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Ran a 10k - Official Thread

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@Otis

We already have one resident in this thread who doesn't listen much, and I assumed you'd be number 2, but I also figured you'd wait until past day 2. WTF, dummy?

You hit an 8 min/mile pace like 4 times this morning. On an uphill, to boot. You ready to throw away your 2nd pair of shoes when you blame them for getting hurt again?

No one cares how fast you run. It's more impressive to have some discipline and run slower even when you can run faster. The times will get better. It will get more fun. But you're trying to build the 2nd story of a home before even digging a hole for a foundation.

Slow the #### down and be patient.

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30 minutes ago, gianmarco said:

@Otis

We already have one resident in this thread who doesn't listen much, and I assumed you'd be number 2, but I also figured you'd wait until past day 2. WTF, dummy?

You hit an 8 min/mile pace like 4 times this morning. On an uphill, to boot. You ready to throw away your 2nd pair of shoes when you blame them for getting hurt again?

No one cares how fast you run. It's more impressive to have some discipline and run slower even when you can run faster. The times will get better. It will get more fun. But you're trying to build the 2nd story of a home before even digging a hole for a foundation.

Slow the #### down and be patient.

:lmao:

WTF you can tell how fast I ran at points??  Goes to show, I have no idea how to use this stuff.  Wait’ll I get that fancy watch, you guys will be giving me colon exams over the internet and I’ll have no idea.  

Honestly, wasn’t “pushing it” at all.  Felt like I was going at a real slow pace the entire time.  Remember too that couch to 5K tells you when to start walking and when to start running.  I was just following directions.  But I didn’t feel like the run parts were overly fast, just felt like a regular jog.  Wasn’t me trying to be macho or to go fast. 

:shrug:

 

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12 hours ago, Otis said:

It's like a werewolf thread.  For Olympians. 

:lmao:

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42 minutes ago, gianmarco said:

You keep blaming those shoes but it's far more likely it has nothing to do with them. It was likely too much too fast.

Could be, I’m not sure.  But honestly those shoes felt so awkward.  They are kind of rounded on the bottom, and overly bouncy.  Just didn’t feel natural at all.  It’s awfully coincidental that the day after I first wore them was when my knees were hurting.  But who knows.

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12 hours ago, ChiefD said:

But I love the benefits. Loss of weight, off my cholesterol meds, better diet, longer dongs

I must have missed this last part...  :kicksrock:

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34 minutes ago, gianmarco said:

@Otis

We already have one resident in this thread who doesn't listen much, and I assumed you'd be number 2, but I also figured you'd wait until past day 2. WTF, dummy?

You hit an 8 min/mile pace like 4 times this morning. On an uphill, to boot. You ready to throw away your 2nd pair of shoes when you blame them for getting hurt again?

No one cares how fast you run. It's more impressive to have some discipline and run slower even when you can run faster. The times will get better. It will get more fun. But you're trying to build the 2nd story of a home before even digging a hole for a foundation.

Slow the #### down and be patient.

Jeez man. He's new. Don't go kicking him in his potatoes right outta the gate. 

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So what are we doing to initiate the new guys? 

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Just now, Otis said:

Could be, I’m not sure.  But honestly those shoes felt so awkward.  They are kind of rounded on the bottom, and overly bouncy.  Just didn’t feel natural at all.  It’s awfully coincidental that the day after I first wore them was when my knees were hurting.  But who knows.

Well, if they are more of a trail shoe than a street shoe, I could see that.

If I wear my trail shoes on the road my legs definitely feel it the next day.

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7 minutes ago, Otis said:

:lmao:

WTF you can tell how fast I ran at points??  Goes to show, I have no idea how to use this stuff.  Wait’ll I get that fancy watch, you guys will be giving me colon exams over the internet and I’ll have no idea.  

Honestly, wasn’t “pushing it” at all.  Felt like I was going at a real slow pace the entire time.  Remember too that couch to 5K tells you when to start walking and when to start running.  I was just following directions.  But I didn’t feel like the run parts were overly fast, just felt like a regular jog.  Wasn’t me trying to be macho or to go fast. 

:shrug:

 

Run, have fun, don't listen to @gianmarco

Serious note, having fun is important, especially early on. Just be careful and listen to your body. Too much too soon is the easiest path to injury that will set you back. But in general, just getting out and adding miles is the first step. If you run some of it faster, that's fine, IMO.

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37 minutes ago, gianmarco said:

@Otis

We already have one resident in this thread who doesn't listen much, and I assumed you'd be number 2, but I also figured you'd wait until past day 2. WTF, dummy?

You hit an 8 min/mile pace like 4 times this morning. On an uphill, to boot. You ready to throw away your 2nd pair of shoes when you blame them for getting hurt again?

No one cares how fast you run. It's more impressive to have some discipline and run slower even when you can run faster. The times will get better. It will get more fun. But you're trying to build the 2nd story of a home before even digging a hole for a foundation.

Slow the #### down and be patient.

I agree with this for the most part but I also think it is a bit harsh. He is following a good conservative plan in this C25K plan, and he may have went out a bit too fast at the start a couple of the walking to running transitions.

@Otisif you want to add more to the plan, I would just walk on your off days.

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By the way, I hurt so bad today... not looking forward to tomorrow. Went to the crossfit class at work yesterday for the first time in forever. It was a fairly cardio intensive workout, IMO, but definitely had a strength aspect to it. I thought I took it easy on the weight side of things but my arms, shoulders, and chest are screaming a bit today. Ouch. 

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Welcome noobs. It's running, it's not building a rocket. Ease into it and try not to make it a chore. 

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22 minutes ago, pbm107 said:

I agree with this for the most part but I also think it is a bit harsh. He is following a good conservative plan in this C25K plan, and he may have went out a bit too fast at the start a couple of the walking to running transitions.

@Otisif you want to add more to the plan, I would just walk on your off days.

Otis needs tough love.  You should have seen @MAC_32 in the diet thread.  But, after multiple beatings, he's actually here and wants to run.  I love it.

In all seriousness, I can assure you everyone in here just wants to see you out there and stick with it, Oats.  In general, follow that plan, don't overdo it, and be patient so you can stay healthy.  And we'll let you know with plenty of advance notice when the colonoscopy is.

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3 minutes ago, The Iguana said:

@gianmarco - out of curiosity...  in general are you a "follow the rules" kind of guy? 

Only ask because for most of my life I have very much been a "color inside the lines" kind of guy. As I've gotten older, I've strayed outside the boundaries more and more, if you know what I mean. But I know when I do, I feel it in my bones and often it takes "work" to continue down that path when I do something "against the rules" no matter how arbitrary a rule may be. Even in the running thing, I pretty much always know when I'm doing something I shouldn't (or isn't advised) but it often doesn't stop me. Just curious if you are a similar personality or if it is simply how much you have seen the "rules work" and are stuck to them in this instance. 

Not sure if all that makes sense but the concept kind of interests me if you can understand my ramblings...

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1 hour ago, El Floppo said:

I don't know if this is still a thing, but there are stores in the city where they'll film and fit you for better fitting shoe for your stride/gait. Probably stores that do this out in the sticks too. Rather than buying a bunch of shoes, I'd highly recommend going that route.

Gl Otis... And take it slow. The injury thing is real, especially trying to get back into things at our ages..but also later once you get fit and start pushing mileage and time. Don't #### around if you start feeling pain- get it checked out immediately (ideally by somebody familiar with running) and dealt with.

Is the running show store reviewing your gait and recommending the right shoe for you still a thing?

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Just now, El Floppo said:

Is the running show store reviewing your gait and recommending the right shoe for you still a thing?

They do it but I wasn't totally convinced of the effectiveness when I did it a few months ago. Part of that is because I'm an old, crotchety fart and had some seemingly 12 year-old helping me and I wasn't sure if he really knew what he was doing. But the results reinforced what I already :knew: so... That said, I got a pair of hoka shoes out of it that I didn't particularly like but are "ok". But at the same time, a pair of brooks that I already had also "matched" my style and I did like those - enough so that I ended up with 3 new pairs of them over a short period of time - one I got early in the marathon training cycle and then 2 more identical pairs I bought not long ago. One pair I wore in the marathon, the other pair is still in the box waiting.

Of course, I work IT for an athletic shoe retailer, we carry the Brooks shoes that I like, and I get a healthy discount. Odds are decent I'll buy a couple more pairs before too long to hold onto before that model is no longer available!

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@Otis, I just started this fitness thing in May of 2017 and have every hike/run I have done since then on Strava.  Right from the beginning.  Like me, you'll be able to look all the way back and see your progression.  It's cool

I started with a hiking base, but this is my first run.  I was an idiot and just went out and ran fast for as long as I could take it, and then had to walk the rest.

That night I read some stuff about run/walk, and the next day, I did this.  Intervals of 2 minutes running, 30 seconds walking.  But I was still running too fast and couldn't sustain the intervals beyond 3-4.

A month later, I was still hiking with some run/walking mixed-in.

Then in early Oct 2017, I ran my first 5K ever.  Slow pace, but I ran the whole thing.

Over time, I upped my training frequency from Sat/Sun to Wed/Sat/Sun.  And then to Tue/Thu/Sat/Sun.  In Nov last year, I ran my first half marathon.  Then in Jan this year, I ran my first full marathon (walked some of the last 10K) and upped my running frequency to 5x weekly.  Then in May, ran my first no-walk marathon.  And in July my first Ultra (50K, easy pace).

So listen to the experts here.  Start slow.  And over time you can increase distance and speed, and before you know it, you'll be signing-up for a HM.

Over this time, my weight has come down from about 190lbs to 165lbs (I had dropped from 235 to 190 with diet prior to the running but couldn't get past 190).  And the best part is that when I'm running 5x weekly, I can eat whatever I want.  

Welcome to the club.  

 

 

 

Edited by Zasada
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1 minute ago, Zasada said:

Over this time, my weight has come down from about 190lbs to 165lbs.  And the best part is that when I'm running 5x weekly, I can eat whatever I want.  

Yeah, but you are 7 feet tall 2.13 meters tall and weight 165! Eat a cheeseburger and a donut, for Otis' sake!

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2 hours ago, Otis said:

By the way, these $48 New Balance sneakers I wore this morning felt great. Light years better than the expensive Nike trail shoes that made my knees useless for two weeks. 

Why are you wearing trail shoes?  the concrete jungle?

Edited by belljr

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1 hour ago, gruecd said:

 

13 hours ago, ChiefD said:

But I love the benefits. Loss of weight, off my cholesterol meds, better diet, longer dongs

I must have missed this last part...  :kicksrock:

 

Scientifically speaking, you only get the last benefit from racing in the heat.  

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3 hours ago, Otis said:

Two more stupid questions:

Couch to 5 K has 3 runs a week.  But I want to run more than that.  Do I have to take a day off if I'm feeling ok?  I ran yesterday and woke up this morning and felt good and wanted to run again, so I did.  Honestly just kind of lost interest in going to the gym to lift weights and prefer this for now.  I should get back to the weights, or at least push-ups, but for now I'm just content doing this.  

Also, I have this fancy watch coming today and it tracks HR.  Everyone talks about tracking HR.  I'm sure when you get to triathlete levels there's reasons to do that, but other than looking at it as interesting data, how should I use that?  Am I trying to keep my HR above a certain level?  below a certain level?  I'm fully expecting it to redline at "heart attack" the first time I start moving.

TIA

i'd adhere to the plan. it's setup that way for a reason.

as an example of what happens when you don't.. i think it was my 2nd week when i felt pretty, pretty good one day and decided i'd just do double the prescribed time. so instead of "run 90 seconds, walk 60" for 8 legs totaling 20 minutes... i ran/walked for a total of 40 minutes.

felt pretty ####### awesome when i was done.

then i woke up the next morning and it felt like my legs were made of glass & someone had hit them with a baseball bat until they shattered. my shins, thighs and hips felt so bad that i was convinced i'd never be able to run again. thought for sure i'd done some serious damage that would require a doctor's attention

 

that might be an extreme example but from that point forward i adhered to the plan until the end and then i started going off-schedule when i felt like it. back to back day is no big deal now but until your legs are conditioned to running i wouldn't advise going off plan. not only because of the potential for pain but also because staying on schedule helps to form the habit.

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21 minutes ago, The Iguana said:

 

Of course, I work IT for an athletic shoe retailer

Um....hi!

 

Mizuno Wave Rider size 9?

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27 minutes ago, The Iguana said:

Only ask because for most of my life I have very much been a "color inside the lines" kind of guy. As I've gotten older, I've strayed outside the boundaries more and more, if you know what I mean. But I know when I do, I feel it in my bones and often it takes "work" to continue down that path when I do something "against the rules" no matter how arbitrary a rule may be. Even in the running thing, I pretty much always know when I'm doing something I shouldn't (or isn't advised) but it often doesn't stop me. Just curious if you are a similar personality or if it is simply how much you have seen the "rules work" and are stuck to them in this instance. 

Not sure if all that makes sense but the concept kind of interests me if you can understand my ramblings...

Yeah don't change the rules in a boardgame or Iggy will swing his hammer repeatedly 

 

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28 minutes ago, El Floppo said:

Is the running show store reviewing your gait and recommending the right shoe for you still a thing?

yes - one near me checks the supinate/pronate stuff 

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Just now, belljr said:

Yeah don't change the rules in a boardgame or Iggy will swing his hammer repeatedly 

 

damn :goodposting:

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8 minutes ago, ChiefD said:

Um....hi!

 

Mizuno Wave Rider size 9?

none in stock. wave prophecy 8 appears to be the only mizunos we currently have... 

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Oh, and to be fair, your run looks better on the desktop Strava than the mobile @Otis.  So my bad.  

I don't understand why mobile Strava sometimes makes things look so different.  First of all, it looks like he was running up a mountain on the elevation on mobile.  Second, it doesn't show the paces accurately as it seemed like he was down to an 8:00 pace.  So, not as bad as when I first looked and did a nice job overall or running/walking and keeping it mostly even. 

Also, for a little more perspective, just over 2 years ago, I was even more of a n00b than you are now.  You at least used to run.  I never ran more than a mile in my life up until that point.  Helped out my wife in a relay race running 2.6 miles for the last leg and just about died.  Walked more than I ran and was pretty stupid about it.  But, as a result, decided I'd try and run a 5K with her 3 months later.  Made all of the mistakes we all are warning about.  I didn't get hurt, but I certainly was going too fast to start, had no plan.  All the guys here just told me to keep running, keep going slow, keep adding time slowly.  And after finally listening to them, things got so much better so much faster than if I hadn't listened.

There are plenty of us here that are not anywhere close to Olympians and are pretty new at this stuff.  Just trying to keep you from making the same mistakes. 

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Just now, The Iguana said:

none in stock. wave prophecy 8 appears to be the only mizunos we currently have... 

Surpirsed you carry shoes that little......

 

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16 minutes ago, ChiefD said:

Um....hi!

 

Mizuno Wave Rider size 9?

Dong size verified :scared:

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6 minutes ago, belljr said:

Surpirsed you carry shoes that little......

 

no idea what that means but, man, those are some expensive running shoes...

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12 minutes ago, belljr said:

Surpirsed you carry shoes that little......

 

<_<

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6 minutes ago, xulf said:

Dong size verified :scared:

You should have seen it before the running!

 

:blush:

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1 minute ago, ChiefD said:

You should have seen it before the running!

 

:blush:

They tried?

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9 minutes ago, The Iguana said:
16 minutes ago, belljr said:

Surpirsed you carry shoes that little......

 

no idea what that means but, man, those are some expensive running shoes...

 

3 minutes ago, ChiefD said:

<_<

Cheif is so happy I'm in this thread

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2019 Las Vegas Rock n Roll Half Marathon Race Report

Preface

This race was a year + 1 week since my first race ever, the 2018 version of the Vegas RnR HM (1:47).  Training had gone well since then, having completed a couple marathons and an ultra.  Weekly mileage averaged about 75km (46mi) over the course of the year.  I was very consistent and seeing progress in all aspects of my running.  I was setting PRs on some of my favourite courses and meeting my goals.  But since the Houston marathon in January, I had a slow-burn glute issue which was nagging but generally would only appear on only the longest of runs.  Then over time, it started to appear on 20Ks.  And then some 10K ERs.  And it would get worse as each run progressed.

The glute issue was sporadic, and I had my best training run ever in mid-Oct.  Ran 20K at goal HMP, and I was pumped.  Only a month to Vegas, and it felt like I was a lock for sub-1:40.

Following that, I had a 90km (60mi) week and perhaps that was too much for my glute.  It got bad enough that I had to dial-back my volume.  A lot.  Aside from a run or a hike here or there, I basically took a month off before this race.  Mentally I was in rough shape.  Staring at your Garmin status and having it come back to you with "Detraining" for the first time EVER was crushing.

Anyways, I had this race on the calendar for quite some time.  Also, like last year, it was a work thing.  The Las Vegas Visitors' Bureau invited me and my team down for a weekend, but a condition of the junket was running the race.  So if I wanted to go on the trip, I had to run.  And besides, I wanted to run it.  I had such a great experience last year, it felt like I just had to do it again.

So I decided to buy the lottery ticket, and go out at goal pace and see how long I could hold it before my glute or fitness dictated otherwise.  Maybe the long rest from running would offset the loss of fitness and my butt would be OK.  Maybe this year would be like last year, where I could run faster than I dreamed.  So the goal was 1:39:XX, even if it might be an unrealistic one.

This is an afternoon race (so that you can run the strip at night), so that morning I had a carb-heavy breakfast and just kept the water flowing until about 3 hours before the race.  Watched some football, took one of my wife's prescription NSAIDs (forgot mine), a Tylenol, got changed and headed for the shuttle 90 minutes before start time.

The shuttle got stuck in the horrendous traffic, and it was looking like we might miss the closure of our corral, so we jumped off the bus and walked the remaining 3K to the start.  35,000 runners in this race and it was just a mass of people.  Incredible.

Got to the corral about 15 minutes before start.  National anthem, rollers, elites, first corral, then us.  Off we go.

Conditions:  20C (68F), slight wind out of the south.

0-5K (4:39/km, 7:29/mi)

Started really well.  Not too many people to dodge, but there were some.  Glute didn't even squeak until about the 4-5K point.  Crossed the 5K timing mat, looked at my watch and it was at 5.12K.  It had been reading 4:30/km to me for each KM so I knew that I was a little ahead of goal pace, even after considering the extra distance of having to weave.  I was banking time for my sub-1:40 goal and things felt good.

5K-10K  (4:43/km, 7:36/km)

Still feeling good.  Glute was getting a little worse, but the bigger concern was that I was starting to feel the cardio.  My mouth was dry (despite over-hydrating for the prior two days) and so I took a few sips of Gatorade at aid stations.  Dumped a cup of water on my head at another.  I knew my HR was probably higher than I'd like, but I refused to look, for fear of it psyching me out.  After the race, I saw I was already over 160 -- which is generally unsustainable for me.  On my awesome training run a month earlier, which I ran 20K at goal HMP pace, my HR by the end was only 152 (avg 145). 

I used the same playlist as last year, and there was some singing and air guitar when Eddie Money's Take me Home Tonight came on.  I noted that it was further along in distance than last time!  Fun.

Some of my work group ran the 10K, which had finished by then, and as I'm running I hear "Hey, there's Brian!", and I look over/back to see them cheering for me.  That was great.

10K-10mi (4:50/km, 7:48/mi)

This is where the lack of fitness really started to show.  I could tell that I was on the clock and could feel my pace slowing.  My watch was reading my average pace to me with each passing km, and I was getting closer and closer to an average pace of 4:45/km.  Which is what I needed to hit for my goal, not including the added distance of circuity and inaccuracy.  So realistically, I needed to be 4:40/km or faster and it just wasn't in me.

The pavement was uneven in sections, and this combined with the new Nike Zoom Fly Flyknit shoes I was wearing, was causing my feet/ankles to wobble in the cracks/dips in the pavement and it felt so energy-sucking to keep losing my balance, if even only slightly.  The shoes had so little support, but were otherwise great.  I think in the future they might be my 10K shoes but maybe they're not right for longer runs.

10mi-12.3mi (5:05/km, 8:12/mi)

Once we hit downtown, and turned around to run back towards the Stratosphere and the finish, the slight downhill + tailwind, turned into a slight uphill + headwind.  Again, only after the race did I see my HR had climbed to 170.  170+ is barf territory for me, and I normally can't hold that for more than a few minutes.  So for this stretch I found myself alternating between something close to goal pace (likely slower) and my ER pace.  I'd run goal pace for a few hundred meters and then run out of steam.  I actually wanted to walk but, like in Calgary, willed myself into at least running an ER pace.  Looking at my watch, I knew 1:39:XX wasn't happening.  But I still wanted to PR by as much as I could. 

At about 500m before the finish I knew I would pass my wife and my work colleagues, so I got my pace up to something more respectable.  I ran by them and it was great to hear them cheering.  But 200m later, I had to go ER pace again for 100m.  For the last 200m I gutted-out a "sprint" to the finish.  Again, looking at my HR data afterward, I can see I hit 179 at the end, and 177 for each little HMP section I ran before that.  That's my MAX HR.  Got to the finish, and like the Calgary marathon, crossed the double timing mats and proceeded to stop and suck wind 2 meters from there.  

  • 1:41:59 (nice to see my desperate sprint at the end got me under 1:42)
  • 438/16421 overall
  • 364/6959 among men
  • 39/1112 among men 45-49

It was a 5+ minute PR but I knew I was capable of more.  At least I was a month ago.  So I was disappointed.

The finisher's gauntlet is huge at Vegas, you have to walk another 2K up the strip before you can get out.  And then I had to walk another 2K back to meet my wife at the viewing area.  By this point my glute & hip were screaming at me and I was walking with a limp.  But thankfully the pain waited until then rather than get that bad during the race.

I failed in my goal because of fitness, but after looking at my HR data, I'm happy with the effort.  I really gave it my all.  Holding a HR of 160+ for 15K and 170+ for 5K was something I had never done before.  Even last year, my first race ever, I only got to 170 at the end, and just barely.

As for excuses, I think the heat probably played a role.  I'm used to running in temps of 5C-10C (42-50F), or even cooler.  I haven't run in 20C (68F) since last year, let alone raced in it.

Not sure of any lessons-learned on this one.  I just need to figure out this glute issue.  Which is also becoming a hip issue, it seems.

Next race is the Houston Marathon in January.  But I'm seriously considering skipping it.  My overriding goal now is the Miwok 100 in May, and I will forego any/all other goals between now and then in the hope of achieving that one.  I just need a plan.  A plan to fix my injury, and a plan to train the right way for my first 100K. 

After this race, I am in even more admiration of @The Iguana's HM execution than I was before.  Bringing it home like he did was awesome.  I really wanted to do the same, but didn't have the gas.  And I was thinking of his effort during mine, trying to give me the motivation.  Tried reciting "DBAP" to myself at many points to get me back up to a faster pace.  Running faster for the last 3K is easy when you're planning, but when you're at the 18K point with all your energy on the pavement, it's so much harder.  What a great effort on his part.

Edited by Zasada
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Great report to read Z.  I wouldn't know what to do with myself if a successful training period coincided with a race with both of them injury free ( 4 years and still waiting).  I feel your frustration.   

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Awesome report @Zasada. Do not discount that 70* weather. 70 vs 45 is huge, IMO, especially when it comes to things like HR and effort. 20 degrees cooler and you crush 1:40, IMO. 

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i thought listening to music was illegal in races...

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19 minutes ago, Zasada said:

2019 Las Vegas Rock n Roll Half Marathon Race Report

Preface

This race was a year + 1 week since my first race ever, the 2018 version of the Vegas RnR HM (1:47).  Training had gone well since then, having completed a couple marathons and an ultra.  Weekly mileage averaged about 75km (46mi) over the course of the year.  I was very consistent and seeing progress in all aspects of my running.  I was setting PRs on some of my favourite courses and meeting my goals.  But since the Houston marathon in January, I had a slow-burn glute issue which was nagging but generally would only appear on only the longest of runs.  Then over time, it started to appear on 20Ks.  And then some 10K ERs.  And it would get worse as each run progressed.

The glute issue was sporadic, and I had my best training run ever in mid-Oct.  Ran 20K at goal HMP, and I was pumped.  Only a month to Vegas, and it felt like I was a lock for sub-1:40.

Following that, I had a 90km (60mi) week and perhaps that was too much for my glute.  It got bad enough that I had to dial-back my volume.  A lot.  Aside from a run or a hike here or there, I basically took a month off before this race.  Mentally I was in rough shape.  Staring at your Garmin status and having it come back to you with "Detraining" for the first time EVER was crushing.

Anyways, I had this race on the calendar for quite some time.  Also, like last year, it was a work thing.  The Las Vegas Visitors' Bureau invited me and my team down for a weekend, but a condition of the junket was running the race.  So if I wanted to go on the trip, I had to run.  And besides, I wanted to run it.  I had such a great experience last year, it felt like I just had to do it again.

So I decided to buy the lottery ticket, and go out at goal pace and see how long I could hold it before my glute or fitness dictated otherwise.  Maybe the long rest from running would offset the loss of fitness and my butt would be OK.  Maybe this year would be like last year, where I could run faster than I dreamed.  So the goal was 1:39:XX, even if it might be an unrealistic one.

This is an afternoon race (so that you can run the strip at night), so that morning I had a carb-heavy breakfast and just kept the water flowing until about 3 hours before the race.  Watched some football, took one of my wife's prescription NSAIDs (forgot mine), a Tylenol, got changed and headed for the shuttle 90 minutes before start time.

The shuttle got stuck in the horrendous traffic, and it was looking like we might miss the closure of our corral, so we jumped off the bus and walked the remaining 3K to the start.  35,000 runners in this race and it was just a mass of people.  Incredible.

Got to the corral about 15 minutes before start.  National anthem, rollers, elites, first corral, then us.  Off we go.

Conditions:  20C (68F), slight wind out of the south.

0-5K (4:39/km, 7:29/mi)

Started really well.  Not too many people to dodge, but there were some.  Glute didn't even squeak until about the 4-5K point.  Crossed the 5K timing mat, looked at my watch and it was at 5.12K.  It had been reading 4:30/km to me for each KM so I knew that I was a little ahead of goal pace, even after considering the extra distance of having to weave.  I was banking time for my sub-1:40 goal and things felt good.

5K-10K  (4:43/km, 7:36/km)

Still feeling good.  Glute was getting a little worse, but the bigger concern was that I was starting to feel the cardio.  My mouth was dry (despite over-hydrating for the prior two days) and so I took a few sips of Gatorade at aid stations.  Dumped a cup of water on my head at another.  I knew my HR was probably higher than I'd like, but I refused to look, for fear of it psyching me out.  After the race, I saw I was already over 160 -- which is generally unsustainable for me.  On my awesome training run a month earlier,, which I ran 20K at goal HMP pace, my HR by the end was only 152 (avg 145). 

I used the same playlist as last year, and there was some signing and air guitar when Eddie Money's Take me Home Tonight came on.  I noted that it was further along in distance than last time!  Fun.

Some of my work group ran the 10K, which had finished by then, and as I'm running I hear "Hey, there's Brian!", and I look over/back to see them cheering for me.  That was great.

10K-10mi (4:50/km, 7:48/mi)

This is where the lack of fitness really started to show.  I could tell that I was on the clock and could feel my pace slowing.  My watch was reading my average pace to me with each passing km, and I was getting closer and closer to an average pace of 4:45/km.  Which is what I needed to hit for my goal, not including the added distance of circuity and inaccuracy.  So realistically, I needed to be 4:40/km or faster and it just wasn't in me.

The pavement was uneven in sections, and this combined with the new Nike Zoom Fly Flyknit shoes I was wearing, was causing my feet/ankles to wobble in the cracks/dips in the pavement and it felt so energy-sucking to keep losing my balance, if even only slightly.  The shoes had so little support, but were otherwise great.  I think in the future they might be my 10K shoes but maybe they're not right for longer runs.

10mi-12.3mi (5:05/km, 8:12/mi)

Once we hit downtown, and turned around to run back towards the Stratosphere and the finish, the slight downhill + tailwind, turned into a slight uphill + headwind.  Again, only after the race did I see my HR had climbed to 170.  170+ is barf territory for me, and I normally can't hold that for more than a few minutes.  So for this stretch I found myself alternating between something close to goal pace (likely slower) and my ER pace.  I'd run goal pace for a few hundred meters and then run out of steam.  I actually wanted to walk but, like in Calgary, willed myself into at least running an ER pace.  Looking at my watch, I knew 1:39:XX wasn't happening.  But I still wanted to PR by as much as I could. 

At about 500m before the finish I knew I would pass my wife and my work colleagues, so I got my pace up to something more respectable.  I ran by them and it was great to hear them cheering.  But 200m later, I had to go ER pace again for 100m.  For the last 200m I gutted-out a "sprint" to the finish.  Again, looking at my HR data afterward, I can see I hit 179 at the end, and 177 for each little HMP section I ran before that.  That's my MAX HR.  Got to the finish, and like the Calgary marathon, crossed the double timing mats and proceeded to stop and suck wind 2 meters from there.  

  • 1:41:59 (nice to see my desperate sprint at the end got me under 1:42)
  • 438/16421 overall
  • 364/6959 among men
  • 39/1112 among men 45-49

It was a 5+ minute PR but I knew I was capable of more.  At least I was a month ago.  So I was disappointed.

The finisher's gauntlet is huge at Vegas, you have to walk another 2K up the strip before you can get out.  And then I had to walk another 2K back to meet my wife at the viewing area.  By this point my glute & hip were screaming at me and I was walking with a limp.  But thankfully the pain waited until then rather than get that bad during the race.

I failed in my goal because of fitness, but after looking at my HR data, I'm happy with the effort.  I really gave it my all.  Holding a HR of 160+ for 15K and 170+ for 5K was something I had never done before.  Even last year, my first race ever, I only got to 170 at the end, and just barely.

As for excuses, I think the heat probably played a role.  I'm used to running in temps of 5C-10C (42-50F), or even cooler.  I haven't run in 20C (68F) since last year, let alone raced in it.

Not sure of any lessons-learned on this one.  I just need to figure out this glute issue.  Which is also becoming a hip issue, it seems.

Next race is the Houston Marathon in January.  But I'm seriously considering skipping it.  My overriding goal now is the Miwok 100 in May, and I will forego any/all other goals between now and then in the hope of achieving that one.  I just need a plan.  A plan to fix my injury, and a plan to train the right way for my first 100K. 

After this race, I am in even more admiration of @The Iguana's HM execution than I was before.  Bringing it home like he did was awesome.  I really wanted to do the same, but didn't have the gas.  And I was thinking of his effort during mine, trying to give me the motivation.  Tried reciting "DBAP" to myself at many points to get me back up to a faster pace.  Running faster for the last 3K is easy when you're planning, but when you're at the 18K point with all your energy on the pavement, it's so much harder.  What a great effort on his part.

Awesome. You got all you had out of the fitness you had. When he becomes the limiting factor over muscle fatigue you did dang good. 

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2 minutes ago, belljr said:

i thought listening to music was illegal in races...

Discouraged.  And if they find that you're unsafe or causing other runners to be unsafe as a result, they can ask you to stop.  But I use headphones which still allow me to hear my surroundings, so it's a good middle ground.

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2 hours ago, ChiefD said:

potatoes

A+ touch, right there.

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7 minutes ago, belljr said:

i thought listening to music was illegal in races...

Sometimes illegal if it’s USATF-sanctioned and you’re racing for money. So if probably doesn’t apply to any of us except @SteveC702.

I’ve run all of my 34 marathons with music and never had a problem.

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26 minutes ago, Zasada said:

 

I failed in my goal because of fitness

Man, I don't know about this.  You had a 5 minute PR, which is a huge win. 

If there is any failure, it was your glute and not your fitness. Injuries happen. And for you to get out there and STILL gut out a PR is a big win. But, you are like the rest of us.

Happy but not satisfied. That's what keeps us coming back for more. Congrats. :thumbup:

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@Zasada while it won't be apples to apples or anything, I think it is a pretty good representation of what temps can do to race times. The Fort Ben HM is run the first weekend in October. In 2018, there was extremely warm, unseasonably warm weather for the race. Looking at wunderground for historical info, it was about 70* at race start.

A time of 1:38:47 in 2018 would have finished: 4 of 86 in my age group, 54 of 764 in men, 64 of 1608 overall

That was my time in 2019 when it was 45* at start: 16 of 102 in AG, 125 of 875 men, 146 of 1728 overall

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4 minutes ago, The Iguana said:

@Zasada while it won't be apples to apples or anything, I think it is a pretty good representation of what temps can do to race times. The Fort Ben HM is run the first weekend in October. In 2018, there was extremely warm, unseasonably warm weather for the race. Looking at wunderground for historical info, it was about 70* at race start.

A time of 1:38:47 in 2018 would have finished: 4 of 86 in my age group, 54 of 764 in men, 64 of 1608 overall

That was my time in 2019 when it was 45* at start: 16 of 102 in AG, 125 of 875 men, 146 of 1728 overall

I also looked at similar types of things with the race I ran in May - first weekend in May in Indiana can be anything from -7 to 95. When you look at some of the historical results and compare what time xx:xx means in terms of finish, it can be pretty dramatic - and you can make some pretty easy correlations to weather. 

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@Zasada - great report.  You had so much going against you and you still went for it and gave it all you had.  You can't ask for anymore than that (well minus a PR of course :thumbup:).

 

 

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26 minutes ago, The Iguana said:

Awesome report @Zasada. Do not discount that 70* weather. 70 vs 45 is huge, IMO, especially when it comes to things like HR and effort. 20 degrees cooler and you crush 1:40, IMO. 

This. The conditions were brutal for my half. Avg pace was 7:15 with an avg HR of 171! My run yesterday morning with temps in the 50s, close to the same pace. Avg HR 144. The weather plays a huge role in a race that long. Awesome job!

Edited by JShare87
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5 hours ago, Otis said:

Two more stupid questions:

Couch to 5 K has 3 runs a week.  But I want to run more than that.  Do I have to take a day off if I'm feeling ok?  I ran yesterday and woke up this morning and felt good and wanted to run again, so I did.  Honestly just kind of lost interest in going to the gym to lift weights and prefer this for now.  I should get back to the weights, or at least push-ups, but for now I'm just content doing this.  

Also, I have this fancy watch coming today and it tracks HR.  Everyone talks about tracking HR.  I'm sure when you get to triathlete levels there's reasons to do that, but other than looking at it as interesting data, how should I use that?  Am I trying to keep my HR above a certain level?  below a certain level?  I'm fully expecting it to redline at "heart attack" the first time I start moving.

TIA

As others stated, more runs would be fine.  Just don't increase the weekly mileage too quickly.  Running on consecutive days has benefits, in part just learning to run on legs that are a little tired already.  

Over time, you'll learn how to use HR data, or learn what you want to do with it.  After gathering HR data during training, I'll rely heavily on the HR during longer races (HM to marathon).  But related to the above, a high HR on a 'normal' run can be an indication of fatigue or possibly an early warning of an injury.

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