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timschochet

Official Hillary Clinton 2016 thread

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16 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Did you know that in Michigan, she led Bernie by 21 points right up to the primary vote?  The primary where she lost by 1.5 points?  

The polls were off by a whopping 22 points....seems like precedence to me...

Nate Silver has lamented several times there that the polls are seriously lacking in quality and that he doesn't trust them.

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Just now, Sand said:

BTW, I'm very disappointed in how the day has started.  No new criminal enterprises, sex tapes, FBI bombshells so far.

:yawn:

 

Well, no new Clinton ones. Trump, though ...

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26 minutes ago, Billy Bats said:

Is Huma ok? Anyone seen her or she still in timeout? God forbid suicide by gunshot to the back of the head. 

She is not traveling with the campaign but supposedly has been at Brooklyn HQ. I'm guessing she has been meeting with lawyers and decompressing. But she's not at Hillary's side, which is a change.

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2 minutes ago, Koya said:

Stop it. This tact is simply grotesque.  It says a lot about those who make and support comments like this. Disgusting, Anti-American, utterly unpatriotic and anti-democracy.

 

Showing true colors, and those colors are of a terribly weak and faulted human being to keep going back to the "oh, she gonna get killed... better watch for Hillary's henchmen" Even by the utterly low standards of Trump's campaign, this (should be) below you and such outrageous and sad comments must be met with derision by anyone who believes in our institutions, our nation and our founding principles.

Agree with all of this.  I hate Hillary as much as the next guy, but you can't go there.  

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3 minutes ago, Sand said:

BTW, I'm very disappointed in how the day has started.  No new criminal enterprises, sex tapes, FBI bombshells so far.

:yawn:

 

It's a different time-zone in Russia...they're not up yet...

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5 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

Well, no new Clinton ones. Trump, though ...

 

It's not like the press hasn't been dropping hand grenades over Trump. He just suffers from/enjoys the shell shock of the voters who seem numb to these reports now.

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Just now, Koya said:

It's only a lie if you are gullible enough to have been brainwashed by the media over the last year, acutely, and over the past 20 years in general.

You know, that same media the right rails against? It's bamboozled you all into sychophants of the alt-right.  You've been caught, hook line and sinker.  What within so many people drives a willingness and desire to hate this woman (whom I don't like mind you, but the venom and constant attacks are utterly unwarranted and will be a historic stain upon this nation's story)? 

Oh, that's right... just as the right claims, people are sheep.  They just don't realize that they are the ones being suckered into believing a made up, exaggerated construct that is designed not to benefit you sheep, but rather the oligarchy on the right that controls you.

Who bamboozled you into thinking I'm part of the alt-right?  I financially supported and voted for Bernie in the primary.  I don't hate Hillary but I definitely don't like her and by no means will I ever vote for her.  I think there is plenty of evidence out there that can lead an independent thinker into severely questioning the relationship between The Clinton Foundation, CGI, Teneo and The Clintons themselves.

I've gone out of my way to not personally attack posters in this thread for having a different opinion than me (I haven't always been successful) so not sure why you have made false assumptions about me and my views and then turned that into insults.  

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3 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

Well, no new Clinton ones. Trump, though ...

Quote

A newly uncovered video appears to contradict Donald Trump’s claim that he never knew a high-stakes gambler who was banned from New Jersey casinos for alleged ties to organized crime.

The reputed mob figure, Robert LiButti, can be seen standing alongside Trump in the front row of a 1988 “WrestleMania” match in Atlantic City, N.J. LiButti wasn’t there by accident, according to his daughter, Edith Creamer, who also attended the event. “We were his guests,” she told Yahoo News in a text message this week.

The video was given to Yahoo News by a confidential source who discovered it in the online archives of World Wrestling Entertainment, the sponsor of “WrestleMania.”

The video appears to lend new support to assertions Trump once had close relations with LiButti, who was banned from the state’s casinos in 1991 because of his ties to Mafia boss John Gotti, then the chief of the Gambino crime syndicate. Separately, the New Jersey Casino Control Commission that same year levied $650,000 in fines against the Trump Plaza hotel over its dealings with LiButti, who gambled huge sums at the hotel’s casino. LiButti died in 2014.

“That’s definitely Bob LiButti standing right next to Donald Trump,” said David Cay Johnston, an author and former Pulitzer Prize-winning New York Times journalist who, as a reporter for the Philadelphia Inquirer, extensively interviewed the gambler in the early 1990s. At the request of Yahoo News, Johnston reviewed the video of the “WrestleMania IV” contest, held at the Atlantic City Convention Hall on March 27, 1988. “It’s at an event that Bob described to me a quarter century ago when I spent an afternoon in his Saddle River home,” Johnston added. “The ‘WrestleMania’ event is just one of many times that Trump was close to Bob, who was the biggest loser at Trump casinos and therefore Trump’s most important customer.”

 

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7 minutes ago, Koya said:

Stop it. This tact is simply grotesque.  It says a lot about those who make and support comments like this. Disgusting, Anti-American, utterly unpatriotic and anti-democracy.

 

Showing true colors, and those colors are of a terribly weak and faulted human being to keep going back to the "oh, she gonna get killed... better watch for Hillary's henchmen" Even by the utterly low standards of Trump's campaign, this (should be) below you and such outrageous and sad comments must be met with derision by anyone who believes in our institutions, our nation and our founding principles.

Calm down man, do you not know who Billy Batts is?? It was more of a joke on my username, racketeering,  and my past "experiences". :mellow:  

FTR going forward, I'm not an ardent Trump guy, not even sure I'm casting a vote for president yet. 

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Maybe Trump was just acting as a go between for the Mafia and the Russian Mob - showing good diplomatic and negotiating skills...

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1 hour ago, Sammy3469 said:

Yeah it is...their job is not to leak this stuff either way.  Seriously they take an oath not to do this.  They don't get some get out of jail public interest card to disclose things as they see fit. 

Hey remember when what the FBI did to Nixon in Watergate was awesome?

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2 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Colorado is a pretty key state.  Trump can win without Colorado but it would be an important state for him to target - its a very narrow range without colorado 

 

I think Pennsylvania is out of reach, Virginia and Wisconsin would be a stretch.  If Trump can carry some momentum from Ohio over to Michigan, maybe he can pull the upset in Michigan, and I think Colorado is still a state Trump would like to get.

 

Bottom line, Hillary is stumbling to the finish, but she should still be able to finish by a head...

I agree except with Michigan. It could happen, but I would be more surprised if it went red than if Colorado did. 

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Just now, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Too much to keep up with but there was a major report out just a day or so ago about Trump's supporting this guy at his hotels.

It's not like the hasn't been dropping hand grenades over Trump. He just suffers from/enjoys the shell shock of the voters who seem numb to these reports now.

The whole article is something else.  Stories of Trump getting fined under anti-discrimination laws for indulging this guy's request to clear women and minorities from his tables (including dealers and pit bosses), Trump lying under oath about knowing the guy, a fun tale about Trump hitting on his married daughter and the mobster threatening to "####### pull his balls from between his legs," and so on.

Some of it is old news, but the video (and text from the guy's daughter) confirming a relationship Trump has repeatedly denied is news.  And it's from Michael Isikoff, not some random Yahoo reporter.  So it might get some legs.

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It really says something not only about Trump, but his base of support, that I have had to so vigorously defend a woman I absolutely can't stand.  The small minded, anachronistic hate and vitriol, the rabid desire to pass along stories with no basis, no true sources and an excitement about spreading the worst lies and inflammatory hyperbole does demonstrate a legitimate frustration with the system, but also clearly shows that those who employ such disingenuous tactics are also inexcusably copping out in terms of how their frustration is being vented.

Seriously, don't you Trumpers have enough cojones to actually address the real issues, the real concerns? What within you makes you feel it's ok to spread not only lies and bull####, but to do so in a way that highlights our divisions rather than looking to find any set of common ground? Why is it that the entire vocal right is an attack dog rather than a fellow-citizen, and why are they so weak of heart and with lack of actual substance to continue to resort to these base measures?

The lasting impression of this election for me will be of a truly saddened state for our nation.  We are no longer one nation, and that reality is not only being pushed by the right, it's being exploited for their (and if you are a Trumper, your) own gain, literally at the expense of our nation as a whole. I'd ask do you feel no shame, but it's pretty clear when you see footage of your mindset in action at Trump rallies, in the tone of your posts here or facebook... it's clear that many of you really don't feel any shame.  Not if it forwards your particular candidate, your particular world view - and sometimes it feels that if as a result of this certain segments of our population suffer as a result (those segments not aligned with your politics), that is a bonus. As if it's a plus not only for you to forward your political agenda, but to actually harm folks who don't agree. 

Never felt this with Romney, nor Bush (he was a clueless danger, but of good heart imo)... no one.  Trump has energized and brought out the worst in you all, and it's sad to see although I suppose it's forcing us as a nation to reconcile the long march of equality and freedom with the fear of a still relatively small component of our population that wants to stop it, if only to ensure that their piece of the pie remains intact, even at and perhaps especially at, the expense of others.

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Another morning of not being able to believe what complete unwashed ###holes we have as candidates for President, or how clearly preferable one of the unwashed ###holes is to the other.

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1 minute ago, Sinn Fein said:

Colorado is a pretty key state.  Trump can win without Colorado but it would be an important state for him to target - its a very narrow range without colorado 

I think Pennsylvania is out of reach, Virginia and Wisconsin would be a stretch.  If Trump can carry some momentum from Ohio over to Michigan, maybe he can pull the upset in Michigan, and I think Colorado is still a state Trump would like to get.

Bottom line, Hillary is stumbling to the finish, but she should still be able to finish by a head...

He can get there through NH, which has always been a battleground state and is reasonable close right now.  In fact a NH win puts a 269-269 tie on the table, which would be just amazingly awesome.  A tie wins it for Trump, but it would still be incredible to see the Senate to have to convene over this.

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1 minute ago, Jrodicus said:

I agree except with Michigan. It could happen, but I would be more surprised if it went red than if Colorado did. 

Yeah, I think if Trump really wanted to win Michigan, he needed to spend a lot more time there, and really harp on trade issues - that is how Bernie pulled the upset.

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So because the FBI made a ridiculous statement to congress, that excuses all the things Trump has done?

Ok, I guess I'm a sheep and will play along too.

I have forgotten that he sexually assaults and rapes women and am more terrified of someone deleting my emails. SAVE ME BABY JESUS FROM THE EMAILS! My daughter is much safer in a world where the most powerful man endorses sexual abuse. I'm pretty sure my daughter deletes emails and survived without any harm in her life.

In a world where people pretend they care about national security with deleted emails, they ignore the obvious connections between Trump and Russia and a country hacking the opponent on his behalf is the move plot of and maybe a different version of Idiocracy.

Livin the life!

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7 minutes ago, Baloney Sandwich said:

Who bamboozled you into thinking I'm part of the alt-right?  I financially supported and voted for Bernie in the primary.  I don't hate Hillary but I definitely don't like her and by no means will I ever vote for her.  I think there is plenty of evidence out there that can lead an independent thinker into severely questioning the relationship between The Clinton Foundation, CGI, Teneo and The Clintons themselves.

I've gone out of my way to not personally attack posters in this thread for having a different opinion than me (I haven't always been successful) so not sure why you have made false assumptions about me and my views and then turned that into insults.  

I'm not talking about anyone in particular, and those who continually attack and parrot the breitbarts of the world are pretty clear.

As you put it, very well stated I may add, you are correct - there are serious questions about everything you listed.  That is not the same as saying she's a criminal, lock her up, and making up / exaggerating what legitimate concerns may exist. 

Apologies if it appeared that I meant you were of the alt-right, and your clarification in this post makes it clear that you're perspective appears legitimate and balanced.  That said, I know some former Berners who absolutely have themselves bought into the alt-right bull####... but that's another story all together. 

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14 minutes ago, Koya said:

Stop it. This tact is simply grotesque.  It says a lot about those who make and support comments like this. Disgusting, Anti-American, utterly unpatriotic and anti-democracy.

Showing true colors, and those colors are of a terribly weak and faulted human being to keep going back to the "oh, she gonna get killed... better watch for Hillary's henchmen" Even by the utterly low standards of Trump's campaign, this (should be) below you and such outrageous and sad comments must be met with derision by anyone who believes in our institutions, our nation and our founding principles.

:goodposting:

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Just now, Autumn Wind said:

Just want to throw this out there, in case it becomes relevant: Faithless Electors.

Hillary would kill any of her electors that went off the reservation.  I don't think you have to worry about that.

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11 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Colorado is a pretty key state.  Trump can win without Colorado but it would be an important state for him to target - its a very narrow range without colorado 

I think Pennsylvania is out of reach, Virginia and Wisconsin would be a stretch.  If Trump can carry some momentum from Ohio over to Michigan, maybe he can pull the upset in Michigan, and I think Colorado is still a state Trump would like to get.

Bottom line, Hillary is stumbling to the finish, but she should still be able to finish by a head...

If Trump wins Colorado, he wins the election. Another close state that would give him enough EV is New Hampshire. 

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2 minutes ago, Autumn Wind said:

PEC's updated EV projection has Hillary strongly in the 300-330 range, FWIW.

 

http://election.princeton.edu/history-of-meta-analysis/

There hasn't been much in the way of good Clinton news lately, but by far the most encouraging is the 538 report yesterday afternoon of her significantly outperforming the polls in Nevada in early voting, which apparently comprises half the voting in that state. If she wins Nevada that creates serious problems for Trump getting to 270. 

Also if she's outperforming polls there (which assume low Hispanic turnout based on historical voting patterns) that raises the possibility of higher than expected turnout of Hispanics elsewhere, too. If she upsets Trump in Arizona she's insulated against losing all of the tossup states plus Wisconsin or Michigan.

 

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On 9/20/2016 at 1:06 PM, Sinn Fein said:

I think Colorado is the new battleground.  Uphill battle for Trump though.

:bowtie:

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Isn't Trump's path Florida, Ohio, Michigan, NC, and Nevada?  He wins those, he wins the election. 

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5 minutes ago, cstu said:

If Trump wins Colorado, he wins the election. Another close state that would give him enough EV is New Hampshire. 

Hillary's back to looking at this. She will do it but we are back to roughly ~300 EV projections, not the swamping the GOP which would have allowed her to claim a 'mandate'.

Going in at stalemate is not great for her IMO. Also, the Dems winning the Senate is almost as important. GOP Senate and House with a slight majority win for the WH is not great. Optimal for Hillary is 325+ Evs and win the Senate.

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19 minutes ago, Koya said:

Stop it. This tact is simply grotesque.  It says a lot about those who make and support comments like this. Disgusting, Anti-American, utterly unpatriotic and anti-democracy.

 

Showing true colors, and those colors are of a terribly weak and faulted human being to keep going back to the "oh, she gonna get killed... better watch for Hillary's henchmen" Even by the utterly low standards of Trump's campaign, this (should be) below you and such outrageous and sad comments must be met with derision by anyone who believes in our institutions, our nation and our founding principles.

People do seem to end up dead no matter how you look at it 

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Koya...Brother.

Time to step away from the keyboard and go outside for a deep breath of fresh air.

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14 minutes ago, Baloney Sandwich said:

Who bamboozled you into thinking I'm part of the alt-right?  I financially supported and voted for Bernie in the primary.  I don't hate Hillary but I definitely don't like her and by no means will I ever vote for her.  I think there is plenty of evidence out there that can lead an independent thinker into severely questioning the relationship between The Clinton Foundation, CGI, Teneo and The Clintons themselves.

I've gone out of my way to not personally attack posters in this thread for having a different opinion than me (I haven't always been successful) so not sure why you have made false assumptions about me and my views and then turned that into insults.  

Because that's what Koya does. Then he will throw a tantrum when you don't answer to his satisfaction. Then he will accuse you of lacking critical thinking skills. The same guy that has claims he's getting into local politics but talks to people this way and has an avatar of a guy shooting the bird. Oh the irony

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3 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

There hasn't been much in the way of good Clinton news lately, but by far the most encouraging is the 538 report yesterday afternoon of her significantly outperforming the polls in Nevada in early voting, which apparently comprises half the voting in that state. If she wins Nevada that creates serious problems for Trump getting to 270. 

Also if she's outperforming polls there (which assume low Hispanic turnout based on historical voting patterns) that raises the possibility of higher than expected turnout of Hispanics elsewhere, too. If she upsets Trump in Arizona she's insulated against losing all of the tossup states plus Wisconsin or Michigan.

 

I still think people (ie polls) are undercounting the vast difference in GOTV. Hillary has a huge one, Trump has next to nothing. It will show up on election day IMO.

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A tie would be my favorite outcome, and it's not all that outlandish.

Trump needs FL, OH, NH, NV, UT, AZ, NC, IA, GA as well as the other red states he is projected to win.  Hillary takes CO, NM, PA, MI, WI, MN, IL, and the blue states.

Result:  269 to 269.

Make congress put up or shut up.  Is the GOP willing to go against the will of their constituents and pick someone other than Trump?  Can the GOP and Dems work together to select a better candidate?  Will the Senate select Clinton as VP as a cruel joke?  Think of the drama...

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16 minutes ago, cstu said:

 

Ugh....dammitt Trump! You knew a gambler, that's it back to Hillary!

 

 

NAH

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Just now, Andy Dufresne said:

Koya...Brother.

Time to step away from the keyboard and go outside for a deep breath of fresh air.

Next week will be like smelling salts for a lot of enlightened people , Believe me , smelling salts

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Just now, Sweet J said:

Isn't Trump's path Florida, Ohio, Michigan, NC, and Nevada?  He wins those, he wins the election. 

He definitely wins in that scenario - but Michigan is not critical

 

This is a map where it is 259 - 266 with Colorado and New Hampshire tossups.  Clinton must win both, Trump must win one.

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Just now, Andy Dufresne said:

Koya...Brother.

Time to step away from the keyboard and go outside for a deep breath of fresh air.

No, its actually not.  Calling a spade a spade is nothing more than calling it like it is, and honestly, I don't believe I've done anything but.

 

And the gaul for people to continue to go back to the "oh she should be locked up... she should be shot.... electrocuted... watch out for her henchmen" deserves at least the level of derision being shown. 

Plus, I have a conference call in 8 min with one of the lead economists/futurists from Bain so trying to get my adrenaline going. 

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Just now, Jrodicus said:

A tie would be my favorite outcome, and it's not all that outlandish.

Trump needs FL, OH, NH, NV, UT, AZ, NC, IA, GA as well as the other red states he is projected to win.  Hillary takes CO, NM, PA, MI, WI, MN, IL, and the blue states.

Result:  269 to 269.

Make congress put up or shut up.  Is the GOP willing to go against the will of their constituents and pick someone other than Trump?  Can the GOP and Dems work together to select a better candidate?  Will the Senate select Clinton as VP as a cruel joke?  Think of the drama...

Gee. Anarchy just sounds like fun on html, amiright?

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3 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Hillary's back to looking at this. She will do it but we are back to roughly ~300 EV projections, not the swamping the GOP which would have allowed her to claim a 'mandate'.

Going in at stalemate is not great for her IMO. Also, the Dems winning the Senate is almost as important. GOP Senate and House with a slight majority win for the WH is not great. Optimal for Hillary is 325+ Evs and win the Senate.

 At this point, I'll take it.  I'll take a 4 year stalemate (they can even keep the f^cking supreme court justice) if I could guarantee trump doesn't win. 

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13 minutes ago, Koya said:

It really says something not only about Trump, but his base of support, that I have had to so vigorously defend a woman I absolutely can't stand.  The small minded, anachronistic hate and vitriol, the rabid desire to pass along stories with no basis, no true sources and an excitement about spreading the worst lies and inflammatory hyperbole does demonstrate a legitimate frustration with the system, but also clearly shows that those who employ such disingenuous tactics are also inexcusably copping out in terms of how their frustration is being vented.

Seriously, don't you Trumpers have enough cojones to actually address the real issues, the real concerns? What within you makes you feel it's ok to spread not only lies and bull####, but to do so in a way that highlights our divisions rather than looking to find any set of common ground? Why is it that the entire vocal right is an attack dog rather than a fellow-citizen, and why are they so weak of heart and with lack of actual substance to continue to resort to these base measures?

The lasting impression of this election for me will be of a truly saddened state for our nation.  We are no longer one nation, and that reality is not only being pushed by the right, it's being exploited for their (and if you are a Trumper, your) own gain, literally at the expense of our nation as a whole. I'd ask do you feel no shame, but it's pretty clear when you see footage of your mindset in action at Trump rallies, in the tone of your posts here or facebook... it's clear that many of you really don't feel any shame.  Not if it forwards your particular candidate, your particular world view - and sometimes it feels that if as a result of this certain segments of our population suffer as a result (those segments not aligned with your politics), that is a bonus. As if it's a plus not only for you to forward your political agenda, but to actually harm folks who don't agree. 

Never felt this with Romney, nor Bush (he was a clueless danger, but of good heart imo)... no one.  Trump has energized and brought out the worst in you all, and it's sad to see although I suppose it's forcing us as a nation to reconcile the long march of equality and freedom with the fear of a still relatively small component of our population that wants to stop it, if only to ensure that their piece of the pie remains intact, even at and perhaps especially at, the expense of others.

I could read this a thousand times and still start at the beginning to read it one time over again.

Very well articulated, and I share your frustration, anger, and sadness.

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8 minutes ago, Sinn Fein said:

Hillary would kill any of her electors that went off the reservation.  I don't think you have to worry about that.

I was actually looking at it from the other side. There was a widely publicized article over the summer about a GOP elector from Georgia who pretty much said he wouldn't vote Trump. I suspect there may be more.

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Just now, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Gee. Anarchy just sounds like fun on html, amiright?

BILL WELD FOR PRESIDENT!

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I don't think he can get Colorado. When he comes here he goes to places on the western slope or some places where there are not many voters to be had. He did go to Golden once. But he probably can't swing the Denver metro counties and no way he swings Boulder county which he would have to do.

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1 minute ago, Sweet J said:

 At this point, I'll take it.  I'll take a 4 year stalemate (they can even keep the f^cking supreme court justice) if I could guarantee trump doesn't win. 

Yup. Every election cycle now makes the voices of the far right crazies less and less powerful. I'm OK with playing prevent defense to get to the point where they are reduced to nothing more than white noise (heh heh).

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Just now, Koya said:

BILL WELD FOR PRESIDENT!

I'm laughing here thinking of all the people who may just walk into the ballot booth and just say :censored:-it and then the look on Gary Johnson's face when they tell him he's president.

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1 minute ago, Jrodicus said:

A tie would be my favorite outcome, and it's not all that outlandish.

Trump needs FL, OH, NH, NV, UT, AZ, NC, IA, GA as well as the other red states he is projected to win.  Hillary takes CO, NM, PA, MI, WI, MN, IL, and the blue states.

Result:  269 to 269.

Make congress put up or shut up.  Is the GOP willing to go against the will of their constituents and pick someone other than Trump?  Can the GOP and Dems work together to select a better candidate?  Will the Senate select Clinton as VP as a cruel joke?  Think of the drama...

The better outcome here is McMullin taking Utah in this scenario.

269-265-4  But it still gets tossed to the House, and they get to vote on the top-3 - so that throws McMullin into the mix as a "compromise" candidate....

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10 minutes ago, Koya said:

I'm not talking about anyone in particular, and those who continually attack and parrot the breitbarts of the world are pretty clear.

As you put it, very well stated I may add, you are correct - there are serious questions about everything you listed.  That is not the same as saying she's a criminal, lock her up, and making up / exaggerating what legitimate concerns may exist. 

And....as Hillary herself said a couple weeks ago, "there's smoke but no fire"

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3 minutes ago, Koya said:

No, its actually not.  Calling a spade a spade is nothing more than calling it like it is, and honestly, I don't believe I've done anything but.

 

And the gaul for people to continue to go back to the "oh she should be locked up... she should be shot.... electrocuted... watch out for her henchmen" deserves at least the level of derision being shown. 

Plus, I have a conference call in 8 min with one of the lead economists/futurists from Bain so trying to get my adrenaline going. 

Okay. Then this won't matter.

It's "gall" not "gaul".

Gall is impudent behavior.

Gaul was invaded by Hannibal.

:clyde:

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