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Dynasty & Redraft: RB Derrick Henry, Titans

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51 minutes ago, Bri said:

Good, probably. Great, no, doubtful.

It appears LaFleur has botched the zone blocking system that the Rams use and he and the OL coach have just mangled it.

The Titans have a regular pro bowler at LT, an all pro/pro bowler at RT, and a G that only allows a sack every nine games and still can pull off pancakes in the NFL. They WERE one of the best lines in football, joining the Cowboys, but this new staff has wrecked that.

Dion Lewis had more carries than Henry despite his success. Don't underestimate Vrabel's anxiousness to show the world his ego and tell everyone he knows best.

Pasting 

Vrabel was asked how Henry’s performance on Thursday might change how the team approaches things in the run game going forward.

“Well, if you could promise that same type of success our past meetings would've been pretty short,” Vrabel said. “The one thing that is great about this league is you have to do it every week. You have to be able to consistently come out and do the things that you feel like are a strength.

“Just because you had one good game one week, or you had a couple of sacks, or had a couple tackles, or threw a couple of touchdown passes, you have to come back each and every week and prove it.”

Henry now has 712 yards and nine touchdowns on 145 carries on the season for the Titans.

Running back Dion Lewis has 477 yards and a touchdown on his 145 carries.

“Derrick will have all the opportunity to continue to do that, and to help us,” Vrabel said. “His attitude and his preparation has remained consistent and that was always good to see. So we’ll try and keep that going. Obviously we have to try and keep that going.”

What consistent success has Vrabel had as a coach? By his own standard, he should be fired. My guess is it won't be until after next year and then Vrabel will get his just return.

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2 hours ago, menobrown said:

Not sure, find it hard to trust him myself. It's not like we did not see something similar earlier this year with Crowell.

Yup... my thought precisely on Crowell.

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1 hour ago, Bri said:

Good, probably. Great, no, doubtful.

It appears LaFleur has botched the zone blocking system that the Rams use and he and the OL coach have just mangled it.

The Titans have a regular pro bowler at LT, an all pro/pro bowler at RT, and a G that only allows a sack every nine games and still can pull off pancakes in the NFL. They WERE one of the best lines in football, joining the Cowboys, but this new staff has wrecked that.

Dion Lewis had more carries than Henry despite his success. Don't underestimate Vrabel's anxiousness to show the world his ego and tell everyone he knows best.

Pasting 

Vrabel was asked how Henry’s performance on Thursday might change how the team approaches things in the run game going forward.

“Well, if you could promise that same type of success our past meetings would've been pretty short,” Vrabel said. “The one thing that is great about this league is you have to do it every week. You have to be able to consistently come out and do the things that you feel like are a strength.

“Just because you had one good game one week, or you had a couple of sacks, or had a couple tackles, or threw a couple of touchdown passes, you have to come back each and every week and prove it.”

Henry now has 712 yards and nine touchdowns on 145 carries on the season for the Titans.

Running back Dion Lewis has 477 yards and a touchdown on his 145 carries.

“Derrick will have all the opportunity to continue to do that, and to help us,” Vrabel said. “His attitude and his preparation has remained consistent and that was always good to see. So we’ll try and keep that going. Obviously we have to try and keep that going.”

Good info.  Feel like this guy is totally cutting words...... What a vagina.  

I feel like he is flex start-able going forward.  My gut.

He is not Gurley and Vrabel is not McVay.  And we have some outstanding blockers out here in LA, including our WRs.

Good luck bro.

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2 hours ago, Bri said:

Henry now has 712 yards and nine touchdowns on 145 carries on the season for the Titans.

Running back Dion Lewis has 477 yards and a touchdown on his 145 carries.

I am probably one of the stronger Dion Lewis apologists on this board (he looked as good as any RB in the league his breakout season with NE) but if that isn’t a cut and dried “one of these guys should be getting more carries than the other” I don’t know what is

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3 hours ago, EthnicFury said:

I am probably one of the stronger Dion Lewis apologists on this board (he looked as good as any RB in the league his breakout season with NE) but if that isn’t a cut and dried “one of these guys should be getting more carries than the other” I don’t know what is

And Dion might benefit from it, even 

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It's a different league now. Teams don't use the FB anymore but some TE pretending he is to save a roster spot. RBs don't get X amount of carries to get going. Maybe Bell, maybe ADP, maybe the elite, but in general that's been dead for years now. 

I don't agree with it one bit. Fowler was a top rated FB by PFF and 3rd best the year before. All PFF is rating is blitz pickup and did he land his block (maybe catch percentage and rushing for a handful of plays) In this regard, PFF ratings are perfect and show a clear efficiency. There may be gripes with how PFF rates this or that, but in some regards like the FB, it's very simple and illustrates things perfectly. The Titans averaged more than 5 ypc when they ran behind Fowler. The Pats use a FB and the league copies a zillion other things BB does, yet here we have coaches claiming they know better than him and getting rid of the FB. For me, this is all "you dopes! use the FB!"

The Sooners produced a fascinating FB last year. Flowers was a 3rd down scat back type that seemed to go to the sideline and put his hard hat on, then return to play FB and nail someone. Without a doubt, the hardest hitting 3rd down back you ever saw yet when he catches a screen and scoots, ya gotta look at the # to make sure it's the same guy. He couldn't make a loaded Chiefs backfield (where former RBs like Thomas also play WR) and he's not even on a team now. If saving a roster spot is so important, then there ya go. A lot of teams' 3rd or 4th RB don't even play but ST. At least this guy would have contributed. Fowler, BTW, had great hands for a FB and played slot WR in two camps and did very well.

Eddie George explained RBs not getting the carries to get going as the offenses changing. OCs are looking for 7 yards per play while it used to be 4. A coach would absolutely ride a guy with the simple math that 3 carries times 4 gets you a first. It's not that way. OCs want the quick 7. 10 yards may come from a missed tackle and 7 plus a few yards. Maybe it comes from a second play netting 7. He explained that if ya look at this Titans group for example, Mariota can beat someone to the sideline for 7, throw a quick slant, throw a flip to Dion who scampers for 7, Davis can run a quick curl for 7. To him, OCs wanted more and they found out they could get it. When the DBs are backed off prepared for the quick 7, a fast RB can take off and get the 7 before the DB can respond quick enough, so what would have probably been a four yard carry in year's past, that just got them 7. 

Eddie is genuinely concerned for Henry. (Before this game) He explained that (when he's a free agent) he would need to spend some time with his agent looking for the right coach, maybe an older one, to find a guy that would still do it the old way. Eddie has no doubt Henry would dominate in any previous era. The interviewer mentioned his size and strength and George says it's because of how he thinks, his mental makeup. You can put a team on his back and he's totally comfortable, while other backs act like they're carrying a piano. It was a great analogy. George and Henry are friends, maybe mentor student...not sure what ya call it. Henry has met tons of former backs and players through George. He is quite aware of the change in philosophy around the league and that "let Lewis get the 5th TD" bit was some of what people have said for years- Henry is a special special guy. A true good guy, raised by his grandma, that doesn't take anything for granted and is very respectful of others. The old timers love Henry too. 

Vrabel is a former player in that era. He should know and appreciate the value of a back like that. He should also appreciate a FB because he played it on many plays and his teams always had one. BB uses one and Vrabel came from there. BB has ridden Dillon, Blount, and now Michel and if he's got the back, he'll ride him it's just that he usually has a different set of backs on the roster. Vrabel's got this "fresh" new offense by LaFleur and whatever rookie understanding of the game evolving. I keep saying this isn't a Vrabel offense and I can't say that enough- he was tougher and more hard-nosed. We will know a Vrabel offense when we see one.  

Another thing was pointed out recently, Delanie is an intelligent player and a sound blocker if not a real good blocker. They are missing him in the run game too. Henry loves the corner (like many classic backs) and if Walker can return before the season ends, that would really help the backs a bunch. If you watch a play develop, the blocks are there initially but a good second (maybe two) and they can't hold em'. The backup TEs are doing it right, they're just not winning long enough. Walker's got every veteran trick a TE would have and he'll figure a way to hold that corner even if he has to dive to get in the DE's way. The key-ness of the TE also lends to BB and Vrabel's "upbringing" too. 

The Titans will now start the smartest TE in football. Firkser who is a perfect 16 for 16 in passes thrown his way and runs perfect routes. He's a harvard grad and it's evident, but he isn't big and tough. He won't hold the corner. Not against a 300lb burly DE. Stocker is just awful at blocking and we've griped about it all year. Jonnu's injury hurts Henry and Lewis. They're gonna have to run up the middle or script it just right for Lewan to be beastly. They really need to re-sign the FB, but they won't. Vrabel spoke of MyCole Pruitt playing very well after Jonnu's injury. He's an inexperienced TE that is OMG cut and looks like a WR because he is so. Pruitt has been "in trouble" for blocking the wrong guy many times and yeah he looks like he could fight anyone but the guy can't even get his assignments right, next to an intelligent soul like Firkser, Pruitt appears dumb when he does it. If Conk didn't get hurt, the Titans could use Dennis Kelly as the blocking TE as they have the prior two years. There's a real problem with the corner not gonna be there and it probably goes to Spain. The best G everyone disrespects and doesn't appreciate.  Look how far he is down the field in the Henry highlights, look how he blows up several pro bowl caliber members of the Jags DL. Vrabel benched him the game before to make an example out of him. It's not like he has this extreme faith in Spain but they gotta run there. At worst, Henry can maybe bounce it with Lewan blocking next to him. The TE not holding the edge makes it tricky.

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6 hours ago, msommer said:

And Dion might benefit from it, even 

And quite possibly Henry benefited from it Thursday.

I am one who does not think the Titans have misused their RB's this year, not in the least.  But now it's time to fade Dion and use a fairly fresh legged big fast back more, which I think they will be doing.

 

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Interesting spin on Vrabel by the national media-

He will not keep his job with a 200 yard rusher on the sideline.

This started a radio conversation I heard on ESPN radio and TEN radio

The obvious points are that Lewis can get carries and they can share the load some but a coach must use a player to the best of their ability and sitting a guy isn't doing that.

The other is (which I didn't think of) that owners make millions of $ from a star and an NFL owner looks at a potential star like a rising stock. This has me hmmmm since the Titans will have (somewhat) of an ownership change this offseason going from sister to brother in the Adams family. 

The general consensus for Vrabel has been he has 2 years or at least midway through next year, but he needs to show something as the season closes and be open to change/progress during the offseason. This patience has been wearing down with some incidents and their season only having an 11% chance of making the playoffs

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26 minutes ago, Bri said:

Interesting spin on Vrabel by the national media-

He will not keep his job with a 200 yard rusher on the sideline.

This started a radio conversation I heard on ESPN radio and TEN radio

The obvious points are that Lewis can get carries and they can share the load some but a coach must use a player to the best of their ability and sitting a guy isn't doing that.

The other is (which I didn't think of) that owners make millions of $ from a star and an NFL owner looks at a potential star like a rising stock. This has me hmmmm since the Titans will have (somewhat) of an ownership change this offseason going from sister to brother in the Adams family. 

The general consensus for Vrabel has been he has 2 years or at least midway through next year, but he needs to show something as the season closes and be open to change/progress during the offseason. This patience has been wearing down with some incidents and their season only having an 11% chance of making the playoffs

Thanks.  Heisman winner, touted draftee and massive performance.  I mean... you gotta wonder what is going on with that coaching staff.  OH, and I have a reason to be bitter.  I'd be in second place by 0.13 points in the FFPC right now had I started Henry.

I don't know a lot about the Titans, but I am super frustrated with his usage this year.  OK my venting is done.  Thank you.

Edited by leftcoastheel
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17 minutes ago, leftcoastheel said:

Thanks.  Heisman winner, touted draftee and massive performance.  I mean... you gotta wonder what is going on with that coaching staff.  OH, and I have a reason to be bitter.  I'd be in second place by 0.13 points in the FFPC right now had I started Henry.

I don't know a lot about the Titans, but I am super frustrated with his usage this year.  OK my venting is done.  Thank you.

We all are. Had him every year and finally cut bait mid year this year but I’m really curious to see what he could do with Zeke-like touches. 

Edited by Elevencents

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On 12/10/2018 at 10:28 PM, leftcoastheel said:

Thanks.  Heisman winner, touted draftee and massive performance.  I mean... you gotta wonder what is going on with that coaching staff.  OH, and I have a reason to be bitter.  I'd be in second place by 0.13 points in the FFPC right now had I started Henry.

I don't know a lot about the Titans, but I am super frustrated with his usage this year.  OK my venting is done.  Thank you.

Hard pill to swallow sometimes and trust me I know because  I'd also be in second in the FFPC contest if I'd started Henry, trailing first by 5 points. And I got two teams in that RTS league that would be in 11th and 13th place if I"d started him trailing first by around 20. So about 5 points from sniffing $250K and 20 points from my teams sniffing $200K. No biggie, right?  Though I must say the only one of those 3 leagues I actually mulled starting him was the FFPC league so it's not like they were all wrong WDIS decisions but still can be hard to take.

But unlike you I'm not frustrated with his usage.  I think up until a few weeks ago Dion was outplaying him and  I think the fact that Henry is fairly fresh is a big assist to him right now.  If this last game does not earn him more usage then I I can see having a reason to be super frustrated, but right now only person I'm frustrated with is me for not starting him.

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1 minute ago, menobrown said:

Hard pill to swallow sometimes and trust me I know because  I'd also be in second in the FFPC contest if I'd started Henry, trailing first by 5 points. And I got two teams in that RTS league that would be in 11th and 13th place if I"d started him trailing first by around 20. So about 5 points from sniffing $250K and 20 points from my teams sniffing $200K. No biggie, right?  Though I must say the only one of those 3 leagues I actually mulled starting him was the FFPC league so it's not like they were all wrong WDIS decisions but still can be hard to take.

But unlike you I'm not frustrated with his usage.  I think up until a few weeks ago Dion was outplaying him and  I think the fact that Henry is fairly fresh is a big assist to him right now.  If this last game does not earn him more usage then I I can see having a reason to be super frustrated, but right now only person I'm frustrated with is me for not starting him.

Precisely my point from a FF standpoint.  He was un-startable because of his usage.  Perhaps Lewis was outplaying him... but it appears to me, in my admittedly minimal knowledge of the Titans since I just don't watch them often, it was poor coaching and poor personnel decisions.

That's my frustration.  You should not be frustrated with yourself for benching him against JAX dude... that was the obvious play.

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8 minutes ago, leftcoastheel said:

.  You should not be frustrated with yourself for benching him against JAX dude... that was the obvious play.

Maybe but when I referenced the FFPC league as the one league I was mulling using him it was him or Michel, the other two leagues had stronger options so he got zero consideration.

 And why I guess it was maybe not so obvious is Michel was not an overly strong option either and  a good friend of mine called me right before the game to get my lineup advice for a local league he was in with a fairly high stakes, as local leagues go. He thought he should go with Henry over Michel and it was not easy to make him change his mind, he felt strong about it and it  took me a few minutes to convince him that Michel was the right call. Wrong person called for advice last week.

Anyway one of the reasons I took Henry was I assumed he'd be not be heavily used and with Dion's injury history it could make Henry a fresh legged beast when it was time to win big money. Dion has remained healthy but hopefully that time is here and it's not to late for us.

But a lot of times I'll blame coaches for lack of or improper use of a player and this is just not one of those cases, I never watched Titans games this year thinking to myself they have got to give Henry more touches or he is being criminally underused, thought he got the playing time his performance earned.

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