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****OFFICIAL DYNASTY TRADES**** (20 Viewers)

Hankmoody said:
Back to some completed trades:

Team A gets Adam Thielen

Team B gets 2.09, 2019 1st (random)
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Seems equitable on the surface and one thing I ask myself on equitable type trades is would I trade Thielen for this on my teams or would I pay this for Thielen on my existing teams?

In this case it's easier for me to ask myself if I'd pay this for Thielen since I don't actually own him anywhere and the answer would be no on all or almost all teams, might consider it on one team.

Hankmoody said:
Team A got Sammy Watkins, 3.12

Team B got Alex Collins, 2.01
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Sammy will improve next year but I'd like him a ton more if I thought he would leave as I think he is destined for a DJAX role in LA and he is capable of more. I'd still take him on this deal.

Matt's Eagles said:
12 Team PPR

Team A got A Robinson, E Sanders

Team B got D Thomas, A Jeffrey, C Clement
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I'll take  the two WR's who don't look like they are running with ankle weights.

TheBottomLine said:
10-team PPR league with IDP

Gave Brandin Cooks + 2.08

Got Amari Cooper
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I don't play IDP so possible I underrate the pick but if that was something like pick 12 in standard PPR league I'd still easily take the Cooper side.

 
Hankmoody said:
I took you at the words you wrote.  You want me to start assuming you mean something other than what you wrote?  Yeah that's going to get good results on the Internet.  But sure, I'll do that.  I'll start by assuming you meant I would brag about something worth bragging about rather than the format of my leagues - my salary perhaps?  It's quite generous after all.

And again, the leagues I am in are quite serious.  Not sure why or with what authority you find id necessary to dismiss taxi-style leagues, they are quite popular.  You could have made your point just as well without being condescending about it.
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Maybe you boys could move your unrination contest to PMs?

 
JPeso said:
DT and Jeffery both likely match AR in short-term scoring in my book, I’ll take the free starter.

Mediocre year for AR and then where is his value? Expecting DeDe and Cole to have roles much bigger than any competition AR had in his last big year.

A move to add a free starter like this allows me to be more aggressive in trading points to buy a rookie/2nd year guy elsewhere. 

Not/never been super high on Robinson. Jeffery is the best player in the deal for me. 
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I agree with a lot of what you're saying about Robinson and I've never been that high on him, but the bolded doesn't make sense to me.  What happens if AR has a mediocre year?  I dunno, but I do know that Jeffery just had a worse than mediocre year and somehow his value went up in the eyes of a lot of people.

The Jeffery love is just so bizarre.  His season was worse than ARob's "bad" year that knocked ARob down from a top 10 dynasty player to a 2nd/3rd round startup pick.  It was worse than Dez's "bad" year that knocked him down from a 3rd round startup pick to a 6th/7th rounder (and Dez is only 1 year older than Alshon, btw).  But when Jeffery has the same season, despite much better QB play, his value goes....UP?

It's been 27 games since Alshon had 100 yards receiving, and about half of those came alongside top 5 QB play.  How much better can the situation really get for him?  Top 5 offense with a top 5 QB and he's a fantasy WR3.  He's just not getting the targets there and I don't see them peppering with them any time soon given his 47% catch rate last year despite playing with an elite QB.  Even if things trended up a little bit towards the end of the year for him they still weren't that good and it was with a different QB and no Ertz in the lineup, both things that likely won't be the case next year.  Wentz spreads it around a lot more.

This feels like one of those classic cases where a guy makes a few spectacular plays in the playoffs and everyone vastly overrates his fantasy impact.

57-789-9 on 120 targets in a top 5 offense last year.  But people are treating him like he just went 80-1400-14.  You know, what ARob did the last time he had QB play half as competent as what Jeffery was playing with in his WR25 ppg season.

 
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Hankmoody said:
Hi kettle.  We moved on 24 hours ago, nice of you to bring it back up.
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I know what your kettle comment is meant to imply, but I have no idea why you are making it.Don't bother explaining, because I don't care to read it.

 My comment was directed at both parties in the exchange.

Sorry, I don't live on these boards. I just saw your exchange earlier today. Nice to see you don't limit being a richard to just certain people on these boards. It is just you being you. 

 
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I like cooper a lot better than cooks but I understand liking cooks more and loving getting the pick for free.

For the people who prefer cooks - do you think he can made a leap to another level? In the last 3 years - years 2, 3 and 4 of his career - he's averaged 76 receptions, 1131 yards and 8 touchdowns - but he's been within 60 yards and a touchdown of those numbers every year. Those are very good numbers but they're low end wr1 numbers - they've been 11th, 8th and 7th in non ppr, and a touch lower in ppr.

And he's somehow consistently inconsistent, with 5, 5 and 6 games under 45 yards in those seasons. 

He's done this as the number one receiving option for brees and Brady, so it's unlikely his qb play will improve. 

Do the people who like him better than Cooper see cooks ascending to another level at some point?  Or do you just like what you've been getting from him, which is certainly good in and of itself? 

 
bostonfred said:
I like cooper a lot better than cooks but I understand liking cooks more and loving getting the pick for free.

For the people who prefer cooks - do you think he can made a leap to another level? In the last 3 years - years 2, 3 and 4 of his career - he's averaged 76 receptions, 1131 yards and 8 touchdowns - but he's been within 60 yards and a touchdown of those numbers every year. Those are very good numbers but they're low end wr1 numbers - they've been 11th, 8th and 7th in non ppr, and a touch lower in ppr.

And he's somehow consistently inconsistent, with 5, 5 and 6 games under 45 yards in those seasons. 

He's done this as the number one receiving option for brees and Brady, so it's unlikely his qb play will improve. 

Do the people who like him better than Cooper see cooks ascending to another level at some point?  Or do you just like what you've been getting from him, which is certainly good in and of itself? 
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It's a bit of a catch-22, because for as good as they are they are also well known for spreading the ball around at this stage in their careers.  His targets those three years were a very modest 129, 117, and 114.

For me, while I like Cooper quite a bit and expect him to bounce back this year, what really draws me to Cooks is just the eye test, which I realize is subjective.  He snatches the ball out of the air like I love to see.  I really believe he could flourish as a high target true WR1 if given the opportunity.  His efficiency numbers have always been good.  Solid catch rate given that he's near the top of the league in air yards per target.  Elite YPT.  Some of this is certainly aided by the QBs he's been playing with but there's a lot of room for it to come down and still be near the top of the league.

I can certainly undertand people liking Cooper especially since he looks in line to get his chance with true WR1 level targets this year whereas for Cooks we don't really have any visibility on when/if that will happen.

 
I'm sure I will get blasted for this one, but...

10-team Best Ball PPR with IDP

Gave: Gronk

Got: OJ Howard

Really not liking the vibes from Gronk this offseason and even if he comes back, is it for what, one year?  Who knows for sure.  Had already been turned down for other tight ends like Ertz, Henry, Engram.  

 
TheBottomLine said:
I'm sure I will get blasted for this one, but...

10-team Best Ball PPR with IDP

Gave: Gronk

Got: OJ Howard

Really not liking the vibes from Gronk this offseason and even if he comes back, is it for what, one year?  Who knows for sure.  Had already been turned down for other tight ends like Ertz, Henry, Engram.  
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I wouldn't blast you - I get the mindset - I just think you probably could have done a little better. It could work out fine though.

 
TheBottomLine said:
I'm sure I will get blasted for this one, but...

10-team Best Ball PPR with IDP

Gave: Gronk

Got: OJ Howard

Really not liking the vibes from Gronk this offseason and even if he comes back, is it for what, one year?  Who knows for sure.  Had already been turned down for other tight ends like Ertz, Henry, Engram.  
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Rehabs value with a good season, and immediately tanks it with retirement talk. As a gronk owner i suppose this is what you’re hoping for at this point. I may wait until in season and see what kicks up then.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
I wouldn't blast you - I get the mindset - I just think you probably could have done a little better. It could work out fine though.
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Yeah, I shopped for a while and not many were interested, everyone hesitant to trade for him at this point in my league.  Howard the only thing I felt decent about giving him up for, as much as I wasn't crazy about it.  

 
Snorkelson said:
Rehabs value with a good season, and immediately tanks it with retirement talk. As a gronk owner i suppose this is what you’re hoping for at this point. I may wait until in season and see what kicks up then.
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Yeah I just didn't want to risk getting nothing if he were to come out and retire before the season.  Do I think he will?  No, I don't, but I don't see it out of the realm of possibilities.  Or even if he comes back and gets hurt or even he has a good year and retires after next year, just really don't trust him at this point.  

 
Concept Coop said:
12 Tm PPR - 4pt Passing - Q-RR-WWW-T-F-D 

A Gets: 1.04, S. Ware, S. Bradford

B Gets: M.Williams (LAC), P. Mahomes, 2.04
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1.04 easily.  Mike Williams was my 8th rated guy last year and he did nothing to change that outlook so if I need a RB, I'd happily pay that to get into the top4.  

 
Concept Coop said:
12 Tm PPR - 4pt Passing - Q-RR-WWW-T-F-D 

A Gets: 1.04, S. Ware, S. Bradford

B Gets: M.Williams (LAC), P. Mahomes, 2.04
Click to expand...
Looking at scoring, starting line-up requirements, and players involved here - I see this as WR Williams + QB Mahomes + 2.04 for the 1.04 since the other two "players" would not even make my 20 player roster, no less compete for back-up slot on my bench. So, I believe that Owner A "appears" to have overpaid a smidge to get control of the 2018 1.04 slot - but if he didn't own a top 5 pick, and might be having roster cut decisions coming up and didn't need nor didn't like Williams and/or Mahomes .  .  .  . then he really believes this was the trade for him to get whomever he is targeting as the 4th rookie in this year's class. Of course, he might have other irons in the fire that he'll use the 1.04 as leverage. It would be interesting to be able to follow what transpires with the (2 teams involved) as the calendar goes forward in 2018. Some owners prefer to take their chances with the 1.04 pick rather than the other assets involved - but at this stage of things, who knows which rookie goes where come the NFL Draft in late April. In any case, GL to both owners. :thumbup:

 
ILUVBEER99 said:
1.04 by a lot.

I have Mike Williams and there is no way anyone would give me a 1st for him. Maybe a mid 2nd.  

So basically this is Mahomes and a mid 2nd for 1.04.  give me 1.04 all day over that.
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I thought for sure it was a superflex league when I saw the deal. In that case it would have been fair. Makes no sense in a standard league. 

 
Zyphros said:
1.04 easily.  Mike Williams was my 8th rated guy last year and he did nothing to change that outlook so if I need a RB, I'd happily pay that to get into the top4.  
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ILUVBEER99 said:
1.04 by a lot.

I have Mike Williams and there is no way anyone would give me a 1st for him. Maybe a mid 2nd.  

So basically this is Mahomes and a mid 2nd for 1.04.  give me 1.04 all day over that.
Click to expand...


FreeBaGeL said:
I thought for sure it was a superflex league when I saw the deal. In that case it would have been fair. Makes no sense in a standard league. 
Click to expand...


Team B here.  I expected some push back, as I'm higher on Mike than most.  

Mike's market value is around 1.10; I value him around 1.08ish.  Mahomes is going ahead of Dak in DLF startups (not that I'd take him there).  The class is deep and if the 2.04 isn't a back like Freeman, Walton, or Kelly, it will be a quality WR prospect.  Bradford and Ware might survive cuts, but have no real value.  

The meat of my roster:
Q - Mahomes
R - Gurley, Kamara, Lewis
W - Hopkins, Evans, Jones, Williams, Cole
T - Ertz, Clay
D - Jax

 
Concept Coop said:
Team B here.  I expected some push back, as I'm higher on Mike than most.  

Mike's market value is around 1.10; I value him around 1.08ish.  Mahomes is going ahead of Dak in DLF startups (not that I'd take him there).  The class is deep and if the 2.04 isn't a back like Freeman, Walton, or Kelly, it will be a quality WR prospect.  Bradford and Ware might survive cuts, but have no real value.  

The meat of my roster:
Q - Mahomes
R - Gurley, Kamara, Lewis
W - Hopkins, Evans, Jones, Williams, Cole
T - Ertz, Clay
D - Jax
Click to expand...
I'd have taken the 1.4 side but agree with your rationale and why I thought it was pretty close. How close? If clearing roster space was not an issue I'm not sure if I'd rather take what you gave for 1.5 and for sure would rather have the players you obtained over 1.6.

 
Concept Coop said:
Team B here.  I expected some push back, as I'm higher on Mike than most.  

Mike's market value is around 1.10; I value him around 1.08ish.  Mahomes is going ahead of Dak in DLF startups (not that I'd take him there).  The class is deep and if the 2.04 isn't a back like Freeman, Walton, or Kelly, it will be a quality WR prospect.  Bradford and Ware might survive cuts, but have no real value.  

The meat of my roster:
Q - Mahomes
R - Gurley, Kamara, Lewis
W - Hopkins, Evans, Jones, Williams, Cole
T - Ertz, Clay
D - Jax
Click to expand...
This is the type of situation that I can understand trading out of 1.04.  I still don't like the value you got but with strong RB's like that I can understand.  We need to be in a league together though because the guys you seem to really like I pretty much hate.  Mahomes is not a guy I'd count on for QB1 numbers.  Hell I'd easily start Bradford over him without even knowing his new team.  

 
menobrown said:
I turned down an offer of 1.10 for him a few days ago and in another league I offered 2.2 and Keelan Cole and got rejected.
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He went around 1.6 - 1.10 in last years rookie draft and had an awful rookie season.  No production and his back injury flared up again.  I'm just not seeing how he's maintained his value.  I'd keep him over a 2nd but if anyone offered me a 1st he'd be gone.  Maybe i'm undervaluing him but i'm finding it hard to understand the logic that he didn't lose much value.  His rookie season was epically bad.

 
ILUVBEER99 said:
He went around 1.6 - 1.10 in last years rookie draft and had an awful rookie season.  No production and his back injury flared up again.  I'm just not seeing how he's maintained his value.  I'd keep him over a 2nd but if anyone offered me a 1st he'd be gone.  Maybe i'm undervaluing him but i'm finding it hard to understand the logic that he didn't lose much value.  His rookie season was epically bad.
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I don't see an epic bad season when I look at him, I just see a guy who was hurt all last year including early in OTA's and never really had a chance.

Missing chunk of 2 of last 3 years is a concern from an injury angle but I don't recall the back being a previous issue until last off seasons surgery?

He did not maintain value for me. He lost at least a little as I'd put his value as a late one. Was 6th for me in a stronger draft last year so he did lose some value.

Way I see NFL draft right now is a lot of WR's but hard to identify the few I feel really confident about. Way I see most dynasty drafts is RB's deemed as elite talents and/or in attractive landing spots dominating chunk of most early to mid round one of drafts. I'd guess right now at pick 10 I'm either looking at taking the 3rd-4th WR off the board or 6th-8th RB, somewhere in that range. Right now I don't have 3 WR's in this class ranked over Mike Williams so for me putting his value as a late round one seems about right.

 
The league I am talking about is 1.25 ppr for tight ends and a small devy league. Last year at this time I offered Gronk for 1.01 and 1.02 and was laughed at, Mixon and McCaffery were the only guys not already on a roster. This year I put him on the block and the best offer I got was 1.12. 

 
gianmarco said:
FFPC:

Team A receives D. Freeman

Team B receives T. Hill
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I don’t mind sharing some context here, as I’m a fan of both players at current value. There aren’t many big deals like this going down in $2500 league, especially across position.

Poor lineup decisions cost us this year’s title, so we didn’t need sweeping changes, and with the depth at RB of 12-14 PPG, of guys who also don’t have the greatest market value, I knew it unlikely to strike a deal giving another RB for a WR who would prove a better option than who is on the roster currently.

I’ve been beating the table on Drake for a while now, and clearly this move puts pressure on him as the go-to back for the roster. Gulp.

Roster for context:

QB: Dak, Bortles

RB: Drake, Hyde, Duke, Dion, Crowell

WR: Cooks, Hill, Jeffery, MBryant, DBryant

TE: Kelce, Gronk (1.5 PPR)

 
JPeso said:
I don’t mind sharing some context here, as I’m a fan of both players at current value. There aren’t many big deals like this going down in $2500 league, especially across position.

Poor lineup decisions cost us this year’s title, so we didn’t need sweeping changes, and with the depth at RB of 12-14 PPG, of guys who also don’t have the greatest market value, I knew it unlikely to strike a deal giving another RB for a WR who would prove a better option than who is on the roster currently.

I’ve been beating the table on Drake for a while now, and clearly this move puts pressure on him as the go-to back for the roster. Gulp.

Roster for context:

QB: Dak, Bortles

RB: Drake, Hyde, Duke, Dion, Crowell

WR: Cooks, Hill, Jeffery, MBryant, DBryant

TE: Kelce, Gronk (1.5 PPR)
Click to expand...
I prefer Hill. Freeman’s concussion risks scare me a bit. Wouldn’t want to rely on Drake as RB1, but you have plenty of useful backs and Gronk locks up your Flex1 every week.

 
Concept Coop said:
I'm higher on Mike than most.  
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What are your expectations for him in the next 2-3 years? I didn't really like him as a prospect so I kind of wrote him off when he had an injury and Keenan looked 100% back to form. But if there's reason for excitement for him, which there must be for you to give up 1.04 (not that Mahommes is a throw in, but he's also not the least bit proven), then I'm all ears. I'm sure he's going cheaper in some leagues.

 
FF Ninja said:
need moar roster
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Sort of limited by the FFPC standard Dynasty set-up. However, they are rolling out a Best Ball dynasty format with a 22-player in-season roster, and will allow two blind bidding sessions per week during the season, in addition to traditional trading and rookie drafts of 10 rounds (after cutting down to a 16-player roster in March), and obviously after the NFL Draft is in the books. It will be total points after 16-weeks, with no playoffs, nor any H2H. They are projecting to conduct maiden 26-round start-up drafts (in this new format in both slow and live drafting formats) in the summer time frame at different pricing levels. I'm sure getting to the FFPC home page is familiar to almost everyone who posts here, so definitely check out this new variation for dynasty.

 
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ILUVBEER99 said:
He went around 1.6 - 1.10 in last years rookie draft and had an awful rookie season.  No production and his back injury flared up again.  I'm just not seeing how he's maintained his value.  I'd keep him over a 2nd but if anyone offered me a 1st he'd be gone.  Maybe i'm undervaluing him but i'm finding it hard to understand the logic that he didn't lose much value.  His rookie season was epically bad.
Click to expand...


FF Ninja said:
What are your expectations for him in the next 2-3 years? I didn't really like him as a prospect so I kind of wrote him off when he had an injury and Keenan looked 100% back to form. But if there's reason for excitement for him, which there must be for you to give up 1.04 (not that Mahommes is a throw in, but he's also not the least bit proven), then I'm all ears. I'm sure he's going cheaper in some leagues.
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Especially at the WR spot, where you can watch a full game and only see 2 full routes, I rely heavily draft spot and professional opinions.  Mike was largely valued as a mid 1st round talent last year. The gap between he and Davis was exaggerated in fantasy circles - and I never fully bought that.  I preferred Davis, but Williams was pretty close.  Translating that into fantasy - he's got a prototypical collection of traits - I liked him more than I like any WR in this class today.

I certainly agree with ILB99 (MeToo99BTW) that his stock should take a sizable hit.  In this class he's 1.04 for me, prior to that hit.  I think 1.08-1.10 is a fair re-pricing.  That's really quite a drop.  His season was sabotaged, as he missed all of camp and didn't suit up until October - and T. Williams was playing well (RFA).  I'm not giving him a mulligan, but I'm certainly not writing him off.  I'm buying the dip.

I'm not worried about his situation.  LAC is an offense that can support a productive #2, especially if Mike is the top RZ target they drafted him to be.  

And I didn't give the 1.04 for him.  Mahomes carries late first round value, right or wrong, and the 2.04 is a valuable asset this year.

I think there is plenty of reason to value the other side more, so I don't mean to sound defensive - I get it.  Just sharing my rationale.

 
JPeso said:
I don’t mind sharing some context here, as I’m a fan of both players at current value. There aren’t many big deals like this going down in $2500 league, especially across position.

Poor lineup decisions cost us this year’s title, so we didn’t need sweeping changes, and with the depth at RB of 12-14 PPG, of guys who also don’t have the greatest market value, I knew it unlikely to strike a deal giving another RB for a WR who would prove a better option than who is on the roster currently.

I’ve been beating the table on Drake for a while now, and clearly this move puts pressure on him as the go-to back for the roster. Gulp.

Roster for context:

QB: Dak, Bortles

RB: Drake, Hyde, Duke, Dion, Crowell

WR: Cooks, Hill, Jeffery, MBryant, DBryant

TE: Kelce, Gronk (1.5 PPR)
Click to expand...
I put a little more value on Hill, in general I think you gave up a rock solid high end RB2 with some concussion issues for a solid WR1 with top 5 potential who is a few years younger.

FA and draft is going to be huge in your RB room! Plenty of solid talent but every one of them should get impacted a little to earth shattering depending on how things go.

 
Zyphros said:
This is the type of situation that I can understand trading out of 1.04.  I still don't like the value you got but with strong RB's like that I can understand.  We need to be in a league together though because the guys you seem to really like I pretty much hate.  Mahomes is not a guy I'd count on for QB1 numbers.  Hell I'd easily start Bradford over him without even knowing his new team.  
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Bradford's value is 0.  I'll certainly be trying to turn Mahomes into Dak, Newton or Luck, but Mahomes is a sexy name right now and has a lot of market value.  I think it's inflated a bit, but the upside is obvious.  If I can't flip Mahomes, I'll add a cheap vet like Ben.  I was never going to start Sam.

 
Concept Coop said:
I'm not worried about his situation.  LAC is an offense that can support a productive #2, especially if Mike is the top RZ target they drafted him to be. 

And I didn't give the 1.04 for him.  Mahomes carries late first round value, right or wrong, and the 2.04 is a valuable asset this year.
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Ok, I didn't realize people valued Mahomes that much, but I'm still curious what your expectations are for WM in the next 2-3 years.

I'm not saying you need 100 targets to be productive, but I just couldn't remember Rivers ever having a notable WR2 so I glanced and he has never had a WR2 with 100 targets. Doesn't mean a whole lot since he had Gates in his prime and we're talking about several different OCs, but just figured it was worth mentioning.

Personally, I will be shocked if MW ever cracks the top 24 ppg for WR while Keenan is healthy. Partially bc I expect Rivers to utilize his WR1, TE, and RB too much for the WR2 to get the necessary targets, but also partially due to my bias from not liking him as a prospect. You must expect much better than that, so I'm curious what that is.

 
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FF Ninja said:
Personally, I will be shocked if MW ever cracks the top 24 ppg for WR while Keenan is healthy. Partially bc I expect Rivers to utilize his WR1, TE, and RB too much for the WR2 to get the necessary targets, but also partially due to my bias from not liking him as a prospect. You must expect much better than that, so I'm curious what that is.
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I don't really bother with redraft-like projections.  The Chargers toss it enough to support 2+ guys, as long as Williams proves worthy of it.  I'm gambling that he will.  Mike will be 26 when Allen's contract is up, worst case.  

 
Concept Coop said:
I don't really bother with redraft-like projections.  The Chargers toss it enough to support 2+ guys, as long as Williams proves worthy of it.  I'm gambling that he will.  Mike will be 26 when Allen's contract is up, worst case.  
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I wasn't really looking for redraft projections. Just wondering what kind of performance you're expecting (WR2, WR3, flex?). Keenan has 2 years left on his contract. If he's healthy, not sure I can fathom anything beyond WR3 ppg numbers for MW. 

 
FF Ninja said:
I wasn't really looking for redraft projections. Just wondering what kind of performance you're expecting (WR2, WR3, flex?). Keenan has 2 years left on his contract. If he's healthy, not sure I can fathom anything beyond WR3 ppg numbers for MW. 
Click to expand...
WR3-WR4, short term.  Alshon Jeffrey long term.  

 
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