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DFS and Gambling - A Discussion (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter LittleLarry
- Start date
Team ROFLCOPTERS
Footballguy
It's a partnership. it's mutually profitable. Besides, both are just giving you and I an avenue to enrich your football watching experience. It's up to us to be responsible and put ourselves in the best position to win. Those of us that make little money have strict rules and do not outside from them.
How is their the potential to "win more money if not make your money back at worst" playing at Draftstreet?
Revo
Footballguy
I started with FanDuel baseball this year with their freeroll on Opening Day, finished in the top half and won $2. I then used the $2 to enter a 3,000-team 'squeeze' the second day of the baseball season, and lo and behold, I won that and took home $700. Even though I've won season-long fantasy leagues before, that was my greatest fantasy sports thrill. I redeemed $500 for the wife, then used the remaining $200 to play around with. I started with $2 50-50s but before long,I was entering $50 worth of games every day. By mid-May, I had the $200 up to almost $800 and thought wow, this game is easy! By that point, I had a winning percentage of almost 80%. I was playing as much as $100 a day.
Then the cold streak hit, and I couldn't win if my life depended on it. My win% dropped from 80% to 45%, and my bankroll dwindled from around $800 to just shy of my $200 playing around money.I cut back, and was playing only a few $2 50/50s are Double Ups, but I couldn't even win those. Thankfully, I have a 'walk away from the table' gambling mentality, stopped cold turkey in early July, and redeemed another $100 to leave me with just $100 left on the site for football season. I haven't played in almost 2 months.
Moral of the story -- if you have it in you, redeem your money and walk away! You can't play if you don't have the money on the site! And don't add anymore! Good luck to you.
Then the cold streak hit, and I couldn't win if my life depended on it. My win% dropped from 80% to 45%, and my bankroll dwindled from around $800 to just shy of my $200 playing around money.I cut back, and was playing only a few $2 50/50s are Double Ups, but I couldn't even win those. Thankfully, I have a 'walk away from the table' gambling mentality, stopped cold turkey in early July, and redeemed another $100 to leave me with just $100 left on the site for football season. I haven't played in almost 2 months.
Moral of the story -- if you have it in you, redeem your money and walk away! You can't play if you don't have the money on the site! And don't add anymore! Good luck to you.
Don't quite understand your question - but my point was from what it sounds like at Fanduel, its hard to win $$ (especially if you have to bet $100 to win $80 or whatever the OP said)...at Draftstreet, you can bet $2 or $5 and still win $40-$50 fairly easily, and they have payouts to top 10, top 20, etc depending on what type of league you join. If you bet more (the $22 or $55 or $109 leagues), you can obviously win more.
BoltBacker
Footballguy
I really hope this entire thread is a fishing trip.
Fanduel(and now FBG's) have "turned you into" a compulsive gambler. Well, stay locked in your house without a lifeline to the outside world because Krispy Kreme and McDonalds are forcing you to have a heart attack, Visa is crippling you under a mountain of debt, and Coors is forcing you to drink and drive.
Or... you need take responsibility for the actions you take and choices you make. I guess that decision is up to yo...... well, hell, I don't know who your decisions are up to since you seem incapable of making your own decisions.
MoveToSkypager
Footballguy
mrip541
Footballguy
If you went to Vegas and the best poker players in the world cloned themselves so they could sit at every table in the city at the same time, would you ever play? If you would, what if the casinos also increased their traditional rake by 400%? Still interested? Welcome to weekly fantasy football.
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BoltBacker
Footballguy
Untrue.
I'm sure it's the same way I feel a tinge of responsibility every time "LittleLarry" gets pulled over for a speeding ticket. I mean sure he was driving and he broke the speed limit but who is really at fault? Who made him speed? I think we are all at least a little to blame for every mistake "LittleLarry" makes. I'm not sure how you sleep at night.
Its an unavoidable problem. I tried FD and its not just the best fantasy players... but its the guys linked into team sources that began to pop up. And then cloning began. It was ok if it was one guy with one account but then it became one guy with 50 accounts. Its not something I'd want to invest in. These high stakes guys can make money but we're talking about guys with huge bankrolls that can handle big buy ins in multiple leagues or sustain big losses if that happens.
So its not really a hate post but it is what it is and I cant change it. If I had the bankroll to sustain 40 accounts and high stakes, I honestly would do it because its an enjoyable way to make cash.
My real problem is this daily emails with all this spam garbage about FD and other promotions at the beginning of emails. Aren't they subscriber only? I understand the needs to generate income but its getting annoying. The worst part is that the ads are at the beginning of the email and it looks really bad to passer-bys at work or home when your mail preview is another ad for a 50k double-reverse WCOFF buyin for 3k.
Easy solution would be to keep the advertisements at the bottom of the email.
The Duff Man
Footballguy
Isnt the paranoia at a high level if you think that most of the competition is a few guys with cloned accounts?
Even if it is, submit a better roster and beat them!
There is a threshhold in fantasy football where incremental gains in information or skill provide little benefit. ESPECIALLY when it is weekly contest. Unless their inside info tells them the offensive game plan of the team?
I assume people reading this site are relatively close to this point of incremental gain.
It is like the early days of online poker, ya it might be rigged so that others can make more money, but as long as you are making money no problem. If you arent....stop playing.
As for OP, you need to learn to stop.
Even if it is, submit a better roster and beat them!
There is a threshhold in fantasy football where incremental gains in information or skill provide little benefit. ESPECIALLY when it is weekly contest. Unless their inside info tells them the offensive game plan of the team?
I assume people reading this site are relatively close to this point of incremental gain.
It is like the early days of online poker, ya it might be rigged so that others can make more money, but as long as you are making money no problem. If you arent....stop playing.
As for OP, you need to learn to stop.
Brony
Footballguy
I would ask the poker clones some trick question designed to reveal their true identity and then I'd own them on the tables. Then I'd profit.
BoltBacker
Footballguy
Meh, the best poker players in the world are already in places like Las Vegas and there are so many of them and they play such long hours they may as well be "clones" of them at the tables. If your point is the level of competition is high compared to Yahoo or your local league than, yeah you have a point. I'm not so sure the level is all that much higher than the other "serious" fantasy football sites though.
I guess my point is if you look at it as an entertainment expense you can never really "lose" if you are enjoying the event.
(HULK)
(Smash)
I hear Fanduel adds on the radio and see them on TV. There will be PLENTY of dead money in there to start this season imo.
massraider
Footballguy
Not for nothing as well, but let's not pretend FBG is not what it is. This is a site dedicated to what, for most, is a form of gambling.
mrip541
Footballguy
I didn't really mean one person actually running a number of accounts, just meant that one top player with one account can enter a LOT of leagues. I stopped playing last year when I started browsing through entries in what I considered the most attractive leagues and saw the same guys in virtually every league I checked. These guys are laying out thousands and thousands every week to blanket all the best games.
Team ROFLCOPTERS
Footballguy
I don't think anyone believe that most of the competition is cloned accounts, but it's a fact that the top winners have 8-20 accounts (like I said on page one is the reason I won't do 50/50 leagues anymore). They play in 500 to 1200 games a week between 1-125 dollars and have win percentages over .850 if you track them on sites like rotogrinders.com. There is a certain tier that you don't want to go against. These are the same guys that have an in with the site (condia is associated with fanduel now) and some of these top guys help set the price point for players according to Ray Flowers. It's against the terms and conditions to have multiple accounts and be in the same leagues on fanduel. The problem was unavoidable when fanduel started limited the number of potential games one player could play. They also match the initial bankroll for new accounts and offer incentives for one account recruiting friends. Frankly, fanduel doesn't care because they are making money every time someone submits a roster. They are not taking risk of a loss. It's their daily celebrities that they are promoting that are the culprits so reporting them and their cloned lineups do zero good.The Duff Man said:
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The Duff Man
Footballguy
I dont see the problem, they are paying an entry fee for every lineup. They hit a winner, they win multiples. They lose, it is also multiplied.
In my local survivor, 1100 entries at $20 each, some people put in 5 entries. I put in one. Same concept.
In my local survivor, 1100 entries at $20 each, some people put in 5 entries. I put in one. Same concept.
The Duff Man
Footballguy
After your edit, yeah it seems shady, but I will bow out if I cant win. Until then....
Team ROFLCOPTERS
Footballguy
Yeah, that's my strategy. That's why I don't do 50/50's anymore. I did the math and I have a 72 percent winning percentage in 2 man leagues and a 56% win percentage in 50/50's. I keep on top of these things. Those that don't pay that close of attention are destined to go backwards and wonder why they are not covering rake.
Team ROFLCOPTERS
Footballguy
McGarnicle
Footballguy
One thing's for sure -- you'll never make your money back if you stop now.
KellysHeroes
Footballguy
doing the rotoworld challenge, if I winning any $$ they I might try it again if not I'll never visit the site again.
Just picking a weekly line up without a draft / trading / waiver wire pick ups takes most of the fun out of fantasy football for me.
However, I would like to create a concept of a standard draft using fanduel's prices and increasing the total team cap to maybe $100k. Maybe something I'll work on over the yr and present next yr but doubt I'm the 1st one to think of it.
Just picking a weekly line up without a draft / trading / waiver wire pick ups takes most of the fun out of fantasy football for me.
However, I would like to create a concept of a standard draft using fanduel's prices and increasing the total team cap to maybe $100k. Maybe something I'll work on over the yr and present next yr but doubt I'm the 1st one to think of it.
FantasyTrader
Footballguy
KellysHeroes
Footballguy
looking at their main contests, their making over 11% off each one. Contest collects $111500 and pays out $100K; not a bad business.
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Wilfredo Ledezma
Footballguy
Dentist
***Official FBG Dentist***
I threw $50 on there this year just to get a FBG subscription and try it out.
sure has a look and feel of the online poker sites.
I was pretty surprised at the rake.
I intend to play around with it for a bit and see what happens... but i'm guessing i'm going to gravitate towards the lottery style contests.
I entered a $10 h2h today... then i realized i wouldn't give a crap if i won the $18 or lost...
I can definitely see where this turns into the equivalent of sports wagering... but this is legal and betting on outcomes and over/unders isn't... lolz
Unless I wanted to get serious about it.. FFL is a hobby that's not hugely profitable compared to when i played poker... or compared to the money i can generate by studying investments or by working..... but studying how Roddy White is going to do just seems more fun than doing another filling or checking out the prospectus on an ETF or re-balancing your investments.
sure has a look and feel of the online poker sites.
I was pretty surprised at the rake.
I intend to play around with it for a bit and see what happens... but i'm guessing i'm going to gravitate towards the lottery style contests.
I entered a $10 h2h today... then i realized i wouldn't give a crap if i won the $18 or lost...
I can definitely see where this turns into the equivalent of sports wagering... but this is legal and betting on outcomes and over/unders isn't... lolz
Unless I wanted to get serious about it.. FFL is a hobby that's not hugely profitable compared to when i played poker... or compared to the money i can generate by studying investments or by working..... but studying how Roddy White is going to do just seems more fun than doing another filling or checking out the prospectus on an ETF or re-balancing your investments.
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KellysHeroes
Footballguy
down again?
(HULK)
(Smash)
what games do you play? Looks like I'm in the money in my $25 50/50, but out in that $10 1000+ people one. So, if I only won $10 while you tripled up, clearly I'm doing it wrong.
The Duff Man
Footballguy
I think I am 2/2 in the 50/50s. I got cute in three tournaments with EJ Manuel as a value pick allowing me to load up at WR on Bryant and Garcon. I was on the money with EJ....not so much were I spent the extra $ I saved.
I'll end up down $29 including the vig.
I'll end up down $29 including the vig.
candymanvandyfan
Footballguy
![[icon]](/data/avatars/m/5/5167.jpg?1660313464){kind=avatar}
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Insoxicated
Played 5 leagues on fanduel:(HULK) said:
3 double ups (5/10/25): won all
1 triple up (25): won it
One 10T league ($5): finished 1st for 22.50
Played 3 leagues in draft day:
1) $20k frenzy (15) that barely cashed for 20
2) double up (11): won it
3) target league (150pts) (11 buy): hit for 82.50
Cashed in every one. Not going to happen every week but the competition sucks out there, GB!
Ignoramus
Footballguy
(HULK)
(Smash)
So the cheap games are less shark/hawk infested? I prefer to gamble against suckers imo.
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Insoxicated
In my experience anyways the $25 and below feel pretty damn soft over dating back to early last year.
Link to a screen capture of my results from week one in case there is any skepticism.
Again, not claiming that's any large sum by any stretch.. nor am I claiming every week will be cleaning up like this one. However I do believe the game is definitely beatable, particularly at the lower limits. I personally used the same lineup in each game and targeted the double up / triple up games as the variance is lower.
That said it's fun to add in a Low limit Boom or bust game or two as well (ie the 150 Target, or Frenzy games at DraftDay or the standard 10 team+ leagues at Fanduel.
Strategy includes using input from Dodd's Fanduel Article (subscriber content) plus input from a couple other sites (RotoGrinders, FantasyPros, etc).
Jetznut674
Footballguy
for the guys playing Fan Duel what are the best sites dedicated to this for advice on lineups and value plays? I have checked out Rotogrinders.com... are there certain guys to follow on twitter with daily baseball tips?
Bobby Guano
Footballguy
I dropped $25 on fanduel for the first time this year after somebody in here posted a 5$ 12 team league and I won it($27). (Beginners luck)
I really have no idea what I'm doing other than my years of experience with FF but it has been fun so far. I'm not a huge gambler so I don't understand a lot of the langue in here or all the different options for leagues.
I went a little nuts this week with the extra bank roll and joined ten $1-$2 tournaments of various sizes and one $5 ten team expert (55K) league. I'm staying away from the 50/50's and H2H, I understand the odds a better but I'm just messing around so I'm going for the low limit higher odds/reward. It just seems more fun that way.
In the 10 man expert it looks like at least 50% total guppies? 4 players have no wins and myself with 1. The other 5 profiles have some wins but most of them are in other sports and not high amounts (I think the most NFL wins anyone has is 4).....I actually feel pretty decent about my chances on this one.
I've got 3 different base set ups that I used for QB WR1 WR2 TE K D and have some slight variance in all of them at RB1, RB2 and WR3 with a pool of guys I like this week, that's probably not the best way to do it but hey I'm just playing for fun.
I can defiantly see how this could become addicting. I will quit if I loose the $25 I started with and probably drop another $25 at the start of next season.
I really have no idea what I'm doing other than my years of experience with FF but it has been fun so far. I'm not a huge gambler so I don't understand a lot of the langue in here or all the different options for leagues.
I went a little nuts this week with the extra bank roll and joined ten $1-$2 tournaments of various sizes and one $5 ten team expert (55K) league. I'm staying away from the 50/50's and H2H, I understand the odds a better but I'm just messing around so I'm going for the low limit higher odds/reward. It just seems more fun that way.
In the 10 man expert it looks like at least 50% total guppies? 4 players have no wins and myself with 1. The other 5 profiles have some wins but most of them are in other sports and not high amounts (I think the most NFL wins anyone has is 4).....I actually feel pretty decent about my chances on this one.
I've got 3 different base set ups that I used for QB WR1 WR2 TE K D and have some slight variance in all of them at RB1, RB2 and WR3 with a pool of guys I like this week, that's probably not the best way to do it but hey I'm just playing for fun.
I can defiantly see how this could become addicting. I will quit if I loose the $25 I started with and probably drop another $25 at the start of next season.
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KellysHeroes
Footballguy
That would be a rake of 4.13%. For each pair of entrants, the site collects $218, gives the winner his $109 back plus $100 profit, and keeps $9 for itself.
9/218 = 4.13%.
If I'm putting $100 down on a pick'em against the book in vegas and they take $9 off the top is the rake 4.5%?
Yes. If you're betting $100 to win $91, that's a 4.5% vig. (In Vegas, you typically bet $110 to win $100, which is a 4.55% vig.)
Run It Up
Footballguy
Not currently a subscriber but Dodd's subscriber articles were pretty good, hes apparently even more involved this year so I wouldn't be surprised if they were better done.
heropretend
Footballguy
fanduel isn't too bad. glad i cut back on my fpc gambling addictions.
http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=681327
post 20.
footballguys players championship takes about 25% of the total entry fees.
There are 5808 entries x $350 (or $333 since 3 packs of teams sold for $1k) = not quite $2 million in entry fees. Including championship rounds, the total prize payout is around $1.5 million.
http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=681327
post 20.
footballguys players championship takes about 25% of the total entry fees.
There are 5808 entries x $350 (or $333 since 3 packs of teams sold for $1k) = not quite $2 million in entry fees. Including championship rounds, the total prize payout is around $1.5 million.
