captain_amazing

Indefinite New England Patriots Thread

4,348 posts in this topic

24 minutes ago, nightmare said:

The article doesn't mention that the Pats have a lot of free agents to re-sign.

But most of them are not top tier free agents. The two most important ones are Hightower and Butler.

UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
TE Martellus Bennett
RB LeGarrette Blount
RB Brandon Bolden
DT Alan Branch
FB James Develin
WR Michael Floyd
FS Duron Harmon
LB Dont’a Hightower
DE Chris Long
LB Barkevious Mingo
CB Logan Ryan
TE Greg Scruggs
DE Jabaal Sheard

RESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
CB Malcolm Butler
OT Cameron Fleming

EXCLUSIVE-RIGHTS FREE AGENTS
CB Justin Coleman
DE Geneo Grissom
LB Brandon King
TE Matt Lengel

 

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No, they are not, but as much as N.E has success with some plug n play free agents they have had
a few failures. I wouldn't guess what BB's plan is, you just have to trust him.
  

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1 hour ago, Anarchy99 said:

But most of them are not top tier free agents. The two most important ones are Hightower and Butler.

UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
TE Martellus Bennett
RB LeGarrette Blount
RB Brandon Bolden
DT Alan Branch
FB James Develin
WR Michael Floyd
FS Duron Harmon
LB Dont’a Hightower
DE Chris Long
LB Barkevious Mingo
CB Logan Ryan
TE Greg Scruggs
DE Jabaal Sheard

RESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
CB Malcolm Butler
OT Cameron Fleming

EXCLUSIVE-RIGHTS FREE AGENTS
CB Justin Coleman
DE Geneo Grissom
LB Brandon King
TE Matt Lengel

 

Obviously Butler and Hightower are the big ones...not gonna doubt BB but I can't see these two not being back in 2017...hopefully on long deals because they are two of the most important players on this team (and they are young, will make big-plays and both have great attitudes)...they would be incredibly difficult to replace...as for the other names the two I am real interested in are Ryan and Harmon...Ryan is playing at a high-level and I would love to see him back but he could get a silly deal and walk if he hits free agency as CBs tend to be a hot commodity...Harmon is another guy who could get more than the Pats are willing to give...he has turned into a nice solid player but not a guy you overpay for...Branch is a guy I would like to see back as he has settled into a nice role with this team...as long as they can give him short-years he should be in play to come back...Bennett is a guy I would let walk unless he wants to play on a pretty team-friendly deal (which I don't think he will)...he was a huge addition for them but there's a side of me that says you may want to cash in your chips while you are on top with him...as for the other guys there's a few I would like to see come-back but if they don't I am very confident Bill and Caserio can find their replacement...

The more I look at this cape-space the more intrigued I am by this off-season...they are set-up so they can take on a big short-term or two like they did with Revis and Browner...not sure who they would be eying but I gotta believe there will be some rumors soon... 

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NE expected to franchise Hightower if they can't come to an agreement. 

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11 minutes ago, Anarchy99 said:

NE expected to franchise Hightower if they can't come to an agreement. 

I would really like to see both Hightower and Butler locked up long-term...the good news is that Butler is restricted and they have the franchise tag available for Hightower so neither one is going anywhere in 2017 and they have time to figure this out...

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Being a restricted free agent does not automatically mean Butler would be back. If the Pats don't reach an agreement with Butler and slap him with a first round tender tag, another team could offer him the moon and their first round pick and NE would have to match the contract offer. If no one made a qualifying offer (very unlikely), then NE would have get Butler for roughly $4 million this year.

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27 minutes ago, Anarchy99 said:

Being a restricted free agent does not automatically mean Butler would be back. If the Pats don't reach an agreement with Butler and slap him with a first round tender tag, another team could offer him the moon and their first round pick and NE would have to match the contract offer. If no one made a qualifying offer (very unlikely), then NE would have get Butler for roughly $4 million this year.

I know that...guess I am being a little optimistic that this is not an issue...that no one will give him a major deal that the Pats won't match as well as a #1...I think if the Pats are fair to him this won't be an issue...if not they get a #1 along with the Jimmy G picks and than we can watch BB turn it into 20 third round picks...

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Pretty amazing, Pats fans, congratulations.

Edited by SaintsInDome2006
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The Hightower situation does not look to be so rosy. He didn't go to the parade, has already opted out of the White House visit, and the two sides apparently haven't been negotiating. It has been said that he turned down a $10 million a year deal before the season. 

Curran reported that they will let him hit the open market with the thought that they would get a chance to match. 

IMO, not if that gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling that he will be back. 

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At best the odds of Hightower returning are 50/50...I think they will handle him in a similar fashion to the way they dealt with Devin McCourty. It’s likey they let him hit the open market and counter what ever offer he gets. At this point my best guess is that Hightower will not return.

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8 hours ago, Anarchy99 said:

The Hightower situation does not look to be so rosy. He didn't go to the parade, has already opted out of the White House visit, and the two sides apparently haven't been negotiating. It has been said that he turned down a $10 million a year deal before the season. 

Curran reported that they will let him hit the open market with the thought that they would get a chance to match. 

IMO, not if that gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling that he will be back. 

While i don't know for sure, i'd highly doubt not going to the parade had anything to do with his contract situation, and i know not going to the white house doesn't.  That said, I wouldn't be shocked if if he wasn't back, maybe i'm an optimist but i'd say 60/40 he's back.

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I do expect Hightower back...it could be on the franchise tag but I don't think they are in a position to let him go (especially if you get nothing in return)...that being said they could be a little hesitant due to his injury history...he is their best defensive player (and has turned into a leader as well as a big-game player) and he is only 26 but he has only played one full season and injuries are a concern with him...this could be a negotiation kind of like Mankins...I don't think Hightower is gonna give a home-town discount but I do think he will be in a Pats uni next season...I guess I just have faith that this one will get figured out...he would be a huge loss and guys like him are difficult to replace...

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Seems like a no brainer to franchise Hightower 

Edited by Snickers

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Here's to hoping for a raucous round of boos from the Pats hating masses at this years draft being heard TWICE in the first round after the upcoming JG trade.

Of course BB will most likely trade back with one of them thus ruining my moment.

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15 hours ago, Tool said:

While i don't know for sure, i'd highly doubt not going to the parade had anything to do with his contract situation, and i know not going to the white house doesn't.  That said, I wouldn't be shocked if if he wasn't back, maybe i'm an optimist but i'd say 60/40 he's back.

Hightower is not going to the White House because in his words "been there done that", meaning he was there with the Alabama National Championship team. He also skipped the White House (Obama) visit 2 years ago when the Patriots won. So, not going to the White House just looks like indifference, not a political statement. So, i wouldnt be surprised if he skipped the Patriots parade this year for the same "been there done that".

i would be surprised if Hightower was not back next year. Either franchised or signed to a long term deal. He has been described as a leader who was very instrumental in getting the newer linebackers integrated into the Patriots defense. He made game changing plays in both Super Bowls while playing hurt in both games. He made the most underrated play in the win over Seattle when he threw off a blocker and tackled Lynch on the first down play at the end of the game (followed by the Butler play). And in this years game he forced the Ryan fumble. 

Edited by medstudent

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3 hours ago, medstudent said:

Hightower is not going to the White House because in his words "been there done that", meaning he was there with the Alabama National Championship team. He also skipped the White House (Obama) visit 2 years ago when the Patriots won. So, not going to the White House just looks like indifference, not a political statement. So, i wouldnt be surprised if he skipped the Patriots parade this year for the same "been there done that".

i would be surprised if Hightower was not back next year. Either franchised or signed to a long term deal. He has been described as a leader who was very instrumental in getting the newer linebackers integrated into the Patriots defense. He made game changing plays in both Super Bowls while playing hurt in both games. He made the most underrated play in the win over Seattle when he threw off a blocker and tackled Lynch on the first down play at the end of the game (followed by the Butler play). And in this years game he forced the Ryan fumble. 

I have a hard time believing that you can skip these kinds of activities for the reason he stated.  I could be completely wrong, but it seems to go against the Pats' culture, which is all about being team-first.  I'm guessing anyone skipping the whitehouse has a reason that's more substantive for not going other than "I've already been there" - I'm sure they don't need much of a reason (e.g. don't agree with elected officials, family matters, etc.), but I'd guess that BB would require something.  Additionally, I have a hard time believing he skipped the parade for no reason.  Did no other team members feel that they had "been there done that" and would have rather done something else?  All of it stinks like someone not happy with the way things are going (or not going) contract-wise.

 

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I think they are doing with Hightower what they did with Mccourty and Edelman. I think they do want him but they are okay with him testing the market. I feel like it will probably go down to the 11th hour again.

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4 minutes ago, Run It Up said:

I think they are doing with Hightower what they did with Mccourty and Edelman. I think they do want him but they are okay with him testing the market. I feel like it will probably go down to the 11th hour again.

This is exactly how I feel about this.

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Watching the Pats first SB victory on NFL Network, Brady looks like he just got his driver's license. And Faulk can still go pound sand. 

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1 hour ago, Anarchy99 said:

Watching the Pats first SB victory on NFL Network, Brady looks like he just got his driver's license. And Faulk can still go pound sand. 

Give JR Redmond and Otis Smith my regards...

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Brian Daboll is the new Alabama Offensive Coordinator.  Obviously Belichick and Saban are very close, so he comes highly recommended.  We've heard he was next in line for OC of the Pats?  Players talk highly of him.  Any noteworthy insight?

Edited by gump

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I gotta rant for a second:

<RANT>

What's with all the disrespect for Wes Welker?  It really grinds my gears.  I am a HUGE fan of Edelman and you can go back and find psots form me about how I thought Edelman would be the next Welker when folks thought Edelman was a jag, but Welker gets such disrepect by NE fans and it drives me nuts.  If you had to choose Edelman and Welker straight up in their prime and you choose Edelman, then there's something wrong with you.  Welker was the better receiver of the too, reliable as ####, far less injury prone, and great at YAC.  Edelman is the better athelete any by far the better punt returner, and while a very good receiver, not as good as Welker.  

</RANT>

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Also, still pissed about the folks that wanted to jettison James White. 

You know who you are.

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1 hour ago, captain_amazing said:

Also, still pissed about the folks that wanted to jettison James White. 

You know who you are.

I will come clean on White...I thought he was just a jag for awhile...and for a period of time he was...but it appears he has a chance to be the next kevin Faulk and he has earned it...I am definitely comfortable with him now...

i love Welker but if it's third and five in a big playoff game give me Edelman all day long...

Edited by Boston

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4 minutes ago, Boston said:

I will come clean on White...I thought he was just a jag for awhile...and for a period of time he was...but it appears he has a chance to be the next kevin Faulk and he has earned it...I am definitely comfortable with him now...

i love Welker but if it's third and five in a big playoff game give me Edelman all day long...

I don't think he was ever a jag, but to each their own.  I think he got a bad rap after that Denver game, and everyone jumped on the bandwagon to run the kid out of town.  

While I still think Welker is better than Edelman as a WR, I do understand your sentiment there.

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6 minutes ago, captain_amazing said:

I don't think he was ever a jag, but to each their own.  I think he got a bad rap after that Denver game, and everyone jumped on the bandwagon to run the kid out of town.  

While I still think Welker is better than Edelman as a WR, I do understand your sentiment there.

 Never wanted him out of town...I honestly thought he couldn't take his game to another level and early in his career he just didn't "pop"...I thought he would just be an ok guy who you trusted but not quite good enough to make the big play when it counted...I am very pleased to say I was wrong and if he can build off of that Super Bowl performance and give the Pats a run of years like Faulk did than they will be in good hands with that role... 

Edited by Boston

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6 minutes ago, captain_amazing said:

I don't think he was ever a jag, but to each their own.  I think he got a bad rap after that Denver game, and everyone jumped on the bandwagon to run the kid out of town.  

While I still think Welker is better than Edelman as a WR, I do understand your sentiment there.

Welker is tough as nails but Edelman has that insane quality about him that just gives the whole team a lift...the punishment both these guys have taken is scary...

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12 hours ago, gump said:

Brian Daboll is the new Alabama Offensive Coordinator.  Obviously Belichick and Saban are very close, so he comes highly recommended.  We've heard he was next in line for OC of the Pats?  Players talk highly of him.  Any noteworthy insight?

I think he will do real well there...the best way to describe him is a trusted BB Assistant...he is well regarded here and he is a natural fit to work with Saban after being with BB...I think this could turn out to be a real nice hire...great move for both DaBoll and The Tide...

Edited by Boston
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Count me in the crowd that thinks White is just another guy.

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On 2/8/2017 at 0:01 PM, Anarchy99 said:

But most of them are not top tier free agents. The two most important ones are Hightower and Butler.

UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
TE Martellus Bennett
RB LeGarrette Blount
RB Brandon Bolden
DT Alan Branch
FB James Develin
WR Michael Floyd
FS Duron Harmon
LB Dont’a Hightower
DE Chris Long
LB Barkevious Mingo
CB Logan Ryan
TE Greg Scruggs
DE Jabaal Sheard

RESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
CB Malcolm Butler
OT Cameron Fleming

EXCLUSIVE-RIGHTS FREE AGENTS
CB Justin Coleman
DE Geneo Grissom
LB Brandon King
TE Matt Lengel

 

$60m in cap space .... so can only afford to sign 8 or 10 of these players to retain them?

Who do they resign? Who doesn't get re-signed?

UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
TE Martellus Bennett - Team wants him but he would have to sign at a discount. Talks about how much he liked being a Patriot but not sure Bennett will give up a couple million just for another title shot. I hope I'm wrong.
RB LeGarrette Blount - $$ Should be back. Already learned his lesson in PIT. Would play for NE for free if need be.
RB Brandon Bolden - He's still on the team?
DT Alan Branch - $$$ Team loves the widebody DL
FB James Develin - $ Cheap money
WR Michael Floyd
FS Duron Harmon
LB Dont’a Hightower - $$$$ Defensive leader. Top priority.
DE Chris Long - Time to retire
LB Barkevious Mingo
CB Logan Ryan - Someone is going to overpay Ryan. Won't be the Pats
TE Greg Scruggs
DE Jabaal Sheard - Another super bowl champ that someone will overpay
RT Sebastian Vollmer - Big German is gonna get one last big contract ... somewhere else.


RESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
CB Malcolm Butler - $$$$ Will be priority #2 behind Hightower. 
OT Cameron Fleming - $$

 

One advantage the Pats have is that other teams quality free agents may choose to sign at a discount so they can have a shot at a ring.

Gotta leave some money aside for those guys coming in.

 

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They certainly could keep more than 8 or 10 of those players if they wanted them back. Some of them won't cost much at all. Blount played last year for under $1 million. Branch was a little over $2 million. Floyd would play for peanuts if they wanted him back. Develin played for $750K. I have read speculation that they will give Butler a first round tender so they could get him back for only $4 million. I have my doubts that that would play that way, but it is a cheap option to try. 

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6 hours ago, Anarchy99 said:

They certainly could keep more than 8 or 10 of those players if they wanted them back. Some of them won't cost much at all. Blount played last year for under $1 million. Branch was a little over $2 million. Floyd would play for peanuts if they wanted him back. Develin played for $750K. I have read speculation that they will give Butler a first round tender so they could get him back for only $4 million. I have my doubts that that would play that way, but it is a cheap option to try. 

I could see them keeping Harmon and Mingo if they can be had for cheap. 

I think someone will pay Floyd a decent contract now that his off-field shenanigans have faded from memory somewhat.

 

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Just now, Bossman said:

I could see them keeping Harmon and Mingo if they can be had for cheap. 

I think someone will pay Floyd a decent contract now that his off-field shenanigans have faded from memory somewhat.

 

Doubt it. He's a P.R. nightmare, is guaranteed a suspension, and has all but begged to stay with NE. How did the other guys with off-field issues do? Hardy . . . no job. Rice . . . no job. Manziel . . . no job. Josh Brown . . . no job. Blackmon . . . no job. Former NE CB Alfonzo Dennard . . . no job. It's not like teams are lining up to sign players with off field issues.

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Not sure when Floyd's sentence begins but he may miss either the start of free agency or be on house arrest during training camp

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15 minutes ago, bostonfred said:

Not sure when Floyd's sentence begins but he may miss either the start of free agency or be on house arrest during training camp

He is already serving his "120-day" sentence . . . which is really just 24 days in "prison" . . . and then 96 days of house arrest, I believe he started right after he accepted the plea deal. That puts him totally out on the street on 6/15. He would still get a full training camp in, so that part would not be an issue. All he would miss would be OTA's (and however long his suspension would be). I would not be shocked if the league waits to see where he signs. If it's NE . . . then 4 games. Anywhere else . . . 2 games. 

 

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On ‎2‎/‎17‎/‎2017 at 11:00 PM, Run It Up said:

Count me in the crowd that thinks White is just another guy.

He is a jag....in any other system. He would be just like Lewis was in CLE. A nobody. If you can grasp the NE system, you will thrive. If you can't Aaron Dobson, Chad Johnson, you will be gone. Sometimes it takes a little while to grasp it. They worked with Dobson and finally gave up.

Michael Floyd will be cut before the start of the season. He's too dumb.

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