What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

RB Ezekiel Elliott, NE (2 Viewers)

The suspension would not have to wait until Zeke failed to get an injunction.  It could start immediately.
Yes, I posted that earlier.  Just pointing out (for the other poster-beerbuff?) that even if Zeke "loses" this hearing, and continues to fight (rather than "rolling over"), the suspension could/would start fairly quickly; it isn't automatically going to be delayed again.

Again, this all hinges on the decision by the appeals panel.

 
so..are they ruling on just whether the court had jurisdiction, or other grounds? What exactly are the scenarios?

 
Last edited by a moderator:
so..are they ruling on just whether the court had jurisdiction, or other grounds? What exactly are the scenarios?
Both.  The NFL has asked that the injunction be lifted.  They argued that by allowing Zeke to play, they are doing irreparable harm to the NFL's power to police its' players (which was contractually agreed upon).  They also argued that the NFLPA didn't have the right to file their suit when they did, since the judgement hadn't been handed down by the arbitrator.

If the appeals panel rules for the NFL on either point, the suspension could/would start immediately.  IMO, it's unlikely that the NFL wins the "irreparable harm" argument (but I also thought the TX court wouldn't rule, since they didn't have the authority to do so).  It's really a crapshoot.

 
Both.  The NFL has asked that the injunction be lifted.  They argued that by allowing Zeke to play, they are doing irreparable harm to the NFL's power to police its' players (which was contractually agreed upon).  They also argued that the NFLPA didn't have the right to file their suit when they did, since the judgement hadn't been handed down by the arbitrator.

If the appeals panel rules for the NFL on either point, the suspension could/would start immediately.  IMO, it's unlikely that the NFL wins the "irreparable harm" argument (but I also thought the TX court wouldn't rule, since they didn't have the authority to do so).  It's really a crapshoot.
Very well stated.

 
Is it a possibility that we see a ruling in the NFL's favor to lift the injunction late in the week, the suspension begins Week 5, Zeke files for and wins another injunction prior to Week 6, and we continue down the merry road with Zeke credited with serving 1 week of his suspension and being allowed to return to play Week 6?  Long question I know, but just curious . . .

 
Is it a possibility that we see a ruling in the NFL's favor to lift the injunction late in the week, the suspension begins Week 5, Zeke files for and wins another injunction prior to Week 6, and we continue down the merry road with Zeke credited with serving 1 week of his suspension and being allowed to return to play Week 6?  Long question I know, but just curious . . .
Between the US Justice System and the "any given Sunday" NFL, yes.  ANYTHING is possible.

 
So who do we want? Morris or McFadden?
It’s the Moors ya idiot.

Ive owned McFadden for several weeks. I only have one bench spot for a backup handcuff currently and this morning Morris cleared waivers so I added him. 

So, that likely means it’s mcfadden. 

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I thought this was going to land "soon?"

Also remember somebody saying the longer this drags out for this particular decision the worse it is for Zeke while a quick decision is good for Zeke.

Also interesting that mass sports media isn't watching this like a hawk nor is it a big story if you click on ESPN's Dallas page. You'd think beat reporters would be all over this still.

 
I thought this was going to land "soon?"

Also remember somebody saying the longer this drags out for this particular decision the worse it is for Zeke while a quick decision is good for Zeke.

Also interesting that mass sports media isn't watching this like a hawk nor is it a big story if you click on ESPN's Dallas page. You'd think beat reporters would be all over this still.
Yeah I see them announcing this next Monday or late Sunday night as his bye week starts saying he's suspended.

Nobody is covering it because they don't know.  WallachLegal was all over this early September on twitter saying Zeke wins hands down etc, etc.  As this has dragged on it's started to give the NFL life.

 
Yeah I see them announcing this next Monday or late Sunday night as his bye week starts saying he's suspended.

Nobody is covering it because they don't know.  WallachLegal was all over this early September on twitter saying Zeke wins hands down etc, etc.  As this has dragged on it's started to give the NFL life.
I'm not sure if the delay has anything to do with the NFL's position improving (it might be, but I'm not sure if the "delay" is a sign of that.

I do think that this hasn't unfolded as many "experts" (NFL and/or legal experts) expected.  Most people figured if Zeke won an injunction, the NFL would just let the court process drag out, then after they ultimately won, enforce the suspension next year.  Their decision to try to move quickly & enforce the suspension ASAP was surprising to most (or, that's my take, at least).

 
I’ve been holding McF

Do I drop Charles to cover Morris too?
I've got both...and hate it.

Would love for some kind of news to hit so I could drop one or both of them and attend to other needs. Nobody else in my league gives a damn about DMC/Morris. My strategy has been drop both early in the week and if necessary pick one or both back up end of week before games on Sunday.

 
I grabbed McF once news that this might not go the way most were expecting dropped.  I guaran-#######-tee that I made the wrong pick.
I’m surprised a beat reporter hasn’t asked this at a presser.

Not that Garrett would give a straight answer, but mum is the word so far.

 
I don't typically handcuff.  But maybe just picking up either Alf or DMC wouldn't be a bad idea, just in case of injury.  And if the suspension happens, well, that's like a 6 game injury.  If the suspension does occur, then you'll see your entire league running to the waiver wire.

Alf or DMC are probably worth more on your bench than a waiver guy like Eli McGuire or whatever his name is. 

 
I don't typically handcuff.  But maybe just picking up either Alf or DMC wouldn't be a bad idea, just in case of injury.  And if the suspension happens, well, that's like a 6 game injury.  If the suspension does occur, then you'll see your entire league running to the waiver wire.

Alf or DMC are probably worth more on your bench than a waiver guy like Eli McGuire or whatever his name is. 
would be a great idea if you knew which one, that's the problem

 
To believe McFadden is the guy you have to come up with a reason why Morris has been active over him. It's not special teams because Morris doesn't play STs. No doubt it's why Rod Smith is active over McFadden, but it doesn't explain Morris. I suppose it's possible there's a reason, but with what we know right now, not likely, IMO.

Besides that, Morris seems like he just flat beat out McFadden. Whether it's due to being more acclimated to Dallas' system in his 2nd year, losing some weight (speculative, but he does look a little slimmer), or some other reason(s), Morris looks like a totally different runner from last season & reminiscent of his earlier days in Washington. He looked great in preseason.

My money is on Morris.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
That's the puzzling part. McFadden has been listed as 2nd string since training camp. Like I said, there could be a reason why he's not been active, but everything considered, I like Morris to get first crack at it.

Another reason I favor Morris is because even if I'm wrong, he's looked so good it would be a surprise to me if a 30-year old McFadden could hold him off for long.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
https://sportsday.dallasnews.com/dallas-cowboys/cowboys/2017/09/14/cowboys-continue-go-alfred-morris-switch-darren-mcfadden-rb2

I couldn't sleep last night as 3:00 AM Yahoo waivers came in and I like to scour free agency while they process. So I just started googling "Mcfadden or Morris", and other terms to see what was out there, since no reporters really seem to want to talk about it.

I ended up on this article. Granted it's from September 14th after the Cowboys first game when there was a little bit of surprise that Mcfadden was inactive.

"So why did the coaches decided to go with Morris last week? And will he get the nod over McFadden again this coming Sunday?

The decision to go with Morris was based on the progress he made through last season and during this past offseason in the passing game, not only in route running and catching the ball, but also in pass blocking. Those are things he was not asked to do with the Redskins, and they were areas he needed to improve. He showed enough improvement in those areas to get the nod last Sunday, plus his running style is conducive for what the Cowboys needed against the Giants' run defense. Morris has also improved on special teams, so he would not be a liability if he had to fill-in on special teams.

But the decision to go with Morris with last week is not a knock on McFadden. The coaches are still happy with him, and don't be surprised if he's the player who is active this coming Sunday. Head coach Jason Garrett said McFadden reacted "like a pro" when told he would not be active versus New York. It will be interesting to see if McFadden gets any reps on kickoff returns during practice this week (as the off-man, not necessarily as the returner). If McFadden gets first-team practice reps on special teams, it could indicate whether or not he or Morris will be active Sunday."

Clear as mud.

As I said above, I own Zeke and only have one bench spot.  I owned Mcfadden, but read this article and switched to Morris. I have ZERO idea whether that was a good choice or not, but the comments on his improvement in the passing game and blocking game moved the needle for me just enough. That, and he's been active every game and McFadden has not played a down, so he's continuing to earn more game-time trust with Dak and the others.

Morris is also averaging 12.8 yards per carry!!!!! LOL.

The truth is, if Zeke sits, this will be a timeshare until one of these guys separates themselves from the other, so hitch your wagon to whichever one you think might have that capability.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
They also argued that the NFLPA didn't have the right to file their suit when they did, since the judgement hadn't been handed down by the arbitrator.
The jurisdiction issue appears to be the NFL's ace in the hole... the irreparable harm question doesn't even seem to play in here.

 
The jurisdiction issue appears to be the NFL's ace in the hole... the irreparable harm question doesn't even seem to play in here.
True; they are making the argument, but I’m not sure it holds much weight.  As one of the judges commented, their decision to delay it past week 1 b/c they didn’t decide in time to be fair to the Cowboys seems to undermine that argument.

 
We may finally get to see who is right (I also think it will be McFadden now)
I doubt it. Zeke will play all year. Even if CA5 rules for NFL, Zeke will play this weekend and he will file for injunction in New York and get it, and there will be no jurisdiction play for the NFL. Game over for the NFL this year.

 
I doubt it. Zeke will play all year. Even if CA5 rules for NFL, Zeke will play this weekend and he will file for injunction in New York and get it, and there will be no jurisdiction play for the NFL. Game over for the NFL this year.
Stop it, you’re giving me wood 

 
I doubt it. Zeke will play all year. Even if CA5 rules for NFL, Zeke will play this weekend and he will file for injunction in New York and get it, and there will be no jurisdiction play for the NFL. Game over for the NFL this year.
That is alot of speculation with alot of uncertainties.

 
If you could trade Zeke or Hyde and Ertz for Julio what RB would you part with?  I'm in a start RB, WR, TE, 2Flex league.  So I only need to start 1RB a week.   Short bench league. My RBs are Zeke, Kamara, Hyde. 

 
I doubt it. Zeke will play all year. Even if CA5 rules for NFL, Zeke will play this weekend and he will file for injunction in New York and get it, and there will be no jurisdiction play for the NFL. Game over for the NFL this year.
This, from everything I've heard, is not even close to being a given.  In fact, if the appeals panel rules that the lower court had no jurisdiction, from what I've read, the southern NY district leans toward the side of business & is unlikely to grant an injunction.  Do you have any information that suggests otherwise, or is this just your own speculation?  Because if this is true, why would the NFL bother?  They are going to win this case, whether it gets decided now, or in the off-season.  If it is such a lock that the injunction will be "re-granted" by the southern NY court, why go through the bother of trying to get it moved?  Your speculation makes little sense.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Regarding the question of why DMC has been healthy scratched in lieu of Morris, I think it's a possibility that the cowboys were hedging their bets.  Meaning that with Zeke in there, they had no reason to risk potential injury to his backup-a backup that they believe has a good chance of being a starter for six games this season.  Morris infilling during breathers for zeke is suitable.  They be looking at this worst case scenario and protecting a guy that will possibly (probably) be their starting RB for some stretch this year.  Seems plausible to me.

 
This, from everything I've heard, is not even close to being a given.  In fact, if the appeals panel rules that the lower court had no jurisdiction, from what I've read, the southern NY district leans toward the side of business & is unlikely to grant an injunction.  Do you have any information that suggests otherwise, or is this just your own speculation?  Because if this is true, why would the NFL bother?  They are going to win this case, whether it gets decided now, or in the off-season.  If it is such a lock that the injunction will be "re-granted" by the southern NY court, why go through the bother of trying to get it moved?  Your speculation makes little sense.
Wallach:

NFLPA: "The NFL's only motivation to file in SDNY was to seek to deprive the NFLPA and Elliott of their chosen forum"

Wallach:

I believe the NFLPA would get the TRO in the SDNY despite Brady ruling + mid-season irreparable harm is off charts.

 
Wallach:

NFLPA: "The NFL's only motivation to file in SDNY was to seek to deprive the NFLPA and Elliott of their chosen forum"

Wallach:

I believe the NFLPA would get the TRO in the SDNY despite Brady ruling + mid-season irreparable harm is off charts.


The only reason the NFLPA filed their suit prematurely was to seek to deprive the NFL of their chosen forum.  A decision that worked initially; they picked a district they thought would be favorable to them.  The NFL did the same, and it is reasonable to conclude (if they get a favorable decision from the appeals panel)  that they will similarly get the ruling they hoped for from their chosen forum.  

It is not reasonable to assume the NY court will go against the ruling made by their appellate circuit less than 2 years ago.  You’re offering what appears to be what you hope will happen, but it’s not based in fact.  Zekes best hope to play out this season is got the appeals panel to deny the NFL.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Being offered Zeke and my choice of either Keenan Allen or Hopkins for Hunt in a full pt ppr. My wr's are Thomas-NO, Cooks, and Dez. Thinking about doing this deal and banking on Zeke playing this year. Hopkins sure would fit into my flex spot nicely.

 
Being offered Zeke and my choice of either Keenan Allen or Hopkins for Hunt in a full pt ppr. My wr's are Thomas-NO, Cooks, and Dez. Thinking about doing this deal and banking on Zeke playing this year. Hopkins sure would fit into my flex spot nicely.
Don't do that trade...

 
Being offered Zeke and my choice of either Keenan Allen or Hopkins for Hunt in a full pt ppr. My wr's are Thomas-NO, Cooks, and Dez. Thinking about doing this deal and banking on Zeke playing this year. Hopkins sure would fit into my flex spot nicely.
It's a huge risk, but if Zeke isn't suspended you might win your league based solely on this trade...

and if he is suspsended, you're in trouble.

clearly the person offering the trade thinks he will be suspended.

also, 100% Hopkins > Allen.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
The only reason the NFLPA filed their suit prematurely was to seek to deprive the NFL of their chosen forum.  A decision that worked initially; they picked a district they thought would be favorable to them.  The NFL did the same, and it is reasonable to conclude (if they get a favorable decision from the appeals panel)  that they will similarly get the ruling they hoped for from their chosen forum.  

It is not reasonable to assume the NY court will go against the ruling made by their appellate circuit less than 2 years ago.  You’re offering what appears to be what you hope will happen, but it’s not based in fact.  Zekes best hope to play out this season is got the appeals panel to deny the NFL.
Given the standard for injunctive relief in situations like this, it is very likely that the SDNY would grant an injunction.  While the NFL might win at the end of the case, the irreparable harm to be suffered by Zeke (there is no dispute on this) and the relative hardship on the parties heavily weighs in favor of the injunction.  The only prong that may be of concern is the likelihood of success but Zeke has put forth enough of a case (buttressed by the prior ruling in his case) that it shouldn't prevent him from getting an injunction.

The key is what is the harm in making Zeke serve his suspension next year.  The answer is none which is why he should get an injunction, even in NY.

 
It's a huge risk, but if Zeke isn't suspended you might win your league based solely on this trade...

and if he is suspsended, you're in trouble.

clearly the person offering the trade thinks he will be suspended.

also, 100% Hopkins > Allen.
Agree.  It's a 50/50 move right here.  Nobody knows.  Wallachlegal posted yesterday he still thinks that NYC will side with Zeke even if the case goes there which I was shocked.

It's basically like getting a free WR IF Zeke doesn't get 6 games.

 
Given the standard for injunctive relief in situations like this, it is very likely that the SDNY would grant an injunction.  While the NFL might win at the end of the case, the irreparable harm to be suffered by Zeke (there is no dispute on this) and the relative hardship on the parties heavily weighs in favor of the injunction.  The only prong that may be of concern is the likelihood of success but Zeke has put forth enough of a case (buttressed by the prior ruling in his case) that it shouldn't prevent him from getting an injunction.

The key is what is the harm in making Zeke serve his suspension next year.  The answer is none which is why he should get an injunction, even in NY.
:thumbup:  Hoping it plays out this way.  I have a feeling they announce this during the bye.  Couldn't they say announcing it during the bye gives the Cowboys enough time to gameplan during those 2 weeks to make moves?

 
Agree.  It's a 50/50 move right here.  Nobody knows.  Wallachlegal posted yesterday he still thinks that NYC will side with Zeke even if the case goes there which I was shocked.

It's basically like getting a free WR IF Zeke doesn't get 6 games.
And if he does, it's like getting a free WR for 5 of them.  There's a non-zero chance Watson outscores Hunt ROS, and a pretty reasonable chance he scores within a couple of PPG of him ROS.  That's approaching Zeke for free.  That trade is a no-brainer in my mind.

 
Given the standard for injunctive relief in situations like this, it is very likely that the SDNY would grant an injunction.  While the NFL might win at the end of the case, the irreparable harm to be suffered by Zeke (there is no dispute on this) and the relative hardship on the parties heavily weighs in favor of the injunction.  The only prong that may be of concern is the likelihood of success but Zeke has put forth enough of a case (buttressed by the prior ruling in his case) that it shouldn't prevent him from getting an injunction.

The key is what is the harm in making Zeke serve his suspension next year.  The answer is none which is why he should get an injunction, even in NY.
From what I understand, the SDNY would be bound by the precedent established by the 2nd Circuit's decision in the Brady case, which essentially confirmed that the CBA agreed upon by Zeke's union (NFLPA) gives Goodell nearly unlimited authority under Article 46. 

With that precedent, from their own appellate circuit, the SDNY court should have to conclude that the NFLPA would be hard-pressed to show that their case is likely to be successful.  That would be what prevents Zeke (if he fails to do so) from getting an injunction.

ETA-at this point, if you own Zeke, you're probably better off holding him.  If you were to try to trade him, I doubt you could get fair value.  You'd have to give him away at a discount, & I think the prospect that he keeps the injunction or gets another from the SDNY court would outweigh the return you'd get for him in a trade.

 
Last edited by a moderator:

Users who are viewing this thread

Top