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JohnnyU

O. J Howard TE Alabama

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3 hours ago, Ilov80s said:

He’s back 

Massive role change for O.J. Howard in his first game back from hamstring injury:

* Season-high 84-of-85 snaps

* Ran a route on 85% of Jameis Winston’s 55 dropbacks

* Season-high 7 targets

* Target inside 10

https://twitter.com/notjdaigle/status/1193901315023409153?s=21

Would be interested to know what Brate's stats were...

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1 hour ago, kyoun1e said:

Would be interested to know what Brate's stats were...

Week 9 Brate was 11% snap share and no targets. This week isn’t updated yet but I’m guessing it’s pretty low.

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O.J. Howard was benched after he dropped his only target in Tampa Bay's Week 11 loss to the Saints.

Not only did he bobble his only (perfectly thrown) target, Howard's attempt to corral it behind his back inevitably popped the ball in the air and resulted in Jameis Winston's first of four interceptions on the day. Cameron Brate (10/73) played every down from that moment forward as Howard didn't see a single look to finish the game. Sunday was arguably the last chance for the 24-year-old to stay out of coach Bruce Arians' doghouse. He can be dropped (if he hadn't been already) in 10/12-team leagues.

Nov 17, 2019, 7:03 PM ET

 

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Just now, rick6668 said:

Dropping for sure, but not sure for who, started him with Hopper out.   A Zero hurts.

I started Jack Doyle with Hooper out and got the same score. TE is an aidsfest right now.

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1 hour ago, Brandon Will said:

Hopefully he gets traded next year

if they want to get something in return, it would be wise not to publicly humiliate him.

there may be some cancer here.

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14 hours ago, DocHolliday said:

Hope you are trying to be funny

i was, but i am still correct.

any team that trades for him will use him as a franchise tight end.

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4 minutes ago, grateful zed said:

i was, but i am still correct.

any team that trades for him will use him as a franchise tight end.

Agreed. I'd buy in dynasty, especially if people think he's totally worthless at this point. 

What would it take to get him from a frustrated dynasty owner? 

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1 minute ago, kittenmittens said:

What would it take to get him from a frustrated dynasty owner? 

as a high first rounder 2 years ago, who has been underutilized and injured, im hoping for a high 2nd.

a wise owner would wait and see how this plays out in the off season.

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2 hours ago, grateful zed said:

any team that trades for him will use him as a franchise tight end.

What team do you see trading for him, especially given he will probably require decent draft capital? And does that team excite you more than pass happy TB?

I ask because we almost never see high profile TEs traded. I think Graham to Seattle is the last one I can recall.

It seems like the league has a good number of quality TEs. There arent many teams who either don't have a good TE, or havent invested a decent pick in one. 

Heres a short list of teams that wouldnt torpedo his value further than it is now

New England - obligatory suggestion however they are noticeably hurting at TE

New Orleans- I dont think they would trade for a 1 year rental and I'm not sure they can afford a big contract. But this would make the most sense to me

Dallas- They certainly can't afford a top contract and their offense is evolved to not depend on their TEs as much. I don't see this happening

That's it, from my perspective at least. 

IMO Tampa keeps him. He's relatively cheap and I dont seen a team giving up a premium for him. Especially when they can get Ebron for free this offseason. 

 

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9 minutes ago, Dr. Dan said:

What team do you see trading for him, especially given he will probably require decent draft capital? And does that team excite you more than pass happy TB?

I ask because we almost never see high profile TEs traded. I think Graham to Seattle is the last one I can recall.

It seems like the league has a good number of quality TEs. There arent many teams who either don't have a good TE, or havent invested a decent pick in one. 

Heres a short list of teams that wouldnt torpedo his value further than it is now

New England - obligatory suggestion however they are noticeably hurting at TE

New Orleans- I dont think they would trade for a 1 year rental and I'm not sure they can afford a big contract. But this would make the most sense to me

Dallas- They certainly can't afford a top contract and their offense is evolved to not depend on their TEs as much. I don't see this happening

That's it, from my perspective at least. 

IMO Tampa keeps him. He's relatively cheap and I dont seen a team giving up a premium for him. Especially when they can get Ebron for free this offseason. 

 

Greg Olsen was moved when the oc wouldn’t use him. I could see him traded for a third. Really no use keeping him if they don’t want to use him.

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16 minutes ago, Dr. Dan said:

What team do you see trading for him, especially given he will probably require decent draft capital? And does that team excite you more than pass happy TB?

I ask because we almost never see high profile TEs traded. I think Graham to Seattle is the last one I can recall.

It seems like the league has a good number of quality TEs. There arent many teams who either don't have a good TE, or havent invested a decent pick in one. 

Heres a short list of teams that wouldnt torpedo his value further than it is now

New England - obligatory suggestion however they are noticeably hurting at TE

New Orleans- I dont think they would trade for a 1 year rental and I'm not sure they can afford a big contract. But this would make the most sense to me

Dallas- They certainly can't afford a top contract and their offense is evolved to not depend on their TEs as much. I don't see this happening

That's it, from my perspective at least. 

IMO Tampa keeps him. He's relatively cheap and I dont seen a team giving up a premium for him. Especially when they can get Ebron for free this offseason. 

 

TB is pass happy but mostly to their WRs. As an owner in Dynasty I’d be happy with any of the following destinations;

NE, NO, Dallas, Seattle, Houston, Jacksonville, NY Jets

 

Others that might excite me if their QB/coaching situations improve;

Chicago, Pittsburgh, Washington

 

Now not all of these teams have the ammunition to get a trade done but those are the ones that would improve his value considering how underutilized he is in TB. 

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17 minutes ago, Dr. Dan said:

Heres a short list of teams that wouldnt torpedo his value further than it is now

I haven't had a chance to take a look at the snap counts, but Rotoworld implied that he was benched after the interception. Hence Brate's heavy usage yesterday. IMO, he needs a fresh start with a coaching staff that believes in him, is willing to be patient through his mistakes/ endure through the growing pains, and so on.

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These arent bad team suggestions, and Olsen is a good example of a guy whose career turned around, but I'm not sure I see a similar turn around. The time to sell high has passed IMO, however at this point you may as well hold and hope hes traded, then flip him at that point while the hype is high. 

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O.J. Howard caught 5-of-6 targets for 61 yards in the Bucs' Week 13 win over the Jaguars.

The five grabs marked a new season-best for Howard in what has been a horrific season for him. The 61 yards were his second-most of the year. This game had zero fantasy goodness despite the Bucs hanging 28 points on the board. Howard will be a borderline TE1/2 next week at home against the Colts.

Dec 1, 2019, 5:05 PM ET

 

 

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O.J. Howard caught 4-of-5 targets for 73 yards in the Buccaneers’ Week 14 win over the Colts.

Howard continues to flash in a major way whenever Jameis Winston decides to throw the ball his way. Few TEs in the league provide Howard’s combination of field-stretching ability and after-the-catch goodness, but he continued to lose plenty of work to Cameron Brate. The good news is that Howard could finally see something resembling a consistent pass-game role with Mike Evans (hamstring) potentially out ahead of an appealing Week 15 matchup against the Lions. Of course, we know better by now than to expect consistency from either Howard or Brate. Both are boom-or-bust TE2s.

 

Edited by The Frankman

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1 hour ago, GoBirds said:

Anyone think he finally steps up with Evans out or more wasted hope?

I'm sure as heck not chancing it in the fantasy playoffs unless I were really desperate.  

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Is anyone trusting Howard in week 16? There should be a big yardage pie and he’s been getting more targets recently, but I could just as easily see him getting ignored for Brate, Perriman, the RBs, a street FA at WR, Arians’s nephew who’s in town for the holidays....

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I'm rolling him out there, very limited options. I dropped the ball big time at TE this year but somehow find myself in a title game in-spite of it. LFG!

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My opponent in the championship game had Higbee in until today.  Now Howard.  Not sure how I feel about that since I'm the one that drafted and dropped him.  Pretty sure he'll go off.

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5 hours ago, arctic_panzer_wolf said:

My opponent in the championship game had Higbee in until today.  Now Howard.  Not sure how I feel about that since I'm the one that drafted and dropped him.  Pretty sure he'll go off.

With Evans and Godwin out it's likely he'll see more than the minimal targets he's had in previous weeks.

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On 12/19/2019 at 8:20 AM, oddsbodkins said:

Might pick him up to play over Henry. Gotta wait for Green to be ruled out first though...

I dropped Henry like a bad habit for him. I mean their floors are similar if you look at past several weeks and this week he could see targets

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On 12/19/2019 at 8:02 AM, DAG said:

Is anyone trusting Howard in week 16? There should be a big yardage pie and he’s been getting more targets recently, but I could just as easily see him getting ignored for Brate, Perriman, the RBs, a street FA at WR, Arians’s nephew who’s in town for the holidays....

No. He's been an afterthought in this offense all season. I would rather have one of the WR they signed off the practice squad. 

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(FantasyPros) Buccaneers TE O.J. Howard wasn't targeted in Sunday's Week 17 loss to Atlanta. Analysis: It was the fourth timed this season in which Howard drew fewer than two targets and the second time with zero Jameis Winston looks. While he could be under contract with the Buccaneers until 2020 if you include the club option, it wouldn't surprise me if Howard was traded ahead of or during the NFL draft, especially if Tampa Bay retains Winston. They just don't seem to click.

 

 

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13 hours ago, az_prof said:

I am praying they trade him to a team that will use him.  Not convinced he is a bust at all.

Patriots were interested before, but Tom is so damn old.

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13 hours ago, az_prof said:

I am praying they trade him to a team that will use him.  Not convinced he is a bust at all.

Arians had some really harsh words for him Sunday. I get the impression he’s not doing the work they expect. 

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On 12/31/2019 at 9:23 AM, Capella said:

Arians had some really harsh words for him Sunday. I get the impression he’s not doing the work they expect. 

I do think Howard has struggled and played below his potential this year, but Arians’s postmortem on the season seems to be focused on throwing various players under the bus. 

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1 hour ago, DAG said:

I do think Howard has struggled and played below his potential this year, but Arians’s postmortem on the season seems to be focused on throwing various players under the bus. 

Well he’s not really wrong. 

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, Capella said:

Well he’s not really wrong. 

I agree. But there might be different ways to handle it. Just seems like a pattern w Arians. 

Edited by DAG

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On 11/18/2019 at 2:06 PM, Dr. Dan said:

What team do you see trading for him, especially given he will probably require decent draft capital? And does that team excite you more than pass happy TB?

I ask because we almost never see high profile TEs traded. I think Graham to Seattle is the last one I can recall.

It seems like the league has a good number of quality TEs. There arent many teams who either don't have a good TE, or havent invested a decent pick in one. 

Heres a short list of teams that wouldnt torpedo his value further than it is now

New England - obligatory suggestion however they are noticeably hurting at TE

New Orleans- I dont think they would trade for a 1 year rental and I'm not sure they can afford a big contract. But this would make the most sense to me

Dallas- They certainly can't afford a top contract and their offense is evolved to not depend on their TEs as much. I don't see this happening

That's it, from my perspective at least. 

IMO Tampa keeps him. He's relatively cheap and I dont seen a team giving up a premium for him. Especially when they can get Ebron for free this offseason. 

 

you're the guy who thought he was greater than sliced bread, the new thing, right?

LOLs

sooo, NOW do you see that Howard is Vernon Davis v2.0 like I said back in august but you criticized me for it??! he's overrated TE who never-will-be.  he will never be another Gronk, if that's what you're implying. Johnny Mitchell was supposed to be a juggernaut, too. and Winslow 2nd. never happened. If you want Gronk 2.0 in NE, Pats need to trade for Goedert.he's the best TE in the NFL not named Kittle or Kelce. and the least known. but he's not fragile like Ertz.He's a stud. Ertz is yesterday's newspaper

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
55 minutes ago, Tanner9919 said:

you're the guy who thought he was greater than sliced bread, the new thing, right?

LOLs

sooo, NOW do you see that Howard is Vernon Davis v2.0 like I said back in august but you criticized me for it??! he's overrated TE who never-will-be.  he will never be another Gronk, if that's what you're implying. Johnny Mitchell was supposed to be a juggernaut, too. and Winslow 2nd. never happened. If you want Gronk 2.0 in NE, Pats need to trade for Goedert.he's the best TE in the NFL not named Kittle or Kelce. and the least known. but he's not fragile like Ertz.He's a stud. Ertz is yesterday's newspaper

 

 

 

No...

In fact, my first post in this entire thread is the exact post you quoted

In fact, I remember someone asking in a different thread (Godwin thread I imagine as I spent way more time there in August) how Evans, Godwin, Howard would all have amazing seasons, as it wouldn't be statistically possible, and I said I didnt think Howard would. 

In fact, I believe I recall posting somewhere(probably Godwin thread) the historical analysis of Ariens' lack of use of the TE

In fact, I believe I even said he was a sell high back in August

I've never really been a fan of Howard's, or an owner of his. I always thought this TE situation was murky and one to avoid.

What a weird accusation. You've got an axe to grind with someone it seems, but it certainly isn't me 

Edited by Dr. Dan

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Buccaneers GM Jason Licht said the team is "more than excited" about what O.J. Howard can do in his second year in Bruce Arians’ offense.

For what it's worth, Licht added that the team "always listens to offers" but is planning to have Howard in their offense at this time. A top-five option at his position in most circles heading into his first year under the tutelage of Arians' high-flying O, Howard fell flat for 34/459/1 receiving in 14 underwhelming appearances last season. Given Licht's comments, the 25-year-old specimen will likely return as nothing more than a bet-on-talent flier for 2020 fantasy drafts.

SOURCE: Greg Auman on Twitter

Feb 25, 2020, 12:14 PM ET

 

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If you think Tom Brady is running the show invest in OJ.  If it's still Arians avoid like the ... eh ... Just avoid.

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26 minutes ago, Grahamburn said:

If you think Tom Brady is running the show invest in OJ.  If it's still Arians avoid like the ... eh ... Just avoid.

I'm wondering where the balance between these possibilities is going to be. I can't imagine Brady going to TB without some level of reassurance from the team that he'd have input, but I'm also not assuming that Arians will just overhaul his system. I remain a big believer in Howard's talent. He played like crap last season, but the hype heading into the year was tied to elite efficiency numbers. I have him in 2 dynasty leagues (both TE premium) and I view him as a likely hold, though it might be worth putting him otb if we get a lot of offseason fluff pieces like this (and I think we will).  

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O.J. was clearly the 4th or even 5th option on the majority of passing plays.  As an athlete that situation can cause indifference.  I think he just checked out.  In Koetter's offense the year before he was a featured player and he performed like it. 

In Arians' offense the TE is typically a chess piece to help with max protection so the WR's routes can develop down the field.  He would basically stay in to block or chip and then turn around 5 yards downfield.  It's an absolute and utter waste of his athleticism and talent. 

I have to think Brady will speak up about utilizing him more efficiently, but I've been wrong before...  I also thought Arians was smart enough to alter his offense to make O.J. a featured player.  He wasn't. 

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7 hours ago, Grahamburn said:

O.J. was clearly the 4th or even 5th option on the majority of passing plays.  As an athlete that situation can cause indifference.  I think he just checked out.  In Koetter's offense the year before he was a featured player and he performed like it. 

In Arians' offense the TE is typically a chess piece to help with max protection so the WR's routes can develop down the field.  He would basically stay in to block or chip and then turn around 5 yards downfield.  It's an absolute and utter waste of his athleticism and talent. 

I have to think Brady will speak up about utilizing him more efficiently, but I've been wrong before...  I also thought Arians was smart enough to alter his offense to make O.J. a featured player.  He wasn't. 

Jameis threw downfield. Evans and Godwin, justifiably, were the top targets. Brady was a checkdown artist last year. Could he continue? Maybe. If so then Howard might be the beneficiary.

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49 minutes ago, saintfool said:

Jameis threw downfield. Evans and Godwin, justifiably, were the top targets. Brady was a checkdown artist last year. Could he continue? Maybe. If so then Howard might be the beneficiary.

Howard was fantastic with Jameis in Koetter's offense in 2018, which was also a vertical attack.  It was just an attack that featured the TE.  Arians' offense doesn't.

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This is a definite upgrade for OJ. I can't imagine Brady not altering the offense and he will help make OJ into a great TE. People underestimate how important system and QB is to receivers. Yes, the HC is the same but you don't go out and get Brady without intending to use him in a way that suits his style. They will alter the offense to suit Brady's strengths.

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