.

-QG

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Honestly, if he can rise from the dead, I'm going to set my expectations for him to be a lot higher than just making the playoffs. I mean, Tebow did that, and won a playoff game. And Tebow hasn't even risen from the dead. Yet.

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Let's not say things you can't take back. Do you have any proof that he HAS NOT risen from the dead?

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Anarchy99 said:

I get the OJ references (in that OJ walked when many, if not most, people thought he did it). A lot has changed in almost 20 years. So to re-engineer the OJ case with AH elements and play the what if game.

- Suppose police had texts between Nicole and her family and friends that OJ was coming to pick her and Ron up.

- Let's say that the white Bronco was tracked by GPS to and from Nicole's house and where the bodies were found, with multiple sources of video showing OJ as the driver.

- Throw in video of OJ outside McDonald's or home CCTV less than a mile from the crime scene where he is seen holding a knife at 3:33 AM when the murders were known to occur at 3:30 AM.

- Add in OJ being seen buying gum on video after picking up Nicole and say there was the same bubble gum with his DNA on it at the scene or in his house.

- Also factor in if OJ had another car in his garage that was tied to another double homicide.

Overlaying that type of evidence to the OJ case, would that make the prosecution's case stronger, weaker or the same?

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Shanahanigans said:

Anarchy99 said:

I get the OJ references (in that OJ walked when many, if not most, people thought he did it). A lot has changed in almost 20 years. So to re-engineer the OJ case with AH elements and play the what if game.

- Suppose police had texts between Nicole and her family and friends that OJ was coming to pick her and Ron up.

- Let's say that the white Bronco was tracked by GPS to and from Nicole's house and where the bodies were found, with multiple sources of video showing OJ as the driver.

- Throw in video of OJ outside McDonald's or home CCTV less than a mile from the crime scene where he is seen holding a knife at 3:33 AM when the murders were known to occur at 3:30 AM.

- Add in OJ being seen buying gum on video after picking up Nicole and say there was the same bubble gum with his DNA on it at the scene or in his house.

- Also factor in if OJ had another car in his garage that was tied to another double homicide.

Overlaying that type of evidence to the OJ case, would that make the prosecution's case stronger, weaker or the same?

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This. If OJ had done what he had done in the age of iPhones and internet, I think it's much more likely he would have been convicted. They essentially have a minute by minute account of where Hernandez was that night, because of his iPhone. Hernandez can't even argue that his phone was stolen, because rather than ditch it, he chose to smash it.

This idea being implied in here, that circumstantial evidence is essentially worthless, is proposterous, especially when there is so much of it. Beyond that, there is physical evidence in the form of video, shell-casings, chewed gum, tire tracks, gravel in the wheel well, clothing, and text messages. The prosecution's case is incredibly strong. The level of carelessness displayed by Hernandez is mind-boggling.

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Shanahanigans said:

Anarchy99 said:

I get the OJ references (in that OJ walked when many, if not most, people thought he did it). A lot has changed in almost 20 years. So to re-engineer the OJ case with AH elements and play the what if game.

- Suppose police had texts between Nicole and her family and friends that OJ was coming to pick her and Ron up.

- Let's say that the white Bronco was tracked by GPS to and from Nicole's house and where the bodies were found, with multiple sources of video showing OJ as the driver.

- Throw in video of OJ outside McDonald's or home CCTV less than a mile from the crime scene where he is seen holding a knife at 3:33 AM when the murders were known to occur at 3:30 AM.

- Add in OJ being seen buying gum on video after picking up Nicole and say there was the same bubble gum with his DNA on it at the scene or in his house.

- Also factor in if OJ had another car in his garage that was tied to another double homicide.

Overlaying that type of evidence to the OJ case, would that make the prosecution's case stronger, weaker or the same?

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This. If OJ had done what he had done in the age of iPhones and internet, I think it's much more likely he would have been convicted. They essentially have a minute by minute account of where Hernandez was that night, because of his iPhone. Hernandez can't even argue that his phone was stolen, because rather than ditch it, he chose to smash it.

This idea being implied in here, that circumstantial evidence is essentially worthless, is proposterous, especially when there is so much of it. Beyond that, there is physical evidence in the form of video, shell-casings, chewed gum, tire tracks, gravel in the wheel well, clothing, and text messages. The prosecution's case is incredibly strong. The level of carelessness displayed by Hernandez is mind-boggling.

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Ramblin Wreck said:

Faust said:

Pro Football Hall of Fame removes Aaron Hernandez photo

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Yet a child rapist like Lawrence Taylor still exists in the HOF. That's odd to me.

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As former Patriots tight end Aaron Hernandez continues his time in jail while awaiting a trial on his murder charge, the Bristol County (Mass.) sheriff was forthcoming with the Boston Globe about Hernandez's new life behind bars.

And he gave us an interesting glimpse into the new reality that Hernandez must live with until a court decides on his guilt or innocence.

“This is not the Ritz,” said sheriff Thomas M. Hodgson.

Yes, it sounds brutal. As Hodgson tells the newspaper, Hernandez is locked in a 7-by-10 foot cell for 21 hours a day. The rest of his time is spent in the exercise yard, making collect phone calls and taking a hot shower. He doesn't have any physical contact with other inmates, mostly for his own safety.

Even so, it sounds as if Hernandez has made a good impression.

“He's been nothing but perfect,” Hodgson said. “I met with him when he first came in to lay the rules out. I said, ‘Here's the deal. You won't be treated any better or worse or get any special privileges here. If you have any issues or problems, tell command.' He was very polite and very respectful. He didn't seem nervous, he seemed very comfortable.”

The Globe also talked to other prisoners about Hernandez, and their responses were less than positive. One called him a bum, and another called him a punk.

But in an interest twist, Hernandez has a Patriots connection inside the prison walls. Drew Bledsoe's father, Mac Bledsoe, is an auxiliary sheriff in Bristol County, and he's been running a “Parenting with Dignity” program in the jail for the past 15 years. Considering Hernandez has a daughter who was born last November, Bledsoe told the paper he'd love to help Hernandez.

Hodgson said he's met with Hernandez twice since he's been incarcerated.

“He said, ‘I'm fine,''' said Hodgson. “He's basically adapting.”

Make sure to read this entire Globe piece. It's an interesting look at the new life Hernandez must lead for now.

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When Tim Tebow and Tom Brady squared off in 2011 during the regular season (on CBS), it was a big deal. The Patriots and Broncos would meet later in the playoffs and in advance of that matchup, NFL Films put together a Sound FX piece detailing some of the best audio you didn't hear from the original matchup.

One interesting clip relating to Aaron Hernandez fell under the radar until the Orlando Sentinel unearthed it recently, with Brady telling Tebow that his former Florida teammates Hernandez and Brandon Spikes were "a lot to handle."

After congratulating Tebow on his great year and telling him that "good things happen to good people," Brady said, "I'm trying to watch over Aaron and Brandon, man."

"They're good guys man," Tebow responded.

Brady's response?

"They're a lot to handle."

This comment is sure to generate a question or two from the Boston media denizens, directed towards both Tebow and Brady. (When they're available.)

But it also begs the question of how long the Pats might have noticed the behavior of Hernandez, who's currently in jail after being arrested and charged with murder. We can't simply assume from this quote that the Pats should've known what Hernandez was doing (they feel "duped" after all) and it's much easier to notice this with the benefit of hindsight.

No one caught it when it aired, after all.

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Faust said:

Tom Brady to Tim Tebow in 2011: Florida teammates 'a lot to handle'

By Will Brinson | NFL Writer

July 16, 2013 6:20 pm ET

When Tim Tebow and Tom Brady squared off in 2011 during the regular season (on CBS), it was a big deal. The Patriots and Broncos would meet later in the playoffs and in advance of that matchup, NFL Films put together a Sound FX piece detailing some of the best audio you didn't hear from the original matchup.

One interesting clip relating to Aaron Hernandez fell under the radar until the Orlando Sentinel unearthed it recently, with Brady telling Tebow that his former Florida teammates Hernandez and Brandon Spikes were "a lot to handle."

After congratulating Tebow on his great year and telling him that "good things happen to good people," Brady said, "I'm trying to watch over Aaron and Brandon, man."

"They're good guys man," Tebow responded.

Brady's response?

"They're a lot to handle."

This comment is sure to generate a question or two from the Boston media denizens, directed towards both Tebow and Brady. (When they're available.)

But it also begs the question of how long the Pats might have noticed the behavior of Hernandez, who's currently in jail after being arrested and charged with murder. We can't simply assume from this quote that the Pats should've known what Hernandez was doing (they feel "duped" after all) and it's much easier to notice this with the benefit of hindsight.

No one caught it when it aired, after all.

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Plenty of people around the NFL have offered their opinions on Aaron Hernandez, but Tom Brady has kept mum. Until now.

In comments this week to SI's Peter King, the New England Patriots quarterback said he's focused solely on the future of the team, and not the drama surrounding his former tight end, charged last month with the murder of semi-pro football player Odin Lloyd.

"I've seen a lot of things over 13 years," Brady said, "and what I have learned is that mental toughness and putting aside personal agendas for what's in the best interest of the team matters most. My job is to play quarterback, and I'm going to do that the best way I know how, because I owe that to my teammates regardless of who is out there on the field with me."

Said Brady: "I have moved on. I'm focusing on the great teammates I have who are committed to helping us win games. The only thing I care about is winning. Nothing is going to ever get in the way of that goal. I'm just excited to report to camp and see what we can accomplish as a team. The fate of our season will be determined by the players in our locker room -- nothing else."

Typical Brady: Laser focused on the task at hand and refusing to dwell on what he cannot control. Losing Hernandez strips the Patriots of a dynamic playmaker, but Brady inevitably will build chemistry with the players who remain. Predicting doom for this offense is in vogue of late, but also it's wildly premature.

As long as Brady's at the helm, New England will find a way.

Follow Marc Sessler on Twitter @MarcSesslerNFL.

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Sarnoff said:

He's a shark stash in deep leagues, he's almost for sure done for 2013 but if/when he beats this, there are several landing spots for him that might pay big dividends. I mean, he's basically "free" now, so if anything happens it's all upside & profit. I could see him playing in Green Bay in a couple of years and a lot of people here would be clamoring to grab him then. At the worst he's a great throw-in on any dynasty trades at this point.

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Sarnoff said:

He's a shark stash in deep leagues, he's almost for sure done for 2013 but if/when he beats this, there are several landing spots for him that might pay big dividends. I mean, he's basically "free" now, so if anything happens it's all upside & profit. I could see him playing in Green Bay in a couple of years and a lot of people here would be clamoring to grab him then. At the worst he's a great throw-in on any dynasty trades at this point.

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Sarnoff said:

He's a shark stash in deep leagues, he's almost for sure done for 2013 but if/when he beats this, there are several landing spots for him that might pay big dividends. I mean, he's basically "free" now, so if anything happens it's all upside & profit. I could see him playing in Green Bay in a couple of years and a lot of people here would be clamoring to grab him then. At the worst he's a great throw-in on any dynasty trades at this point.

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