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Mike Tomlin...is it time to go?

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5 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

We are all fantasy football players so we look at the Steelers as loaded - but their defense hasn't been all that great in those 7 years we are talking about here.

And holding any team to that standard ("not even getting to the SB since 2010") seems a little tough. Only 3 AFC  franchises have made it to the Super Bowl in those six years (and that is not likely to change in 2017) and the Patriot and Broncos teams that took up five of the six available berths during that time frame weren't exactly pushovers.

Granted the D has not been like previous Steeler defenses but the point remains - as much talent all over the field (not just the fantasy positions) that they've had and currently have, his 3-5 playoff record since 2010 is pretty bad especially when you consider he's lost games to Tebow and Bortles.  Yes the Pats have been a constant but to not even be able to get past them once is inexcusable to me.  

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1 hour ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Jacksonvilles secondary is light years better than pitt....ramsey...boyue had allowed one pass td all sesson. ...pitt secondary is weak spot of the defense

Yep.  The starting corners (aside from Hayden) are still young so hopefully will improve.  Sean Davis has his moments but Mitchell is a liability and needs to go.  Gay, Wilcox and Sensabaugh will likely be off the team as well.

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I'm reminded of the old Henny Youngman joke: "How's your wife?" "Compared to what?"

Tomlin has his flaws, but he's one of the better coaches in the league, and statistically speaking, it is unlikely his replacement would be better. As for the argument "What they're doing isn't working; they need to try something else," well, that's simply not how the Steelers have operated over the past 50 years. And given that they have been the most consistently successful franchise in the league over that timeframe, I'm inclined to think they may be on to something. In fact, I think more teams should approach their coaching situations like the Steelers, not the other way around.

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48 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

We are all fantasy football players so we look at the Steelers as loaded - but their defense hasn't been all that great in those 7 years we are talking about here.

And holding any team to that standard ("not even getting to the SB since 2010") seems a little tough. Only 3 AFC  franchises have made it to the Super Bowl in those six years (and that is not likely to change in 2017) and the Patriot and Broncos teams that took up five of the six available berths during that time frame weren't exactly pushovers.

I think Shazier is the only defensive player to make the Pro Bowl since Polamalu retired

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14 minutes ago, Yenrub said:

I think Shazier is the only defensive player to make the Pro Bowl since Polamalu retired

You may be right although Cam Heyward probably deserved it this year too.

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1 hour ago, Bad_Mo said:

I think Tomlin is an average coach, at best.  I also think its time for him to go if Pitt wants to be relevant again.

Just curious how you define relevancy?  

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26 minutes ago, Godsbrother said:

According to Dulac, Haley definitely will not be back and supposedly Tomlin will not make any changes in the defensive coaching staff

Heyward came out and said the game plan was good, just not executed. I'm willing to give them another year to turn things around with a defensive-heavy draft, but if they suck again next year, a change needs to happen.

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29 minutes ago, Godsbrother said:

Just curious how you define relevancy?  

They're not the Patriots so they're not relevant.  HTH.

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2 hours ago, Sitch said:

Granted the D has not been like previous Steeler defenses but the point remains - as much talent all over the field (not just the fantasy positions) that they've had and currently have, his 3-5 playoff record since 2010 is pretty bad especially when you consider he's lost games to Tebow and Bortles.  Yes the Pats have been a constant but to not even be able to get past them once is inexcusable to me.  

Bill Belichick playoff record, 2005-2010: 5-5 with losses to Sanchez, Jake Plummer, Flacco and Eli, plus an epic second-half collapse vs. Peyton and a year where the Pats missed the playoffs. Even the best coaches will go through a bad playoff stretch. The fact that he's kept them competitive throughout his tenure is far more significant. If you make the playoffs consistently (and get home playoff games), it will generally pay off in the long run. And Tomlin will still be coaching the Steelers long after Brady and Belichick retire.

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3 hours ago, Dr. Octopus said:

We are all fantasy football players so we look at the Steelers as loaded - but their defense hasn't been all that great in those 7 years we are talking about here.

And holding any team to that standard ("not even getting to the SB since 2010") seems a little tough. Only 3 AFC  franchises have made it to the Super Bowl in those six years (and that is not likely to change in 2017) and the Patriot and Broncos teams that took up five of the six available berths during that time frame weren't exactly pushovers.

But he's supposed to be a defensive guy and it's been poor for a while. Does he totally get a pass? They've had some olb problems but there's a decent amount of talent. They just don't seem to get the job done, especially when it matters.

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2 hours ago, Bad_Mo said:

I think Tomlin is an average coach, at best.  I also think its time for him to go if Pitt wants to be relevant again.

Pittsburgh isn't relevant? This is a tough crowd.

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29 minutes ago, voiceofunreason said:

But he's supposed to be a defensive guy and it's been poor for a while. Does he totally get a pass? They've had some olb problems but there's a decent amount of talent. They just don't seem to get the job done, especially when it matters.

He was a defensive backs coach before becoming HC of the Steelers so I wouldn't say we could call him some defensive guru. I'm not saying he's a great HC, but I do think people are going a little overboard here. I mean MOST teams have not made the Super Bowl since 2010.

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2 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

He was a defensive backs coach before becoming HC of the Steelers so I wouldn't say we could call him some defensive guru. I'm not saying he's a great HC, but I do think people are going a little overboard here. I mean MOST teams have not made the Super Bowl since 2010.

He’s kind of the Alex Smith of coaches. Unfortunately by the time he’s gone the Steelers window will be closed.

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32 minutes ago, zftcg said:

Question for everyone: If you had to do a coaching draft tomorrow, which current NFL coaches would you take ahead of Tomlin?

In before "Cowher"

Tomlin isn't my favorite X's and O's guy, but he handles a ton of volcanic personalities as well as any coach in the NFL could.  I think he's a perfect fit for the Steelers.

I prefer Belichick and Sean Payton (I'm a Saints homer though)

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2 hours ago, zftcg said:

Question for everyone: If you had to do a coaching draft tomorrow, which current NFL coaches would you take ahead of Tomlin?

 

In some order:

BB

McVay

Harbaugh

McDermott(would have been ideal Steeler hire)

Zimmer

 

 

 

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8 hours ago, Bad_Mo said:

I think Tomlin is an average coach, at best.  I also think its time for him to go if Pitt wants to be relevant again.

Average head coach, as in somewhere around 16th best of anyone who could be an NFL coach? Possibly.

4 hours ago, zftcg said:

Question for everyone: If you had to do a coaching draft tomorrow, which current NFL coaches would you take ahead of Tomlin?

 

2 hours ago, menobrown said:

 

In some order:

BB

McVay

Harbaugh

McDermott(would have been ideal Steeler hire)

Zimmer

Pederson

I might add Marrone; and Kyle Shanahan based on potential. 

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53 minutes ago, -OZ- said:

Average head coach, as in somewhere around 16th best of anyone who could be an NFL coach? Possibly.

 

Pederson

I might add Marrone; and Kyle Shanahan based on potential. 

Quinn

Pete carroll

Rivera

Jon gruden

Coaches at his level

Mccarthy

Payton

Reid

 

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1 minute ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Quinn

Pete carroll

Rivera

Jon gruden

Coaches at his level

Mccarthy

Payton

Reid

 

Thought about Carroll and Quinn. 

Disagree on the others.

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7 hours ago, Dr. Octopus said:

He was a defensive backs coach before becoming HC of the Steelers so I wouldn't say we could call him some defensive guru. I'm not saying he's a great HC, but I do think people are going a little overboard here. I mean MOST teams have not made the Super Bowl since 2010.

He was actually DC before coming to the Steelers

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1 minute ago, belljr said:

I think Tomlin is a great Monday to Saturday coach.

He needs to work on his Sundays

This is what everyone in detroit says about jim caldwell

Edited by bicycle_seat_sniffer

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3 hours ago, menobrown said:

 

In some order:

BB

McVay

Harbaugh

McDermott(would have been ideal Steeler hire)

Zimmer

 

 

 

:lmao: Guy almost missed the playoffs benching his QB and trading away his best WR and DL options. Then the same DLineman ate them alive in the playoffs. 

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32 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Quinn

Pete carroll

Rivera

Jon gruden

Coaches at his level

Mccarthy

Payton

Reid

 

:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao: I question whether some of you even watch football.

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3 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

This is what everyone in detroit says about jim caldwell

And everyone in DC says about Gruden. Except without the Monday to Saturday part. 

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2 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Mccarthy beat him h2h in a superbowl where he was am underdog.....shrug. i said same level. Not sure whats laughable 

This guy is easily amused

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59 minutes ago, belljr said:

I think Tomlin is a great Monday to Saturday coach.

He needs to work on his Sundays

Funny, I think it is more of the opposite.  His teams too often (often against bad teams or against teams they think they are inferiors) come into games looking not ready or unprepared to play, and to me, that is all on coaching.  It is the coach's job to get prepare a team and get them ready to play, and when they come out looking as listless and bored as they did last Sunday for example, that means the coaching staff did a poor job in that regard.  Same thing happened in the games this season against Indy, GB, Chicago, etc. 

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15 hours ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Jacksonvilles secondary is light years better than pitt....ramsey...boyue had allowed one pass td all sesson. ...pitt secondary is weak spot of the defense

Is the secondary really the weak spot or is it coaching, I prefer the latter and we will never no who's right unless Butler is gonna get fired.  Which he should be.

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5 hours ago, Doctor Detroit said:

So they kept Tomlin and fired Haley?

Are they the Lions now?

When I look at some of the playcalls and the „chemistry“ between Haley and Ben it is not unreasonable to fire a guy that, on top of it, gets into fist fights at a local bar. :ph34r:

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6 hours ago, Doctor Detroit said:

So they kept Tomlin and fired Haley?

Are they the Lions now?

Yep exactly the same.  The Lions routinely get rid of head coaches that have taken them to Super Bowls, never had losing seasons and average >10 wins per seasons.

 

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11 hours ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Quinn

So the problem people have with Tomlin is that he makes poor in-game decisions and can't beat the Patriots ... and a better alternative is DAN QUINN?

:lmao:

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Just now, zftcg said:

So the problem people have with Tomlin is that he makes poor in-game decisions and can't beat the Patriots ... and a better alternative is DAN QUINN?

:lmao:

Hes done very well his first three season imo. Superbowl collapse aside. Hes done more with less.

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8 minutes ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Hes done very well his first three season imo. Superbowl collapse aside. Hes done more with less.

Sure. I think Quinn is a good coach. My point is for all of Tomlin's flaws, I don't see many other coaches who are clearly superior, and in fact many of the good ones have the exact same flaws.

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Tough Crowd - tomlin is currently second only to Bill Belicheck in Win%

And the last 4  or 5 years?    Second to only Belicheck in playoff wins.  :shrug:

 

 

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8 minutes ago, belljr said:

Tough Crowd - tomlin is currently second only to Bill Belicheck in Win%

And the last 4  or 5 years?    Second to only Belicheck in playoff wins.  :shrug:

Bill Barnwell has been having a hilarious series of exchanges on Twitter with people who keep throwing out misinformed opinions on Tomlin ("He's bad in the playoffs!" "He has a terrible record against sub-.500 teams!") and then Barnwell quotes the actual stats.

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21 minutes ago, belljr said:

Tough Crowd - tomlin is currently second only to Bill Belicheck in Win%

And the last 4  or 5 years?    Second to only Belicheck in playoff wins.  :shrug:

 

 

The flip side is in those last four years he's only won three games in the playoffs(two of which were in one year), only once made it out of the divisional round, had one 1st round bye(which was the loss to JAX) and been to 0 SB's.

Marty Schottenheimer comes to mind

Edited by dutch

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If you extend out to seven years, cuz we're cherry picking, Tomlin's Steelers are 3-5 in the playoffs, one first round bye, one AFC Championship games, 0 SB's

Edited by dutch

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16 minutes ago, dutch said:

If you extend out to seven years, cuz we're cherry picking, Tomlin's Steelers are 3-5 in the playoffs, one first round bye, one AFC Championship games, 0 SB's

What other team besides the patriots have "9" if you include the BYE i guess, have played that many playoff games in the last 7 years?

Serious question - I don't know the answer

Edited by belljr

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2 minutes ago, belljr said:

What other team besides the patriots have "9" if you include the BYE i guess, have played that many playoff games in the last 7 years?

I dont know what 9 is

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43 minutes ago, belljr said:

Tough Crowd - tomlin is currently second only to Bill Belicheck in Win%

And the last 4  or 5 years?    Second to only Belicheck in playoff wins.  :shrug:

 

 

I am starting to come around to the Fire Tomlin crowd.   All we need to do is hire Bill Belichick.

Now all we need is a way to fix the Pirates.

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2017 0-1(1st rd bye)

2016 2-1

2015 1-1

2014 0-1

2013 0-0

2012 0-0

2011 0-1

5 of 7 years= 0 playoff wins

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