Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
massraider

Official Jameis Winston - football talk

Recommended Posts

1 minute ago, rockaction said:

Deep Ball Project over at Football Outsiders also has him rated lowly on truly deep passes. 

Never clicked with DeSean Jackson.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/13/2020 at 4:55 AM, ZWK said:

The Packers traded Tobin Rote to the Lions after he led the NFL in passing yards & touchdowns. Rote proceeded to lead the Lions to an NFL title over the Browns.

ahhhh... the good old days...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, TheWinz said:

Does he remain the TB starter for 2020?

I have Godwin in dynasty now, so I hope so. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the Bucs are stupid if they don't at least give him one more year. He's more familiar with the system, he got his vision corrected, and its not like there are tons of guys walking around that have thrown 5000 yards and 30TDs. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, ffmail4me said:

I think the Bucs are stupid if they don't at least give him one more year. He's more familiar with the system, he got his vision corrected, and its not like there are tons of guys walking around that have thrown 5000 yards and 30TDs. 

This. I mean if you could actually sign a better guy in FA go for it. But is Andy Dalton really anywhere near Winston's current ceiling? He'll be cheaper but that's it. Philip Rivers? LOL. Teddy Bridgewater? Certainly less error prone but risk averse also.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Exactly, I think the only direction they go is backwards if they cut him and sign someone else or start a rookie. But maybe that's what they want to do? Tank for Point Break? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, ffmail4me said:

I think the Bucs are stupid if they don't at least give him one more year. He's more familiar with the system, he got his vision corrected, and its not like there are tons of guys walking around that have thrown 5000 yards and 30TDs. 

He’s a coach killer. Move on. Better chance of winning with Dalton.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, rockaction said:

I have Godwin in dynasty now, so I hope so. 

Godwin might be even better with Rivers. Godwin is in a lot of ways, a more athletic Keenan Allen, and the Bucs pass protect a ton better than the Chargers do, and don't get super run heavy inside the redzone like the Chargers do.

 

9 hours ago, ffmail4me said:

I think the Bucs are stupid if they don't at least give him one more year. He's more familiar with the system, he got his vision corrected, and its not like there are tons of guys walking around that have thrown 5000 yards and 30TDs. 

Just because he threw for 5,000 yards and 30 TD's, doesn't mean he was a good, or even decent QB last year. Baker Mayfield was the only QB last year with a worse TD/INT ratio. Only Mayfield and Josh Allen had a worse comp%, and only Mayfield had a worse passer rating among 16 game starters. Unlike those guys Winston isn't a guy in his first 30 starts he's a guy with 5 years starting. 

Winston isn't a good QB. He shouldn't be starting for anyone in my opinion. He hasn't improved one bit since his rookie year, and has arguably regressed. Its ironic since they shared a team, but he's basically Fitzpatrick. He can get hot for short stretches, but never sustains it. Let's not forget with the same weapons, Fitzpatrick outplayed Winston in 2018.

Tampa Bay is set up very well for fantasy purposes. But, NFL wise, Winston hurt them more than he helped them. Rivers would add at least 2 wins to the team, Dalton would be an upgrade as well. Tampa has the best 1-2 punch at WR in the NFL a solid o-line, a good playcaller, and arguably the division with the least amount of defense. Its almost ideal conditions for a QB.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, The Frankman said:

This. I mean if you could actually sign a better guy in FA go for it. But is Andy Dalton really anywhere near Winston's current ceiling? He'll be cheaper but that's it. Philip Rivers? LOL. Teddy Bridgewater? Certainly less error prone but risk averse also.

Not in stats, but the team doesn't care about that. Will Dalton put them in bad positions that require slinging it like crazy in the second half? Will he make the wrong throw at exactly the wrong time? Will he turn it over nearly three dozen times?

Dalton won't make the Bucs a more explosive team, or more fun to watch. But he just might make them a better team. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thinking Winston can be unlocked to take this big step forward is a fool's errand.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Neil Beaufort Zod said:

Not in stats, but the team doesn't care about that. Will Dalton put them in bad positions that require slinging it like crazy in the second half? Will he make the wrong throw at exactly the wrong time? Will he turn it over nearly three dozen times?

Dalton won't make the Bucs a more explosive team, or more fun to watch. But he just might make them a better team. 

It doesn't really matter if you have a Dalton or a Winston. But some needy team will sign him and pay him a lot of money for brief moments of brilliance surrounded by long stretches of suckiness. Teams do this all the time with coaching retreads too. See Jets.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The middle ground would be to tag him for one year. How much would that cost though?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, rockaction said:

I have Godwin in dynasty now, so I hope so. 

At first glance, I thought losing Winston would bring Godwin's stock down.  But consider this - if Godwin can have a 71.1% catch percentage with a guy who throws at a 60.7% rate, could he approach Michael Thomas levels with an accurate QB?  How many WR's are 10% higher than their QB?  The list is quite small, and if we are talking about fantasy relevant guys, you can count them on one hand.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, TheWinz said:

At first glance, I thought losing Winston would bring Godwin's stock down.  But consider this - if Godwin can have a 71.1% catch percentage with a guy who throws at a 60.7% rate, could he approach Michael Thomas levels with an accurate QB?  How many WR's are 10% higher than their QB?  The list is quite small, and if we are talking about fantasy relevant guys, you can count them on one hand.

 I guess if you're going to drill down the numbers, that makes sense. It just seemed like with Jameis's arm and Arians's system, Godwin benefitted. That could be at total first blush, though, and I'd be happy to be wrong. I think the big thing for Godwin was getting to run routes more frequently than under Koetter. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, rockaction said:

 I guess if you're going to drill down the numbers, that makes sense. It just seemed like with Jameis's arm and Arians's system, Godwin benefitted. That could be at total first blush, though, and I'd be happy to be wrong. I think the big thing for Godwin was getting to run routes more frequently than under Koetter. 

He had more targets per snap in 2018 when he played behind both Evans and Humphries than he had in 2019.  I think the fear in FF is that a WR will decline with a QB change, but that's not always the case.  Many times it's just the opposite.  He had better per game stats with Fitz vs Jameis in 2018.  He will be fine in 2020 no matter who is throwing to him.  A definite hold in dynasty. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, TheWinz said:

 A definite hold in dynasty. 

Many have him as a top ten-twenty guy overall, even. Certainly worth a ton. 

Edited by rockaction

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Leroy Hoard said:

The middle ground would be to tag him for one year. How much would that cost though?

27M I believe. My guess is that is what happens and they draft a QB. 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Quote

Coach Bruce Arians said the Bucs have yet to make a decision on Jameis Winston's future with the team.

"Really nothing has changed," Arians said. "You get about three days to decide. The legal tampering period. Is somebody going to get let go? What's the trade values? It's really monotonous right now because you don't have any answers." The Bucs have "legitimate interest" in Philip Rivers, who moved to Florida this offseason. They've also been linked to Tom Brady, Teddy Bridgewater, and Ryan Tannehill, but whether they view Rivers or any of the other options as upgrades on Winston remains to be seen. With Winston contract talks going nowhere, signs continue to point to the Bucs going in a different direction.

SOURCE: Tampa Bay Times

Feb 15, 2020, 1:00 PM ET

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Quote

ESPN's Jenna Laine reports the Bucs have considered a two-year extension for Jameis Winston.

Winston would get a fully guaranteed $27 million salary this season — roughly the same the Bucs would pay him under the franchise tag — and a team option for 2021. It's not a very player-friendly deal, but re-signing with the Bucs would allow Winston to rehab his value in a scheme that saw him throw for the eighth-most yards in NFL history last year. Winston may also be a candidate for the transition tag, which would pay him $2.5 million less than being franchised. The Bucs have been strongly linked to Philip Rivers, and despite coach Bruce Arians taking multiple shots at Winston through the media, there's still a chance he's brought back on a short-term deal.

SOURCE: Jenna Laine on Twitter

Feb 21, 2020, 6:32 PM ET

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, King of the Jungle said:

Winston is a top 10–20 overall dynasty player? 

No, Godwin.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hope that people look at Winston in redraft and think he sucks and will never learn so I can take him late. The last two QBs I've taken late have won the MVP (2018 Mahomes 11th in a 14-teamer, 2019 Lamar Jackson in the 6th). I'd love it if his ADP stays north of 120.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, The Frankman said:

I hope that people look at Winston in redraft and think he sucks and will never learn so I can take him late. The last two QBs I've taken late have won the MVP (2018 Mahomes 11th in a 14-teamer, 2019 Lamar Jackson in the 6th). I'd love it if his ADP stays north of 120.

If he stays with the Bucs, he should be a steal next year.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/21/2020 at 6:59 PM, Faust said:

 

 

Seems like a pretty fair deal for a guy who turned it over 35 times, but I doubt he and his agent will see it that way. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, kutta said:

If he stays with the Bucs, he should be a steal next year.

He's been a steal for a couple years and now he can actually see.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Quote

When asked if the organization would tag free agent QB Jameis Winston, coach Bruce Arians responded he'll know when "I know who else is available."

Arians eluded that teams really don't know who's going to hit the market "until the tags come out," leaving 2-3 days to make any final decisions. He then added he'll know on Winston's situation when the organization knows "who else is available" next week. "Can we win with Jameis? Hell yeah," Arians said. "But you have to see if there is a better option." All signs point to Tampa Bay bringing back stud EDGE Shaquil Barrett in free agency, but Winston's suitor is still clearly up in the air. The 26-year-old returning on a short-term deal remains a likely outcome.

SOURCE: Rick Stroud on Twitter

Feb 25, 2020, 11:28 AM ET

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Quote

NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reports Jameis Winston had offseason surgery for a torn meniscus.

With Winston looking for a long-term deal, his camp is making sure to expose every ailment he played through in 2019 to show his toughness. Winston apparently couldn't see (eye surgery), couldn't move (meniscus surgery), and couldn't grip a football (broken thumb) as well as he should have last season. It makes his evaluation complicated because he was still productive, but the Bucs are on the fence with him as their 2020 starting quarterback given all of his turnovers. Expect the Bucs to explore the free agent and rookie quarterbacks over the next few weeks, but they may have to settle for each other if other options sour.

SOURCE: Ian Rapoport on Twitter

Feb 28, 2020, 2:53 PM ET

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, BoltNlava said:

So that deft, thumbed blind kid sure could throw a football?

He's got the upside of a guy who won't get fooled again.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Leroy Hoard said:

He's got the upside of a guy who won't get fooled again.

And apparently after his eye surgery he said I can see for miles...

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He’s going to cause a big ssssss-ensation

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bucs reporters reported his meniscus was torn back in December so I don’t know why it’s news today. I’m not sure if he’s any good or not but he’s a tough SOB out there for sure. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

NBC Sports' Peter King reports Winston "is likely" to leave the Buccaneers in free agency. However, King was uncertain which team Winston will end up with and doubted he'll be a starter with a new team. Last season, the Florida State product led the NFL in passing yards (5,109) and was second in touchdowns (33) but also threw a league-wide 30 interceptions.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2020/03/02/nfl-rumors-jameis-winston-tom-brady-patriots-free-agency?xid=socialflow_twitter_si&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sinow&utm_source=twitter.com

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is a crazy market for quarterbacks. Wouldn't a lot of them benefit, given their age or contract situation, to stay where they are under systems they know? Jameis with Evans and Godwin is a fantasy dream. Hate to see it end. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, rockaction said:

This is a crazy market for quarterbacks. Wouldn't a lot of them benefit, given their age or contract situation, to stay where they are under systems they know? Jameis with Evans and Godwin is a fantasy dream. Hate to see it end. 

I hope Brady or Rivers one ends up in TB if they are moving on from Winston. For all of us Evans/Godwin owners :) And think what it could mean for OJ Howard (Gronk/Gates role?) BRING IT ON

Edited by ffmail4me
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He should be treated the same way as TE Austin Hooper. Go see what you can get in the open market and come back to us if you don't like it. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, rockaction said:

This is a crazy market for quarterbacks. Wouldn't a lot of them benefit, given their age or contract situation, to stay where they are under systems they know? Jameis with Evans and Godwin is a fantasy dream. Hate to see it end. 

I had both Winston and Evans on my roster last year.  The interceptions were mind boggling, but knowing that he'd be throwing the ball all day long made them tolerable.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, lod001 said:

He should be treated the same way as TE Austin Hooper. Go see what you can get in the open market and come back to us if you don't like it. 

I'm not sure it works that way very often. Pretty much if you don't reach an agreement before free agency you are going to play elsewhere. I would guess that most players would take offense to that approach and aren't going to talk with that former club anymore and just move on.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, rockaction said:

This is a crazy market for quarterbacks. Wouldn't a lot of them benefit, given their age or contract situation, to stay where they are under systems they know? Jameis with Evans and Godwin is a fantasy dream. Hate to see it end. 

I don’t think he gets to make that decision. Sounds like there are numerous guys the Bucs would prefer to have, unfortunately Bridgewater is one of them. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Capella said:

I don’t think he gets to make that decision. Sounds like there are numerous guys the Bucs would prefer to have, unfortunately Bridgewater is one of them. 

Bridgewater will be a Nick Foles level disaster.  If they're moving on I'd prefer they sign a mid-tier free agent like Mariota, an aging vet like Rivers, or trade for Dalton and then draft Love or Herbert with the 14th pick. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it's crazy not to bring Winston back. Sure the interceptions are an issue, but sticking with him for a couple more years to see if he can learn better ball security seems like a better option than an old QB  or a mediocre QB. Sticking with Winston and drafting a rookie in case sounds like the best option. Then again, this is Tampa Bay we are talking about.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
20 hours ago, Warhogs said:

I think it's crazy not to bring Winston back. Sure the interceptions are an issue, but sticking with him for a couple more years to see if he can learn better ball security seems like a better option than an old QB  or a mediocre QB. Sticking with Winston and drafting a rookie in case sounds like the best option. Then again, this is Tampa Bay we are talking about.

 

He's played the better part of 5 seasons, 70+ games. How much do you need to see? What's the thing that suddenly facilitates a change in his game?

Edited by habsfan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Which available QB do you like better? Brady and Rivers are at the very tail end of their careers. Bridgewater has never shown me he is more than average. Dalton if available has seemed like a decent game manager but I thought he was known for a weak arm?

I too doubt that Winston will change his colors and suddenly become someone who can take care of the football but I think of all the options he still has the highest upside long term. I would bring back Winston and draft a rookie and hope you get lucky and hit a good NFL QB.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, Warhogs said:

Which available QB do you like better? Brady and Rivers are at the very tail end of their careers. Bridgewater has never shown me he is more than average. Dalton if available has seemed like a decent game manager but I thought he was known for a weak arm?

I too doubt that Winston will change his colors and suddenly become someone who can take care of the football but I think of all the options he still has the highest upside long term. I would bring back Winston and draft a rookie and hope you get lucky and hit a good NFL QB.

The franchise tag and draft someone option makes sense but otherwise I would probably prefer someone with a bit less "upside" as opposed to wash, rinse, repeat with Winston.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Warhogs said:

Which available QB do you like better? Brady and Rivers are at the very tail end of their careers. Bridgewater has never shown me he is more than average. Dalton if available has seemed like a decent game manager but I thought he was known for a weak arm?

I too doubt that Winston will change his colors and suddenly become someone who can take care of the football but I think of all the options he still has the highest upside long term. I would bring back Winston and draft a rookie and hope you get lucky and hit a good NFL QB.

The thing is, Tampa isn't that far off. They probably make the playoffs last year, if Winston doesn't cost them multiple games with some just awful decisions. Arians likely isn't going to be around 3+ years from now. The defense is good right now, the offense is great, with better QB play this is a playoff contender. Let us not forget Winston being outplayed by Ryan Fitzpatrick in 2018. 

Brady and Rivers are huge upgrades. I think Dalton would be slightly better. I could see cases for guys like Mariota, Foles, and even Alex Smith if he is cleared. If there is any fire to this Brady to the 49ers or Titans smoke, I'd rather have Tannehill or Jimmy G. I do 100% agree that Bridgewater would be a poor fit. 

Winston has put up big yards/TD's, but he's been an ideal environment, and hasn't shown any signs of improving his decision making in 5 years, its arguably regressed. I personally don't think he should be starting for anybody, and has lost the benefit of the doubt, as again, his conditions have been damn near ideal. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.