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Turkey shoots down Russian jet (1 Viewer)

That's not good because Russia is crazy. Of course, if Russia wasn't continually swinging their junk around and provoking this kind of stuff by entering airspace of other countries over and over again, this wouldn't have happened.

 
Doesn't Turkey know Thanksgiving is right around the corner? They hoping for a presidential pardon from Putin?

 
This is one of the reasons I think some of the Democrats and Rand Paul were/are correct in saying they wouldn't issue a no fly zone in Syria. Because then you would either have to shoot down Russian jets or allow them to run all over you and look weak as they would not acknowledge it.

 
This is one of the reasons I think some of the Democrats and Rand Paul were/are correct in saying they wouldn't issue a no fly zone in Syria. Because then you would either have to shoot down Russian jets or allow them to run all over you and look weak as they would not acknowledge it.
I agree the NFZ is Hillary's idea (maybe a couple goppers too?) and it's nuts.

Even so it was inevitable that this would happen, we are fortunate it wasn't us. This was on the Syrian border and I think Russia will invent some story to back out, deescalate and save face while blaming the Ukrainians.

 
Now it's being reported the Su24 may have been in the 40 mile buffer zone in the Syrian border which Turkey claims, the jet may have been downed 4 km inside Syria.

 
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This is one of the reasons I think some of the Democrats and Rand Paul were/are correct in saying they wouldn't issue a no fly zone in Syria. Because then you would either have to shoot down Russian jets or allow them to run all over you and look weak as they would not acknowledge it.
I agree the NFZ is Hillary's idea (maybe a couple goppers too?) and it's nuts.

Even so it was inevitable that this would happen, we are fortunate it wasn't us. This was on the Syrian border and I think Russia will invent some story to back out, deescalate and save face while blaming the Ukrainians.
:lmao:

Your obsession with Hillary Clinton is bonkers.

 
I know a lot of posts lately speculating about WWIII and I'm quite certain one would never happen...

But this is the type of #### that would be the cause if it ever did happen.

 
This is one of the reasons I think some of the Democrats and Rand Paul were/are correct in saying they wouldn't issue a no fly zone in Syria. Because then you would either have to shoot down Russian jets or allow them to run all over you and look weak as they would not acknowledge it.
I agree the NFZ is Hillary's idea (maybe a couple goppers too?) and it's nuts.

Even so it was inevitable that this would happen, we are fortunate it wasn't us. This was on the Syrian border and I think Russia will invent some story to back out, deescalate and save face while blaming the Ukrainians.
:lmao:

Your obsession with Hillary Clinton is bonkers.
The likely next president has proposed NFZ's. It's real relevant. And really stupid.

 
Very fortunate that the pilots were able to eject. Hopefully both survived.
Both dead.
Really? Link? Haven't seen this.
Noga Tarnopolsky ‏@NTarnopolsky 27m27 minutes ago

Noga Tarnopolsky Retweeted Alejo Schapire

Free Syrian Army says both Russian pilots are dead.
 
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So what does Putin stand to gain by letting this escalate?
Nothing.

I think they wanted to de-escalate from the beginning - going with the story that the plane was shot down from the ground, with Ukrainian-supplied missile. Turkey was having none of that though...

 
From what I'm reading Putin has acknowledged it was Turkey, and that they have back stabbed Russia in an act of terror.

 
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Turkey has called for an extraordinary session of the UN.
A good session wouldn't be enough to get this under control, and a fabulous session would be overkill. Extraordinary seems about right.
Fyi to all I clarified above this is a NATO session.

Btw - yeah, Brussels is a hell of a place to meet right now, surreal NATO is supposed to gather in a town on lockdown.
Thanks Hillary!

 
Hmm, any chance this is like the whole Poland excuse Hitler used to launch WWII? "Hey, fly a jet real near some skittish foreign troops. Maybe we can get them to fire on it, then use that as an excuse to steamroll them." Hopefully it's nothing like that, but Russia has been getting feisty lately.

 
Putin calls Turkey 'accomplices of terrorists' after Russian jet shot down - live updates SummaryHere’s a summary of where things currently stand amid conflicting versions of exactly what happened and terse verbal exchanges between Russia and Turkey.

  • Russia’s president Vladimir Putin has warned Turkey of ‘serious consequences’ after a Russia fighter jet was shot down close to Turkey’s border with Syria. Putin described the incident as a “stab in the back” and accused Turkey of siding with Islamic State militants in Syria.
  • Turkey has summoned Russia’s envoy in Ankara and said it had a right to defend its territory. A Turkish official said:This isn’t an action against any specific country: Our F-16s took necessary steps to defend Turkey’s sovereign territory.”
  • The Turkish military said it shot down the plane after it penetrated Turkish airspace in the province of Hatay at 9.20am warning it to leave 10 times in five minutes before it was shot down. Turkey published radar images claiming to show the plane briefly flying over its southern territory.
  • Russia said its SU-24 plane never left Syrian airspace. Putin said it came down 4km from the border with Turkey and did not pose a threat to Turkey.
  • Video footage showed the pilots parachuting out of the plane before it crashed. An anti-Assad rebel group in Syria said both pilots were killed after parachuting from the jet. This has yet to be confirmed.
  • Turkey is to brief fellow Nato members about the incident at an extraordinary meeting in Brussels at 1600 GMT. The meeting was requested by Turkey.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2015/nov/24/russian-jet-downed-by-turkish-planes-near-syrian-border-live-updates#block-565461eee4b0130fd05d3140

 
Hmm, any chance this is like the whole Poland excuse Hitler used to launch WWII? "Hey, fly a jet real near some skittish foreign troops. Maybe we can get them to fire on it, then use that as an excuse to steamroll them." Hopefully it's nothing like that, but Russia has been getting feisty lately.
They were sending 150,000 troops into Syria to destroy ISIS. Seems like pretty good "feisty" to me if that was their intent.

 
Putin's statement:

Putin warns Turkey of “significant consequences”.

Speaking ahead of his meeting with King Abdullah II of Jordan in Sochi, the Russian leader said:
This event is beyond the normal framework of fighting against terrorism. Of course our military is doing heroic work against terrorism... But the loss today is
a stab in the back
, carried out by
the accomplices of terrorists
. I can’t describe it in any other way. Our aircraft was downed over the territory of
http://www.theguardian.com/world/syriaSyria
http://www.theguardian.com/world/syria, using air-to-air missile from a Turkish F-16. It fell on the Syrian territory 4km from Turkey.
Neither our pilots nor our jet threatened the territory of Turkey. This is obvious. They are fighting terrorists in the northern areas around Latakia, where militants are located, mainly people who originated in Russia, and they were pursuing their direct duty, to make sure these people do not return to Russia. These are people who are clearly international terrorists.


Taking into account that we signed an agreement on deconflicting with the US, and as we know Turkey was among the ones that has joined the US coalition.

Since Isis has such huge resources of hundreds of millions and billions of dollars coming from illicit oil sales, and they are protected by the armed forces of other states,
then it’s clear why they are so brazen, why they are killing people, why they are carrying out terrorist attacks throughout the world including in the heart of Europe.
We will analyse everything, and
today’s tragic event will have significant consequences, including for Russia-Turkish relations
. We have always treated Turkey as a friendly state. I don’t know who was interested in what happened today, certainly not us.
And instead of immediately getting in contact with us, as far as we know, the Turkish side immediately turned to their partners from Nato to discuss this incident, as if we shot down their plane and not they ours.
 
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My guess - a few days of saber-rattling, some trade embargoes imposed by Russia on Turkish products, and then nothing.

Unfortunately we are left with an uncomfortable situation in Syria (Thanks Hillary!) where Russian and Western interests are diametrically opposed.

The current situation will blow over, but we are left with a quagmire in the region.

 
So in short Putin claims that Turkey is supporting Isis and goes out of his way to suggest that the US is involved by way of its involvement with Turkey in the "US coalition."

So basically Putin is claiming that Turkey and the US are running interference for Isis. That's rich.

 
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So what does Putin stand to gain by letting this escalate?
Nothing.

I think they wanted to de-escalate from the beginning - going with the story that the plane was shot down from the ground, with Ukrainian-supplied missile. Turkey was having none of that though...
True, as you say the Turks were never going to do that and maybe even the Russians knew that one was too far fetched. Classic Putin, accuse him of something and he immediately turns into a confrontation in which the accuser is the perpetrator. Even if the Su24 was just a hair over Turkey's border Turkey has been establishing a "buffer zone" in Syria. Erdogan is not as bad as Putin but he is plenty bad, he is a lousy ally and he probably precipitated this crisis by enforcing this buffer zone. On the other hand Russia surely knew Turkey was doing this and in typical fashion decided to play chicken.

 
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Hmm, any chance this is like the whole Poland excuse Hitler used to launch WWII? "Hey, fly a jet real near some skittish foreign troops. Maybe we can get them to fire on it, then use that as an excuse to steamroll them." Hopefully it's nothing like that, but Russia has been getting feisty lately.
I like this.I'll further posit that like the Poland event, Putin put dead pilots (hence the no response) in the jet and flew it remotely into Turkish airspace.

 
will do 48 hours of brine then spatchcock and sit in the corner with my pants down waiting for squishy while eating a snickers

 

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