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Bamac

SSL3 Discussion Thread

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If it were set in stone, then the mfl timer would be on... This isn't my first season at this, and I've never seen anyone skipped so swiftly... Everyone wants bragging rights here, but to what end? What is there to brag about if you're not willing to play against everyone at their best..

Whatever... I'm still aggravated about it, you wont convince me otherwise.. Probably wouldn't have bothered me as much if it weren't the guy picking right after me..

Traditionally we have only used the message boards. MFL during the draft is a very recent addition and really only used for tracking the draft, predrafting, and then eventually scoring the league. The point of these drafts is to generate discussion, ADP, and to have a little fun by watching it play out.

These leagues have been going on for almost a decade. The rules have always been the same. You get an 8 hour clock and if you miss it your clock gets halved. It's not personal. It is necessary to keep things moving because when things move too slowly people lose interest. We've seen some of these go completely off the rails so the rules are in place for a reason. I hope you can move past this and continue to have an enjoyable draft.

Coincidentally, Mr Irrelevant has now been on the clock for over 8 hours... All though I'm tempted, I don't plan on skipping him and giving him a no name kicker... (as was done to me by him)

And I see that none of you have done that either..

I am not sure what has happened this year, but there is confusion in the midst of the ranks. The rules are posted in a sticky at the very first post in the very first topic of this forum. I will paste the time rule for PDSL and SSL (ssl is based on pdsl, but two rounds shorter).

8 hour clock

clock is turned off 12am - 8am EST

Mr. Irrelevant was correct to draft after the eight hour window. MFL allows for pre-draft and that allows all of us to avoid real life interference, whether it be due to travel, work, family, or act of nature. I have taken a call on rare occasion from members I have dratted with over the years, though I don't offer that universally. A PM to a league member that you cannot access the board works very well, but make sure they respond.

It was not that Mr. I picked microseconds ahead of you, I checked and your pick did not go in for three hours after the time expired. Time outs are not common, but happen every year, though not necessarily every league. Even the staff members have timed out and been penalized in the past.

Mr. I was put in a less than desirable position because of your delay. The etiquette is to apologize to the league for the delay with an explanation or just apologize. We all like to do these drafts for fun, and the bragging rights are limited. I don't recall getting free drinks every for making it to SSL1 or a league finals.

I was put in a similar position this year by Carl W Football in PDSL, and his response was almost a caricature of immaturity. He left the league, thankfully many league mates and board members supported the comment I made, and the PDSL moved on.

You are competitive, have a passion for fantasy football, and hopefully will contribute to the discussion. Please believe we welcome you and your input, but I for one believe that you owe Mr. I an apology for your initial remark, and the following, as well as suggesting the league is allowing him to ignore the clock when in fact he is not.

Everyone understands the frustration, we have all been there in one fashion or another. Just don't transfer blame or pain, it is a life lesson that translates to everything you do, not just this incident.

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1) My pick was 3 hours late because I didn't know if I could make up the pick until 3 hours after, or how I would about doing so.. I was actually on line when my pick was skipped. I was trying to make a pick with my phone

2) Certainly I used some harsh words in my frustration, for that I do apologize, and for being late as well. But I still feel like it was not necessary to skip my pick, and that it was inconsiderate from that perspective as well.

3) I never suggested that he is ignoring the clock, though he was on line, at the mfl page last night when I picked. I think maybe he forgot to pick, or that he fell asleep, or whatever. My point is, that he is in violation of the clock, and he has not been skipped.. I'm not trying to implicate Mr. I, I'm pointing out that it is not necessary to skip someone immediately when they are in violation of the clock..

This may be a hot button for you because you'd like to justify your action of skipping someone in another league, I understand, and... whatever... I'm ready to move on. I don't believe skipping picks is necessary in this setup, you may disagree, whatever...

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1) My pick was 3 hours late because I didn't know if I could make up the pick until 3 hours after, or how I would about doing so.. I was actually on line when my pick was skipped. I was trying to make a pick with my phone

2) Certainly I used some harsh words in my frustration, for that I do apologize, and for being late as well. But I still feel like it was not necessary to skip my pick, and that it was inconsiderate from that perspective as well.

3) I never suggested that he is ignoring the clock, though he was on line, at the mfl page last night when I picked. I think maybe he forgot to pick, or that he fell asleep, or whatever. My point is, that he is in violation of the clock, and he has not been skipped.. I'm not trying to implicate Mr. I, I'm pointing out that it is not necessary to skip someone immediately when they are in violation of the clock..

This may be a hot button for you because you'd like to justify your action of skipping someone in another league, I understand, and... whatever... I'm ready to move on. I don't believe skipping picks is necessary in this setup, you may disagree, whatever...

1. First of all I'll apologize if you weren't up to speed on the rules. May be time for a re-write, but I'm not sure the juice is worth the squeeze given we have so few problems and the time it would take. You can always post your pick in the draft pick thread and someone else can clean up mfl later.

2. We have immediately skipped someone after they missed their pick for 10+ years now. It's nothing personal, it's how things are done. It happened last year when you were here.

3. The clock is off from mid-mite to 8am so Mr. I has not violated the 8 hour clock.

4. You are now on a 4 hour clock for the balance of the draft. If you miss another pick, you will be on a 2 hour clock. Don't get upset, it's happened to most of us at one time or another. I remember being on a one hour clock in one league at a time when work was hectic.

5. If we didn't have the clock, these drafts would take 6 plus weeks and turn into a train wreck. We've seen it and it's not fun. Turns into a #####fest and eventually no one checks in a on regular basis.

6. I you know you aren't going to be around (especially during prime business hours), send a pm to someone active with your wish list or load it into mfl.

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1) My pick was 3 hours late because I didn't know if I could make up the pick until 3 hours after, or how I would about doing so.. I was actually on line when my pick was skipped. I was trying to make a pick with my phone

2) Certainly I used some harsh words in my frustration, for that I do apologize, and for being late as well. But I still feel like it was not necessary to skip my pick, and that it was inconsiderate from that perspective as well.

3) I never suggested that he is ignoring the clock, though he was on line, at the mfl page last night when I picked. I think maybe he forgot to pick, or that he fell asleep, or whatever. My point is, that he is in violation of the clock, and he has not been skipped.. I'm not trying to implicate Mr. I, I'm pointing out that it is not necessary to skip someone immediately when they are in violation of the clock..

This may be a hot button for you because you'd like to justify your action of skipping someone in another league, I understand, and... whatever... I'm ready to move on. I don't believe skipping picks is necessary in this setup, you may disagree, whatever...

BassNBrew has addressed your points, reinforcing what has already been said by others.

Mr. I has been a good league member, but I do not know him other than participating in common leagues. My issue with Carl was similar, not the same. I did not skip his pick, though I would have if put in such position - usually at the behest of other league members, in addition to acknowledging the rules. You can read the Carl saga if you want, it is old schtick at this point and almost a "point to the shirt" mockery. This response of yours is disappointing. I cannot imagine believing that a person that takes time to respond to your personal life crisis that this missed pick has become for you is justifying some past action. I hope that whatever life stressors you are dealing with at the moment resolve and you find a calmer place in life.

Now, how about we get back to discussing the draft picks and not mechanics or rules?

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I've written out about a half-dozen responses since last night, but haven't posted any of them. Probably a good thing. Thanks to everyone for stepping in and making things clearer than I would have been able to (and to Bass for keeping things under control as always).

The irony of this situation is that I've always considered myself pretty "live and let live" when it comes to the rules on these drafts ... go back to the threads from all the survivors that I've participated in and you've never seen me jumping in 2 minutes after someone's clock times out with a pick, or wagging my finger at someone for not knowing what's going on. The only reason I even realized Hustler had timed out is that I got 3 PMs from other teams telling me I was OTC ... and when I went into MFL to make a pick, realized Hustler hadn't made one yet, and I couldn't make mine there without putting in a placeholder for him.

In retrospect, yeah, if you haven't been in one of these before I can understand it would look shady that the guy picking next is putting in a placeholder, but if I hadn't done it and just put my pick in the draft thread ... then someone else would have. Sorry, I don't know what else to say. :shrug:

In the end, this is just 16 random guys (others here may know each other outside FBG, but I know I don't) on a football message board trying to get a little insight for our money leagues and have a little fun at the same time. I think we'd all do well to remember that.

I'm willing to let this go at this point - let's all just move on. Cool?

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BTW, here's a suggestion: when the clock gets turned back on after the Memorial Day holiday, everyone gets put on a 4-hour clock (regardless of previous time-outs). This draft is moving too damn slowly as it is anyway.

Anyone opposed?

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One of the most humorous skips I saw was a first time drafter's response to whether or not we should skip a guy who had clocked out in the first round.

"Skip that guy. I need all the help I can get."

If I have a heart attack and come back, I hope you load up predraft and run as many picks as you can on me.

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Thrilled to add TE Heath Miller as TE 22 in our draft. Miller is a reliable release target for Roethlisberger and with the offensive line having a year to work together, they should be improved in 2014 allowing Miller more participation in the passing game.

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Heath Miller is chronically underrated, and given the Steelers WR and RB group missing real dynamite, he will be a consistent target for Ben. I think that is a value pick in this league for sure.

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Miller always under rated. Catches everything. Ben loves him. Only downside is his legs are shot.

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Had a hard time between Steve smith and freeman. Bloom grabbing freeman a few picks later makes me think I blew it.

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Rodgers, Aaron GBP QB

Ivory, Chris NYJ RB

Mathews, Ryan SDC RB

Ridley, Stevan NEP RB

Allen, Keenan SDC WR

Amendola, Danny NEP WR

Floyd, Michael ARI WR

Gordon, Josh CLE WR

Hunter, Justin TEN WR

Gronkowski, Rob NEP TE

Testing my theory that it's really easy to get through the first few weeks of a survivor.

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Rodgers, Aaron GBP QB

Ivory, Chris NYJ RB

Mathews, Ryan SDC RB

Ridley, Stevan NEP RB

Allen, Keenan SDC WR

Amendola, Danny NEP WR

Floyd, Michael ARI WR

Gordon, Josh CLE WR

Hunter, Justin TEN WR

Gronkowski, Rob NEP TE

Testing my theory that it's really easy to get through the first few weeks of a survivor.

This is a weird team.

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QB Nick Foles - 7

Teddy Bridgewater -10

RB Marshawn Lynch - 4

Darren Sproles - 7

MJD - 5

WR Julio Jones - 9

Cordarrelle Patterson - 10

Tavon Austin - 4

TE Charles Clay - 5

Jared Cook - 4

Not liking picking at the end again. Haven't had an early position in quite a while.

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Rodgers, Aaron GBP QB

Ivory, Chris NYJ RB

Mathews, Ryan SDC RB

Ridley, Stevan NEP RB

Allen, Keenan SDC WR

Amendola, Danny NEP WR

Floyd, Michael ARI WR

Gordon, Josh CLE WR

Hunter, Justin TEN WR

Gronkowski, Rob NEP TE

Testing my theory that it's really easy to get through the first few weeks of a survivor.

This is a weird team.

I think the word you're looking for is stupid.

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Heath Miller is chronically underrated, and given the Steelers WR and RB group missing real dynamite, he will be a consistent target for Ben. I think that is a value pick in this league for sure.

very disappointed he went a pick before i planned on taking him.

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Tom Brady 10
Eli Manning 8

Reggie Bush 9
Steven Jackson 9
DeAngelo Williams 12

Ahmad Bradshaw 8

Mike Tolbert 12

Andre Johnson 10
Torrey Smith 11
Dwayne Bowe 6
Odell Beckham 8
Nate Washington
9

Jimmy Graham 6

Still more work to do, but a decent first half. Tough group of drafters. Many targets gone earlier than the other drafts. What do you guys know 1 & 2 don't?

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Tom Brady

Eli Manning

Reggie Bush

Steven Jackson

DeAngelo Williams

Andre Johnson

Torrey Smith

Dwayne Bowe

Jimmy Graham

Still more work to do, but a decent first half. Tough group of drafters. Many targets gone earlier than the other drafts. What do you guys know 1 & 2 don't?

Which targets?

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Re: Targets

Long of the short, sleepers drafted 1 round or more earlier than the other SSLs.

PThomas

Woodhead

Hartline

M. Jones

Hyde

Gordon

Seattle

Boykin

Benjamin

Freeman

Kelce

Wilson

Not all fit my team byes, while others were disappointing.

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Re: Targets

Long of the short, sleepers drafted 1 round or more earlier than the other SSLs.

PThomas

Woodhead

Hartline

M. Jones

Hyde

Gordon

Seattle

Boykin

Benjamin

Freeman

Kelce

Wilson

Not all fit my team byes, while others were disappointing.

Kelce went a full 2 rounds earlier in SSL1. I thought PT felt early but more because I wanted him not because I thought it was TOO early.

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I am not bashful to take players that I want, even above anticipated ADP, but the list above is not correct regarding being drafted a round or more ahead of the previous SSLs.

Pierre Thomas was drafted at 7.12, 7.13, and 7.12 in SSLs 1, 2 and 3 - I was holding my breath hoping he would fall to me as I really needed some running backs.

Danny Woodhead was drafted at 7.14, 7.16, and 8.5, actually later and again I needed the running back depth as I had drafted none since Arian Foster in the 2nd round. Thankful to get both Thomas and Woodhead, who should continue to catch lots of passes.

Seattle was drafted at 10.9, 10.4 and 10.5 so no bargain but I like getting a DST that I trust, particularly one that has a propensity for turnovers early so that I can wait till late (if I choose) to get a second DST.

Haven't checked on the others but since I drafted all three I was curious if I was jumping too early.

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BTW, here's a suggestion: when the clock gets turned back on after the Memorial Day holiday, everyone gets put on a 4-hour clock (regardless of previous time-outs). This draft is moving too damn slowly as it is anyway.

Anyone opposed?

I'll volunteer to be skipped after four hours, so long as the clock is still off from midnight to eight.

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BTW, here's a suggestion: when the clock gets turned back on after the Memorial Day holiday, everyone gets put on a 4-hour clock (regardless of previous time-outs). This draft is moving too damn slowly as it is anyway.

Anyone opposed?

I'll volunteer to be skipped after four hours, so long as the clock is still off from midnight to eight.

Me too. Sure it will happen while working sometime.

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5.06 Tony Romo QB DAL 11

8.11 Carson Palmer QB 4

2.11 Zac Stacy RB STL 4

3.06 C.J. Spiller RB BUF 9

10.11 Tre Mason RB STL 4

11.06 LeGarrette Blount RB PIT 12

1.06 Calvin Johnson WR DET 9

6.11 Reggie Wayne WR IND 10

7.06 Riley Cooper WR PHI 7

4.11 Greg Olsen TE CAR 12

9.06 Travis Kelce TE KC 6

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5.06 Tony Romo QB DAL 11

8.11 Carson Palmer QB 4

2.11 Zac Stacy RB STL 4

3.06 C.J. Spiller RB BUF 9

10.11 Tre Mason RB STL 4

11.06 LeGarrette Blount RB PIT 12

1.06 Calvin Johnson WR DET 9

6.11 Reggie Wayne WR IND 10

7.06 Riley Cooper WR PHI 7

4.11 Greg Olsen TE CAR 12

9.06 Travis Kelce TE KC 6

Solid team, no weaknesses, good bye week coverage though week 9 will be a challenge for many. You drafted well young man, go to the head of the class.

Of course, Stacy and Mason kind of cancel each other out, but you are sure to have the starting RB and handcuff. Just not sure of St Louis's offensive potency this year.

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5.06 Tony Romo QB DAL 11

8.11 Carson Palmer QB 4

2.11 Zac Stacy RB STL 4

3.06 C.J. Spiller RB BUF 9

10.11 Tre Mason RB STL 4

11.06 LeGarrette Blount RB PIT 12

1.06 Calvin Johnson WR DET 9

6.11 Reggie Wayne WR IND 10

7.06 Riley Cooper WR PHI 7

4.11 Greg Olsen TE CAR 12

9.06 Travis Kelce TE KC 6

Solid team, no weaknesses, good bye week coverage though week 9 will be a challenge for many. You drafted well young man, go to the head of the class.

Of course, Stacy and Mason kind of cancel each other out, but you are sure to have the starting RB and handcuff. Just not sure of St Louis's offensive potency this year.

Not a fan of the Stacy pick. Nt sure what to think about Wayne. Seems like Valence got excellent value with Olsen and Romo which definitely improved his standing among his peers. Really like Mason as a handcuff that cheap which improves the Stacy pick for me.

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6.08 Philip Rivers, QB SD - QB15 [10]

9.09 Jake Locker, QB TEN - QB25 [9]


4.08 Ray Rice, RB BAL - RB21 [11]

5.09 Bishop Sankey, RB TEN - RB27 [9]

10.08 Khiry Robinson, RB NO - RB43 [6]


1.09 Dez Bryant, WR DAL - WR3 [11]

3.09 Percy Harvin, WR SEA - WR14 [4]

7.09 Golden Tate, WR DET - WR40 [9]

11.09 Aaron Dobson, WR NE - WR63 [10]

12.08 Denarius Moore, WR OAK - WR69 [5]


2.08 Julius Thomas, TE DEN - TE3 [4]

8.08 Antonio Gates, TE SD - TE18 [10]



When last we checked in on this squad, I was expressing happiness that filling out a starting lineup out of the gate allowed me to roll straight BPA from that point on. So what happens when the BPA at your next two turns are backups at start-1 positions? When does a philosophy stop becoming "straight BPA" and start becoming "stubbornness to the point of stupidity"? I take solace in the fact that in 2PPR, TE scoring will be pretty high-variance week to week, so Gates should score more weeks for me than the first QB or RB off the bench generally would.


I like Robinson's value in the 10th, as I think he has a good chance of forcing himself into at least a timeshare with Thomas. Even if that happens I'm still thin at RB, though, especially if Rice's suspension stretches to 3+ games.


Jumped on some WR value and bye-week coverage in the 11th and 12th. Dobson's almost certainly going to get a larger share of touches in New England - there's zero chance Julian Edelman gets force-fed 175 targets again - but we'll see if he can do anything with them. Oakland's got a ton of bodies at WR and Moore's a logical (and rumored) trade candidate; there are at least 4-5 new locations that would instantly and dramatically boost his stock.


Six rounds left to go, basically dedicated to special teams and RB depth.

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Schaub, Matt OAK QB 177.90 5 9.02

Stafford, Matthew DET QB 425.40 9 3.02

Charles, Jamaal KCC RB (P) 382.00 6 1.02

McCluster, Dexter TEN RB 116.60 9 10.15

McFadden, Darren OAK RB 102.50 5 5.02

Boldin, Anquan SFO WR 246.00 8 8.15

Britt, Kenny STL WR 20.60 4 12.15

Brown, Marlon BAL WR 143.20 11 13.02

Hilton, T.Y. IND WR 220.90 10 4.15

Williams, Terrance DAL WR 148.00 116.15

Bennett, Martellus CHI TE 235.90 9 7.02

Davis, Vernon SFO TE 267.00 8 2.15

Chiefs, Kansas City KCC Def 201.00 611.02

Can't say I am overly disappointed by this draft being at one extreme of the serpentine (1.02). I have a few things that have to fall into place for an excellent team, and subsequent risks.

QB - Stafford should have an above the mean year, and I am happy to rely upon him. Schaub appears to have the QB spot locked and hopefully will be adequate, though I have been burned by him before. Week 9 is a challenge for a lot of teams, so who knows what will happen then if I make it that far.

RB - if DMac returns to form and has the RB1 spot - should if he is 100%, then I am solid at RB until his inevitable injury. Let's hope he is injury free this year for more than fantasy sake. McCluster could be a home run, late value pick, and even be my RB2 some weeks. Hard to imagine a rookie and Shon Greene are that much of a challenge to him.

WR - lots of WR2 talent, but I am hopeful. Caught a couple late round breaks, I am not a fan of drafting head cases, but Stills could out-produce his draft position, which is what we look for.

TE - two solid players with red zone presence, and VDavis is a high target TE as well.

D - KC did well last year, let's see what this year holds.

Mistakes? Maybe taking VDavis so early, but in this league you need a dependable TE that plays every game. Few and far between.

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Schaub, Matt OAK QB 177.90 5 9.02

Stafford, Matthew DET QB 425.40 9 3.02

Charles, Jamaal KCC RB (P) 382.00 6 1.02

McCluster, Dexter TEN RB 116.60 9 10.15

McFadden, Darren OAK RB 102.50 5 5.02

Boldin, Anquan SFO WR 246.00 8 8.15

Britt, Kenny STL WR 20.60 4 12.15

Brown, Marlon BAL WR 143.20 11 13.02

Hilton, T.Y. IND WR 220.90 10 4.15

Williams, Terrance DAL WR 148.00 116.15

Bennett, Martellus CHI TE 235.90 9 7.02

Davis, Vernon SFO TE 267.00 8 2.15

Chiefs, Kansas City KCC Def 201.00 611.02

Can't say I am overly disappointed by this draft being at one extreme of the serpentine (1.02). I have a few things that have to fall into place for an excellent team, and subsequent risks.

QB - Stafford should have an above the mean year, and I am happy to rely upon him. Schaub appears to have the QB spot locked and hopefully will be adequate, though I have been burned by him before. Week 9 is a challenge for a lot of teams, so who knows what will happen then if I make it that far.

RB - if DMac returns to form and has the RB1 spot - should if he is 100%, then I am solid at RB until his inevitable injury. Let's hope he is injury free this year for more than fantasy sake. McCluster could be a home run, late value pick, and even be my RB2 some weeks. Hard to imagine a rookie and Shon Greene are that much of a challenge to him.

WR - lots of WR2 talent, but I am hopeful. Caught a couple late round breaks, I am not a fan of drafting head cases, but Stills could out-produce his draft position, which is what we look for.

TE - two solid players with red zone presence, and VDavis is a high target TE as well.

D - KC did well last year, let's see what this year holds.

Mistakes? Maybe taking VDavis so early, but in this league you need a dependable TE that plays every game. Few and far between.

Davis is an excellent TE, but calling him high target is stretching it a little. I have been a huge backer of McFadden's talent but he just hasn't been able to stay on the field and now they also have Jones-Drew to call on. Think that you just called Stills a head case and surely you meant Britt

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6.08 Philip Rivers, QB SD - QB15 [10]
9.09 Jake Locker, QB TEN - QB25 [9]
4.08 Ray Rice, RB BAL - RB21 [11]
5.09 Bishop Sankey, RB TEN - RB27 [9]
10.08 Khiry Robinson, RB NO - RB43 [6]
1.09 Dez Bryant, WR DAL - WR3 [11]
3.09 Percy Harvin, WR SEA - WR14 [4]
7.09 Golden Tate, WR DET - WR40 [9]
11.09 Aaron Dobson, WR NE - WR63 [10]
12.08 Denarius Moore, WR OAK - WR69 [5]
2.08 Julius Thomas, TE DEN - TE3 [4]
8.08 Antonio Gates, TE SD - TE18 [10]
When last we checked in on this squad, I was expressing happiness that filling out a starting lineup out of the gate allowed me to roll straight BPA from that point on. So what happens when the BPA at your next two turns are backups at start-1 positions? When does a philosophy stop becoming "straight BPA" and start becoming "stubbornness to the point of stupidity"? I take solace in the fact that in 2PPR, TE scoring will be pretty high-variance week to week, so Gates should score more weeks for me than the first QB or RB off the bench generally would.
I like Robinson's value in the 10th, as I think he has a good chance of forcing himself into at least a timeshare with Thomas. Even if that happens I'm still thin at RB, though, especially if Rice's suspension stretches to 3+ games.
Jumped on some WR value and bye-week coverage in the 11th and 12th. Dobson's almost certainly going to get a larger share of touches in New England - there's zero chance Julian Edelman gets force-fed 175 targets again - but we'll see if he can do anything with them. Oakland's got a ton of bodies at WR and Moore's a logical (and rumored) trade candidate; there are at least 4-5 new locations that would instantly and dramatically boost his stock.
Six rounds left to go, basically dedicated to special teams and RB depth.

really like the value you got with Dobson and D. Moore and I really like your wide receivers and TEs.

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Schaub, Matt OAK QB 177.90 5 9.02

Stafford, Matthew DET QB 425.40 9 3.02

Charles, Jamaal KCC RB (P) 382.00 6 1.02

McCluster, Dexter TEN RB 116.60 9 10.15

McFadden, Darren OAK RB 102.50 5 5.02

Boldin, Anquan SFO WR 246.00 8 8.15

Britt, Kenny STL WR 20.60 4 12.15

Brown, Marlon BAL WR 143.20 11 13.02

Hilton, T.Y. IND WR 220.90 10 4.15

Williams, Terrance DAL WR 148.00 116.15

Bennett, Martellus CHI TE 235.90 9 7.02

Davis, Vernon SFO TE 267.00 8 2.15

Chiefs, Kansas City KCC Def 201.00 611.02

Can't say I am overly disappointed by this draft being at one extreme of the serpentine (1.02). I have a few things that have to fall into place for an excellent team, and subsequent risks.

QB - Stafford should have an above the mean year, and I am happy to rely upon him. Schaub appears to have the QB spot locked and hopefully will be adequate, though I have been burned by him before. Week 9 is a challenge for a lot of teams, so who knows what will happen then if I make it that far.

RB - if DMac returns to form and has the RB1 spot - should if he is 100%, then I am solid at RB until his inevitable injury. Let's hope he is injury free this year for more than fantasy sake. McCluster could be a home run, late value pick, and even be my RB2 some weeks. Hard to imagine a rookie and Shon Greene are that much of a challenge to him.

WR - lots of WR2 talent, but I am hopeful. Caught a couple late round breaks, I am not a fan of drafting head cases, but Stills could out-produce his draft position, which is what we look for.

TE - two solid players with red zone presence, and VDavis is a high target TE as well.

D - KC did well last year, let's see what this year holds.

Mistakes? Maybe taking VDavis so early, but in this league you need a dependable TE that plays every game. Few and far between.

Davis is an excellent TE, but calling him high target is stretching it a little. I have been a huge backer of McFadden's talent but he just hasn't been able to stay on the field and now they also have Jones-Drew to call on. Think that you just called Stills a head case and surely you meant Britt

LOL, yep, still thinking Tennessee receivers even though Britt is now on the Rams. Funny how association kicks in while typing and multi-tasking.

I assume it was the head case descriptive that clarified it for you as much as my roster.

Vernon Davis has had some high target years, and with the WR and RB talent there in SF, a lot of mismatches this year seem likely. SF is going to be hungry for a Super Bowl appearance. Probably need some Chunky Soup to quench that appetite. (commercial reference).

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Tom Brady 10

Eli Manning 8

Reggie Bush 9

Steven Jackson 9

DeAngelo Williams 12

Ahmad Bradshaw 8

Mike Tolbert 12

Andre Johnson 10

Torrey Smith 11

Dwayne Bowe 6

Odell Beckham 8

Nate Washington 9

Jimmy Graham 6

QB - Middle of the pack

RB - Donged myself with byes early. Tolbert got points every week last year and Bradshaw produced well pre-injury. Despite byes, points should be there each week.

WR - Good starters with an upside rookie and an old reliable

TE - Best in the fantasy

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Tom Brady 10

Eli Manning 8

Reggie Bush 9

Steven Jackson 9

DeAngelo Williams 12

Ahmad Bradshaw 8

Mike Tolbert 12

Andre Johnson 10

Torrey Smith 11

Dwayne Bowe 6

Odell Beckham 8

Nate Washington 9

Jimmy Graham 6

QB - Middle of the pack

RB - Donged myself with byes early. Tolbert got points every week last year and Bradshaw produced well pre-injury. Despite byes, points should be there each week.

WR - Good starters with an upside rookie and an old reliable

TE - Best in the fantasy

Yep, very good and week 9 will be a toss up regardless for many.

I give Brady better than middle of the pack. If SJax has more good days than bad, this could be a tour de force.

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Flacco, Joe BAL QB 11 8.14

Luck, Andrew IND QB 10 3.03

Greene, Shonn TEN RB (P) 9 14.14

Moreno, Knowshon MIA RB 5 5.03

Peterson, Adrian MIN RB 10 1.03

Stewart, Jonathan CAR RB 12 11.03

Adams, Davante GBP WR 9 13.03

Cobb, Randall GBP WR 9 2.14

Evans, Mike TBB WR 7 7.03

Maclin, Jeremy PHI WR 7 6.13

Wheaton, Markus PIT WR 12 9.03

Amaro, Jace NYJ TE11 10.14

Reed, Jordan WAS TE 10 4.14

Walsh, Blair MIN PK 10 15.03

Bengals, Cincinnati CIN Def 4 12.14

Like my QBs. Flacco has a lock on the job and provides good balance to luck.

If Moreno is the three down back then I really like my group. Greene will get carries this year even though he is terrible and I'll take that in the 14th.

WRs are pretty weak. I need Evans to have a strong rookie season to have a shot.

Probably like my TEs more than most but I think Geno leans on his new TE without having anything besides Decker on the outside.

Solid K/Def so far

I'll give myself a B-/C+ due to my WR issues. Never loved the value early on and it got me.

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kinda lame to just post about a PK....but seeing his name made me think about how playing outside might affect his draft spot.....I think I drafted him in one of these survivor's before realizing MIN is playing outdoors this year......Walsh is a solid PK but probably on my avoid list because of this.....goes from being tied for the best conditions to possibly the worst in the NFL....

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Flacco, Joe BAL QB 11 8.14

Luck, Andrew IND QB 10 3.03

Greene, Shonn TEN RB (P) 9 14.14

Moreno, Knowshon MIA RB 5 5.03

Peterson, Adrian MIN RB 10 1.03

Stewart, Jonathan CAR RB 12 11.03

Adams, Davante GBP WR 9 13.03

Cobb, Randall GBP WR 9 2.14

Evans, Mike TBB WR 7 7.03

Maclin, Jeremy PHI WR 7 6.13

Wheaton, Markus PIT WR 12 9.03

Amaro, Jace NYJ TE11 10.14

Reed, Jordan WAS TE 10 4.14

Walsh, Blair MIN PK 10 15.03

Bengals, Cincinnati CIN Def 4 12.14

Like my QBs. Flacco has a lock on the job and provides good balance to luck.

If Moreno is the three down back then I really like my group. Greene will get carries this year even though he is terrible and I'll take that in the 14th.

WRs are pretty weak. I need Evans to have a strong rookie season to have a shot.

Probably like my TEs more than most but I think Geno leans on his new TE without having anything besides Decker on the outside.

Solid K/Def so far

I'll give myself a B-/C+ due to my WR issues. Never loved the value early on and it got me.

Really like what you did here. this team should hang around for quite awhile.

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Team Holloway recap to this point

QB

1.12 Drew Brees NO

13.12 Ryan Fitzpatrick Houston

RB

2.05 Arian Foster Houston

7.12 Pierre Thomas NO

8.05 Danny Woodhead SD

WR

3.12 Victor Cruz NYG

4.05 Roddy White Atl

6.05 Mike Wallace Miami

11.12 Jordan Matthews Rook Philadelphia

12.05 Cody Lattimer Rook Denver

14.05 Mike Williams Buffalo

TE

5.12 Dennis Pitta Baltimore

9.12 Heath Miller Pittsburgh

DST

10.05 Seattle

The first round went just about as I expected, except Demaryius Thomas fell farther than I thought. I was set to grab him at what I thought was a spectacular bargain, but HitNRun nabbed him one pick before mine. I briefly considered Brandon Marshall, but then went quarterback with Drew Brees as the 2nd QB off the board. Brees is solid and occasionally spectacular and it is really nice to have a QB you can count on in survivors. Had tentatively targeted Sam Bradford as my #2 but he went four picks ahead of me in round 9. At that point, I decided to wait as long as possible. Recent news indicates that Houston will have an outright competition for QB, but I think that Fitzpatrick wins that one and he should be a solid second guy taken as QB 31 late in the 13th round. Like this combo.

Was happy to draft Arian Foster at RB #8 in the 2nd round. Waited late to fill the running back slots and grabbed a couple of solid receiving backs in Pierre Thomas as 7.12 and Danny Woodhead at 8.5. Thomas caught 70 passes a year ago and with Sproles gone, should catch that many again as well as get carries in the running game. Woodhead is also an effective receiver out of the backfield, but he will have to contend with Donald Brown this year for secondary duties behind Mathews.

By going QB and then RB, I got a little behind the curve with wide receivers. Victor Cruz at WR 16 taken at 3.12 was decent and should be in line for lots of targets with Hakeem Nicks gone. Roddy White at WR 21 with my next pick is another guy that should be highly targeted with the retirement of Tony Gonzalez. Mike Wallace played below expectations a year ago, but hopefully the Dolphins' OL improves with their new LT and gives Tannehill more time to find Wallace, who can use his speed to get open deep if Tannehill can get him the ball. A couple of rookies who paly in spots where they can get playing time in Matthews and Lattimer were added at the 11/12 turn and then finally Mike Williams, the new guy in Buffalo, which should be much improved on offense.

Dennis Pitta at TE 10 taken at 5.12 seems like great value and then I added Heath Miller at TE 22 at 9.12. Both of these guys are reliable receivers. Pitta could be one of Flacco's favorite targets and Miller should be released into pattern more often than a year ago.

I was the guy that reached a little and grabbed Seattle's DST as their defensive backs are great getting interceptions and taking it to the house. Their entire team was excellent a year ago with turnovers, sacks, and returns so I got them early.

Still need PKs, a back-DST and a depth pick or two with only four picks remaining. Thoughts?

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Team Holloway recap to this point

QB

1.12 Drew Brees NO

13.12 Ryan Fitzpatrick Houston

RB

2.05 Arian Foster Houston

7.12 Pierre Thomas NO

8.05 Danny Woodhead SD

WR

3.12 Victor Cruz NYG

4.05 Roddy White Atl

6.05 Mike Wallace Miami

11.12 Jordan Matthews Rook Philadelphia

12.05 Cody Lattimer Rook Denver

14.05 Mike Williams Buffalo

TE

5.12 Dennis Pitta Baltimore

9.12 Heath Miller Pittsburgh

DST

10.05 Seattle

The first round went just about as I expected, except Demaryius Thomas fell farther than I thought. I was set to grab him at what I thought was a spectacular bargain, but HitNRun nabbed him one pick before mine. I briefly considered Brandon Marshall, but then went quarterback with Drew Brees as the 2nd QB off the board. Brees is solid and occasionally spectacular and it is really nice to have a QB you can count on in survivors. Had tentatively targeted Sam Bradford as my #2 but he went four picks ahead of me in round 9. At that point, I decided to wait as long as possible. Recent news indicates that Houston will have an outright competition for QB, but I think that Fitzpatrick wins that one and he should be a solid second guy taken as QB 31 late in the 13th round. Like this combo.

Was happy to draft Arian Foster at RB #8 in the 2nd round. Waited late to fill the running back slots and grabbed a couple of solid receiving backs in Pierre Thomas as 7.12 and Danny Woodhead at 8.5. Thomas caught 70 passes a year ago and with Sproles gone, should catch that many again as well as get carries in the running game. Woodhead is also an effective receiver out of the backfield, but he will have to contend with Donald Brown this year for secondary duties behind Mathews.

By going QB and then RB, I got a little behind the curve with wide receivers. Victor Cruz at WR 16 taken at 3.12 was decent and should be in line for lots of targets with Hakeem Nicks gone. Roddy White at WR 21 with my next pick is another guy that should be highly targeted with the retirement of Tony Gonzalez. Mike Wallace played below expectations a year ago, but hopefully the Dolphins' OL improves with their new LT and gives Tannehill more time to find Wallace, who can use his speed to get open deep if Tannehill can get him the ball. A couple of rookies who paly in spots where they can get playing time in Matthews and Lattimer were added at the 11/12 turn and then finally Mike Williams, the new guy in Buffalo, which should be much improved on offense.

Dennis Pitta at TE 10 taken at 5.12 seems like great value and then I added Heath Miller at TE 22 at 9.12. Both of these guys are reliable receivers. Pitta could be one of Flacco's favorite targets and Miller should be released into pattern more often than a year ago.

I was the guy that reached a little and grabbed Seattle's DST as their defensive backs are great getting interceptions and taking it to the house. Their entire team was excellent a year ago with turnovers, sacks, and returns so I got them early.

Still need PKs, a back-DST and a depth pick or two with only four picks remaining. Thoughts?

I think you had a really strong draft. Pitta and Miller were gifts and Thomas was excellent value.

For a team that jumped on QB and D early, you don't have any major holes. You either got lucky and/or did an excellent job of reading the draft flow.

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Ton of preseason work with a chance to compete for regular season carries. Love his talent as he ran hog wild against my Razorbacks in a game that I got to witness a couple of years ago.

Nice pick

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Flacco, Joe BAL QB 11 8.14

Luck, Andrew IND QB 10 3.03

Greene, Shonn TEN RB (P) 9 14.14

Moreno, Knowshon MIA RB 5 5.03

Peterson, Adrian MIN RB 10 1.03

Stewart, Jonathan CAR RB 12 11.03

Adams, Davante GBP WR 9 13.03

Cobb, Randall GBP WR 9 2.14

Evans, Mike TBB WR 7 7.03

Maclin, Jeremy PHI WR 7 6.13

Wheaton, Markus PIT WR 12 9.03

Amaro, Jace NYJ TE11 10.14

Reed, Jordan WAS TE 10 4.14

Walsh, Blair MIN PK 10 15.03

Bengals, Cincinnati CIN Def 4 12.14

Like my QBs. Flacco has a lock on the job and provides good balance to luck.

If Moreno is the three down back then I really like my group. Greene will get carries this year even though he is terrible and I'll take that in the 14th.

WRs are pretty weak. I need Evans to have a strong rookie season to have a shot.

Probably like my TEs more than most but I think Geno leans on his new TE without having anything besides Decker on the outside.

Solid K/Def so far

I'll give myself a B-/C+ due to my WR issues. Never loved the value early on and it got me.

Really like what you did here. this team should hang around for quite awhile.

disagree unless he punts PK2 and/or DST2 and snags more than 1 more WR with 3 picks left....WR will be the demise....will Adams see field over nelson/cobb/boykin and if so enough to help you advance....maclin off injury?....evans rook on a run team....wheaton is tiny and could lose spot/snaps to bryant/moore.....so will withhold judgement until we see what he passes on.....this team might not be able to withstand an automatic zero at PK/Dst...week 10 has some issues (Luck/ADP/Reed/Walsh)....just saying for discussion purposes only..... :suds:

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6.08 Philip Rivers, QB SD - QB15 [10]

9.09 Jake Locker, QB TEN - QB25 [9]

4.08 Ray Rice, RB BAL - RB21 [11]

5.09 Bishop Sankey, RB TEN - RB27 [9]

10.08 Khiry Robinson, RB NO - RB43 [6]

13.09 Donald Brown, RB SD - RB55 [10]

15.09 Christine Michael, RB SEA - RB61 [4]

1.09 Dez Bryant, WR DAL - WR3 [11]

3.09 Percy Harvin, WR SEA - WR14 [4]

7.09 Golden Tate, WR DET - WR40 [9]

11.09 Aaron Dobson, WR NE - WR63 [10]

12.08 Denarius Moore, WR OAK - WR69 [5]

17.09 Chris Givens, WR STL - WR89 [4]

2.08 Julius Thomas, TE DEN - TE3 [4]

8.08 Antonio Gates, TE SD - TE18 [10]

14.08 Steven Hauschka, K SEA - K3 [4]

16.08 Giants, D/ST NYG - D19 [8]

18.08 Colts, D/ST IND - D29 [10]

:drive:

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5.06 Tony Romo QB DAL 11

8.11 Carson Palmer QB 4

2.11 Zac Stacy RB STL 4

3.06 C.J. Spiller RB BUF 9

10.11 Tre Mason RB STL 4

11.06 LeGarrette Blount RB PIT 12

1.06 Calvin Johnson WR DET 9

6.11 Reggie Wayne WR IND 10

7.06 Riley Cooper WR PHI 7

12.11 Harry Douglas WR ATL 9

13.06 Rod Streater WR OAK 5

16.11 Martavis Bryant WR PIT 12

18.11 Mohamed Sanu WR CIN 4

4.11 Greg Olsen TE CAR 12

9.06 Travis Kelce TE KC 6

15.06 Dan Bailey PK DAL 11

14.11 Baltimore DST 11

17.06 Philadelphia DST 7

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Final Rooster:

QB:

Matty Ice -(9) 3rd rd

Geno Smith (11) - 14th rd

Mike Vick (11) - 17th rd

Definitely looking for a resurgence from Matt Ryan this year with Julio back, although no Gonzo. Waiting so long to take my qb2 meant I had to double up, which sucks. With my luck the rookie will be starting week 9.

RB:

Eddie Lacy (9) 1st rd

Doug Martin (7) 2nd rd

Carlos Hyde (8) 9th rd

Andre Williams (8) 16th rd

Went RB early, hzppy with my top 2 guys, and hope to get something from the two rooks.

WR:

Vincent Jackson (7) 3d rd

Cecil Shorts (11) 7th rd

Greg Jennings (10) 8th rd

Marquise Lee (11) 10th rd

Robert Woods (9) 11th rd

Happy with my WRs for a 16 teamer. Hit em hard and heavy in the mid rounds, and I have 3-4 WR1s from their respective teams (woods depends on how watkims steps in). I like my potential production here.

TE:

Kyle Rudolph (10) 5th rd

Zach Ertz (7) 6th rd

I see both as breakout players this year. You saw what Norv Turner did for Cameron last year...I expect similar results from Rudolph. Ertz came on towards the end of last season, and I think he can take a major atep in year 2.

PK:

Adam Viniatieri (10) 15th rd

Dan Carpenter (9) 18th rd

Gotta love dome kickers, and I see Buffalo's offense on the rise.

DEF:

Denver (4) 12th rd

Buffalo (9) 13th rd

I like Denver's additions this offseason...get a big lead and let those pass rushers fly! Buffalo is usually good for some low scoring games at home late in the year.

All in all, just wish I had not waited so long on my QB2, and worried after my top 2 RBs. But I like my chances to hang around later than last year's week 3 exit at least.

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