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Suicide (1 Viewer)

wazoo11 said:
So, the past few weeks have been better.  I just started individual CBT coaching with a PhD clincial psychology student. It's eight weeks on a low sliding scale. Way better than trying my luck with private practice. Lexapro has been tremendously helpful with self-motivation. I am able to meet deadlines in a more efficient way. Time management seems less problematic.

The peer support group was quite interesting. I haven't talked to my family yet, though. 
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Great to hear. Sounds like you are well on your way. Don't worry about family. You'll know when or if the time is right.

Another thing that works well for many people is journaling. This is just for yourself to write down your thoughts, trials and errors, what works, what you learned... Sometimes you see things more clearly or remember stuff when you go back and read something. My cousin had hers with her even in her groups, jotting things down.

Glad you got a good start and are moving in the right direction. That's half the battle is to just do it. Nice work.

 
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CurlyNight said:
Great to hear. Sounds like you are well on your way. Don't worry about family. You'll know when or if the time is right.

Another thing that works well for many people is journaling. This is just for yourself to write down your thoughts, trials and errors, what works, what you learned... Sometimes you see things more clearly or remember stuff when you go back and read something. My cousin had hers with her even in her groups, jotting things down.

Glad you got a good start and are moving in the right direction. That's half the battle is to just do it. Nice work.
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It's hard to admit that I was wrong.  It's easier to blame others than have self-awareness or self-reflection.  I feel like half the battle is trying to adapt a more optimistic outlook.  It's really on me to overcome my own insecurities and ineptitude. 

 
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wazoo11 said:
I opened up to a few friends and was met with indifference.  Does this say more about them?  
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I assume you mean about MI. And I assume these are your good friends. If so, I would say yes. I will say from the cancer perspective that we go through the same thing. There are many people who post on the board about how their bff went MIA once they heard of the cancer diagnosis. It could be that they really do care but can't handle bad news due to their own psych issues and so they need to remove themselves from the situation in order for them to survive themselves. Or they don't care, which I find hard to believe assuming said friends you have been close to and they aren't just people you go out with just for fun.Some women say no excuse, they should care and show up. I'm in the ballpark that they just can't deal and need to pull themselves away to keep their own sanity. There is no right or wrong because we all need to do what we need to do in order to survive emotionally and mentally ourselves. Some people have the capacity to take on others on top of their own stuff while others do not or not for long term.

Note too that the subject of MI is not really understood by many people who are not in the same boat. It's getting better nowadays with the media, but imo there's still a long way to go. I gave the example with my cousin where my fam sure they care and love her but their "you haven't gotten over it yet" attitude just made it worse. That's why she moved away and has minimal contact because you try to explain it to them but they don't really get it so it became necessary to pull back from them for her own sanity's sake,

 
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CurlyNight said:
How'd it go?
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My first class with yoga was went not as expected. Not because the yoga instructor did something wrong, but just because I was so stressed out that I couldn’t stop moving and yoga seemed to force me to slow down. So, my first yoga class felt like torture. I was constantly watching the time, trying to hide my anxiety and, of course, it was not certainly on my side.  It's really hard to let go of the struggle with social anxiety, and depression.

 
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wazoo11 said:
My first class with yoga was went not as expected. Not because the yoga instructor did something wrong, but just because I was so stressed out that I couldn’t stop moving and yoga seemed to force me to slow down. So, my first yoga class felt like torture. I was constantly watching the time, trying to hide my anxiety and, of course, it was not certainly on my side.  It's really hard to let go of the struggle with social anxiety, and depression.
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letting go is the key, though. i know it feels differently from the inside, but from our perspective it's like you saying "i can't let go of this feral cat i'm holding which is biting me, clawing me, taking all my strength to control, tearing me apart & giving me diseases cuz, well, it's a kitty". i know that when one doesn't have a lot of control of one's life, it's even harder to release what little control one has, but really............let go. free yourself from what's holding you back. live -

 
wazoo11 said:
My first class with yoga was went not as expected. Not because the yoga instructor did something wrong, but just because I was so stressed out that I couldn’t stop moving and yoga seemed to force me to slow down. So, my first yoga class felt like torture. I was constantly watching the time, trying to hide my anxiety and, of course, it was not certainly on my side.  It's really hard to let go of the struggle with social anxiety, and depression.
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I encourage you not to give up. Becoming relaxed from a place you describe yourself in is going to take awhile. Yoga and meditation are about becoming focused on the present, which is relaxation, to let those thoughts go, clear the head literally. Practice keeping still with a clear mind at home. Don't watch the news for awhile. That alone creates a lot of anxiety as it's always bad news. Watch things that are positive or funny. Reward yourself for being still. If you can get a buddy on board with you or make a friend at such classes it would be a great support and easier to get through. Don't give up. Keep practising your people skills as discussed, and slowing down. If you feel lexapro isn't doing it let your doc know. I don't know if it's a psychiatrist who rx'd it or a pcp but pcps aren't the best for knowing a good combo of drugs. Some people who are really struggling take more than 1 med. Maybe adding something to it like buspar that's more for anxiety may help. Keep on trying and don't give up. We're all rooting for you! xx

 
wikkidpissah said:
letting go is the key, though. i know it feels differently from the inside, but from our perspective it's like you saying "i can't let go of this feral cat i'm holding which is biting me, clawing me, taking all my strength to control, tearing me apart & giving me diseases cuz, well, it's a kitty". i know that when one doesn't have a lot of control of one's life, it's even harder to release what little control one has, but really............let go. free yourself from what's holding you back. live -
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Great analogy. :thumbup:

 
CurlyNight said:
I encourage you not to give up. Becoming relaxed from a place you describe yourself in is going to take awhile. Yoga and meditation are about becoming focused on the present, which is relaxation, to let those thoughts go, clear the head literally. Practice keeping still with a clear mind at home. Don't watch the news for awhile. That alone creates a lot of anxiety as it's always bad news. Watch things that are positive or funny. Reward yourself for being still. If you can get a buddy on board with you or make a friend at such classes it would be a great support and easier to get through. Don't give up. Keep practising your people skills as discussed, and slowing down. If you feel lexapro isn't doing it let your doc know. I don't know if it's a psychiatrist who rx'd it or a pcp but pcps aren't the best for knowing a good combo of drugs. Some people who are really struggling take more than 1 med. Maybe adding something to it like buspar that's more for anxiety may help. Keep on trying and don't give up. We're all rooting for you! xx
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I realized that acceptance, purpose and authenticity come from inside of you. Now trying to live it is a different story.

PS, really enjoyed watching Twin Peaks tonight. 

 
I mentioned in another thread the Chris Cornell thing scares me.  It doesnt feel like he had suicidal intentions.  Just a drug he took for anxiety got the best of him.   

 
Max Power said:
I mentioned in another thread the Chris Cornell thing scares me.  It doesnt feel like he had suicidal intentions.  Just a drug he took for anxiety got the best of him.   
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I agree!!! I forget what I was on to help me sleep. The generic sounded like it was valium but it wasnt. Any way after being on it for a bit I had big time suicidal thoughts. Even at work i would have to find places to hide where I would breakdown and I did not want anyone to see me. At one point I at least had the sense to call my doctor from work for an appointment. They asked what was up and I told them I am feeling like killing myself right now and I need help or I may not see tomorrow.  I got off that med and things improved dramatically. I still have my low moments but not like I was having on those meds. I think I know exactly how Cornell felt. I was just lucky enough to pull through it.

Be careful with new meds and call the doctor if at any time things seem funny.

 
Max Power said:
I mentioned in another thread the Chris Cornell thing scares me.  It doesnt feel like he had suicidal intentions.  Just a drug he took for anxiety got the best of him.   
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If so, then my question is why didn't he go back to his psychiatrist, which is who you should be seeing when taking psych drugs, and say he's feeling suicidal? The warnings of all psych drugs includes may create suicidal thoughts and report it to your doc immediately. If he did report his feeling and the psych didn't change anything which I highly doubt then the psych needs to lose his license. The drug itself doesn't cause suicide. It's up to the person taking such meds to report issues. That goes for the cancer meds I take. If I don't report anything that feels off to my onc then it's not the med or my onc's fault- it's mine. Also with psych drugs you shouldn't be excessively drinking or doing drugs while on them. Not saying he did as we don't know but that is something to note when on such meds.

 
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prosopis said:
I agree!!! I forget what I was on to help me sleep. The generic sounded like it was valium but it wasnt. Any way after being on it for a bit I had big time suicidal thoughts. Even at work i would have to find places to hide where I would breakdown and I did not want anyone to see me. At one point I at least had the sense to call my doctor from work for an appointment. They asked what was up and I told them I am feeling like killing myself right now and I need help or I may not see tomorrow.  I got off that med and things improved dramatically. I still have my low moments but not like I was having on those meds. I think I know exactly how Cornell felt. I was just lucky enough to pull through it.

Be careful with new meds and call the doctor if at any time things seem funny.
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Yup.

 
CurlyNight said:
If so, then my question is why didn't he go back to his psychiatrist, which is who you should be seeing when taking psych drugs, and say he's feeling suicidal? The warnings of all psych drugs includes may create suicidal thoughts and report it to your doc immediately. If he did report his feeling and the psych didn't change anything which I highly doubt then the psych needs to lose his license. The drug itself doesn't cause suicide. It's up to the person taking such meds to report issues. That goes for the cancer meds I take. If I don't report anything that feels off to my onc then it's not the med or my onc's fault- it's mine. Also with psych drugs you shouldn't be excessively drinking or doing drugs while on them. Not saying he did as we don't know but that is something to note when on such meds.
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They reported he took more than his typical dose.  I'd guess that caused the reaction.  Its a hard thing to digest.  IF the guy had suicidal thoughts before going on the meds, how does one know if its "increased"...

 
Max Power said:
They reported he took more than his typical dose.  I'd guess that caused the reaction.  Its a hard thing to digest.  IF the guy had suicidal thoughts before going on the meds, how does one know if its "increased"...
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On his own or the doc upped the dose knowing he had suicidal tendencies. There is no way to really know unless the psych releases the chart as part of an investigation which would include if he kept up with his follow up visits and what was said/done at each one. That's why you need to have a psych following you when you are on psych meds. So many pcps rx a year's worth of depression/anxiety meds without asking you to check back. This was the case with my cousin. She had seen a psych, didn't like her, so she went to her pcp for refills and got a year's worth. Side effects can show up at any time which is why she is required to see her psych every 3 mo just to get another 90 days worth of refill- and she's been on these meds for a long time now. You just never know. I guess the take away in this tragedy for all of us taking any meds is to know our bodies and to report anything off immediately to the doc rx'ing it.

 
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CurlyNight said:
On his own or the doc upped the dose knowing he had suicidal tendencies. There is no way to really know unless the psych releases the chart as part of an investigation which would include if he kept up with his follow up visits and what was said/done at each one. That's why you need to have a psych following you when you are on psych meds. So many pcps rx a year's worth of depression/anxiety meds without asking you to check back. This was the case with my cousin. She had seen a psych, didn't like her, so she went to her pcp for refills and got a year's worth. Side effects can show up at any time which is why she is required to see her psych every 3 mo just to get another 90 days worth of refill- and she's been on these meds for a long time now. You just never know. I guess the take away in this tragedy for all of us taking any meds is to know our bodies and to report anything off immediately to the doc rx'ing it.
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That part doesn't make sense.  They said his bodyguard gave him his dose.  and yet he took "extra" on accident. 

Overall, your last line is solid advice.  my concern is that you never know its a problem until its a problem.  In this case, it might have been too late.

 
Max Power said:
That part doesn't make sense.  They said his bodyguard gave him his dose.  and yet he took "extra" on accident. 

Overall, your last line is solid advice.  my concern is that you never know its a problem until its a problem.  In this case, it might have been too late.
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Wow. That's sad if the bodyguard screwed up. We'll never know for sure as there is no test to see if indeed a side effect was at play unless like I said it's in the chart.

It's easy to forget if you've taken a med let alone if you are on a few. Many times I forget if I've taken a med and have to decide whether to pop another one just in case. I usually skip it. What I use now which helps since I take more than 1 med a day is a 7 day pill reminder. I fill it on Sunday night. This way I can tell if I've taken my dose for the day or not. Here's what I have which helps me since ever since chemo my memory is worse.

https://www.walgreens.com/store/c/ezy-dose-am/pm-travel-pill-reminder-6/72/ID=prod6145631-product

Not only does this help remind you to take your med(s) but also prevents you from double dosing.

 
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CurlyNight said:
Wow. That's sad if the bodyguard screwed up. We'll never know for sure as there is no test to see if indeed a side effect was at play unless like I said it's in the chart.

It's easy to forget if you've taken a med let alone if you are on a few. Many times I forget if I've taken a med and have to decide whether to pop another one just in case. I usually skip it. What I use now which helps since I take more than 1 med a day is a 7 day pill reminder. I fill it on Sunday night. This way I can tell if I've taken my dose for the day or not. Here's what I have which helps me since ever since chemo my memory is worse.

https://www.walgreens.com/store/c/ezy-dose-am/pm-travel-pill-reminder-6/72/ID=prod6145631-product
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These things are priceless.  My grandmother used something like this for her twilight years.   They are worth the price and double.

 
Max Power said:
They reported he took more than his typical dose.  I'd guess that caused the reaction.  Its a hard thing to digest.  IF the guy had suicidal thoughts before going on the meds, how does one know if its "increased"...
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Maybe i can shed some light on this. There is no state of mind in the entire human realm like the post-performance rush. The combustive state of being as full and as empty as one can possibly be AT THE SAME TIME is without match. It's why ####in' is such a good idea after a show - as the experience most close, it's a good detox. It is NOT a time to be dealing with anything that matters, because over-reacting is not a likelihood, it is a necessity. That's why there's backstage shenanigans - so everybody is with somebody when the adrenaline kicks out and the need to feel another cheer or to doubt the quality of the performance kicks in. The mistake is letting someone be alone for a couple hours after a performance. I never did - my drummers were mostly junkies and i preferred they be hittin with others than sober alone, cuz alone, right after a show, is when ODs happen cuz you empty out but still feel youre king so can megadose to make sure you stay king. Alone was the mistake - any drug in rock&roll is a drug that's been took 1000 times before just fine.

 
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wikkidpissah said:
Maybe i can shed some light on this. There is no state of mind in the entire human realm like the post-performance rush. The combustive state of being as full and as empty as one can possibly be AT THE SAME TIME is without match. It's why ####in' is such a good idea after a show - as the experience most close, it's a good detox. It is NOT a time to be dealing with anything that matters, because over-reacting is not a likelihood, it is a necessity. That's why there's backstage shenanigans - so everybody is with somebody when the adrenaline kicks out and the need to feel another cheer or to doubt the quality of the performance kicks in. The mistake is letting someone be alone for a couple hours after a performance. I never did - my drummers were mostly junkies and i preferred they be hittin with others than sober alone, cuz alone, right after a show, is when ODs happen cuz you empty out but still feel youre king so can megadose to make sure you stay king. Alone was the mistake - any drug in rock&roll is a drug that's been took 1000 times before just fine.
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I know some band members and alcohol is always flowing before, during and after a gig.

 
Max Power said:
bump for awareness. We are here for each other.  I'm struggling at the moment, but its encouraging to see other people post.
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we got you, mp. it's the weekend... time to make whatever you want to happen, happen- as small as is needed. baby steps towards something better.

 
the talk about meds got me thinking... 

I've posted in a couple places that I've been in a genuinely misanthropic place the last week or so (feeling better the last couple days), where I felt ready to snap at people in public, at home, in here... for the standard annoying, but usually not bothersome, stuff. figured I was just in some kind of biorhythmic sinkhole. but reading the comments in here made me remember that I was on a juicy cocktail of new meds to deal with a recurring bronchial issue... probably not a coincidence that I got stabby on the heels of downing a litany of new meds.

 
wazoo11 said:
My next question is what books do you recommend reading? I need to work on interpersonal skills. 
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Two books, one much longer than the other, drastically changed the way I interact with people and the way I interpret what other people say.

Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance by Robert M. Pirsig

Acting: The First Six Lessons by Richard Boleslavsky (or Boleslawski depending on what edition you get.)

 
Henry Ford said:
Two books, one much longer than the other, drastically changed the way I interact with people and the way I interpret what other people say.

Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance by Robert M. Pirsig

Acting: The First Six Lessons by Richard Boleslavsky (or Boleslawski depending on what edition you get.)
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Whoa, I just started re-reading that yesterday. It has been so long, I vaguely remember anything. So it is a real treat to read it. Just an amazing book.

 
It's freeing, in a way, for some of us with depression and anxiety to listen and understand that other people are just on a different path than we are.  Trying to understand what other people actually mean when they express things - without judgment, or anger, or shame, or trying to prove them wrong, or assuming the worst - is absolutely integral to my own mental health.

 
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El Floppo said:
the talk about meds got me thinking... 

I've posted in a couple places that I've been in a genuinely misanthropic place the last week or so (feeling better the last couple days), where I felt ready to snap at people in public, at home, in here... for the standard annoying, but usually not bothersome, stuff. figured I was just in some kind of biorhythmic sinkhole. but reading the comments in here made me remember that I was on a juicy cocktail of new meds to deal with a recurring bronchial issue... probably not a coincidence that I got stabby on the heels of downing a litany of new meds.
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Interesting you bring this up.  I had some very serious bronchitis 9 weeks ago and was put on two meds.  Took them for a month and it did the job, but right afterwards I just noticed from reading your post that I was very angry at a few clients right after I finished the meds.  LIke melt down angry.  I'm now thinking the meds had a lot to do with that.  I feel much better five weeks later after being off them.

 
Henry Ford said:
It's freeing, in a way, for some of us with depression and anxiety to listen and understand that other people are just on a different path than we are.  Trying to understand what other people actually mean when they express things - without judgment, or anger, or shame, or trying to prove them wrong, or assuming the worst - is absolutely integral to my own mental health.
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In my peer group, a couple of people have talked about their "Sick" voice in their heads. Somebody finally admitted in the group. Which means I will feel more comfortable talking about the role playing I have done with my counselor. I have found 2 different voices which effect my recovery. "Compulsion" and "THE MOM." Compulsion makes me do things I don't want to do (like eating too much) and THE MOM is the one always smacking me down. It still feels really weird talking about them but also uplifting. Weird because I keep thinking I am really crazy for even thinking this, that it maybe Schizophrenia :crazy: , but both my counselor and Psychiatrist say it is OK. And uplifting because I can  bring these thoughts to the foreground and deal with them. I have had some interesting conversations in my head and also writing in my journal. It is scary, but I know it will be worth it in the end

 
badmojo1006 said:
In my peer group, a couple of people have talked about their "Sick" voice in their heads. Somebody finally admitted in the group. Which means I will feel more comfortable talking about the role playing I have done with my counselor. I have found 2 different voices which effect my recovery. "Compulsion" and "THE MOM." Compulsion makes me do things I don't want to do (like eating too much) and THE MOM is the one always smacking me down. It still feels really weird talking about them but also uplifting. Weird because I keep thinking I am really crazy for even thinking this, that it maybe Schizophrenia :crazy: , but both my counselor and Psychiatrist say it is OK. And uplifting because I can  bring these thoughts to the foreground and deal with them. I have had some interesting conversations in my head and also writing in my journal. It is scary, but I know it will be worth it in the end
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It will.  And everyone has voices.  They just don't think of them as literally as you are.

 
Henry Ford said:
It's freeing, in a way, for some of us with depression and anxiety to listen and understand that other people are just on a different path than we are.  Trying to understand what other people actually mean when they express things - without judgment, or anger, or shame, or trying to prove them wrong, or assuming the worst - is absolutely integral to my own mental health.
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I'm really grateful to be working with compassionate folks at school and therapy.  I also have seen some positives using the ACT method.

 
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Henry Ford said:
Two books, one much longer than the other, drastically changed the way I interact with people and the way I interpret what other people say.

Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance by Robert M. Pirsig

Acting: The First Six Lessons by Richard Boleslavsky (or Boleslawski depending on what edition you get.)
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Great choice. I found out about this book long ago in Phil Jackson's Sacred Hoops book. PJ is a zen master.

 
For those trying to decide whether or not to attempt medications:

Because of a monumental screw up between my doctor and me, I've been without meds for two days.  It is a tremendous difference. If you're considering medication intervention, be aware it makes a massive difference when it's the right medication (and antidepressants don't come and go as fast as my meds do - it's not as sensitive an issue once you get up to speed on them.)

 
Henry Ford said:
For those trying to decide whether or not to attempt medications:

Because of a monumental screw up between my doctor and me, I've been without meds for two days.  It is a tremendous difference. If you're considering medication intervention, be aware it makes a massive difference when it's the right medication (and antidepressants don't come and go as fast as my meds do - it's not as sensitive an issue once you get up to speed on them.)
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You gonna be OK?

 
Henry Ford said:
Let me know how you like them. 
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I just had an a-ha moment reading both books. I just started going and my thought was "is this supposed to rid me of my problems?" because I find that all i really do is complain about my situation and leaving myself in a crying mess. It doesn't get rid of depression or Social Anxiety. Sure it feels great to unload, but where is the window out? 

 
wazoo11 said:
I just had an a-ha moment reading both books. I just started going and my thought was "is this supposed to rid me of my problems?" because I find that all i really do is complain about my situation and leaving myself in a crying mess. It doesn't get rid of depression or Social Anxiety. Sure it feels great to unload, but where is the window out? 
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And how do you feel about that moment?

 
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