Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
timschochet

My brother says Neil Peart is the greatest rock drummer ever

Recommended Posts

He made this pronouncement at halftime at the UCLA-USC game. I don't listen to that band all that much. I also am no expert on drumming. If asked I might have said John Bonham or Keith Moon. But that's just throwing out big names on my part because I can't tell you what makes them good drummers (for that matter, not sure my brother can either). Thoughts?

Edited by timschochet

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So tell us more about your dungeons and dragons playing brother and his Magic the Gathering card set.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are about 5 guys that can be in the conversation. Peart is one of them. Copeland (Police) is more my favorite. Younger kids usually go with Danny Carey (Tool) or Mike Portnoy (Dream Theater).

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mick Shrimpton

Pshaw....not even the best drummer in his own band. Stumpy Joe Childs takes that honor.....i wonder if modern DNA testing methods would allow them to determine whose vomit he choked on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

no one likes you tim. we think you're a whiny liberal

I like tim. Now do me a favor and find me someone that likes you.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would think Ginger Baker, Ringo Starr, John Bonham, Keith Moon and Peart would make a great top 5 to choose from.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are about 5 guys that can be in the conversation. Peart is one of them. Copeland (Police) is more my favorite. Younger kids usually go with Danny Carey (Tool) or Mike Portnoy (Dream Theater).

Not saying he's in Peart's world, but Tommy Lee is a great drummer. His image has just overshadowed his talent.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"Best" is so subjective.

I don't like Rush's music much but there's no denying that Peart is among the very best.

Keith Moon still gets my vote.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would think Ginger Baker, Ringo Starr, John Bonham, Keith Moon and Peart would make a great top 5 to choose from.

Ringo? Really?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think if God created the perfect rock drummer, He would combine Neil Peart with John Bonham. Peart for the imagination and precision, and Bonham for the power.

Anyone who thinks Neil Peart shouldn't be discussed as one of the best rock drummers ever, needs to go on YouTube and hear the song "YYZ", with just Neil's drum part isolated. It's awfully good.

Mike Portnoy's idolized Rush growing up. He mentions in Rush's "Beyond the Lighted Stage" documentary, that Rush's instrumental "La Villa Strangiato" was the benchmark of drumming when he was growing up.

And Peart is still a top drummer today even at age 60.

Edited by fightingillini

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

no one likes you tim. we think you're a whiny liberal

I like him. :shrug:

Me too

I dont like him, but then again I dont like anyone.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Peart also wrote all the Rush lyrics. He's pretty talented.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As mentioned its very subjective. Moon and Bonham were very unorthodox drummers. I love both the Who and Zep, but don't know if I could ever put them above Peart. And I can't imagine a discussion about the greatest rock drummers not including Bill Bruford (Yes, Crimson, UK, Genesis...).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would think Ginger Baker, Ringo Starr, John Bonham, Keith Moon and Peart would make a great top 5 to choose from.

Ringo? Really?

Yeah really. Ask Dave Grohl, Mike Portnoy, Max Weinberg, etc. All of them have cited Ringo as an influence. It's easy to write Ringo off if you have no idea what you are talking about.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Carter Beauford and Stanton Moore are my two favorite drummers these days, not sure they are in the all-time great discussion although Beauford probably makes the Top 10ish.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would think Ginger Baker, Ringo Starr, John Bonham, Keith Moon and Peart would make a great top 5 to choose from.

Ringo? Really?

Yeah really. Ask Dave Grohl, Mike Portnoy, Max Weinberg, etc. All of them have cited Ringo as an influence. It's easy to write Ringo off if you have no idea what you are talking about.

OK. Like I wrote, I don't know enough to argue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Two completely different styles but both should be in the conversation:

Buddy Rich

Josh Freese

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would think Ginger Baker, Ringo Starr, John Bonham, Keith Moon and Peart would make a great top 5 to choose from.

Ringo? Really?

Yeah really. Ask Dave Grohl, Mike Portnoy, Max Weinberg, etc. All of them have cited Ringo as an influence. It's easy to write Ringo off if you have no idea what you are talking about.

OK. Like I wrote, I don't know enough to argue.

Oh I wasn't really referring to you. I was referring to the people who constantly act like Ringo just lucked into the job and did nothing but play simple beats.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Two completely different styles but both should be in the conversation:

Buddy Rich

Josh Freese

Absolutely. Should have had him on my list.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Two completely different styles but both should be in the conversation:

Buddy Rich

Josh Freese

Absolutely. Should have had him on my list.

Rich was a jazz drummer, totally different conversation imo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ringo was influential, but one of the best ever? Hell no. But he was still better than many thought he was.

As for best, it is hard to say that one guy is without a doubt the best, but it is hard to argue against Peart. Just listen to YYZ, Natural Science, La Villa Strangiato or 2112.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Carl Palmer is good too

For sure. Palmer would be in my rock drummer top 5, along with Peart, Bonham, Carter Beauford (of DMB) and Gavin Harrison (Porcupine Tree).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Two completely different styles but both should be in the conversation:

Buddy Rich

Josh Freese

Absolutely. Should have had him on my list.

Rich was a jazz drummer, totally different conversation imo.

Good point

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would think Ginger Baker, Ringo Starr, John Bonham, Keith Moon and Peart would make a great top 5 to choose from.

Ringo? Really?

Yeah really. Ask Dave Grohl, Mike Portnoy, Max Weinberg, etc. All of them have cited Ringo as an influence. It's easy to write Ringo off if you have no idea what you are talking about.

I think Ringo and to a lesser degree George Harrison suffer from being slighted due to their relative standing to John and Paul, post Beatles breakup.

Although, I still wouldnt put ringo in my top 5. I believe 4 of my top 5 have been mentioned at various points in this thread though: (in no particular order) Copeland, Baker, Bonham, Peart, and Carlton Barrett

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would think Ginger Baker, Ringo Starr, John Bonham, Keith Moon and Peart would make a great top 5 to choose from.

Ringo? Really?

Yeah really. Ask Dave Grohl, Mike Portnoy, Max Weinberg, etc. All of them have cited Ringo as an influence. It's easy to write Ringo off if you have no idea what you are talking about.

I think Ringo and to a lesser degree George Harrison suffer from being slighted due to their relative standing to John and Paul, post Beatles breakup.

Although, I still wouldnt put ringo in my top 5. I believe 4 of my top 5 have been mentioned at various points in this thread though: (in no particular order) Copeland, Baker, Bonham, Peart, and Carlton Barrett

True

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He made this pronouncement at halftime at the UCLA-USC game. I don't listen to that band all that much. I also am no expert on drumming. If asked I might have said John Bonham or Keith Moon. But that's just throwing out big names on my part because I can't tell you what makes them good drummers (for that matter, not sure my brother can either). Thoughts?

I don't believe you really think that...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Rolling Stone Reader's Survey:

1. Bonham

2. Moon

3. Peart

4. Grohl

5. Starr

6. Rich

7. Copeland

8. ?uestlove

9. Baker

10. Shrieve

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are about 5 guys that can be in the conversation. Peart is one of them. Copeland (Police) is more my favorite. Younger kids usually go with Danny Carey (Tool) or Mike Portnoy (Dream Theater).

:goodposting:

The Great Rock & Roll Draft drummers' judging is worth revisiting. Link to top 5.

Full list, sans writeups. Keep in mind that only drummers who were drafted were ranked.

Pts Drummer

---- ----------------------------

20 Neil Peart

19 John Bonham

18 Danny Carey

17 Keith Moon

16 Stewart Copeland

15 Vinnie Colaiuta

14 Terry Bozzio

13 Mike Portnoy

12 Ginger Baker

11 Carl Palmer

10 Bill Bruford

9 Ringo Starr

8 Bill Ward

7 Manu Katché

6 Dave Grohl

5 Dave Lombardo

4 Tony Allen

3 Charlie Watts

2 Tommy Lee

1 Kenney Jones

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Glenn Kotche is up there. Jimmy Chamberlain was a good rock drummer.

Beauford is way too busy and lacks swing, imo. I find him almost unlistenable. Less is generally more when it comes to drumming.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

no one likes you tim. we think you're a whiny liberal

I like him. :shrug:

Me too

Me three.

Hard to argue against Peart. For sure Top 5.

Tim, did your brother just blurt this out? It would makes sense considering he is your brother. Can you get him to post here?

They were at a football game, which means Tim started up a "Rock Drummers from 1970-2000 Draft" with a notebook and pen. Surprisingly the reception from the crowd around him at the LA Coliseum was less than enthusiastic.

Edited by [icon]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Heck with it -- I'm going to post all the old write-ups from 2010 in spoiler boxes so that's it's not an immense post. Lots of links to performances to help settle/stoke arguments :D Also, well more than 20 drummers are sorted through for comparison's sake, though only 20 were drafted.

1 point: Kenney Jones - A highly competent rock drummer, Jones' work does not particularly stand out against those of his contemporaries. He was a reliable performer for Small Faces/Faces, and then later for The Who. Roger Daltrey, regretably, never ultimately accepted Jones' role in the band -- prompting Jones to comment that "There will never be a right Who drummer, it'll only ever be Keith." Listen to: "Stay With Me", "I'm Losing You", "Eminence Front"

2 points: Tommy Lee - One of the top skinsmen of the 80s glam-metal scene. Lee is as not as virtuous a player as most ahead of him on this list, but is solid in this genre. Listen to: "Dr. Feelgood", "Live Wire", "Smokin' In the Boys Room"

3 points: Charlie Watts - An impeccable timekeeper, Watts has chugged away behind two all-time rock titans for over 40 years. The Stones material does not particularly challenge Watts, who has done many jazz and big-band projects on the side. Listen to: "Paint it Black", "Time is on My Side", "Miss You"

4 points: Tony Allen - Allen is a world music pioneer, played with Fela Kuti and Africa 70 in the 70s. Inextricably linked to the Afrobeat movement. Listen to: "Asiko", "Crazy Afrobeat"

5 points: Dave Lombardo - Lombado possesses speed for days. His playing is not particularly tasteful on Slayer's recordings (cf. Yngwie Malmsteen on guitar), though his energy level and stamina are off the charts. Listen to: "War Ensemble", "Angel of Death", "Silent Scream"

...

Notables passed over at this level: Mick Fleetwood, Kenny Aronoff (John Mellencamp), Clive Bunker (Jethro Tull), Clem Burke (Blondie), Doug Clifford (CCR)

6 points: Dave Grohl - An acclaimed multi-instrumentalist, Grohl served a brief but strong term as grunge's pre-eminent drummer. While Nirvana's percussion parts were relatively simple, Grohl had energy and power to spare. Listen to: "Smells Like Teen Spirit", "Rape Me", "Lithium"

7 points: Manu Katché - A highly distinctive session man, listening to a Katché track will make you think immediately of Peter Gabriel's 80s work. He did his most popular work in the 80s with Gabriel (So, Us) and Sting (Nothing Like the Sun, The Soul Cages). Katché's drumming is less about precision and more about "filling space" -- you'll hear a lot of extra sounds that you won't hear from a traditional rock drum kit. Listen to: "In Your Eyes", "Come Talk to Me"

8 points: Bill Ward - A seminal metal player, Ward's M.O. within Black Sabbath was to lock in with Geezer Butler and hammer the songs home. Despite the limits of this approach, Ward was able to introduce tasty fills into Sabbath's material with some regularity and truly imprint his sound on the tracks. Listen to: "War Pigs", "N.I.B.", "Children of the Grave"

9 points: Ringo Starr - An obvious icon thanks to the popularity of the Beatles. Starr's hands are not the fastest ever, but he had a ton of musicality in his playing (to name but one example: "Come Together" is largely Starr filling the space behind Lennon's vocals). Excellent at changing tempos within songs, which was a must with much of the Beatles' early material. He was contributing a lot more than "boom, bam, crash" to the Beatles' records. Listen to: "Come Together", "She Said She Said", "Strawberry Fields", "Paperback Writer"

10 points: Bill Bruford - A snare-drum master, Bruford lent his speedy rolls and uber-precise playing to both Yes and King Crimson in the 70s. Few have been able to change time signatures within a single piece as accurately as him. Listen to: "Heart of the Sunrise", "South Side of the Sky", "Indiscipline"

...

Notables passed over at this level: Nick Mason (Pink Floyd), Roger Taylor (Queen), Larry Mullen (U2), Phil Collins (Genesis), Alan White (Yes), Matt Cameron (Soundgarden), Aynsley Dunbar (Bowie, Zappa, Jefferson Starship, Journey, Whitesnake)

11 points: Carl Palmer - Palmer is an extraordinarily tasteful player, if not a speed freak. Has a somewhat undeserved rep as a less-than-elite timekeeper, but his role in ELP was to fill sonic space and not to lay back in the pocket. Palmer excelled best live, where he was free to delve into his jazz-influenced solos. Listen to: "Fanfare for the Common Man", "Tarkus", "Karn Evil 9"

12 points: Ginger Baker - Baker's thundering kick-bass and sonic assault on the cymbals provided the blueprint for the hard-rock and metal drumming to follow. Baker was not as quick as many on this list, but his drumming was as up-front as Clapton's guitar and Bruce's bass in the musical signature of Cream. Also known as one of rock drumming's great live improvisers. Listen to: "Sunshine of Your Love", "Toad", "Rollin' & Tumblin' "

13 points: Mike Portnoy - Portnoy is tops in the current prog-metal scene. He can bring the speed of thrash with the tastefulness and fills of prog and traditional rock. A player with few apparent technical limits. He doesn't quite take over DT's sound the way several other players on this list do for their bands. Listen to: "Stream of Conciousness", "Acid Rain", "Ytse Jam"

14 points: Terry Bozzio - Bozzio's an unquestionably elite player known for playing a famously huge multi-layered kit. Fast hands, faster feet, and uncanny skill with multiple rhythms (e.g. hands and feet playing different time signatures). His time in Missing Persons may have hurt his iconography somewhat, as he basically lost some prime years "slumming it" in new wave after leaving Zappa. Listen to: "Tragic", A Private Conversation in Music" (with Chad Wackerman), "The Black Page", plus this insane live solo from his Zappa days.

15 points: Vinnie Colaiuta - Nicknamed "The Alien", and possesses a world-class combination of speed, stylistic versatility, & musicality. Higgins' post about Colaiuta in better than what I can hope to improve upon. Colaiuta and Peart are probably about neck-&-neck in virtuousity -- Colaiuta really only suffers in the Iconography/Influence crierion. Listen to: "Central Scrutinizer" and "Joe's Garage" (Frank Zappa), "Truth Be Told" (with Megadeth), "Seven Days" (with Sting), and a smooth jazz solo. He's also got great performances of "The Black Page" that I'm unable to turn up.

...

Notables passed over at this level: Ian Paice (Deep Purple), Jeff Porcaro (Boz Scaggs, Toto), Carmine Appice (Vanilla Fudge, Blue Murder), Rod Morgenstein (Dixie Dregs, Winger), Mike Shrieve (Santana), Carter Beauford (Dave Matthews Band), Alex Van Halen (Van Halen), Tony Thompson (Chic, The Power Station), Steve Gadd (Paul Simon, Eric Clapton, session man)

16 points: Stewart Copeland - As precise and quick-wristed as anyone on this list, and possessing of top-end musicality. King of the hi-hat -- Copeland introduces tasteful hi-hat undertones into many Police tracks. This helps his drumming fill a lot of sonic space, almost like another non-percussion instrument is in play (not coincidentally, the steel drums in one of his major influences - reggae - play exactly this role). Listen to: "Message In a Bottle", "Regatta De Blanc", "One World (Not Three)". Bonus video of Stewart Copeland teaching a student.

17 points: Keith Moon - Way faster and more dextrous (with all four limbs) than his immediate contemporaries. Moon was an out-of-control personality both behind the drum kit and in his personal life. Moon's double-bass work and "wall of cymbals" sounds were to be echoed in rock music for years afterwards (cf. Alex Van Halen). Listen to: "Heaven and Hell", "A Quick One (While He's Away)", "Cobwebs & Strange" (weird, but love the polka percussion)

18 points: Danny Carey - Carey's playing is what happens when you take thrash drumming and distort it out to three full dimensions. He's a master of off-beat time signatures in a genre that doesn't often demand complexity. Is way out in front of Tool's sound. This guy is really into his drumming -- from Tool's website: "[Carey] uses drumming as a ritual similar to occult rituals, with purposes varying from spiritual exploration to 'a gateway [which] summoned a daemon he has contained ...' " Listen to: "Ticks & Leeches", "The Grudge", "Pu####", "Sober"

19 points: John Bonham - Bonham's power and stamina on the kit are unquestioned, and earned him a huge and deserved following. He actually doesn't get enough credit for his before-their-time speed numbers (see "Achilles' Last Stand" below). Queen's Roger Taylor: "And also the greatest sound out of [bonham's] drums - they sounded enormous, and just one bass drum. So fast on it that he did more with one bass drum than most people could do with three, if they could manage them." Listen to: "When the Levee Breaks", "Kashmir", "Moby Dick", "Achilles' Last Stand", "The Ocean"

20 points: Neil Peart - Peart is a case where the rep matches the reality. One of the most virtuous rock drummers of all time -- a true master of polyrhythms and simltaneous time signatures (e.g. playing waltz time on a hi-hat with one foot while playing 4/4 with his other three limbs). Timekeeping, musicality, solos, innovation ... Peart brought/brings it all to the table. His band, Rush, is one of the few in which the drummer is the biggest rock icon. Listen to: "La Villa Strangiato", "The Rhythm Method", "YYZ", "O Baterista"

...

Notables passed over at this level: Really, no one. The house did a great job IDing the top guys in rock. Chops-wise, guys in other genres like Dave Weckl and Thomas Lang would belong, but neither are rock players.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would think Ginger Baker, Ringo Starr, John Bonham, Keith Moon and Peart would make a great top 5 to choose from.

Ringo? Really?

Yeah really. Ask Dave Grohl, Mike Portnoy, Max Weinberg, etc. All of them have cited Ringo as an influence. It's easy to write Ringo off if you have no idea what you are talking about.

I think Ringo and to a lesser degree George Harrison suffer from being slighted due to their relative standing to John and Paul, post Beatles breakup.

Although, I still wouldnt put ringo in my top 5. I believe 4 of my top 5 have been mentioned at various points in this thread though: (in no particular order) Copeland, Baker, Bonham, Peart, and Carlton Barrett

True

Agreed. Ringo was a highly regarded drummer by other British bands before he joined the Beatles.

He may have been well known to the Beatles but George Martin never heard of him so he brought in session drummer Andy White for the Beatles first recording session of Love Me Do/PS I Love You. White played drums on PS I Love You and also played in the version of Love Me Do on the Please Please Me LP but the version of Love Me Do released as a single has Ringo on drums.

You can tell the difference between the two version easily because the version with White has Ringo shaking a tambourine whereas as the single version has no tambourine.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.