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Bernie Sanders HQ! *A decent human being. (2 Viewers)

Pains me to say it, but I think Bernie needs to pull the plug on this thing and get everyone he can behind Biden now. We all knew we couldn't afford to let Trump and the Republicans run the show, we coasted by for a bit, but now we're all paying for it. Getting these people away from positions of power is job one now. Consolidating support behind Biden and the downticket races is necessary as soon as possible.
There's still 2000 delegates to go and 3M votes in Cali yet to be counted... he's not out of this yet.  Trends don't look great, but he's not out of it

 
Nate Cohn has an astute observation of one of the key factors limiting Sanders' chances:

Nate Cohn@Nate_Cohn

He did not need to become the establishment favorite. He did need to try and at least make them feel somewhat comfortable. And personal relationships matter: if Sanders had spent 4 years shmoozing Clyburn after SC, are you certain he would have endorsed Biden in a tight race?


I've seen plenty of Berners upset at Warren for not endorsing Sanders, and I get it. But it's really a pretty damning indictment of his candidacy that he can't even build a coalition with people who agree with them on most of the issues.

Like most politics, elections are about building coalitions.  Bernie was never all that interested in expanding his base.  Maybe he saw futility in trying to court Clyburn over the last 4 years, or that he was rebuffed by other DNC leaders - but ultimately that is what he needed to do.  Everyone got mad when Clinton said: "Nobody likes Sanders" - but maybe there is more truth there than he and his supporters want to acknowledge.

 
Sinn Fein said:
Nate Cohn has an astute observation of one of the key factors limiting Sanders' chances:

Nate Cohn@Nate_Cohn

He did not need to become the establishment favorite. He did need to try and at least make them feel somewhat comfortable. And personal relationships matter: if Sanders had spent 4 years shmoozing Clyburn after SC, are you certain he would have endorsed Biden in a tight race?


I've seen plenty of Berners upset at Warren for not endorsing Sanders, and I get it. But it's really a pretty damning indictment of his candidacy that he can't even build a coalition with people who agree with them on most of the issues.

Like most politics, elections are about building coalitions.  Bernie was never all that interested in expanding his base.  Maybe he saw futility in trying to court Clyburn over the last 4 years, or that he was rebuffed by other DNC leaders - but ultimately that is what he needed to do.  Everyone got mad when Clinton said: "Nobody likes Sanders" - but maybe there is more truth there than he and his supporters want to acknowledge.
Good stuff hard to believe Bernie supporters will support Biden.

 
Bernie has scheduled a 1:00 PM presser in Burlington.

My assumption is he will talk about what he sees as his path forward, and how important it is to get this election right.  He did not speak last night, so this will be the chance for him to outline his plan for his supporters.

 
Just as an aside - and I am not predicting this - if Bernie dropped out, the DNC would obviously cancel the debate on Sunday, but the only thing I can picture is Gabbard jumping up and down with her hand raised, saying:  "Hey, I am still here!  I am not leaving the race!  I can fill in for Bernie on the debate stage!"

 
Good stuff hard to believe Bernie supporters will support Biden.
There's a MASSIVE age gap discrepancy between Biden voters and Bernie voters, and huge policy differences. I know people like Tim will come out and say his old "but they'll come out to vote against Trump." No. They won't.

Millennials couldn't get out to vote for Bernie. They certainly aren't getting out for Biden. Millennials already have nothing. They're not coming out for a guy that promises "nothing would fundamentally change."

 
Bernie has scheduled a 1:00 PM presser in Burlington.

My assumption is he will talk about what he sees as his path forward, and how important it is to get this election right.  He did not speak last night, so this will be the chance for him to outline his plan for his supporters.
As long as it's not him announcing he is dropping out.  I was excited for the debate Sunday.  

 
Just as an aside - and I am not predicting this - if Bernie dropped out, the DNC would obviously cancel the debate on Sunday, but the only thing I can picture is Gabbard jumping up and down with her hand raised, saying:  "Hey, I am still here!  I am not leaving the race!  I can fill in for Bernie on the debate stage!"
Sounds like they're trying to cancel the debate regardless of what Bernie does 

 
Yamiche Alcindor
@Yamiche

What will Senator @BernieSanders say in his 1 p.m. speech today after @JoeBiden
 extended his lead, won black voters overwhelmingly and won big in largely white suburbs?

A source close to the senator tells me: "In summary: He looks forward to the next debate and we fight on."

 
There's a MASSIVE age gap discrepancy between Biden voters and Bernie voters, and huge policy differences. I know people like Tim will come out and say his old "but they'll come out to vote against Trump." No. They won't.

Millennials couldn't get out to vote for Bernie. They certainly aren't getting out for Biden. Millennials already have nothing. They're not coming out for a guy that promises "nothing would fundamentally change."
Really agree with you on the last paragraph. Whether it was Hillary preaching that a vote for her was a 3rd term of Obama, or Biden trying to bring us back from Trump the message doesn't resonate with young voters. Why? Because what you are trying to go back to a system that  doesn't work for them. 

 
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Sinn Fein said:
Nate Cohn has an astute observation of one of the key factors limiting Sanders' chances:

Nate Cohn@Nate_Cohn

He did not need to become the establishment favorite. He did need to try and at least make them feel somewhat comfortable. And personal relationships matter: if Sanders had spent 4 years shmoozing Clyburn after SC, are you certain he would have endorsed Biden in a tight race?


I've seen plenty of Berners upset at Warren for not endorsing Sanders, and I get it. But it's really a pretty damning indictment of his candidacy that he can't even build a coalition with people who agree with them on most of the issues.

Like most politics, elections are about building coalitions.  Bernie was never all that interested in expanding his base.  Maybe he saw futility in trying to court Clyburn over the last 4 years, or that he was rebuffed by other DNC leaders - but ultimately that is what he needed to do.  Everyone got mad when Clinton said: "Nobody likes Sanders" - but maybe there is more truth there than he and his supporters want to acknowledge.
He always seemed to me to be the type that would rather lose clinging to ideological purity than win by adjusting.

 
There's a MASSIVE age gap discrepancy between Biden voters and Bernie voters, and huge policy differences. I know people like Tim will come out and say his old "but they'll come out to vote against Trump." No. They won't.

Millennials couldn't get out to vote for Bernie. They certainly aren't getting out for Biden. Millennials already have nothing. They're not coming out for a guy that promises "nothing would fundamentally change."
If they don't vote who cares about their fundamental changes then? 4 more years of Republicans judges and their movement is dead. Vote Biden work to change from the inside.

 
Clearly Bernie isn’t all that concerned with 4 more years of Trump. 
 

Thanks, Bernie!
Yeah, no thanks.  Rather Sanders go down swinging than hand it over to a deadender sellout like Biden.  This is Sanders’ last run, millions of people stand to be harmed by a Biden/Trump presidency, he needs to go scorched earth.  

 
Fair enough to get in one more debate to try and turn things around, and see what he can do with Florida, Ohio, Illinois, and Arizona next Tuesday. Recent poll out here showed Bernie losing the AZ Latino vote badly, and that’s a demographic they include among their best when they talk about electability. If he loses all of these states as expected, and loses the Latino vote here, not sure what else he can do. But you can’t really blame him for sticking around. It’s not a delegate blowout in reality yet, only in polls and punditry.

 
I think he can have a clearly better debate performance - and still lose the primaries.
The Democrat base is about 25% African American. If Bernie can’t get any more than 15-25% of that vote vs Biden it is clear we don’t want Sanders as the candidate to try to defeat Trump. While it is obvious Sanders would get well over 50% of the Black vote vs Trump the Democrats need a candidate that can enthusiastically capture over 80% of the Black vote. That is far more significant that Sanders ability to garner the support of youth that he currently can’t even get to come out to vote in the primaries in any significant number

 
Yeah, no thanks.  Rather Sanders go down swinging than hand it over to a deadender sellout like Biden.  This is Sanders’ last run, millions of people stand to be harmed by a Biden/Trump presidency, he needs to go scorched earth.  
Yes, because that would be extremely helpful to enacting liberal policies over the next 4 years. 

 
Yeah, no thanks.  Rather Sanders go down swinging than hand it over to a deadender sellout like Biden.  This is Sanders’ last run, millions of people stand to be harmed by a Biden/Trump presidency, he needs to go scorched earth.  
I am happy Bernie is staying in the race, but I disagree that he should go with the scorched Earth approach. That could potentially hurt future candidates that have similar ideas as him. 

Bernie needs to walk the line of pushing Biden, but gracefully bowing out if he wants to continue to push the Democratic party to the left. 

We need to remember that Bernie could be one major leak or gaffe away from being the nominee and Biden is far from a perfect candidate. 

 
Yeah, no thanks.  Rather Sanders go down swinging than hand it over to a deadender sellout like Biden.  This is Sanders’ last run, millions of people stand to be harmed by a Biden/Trump presidency, he needs to go scorched earth.  


This assumes Biden has the slightest interest enacting any of Bernie's policies
On an ideological scale where Trump is zero and Sanders is 100, where would you guys place Biden?  

In my view I'd say something like 85.  But it sounds like you guys think he's somewhere below a 50.

 
Biden might not be an aggressive champion of Bernie's overall platform, but I can see him signing some things that get passed (assuming Mitch is gone). Trump and the GOP are actively trying to dismantle anything decent that's already in place. They're in court right now trying to get rid of pre-existing coverage protection, for just one of many examples.

 
The Democrat base is about 25% African American. If Bernie can’t get any more than 15-25% of that vote vs Biden it is clear we don’t want Sanders as the candidate to try to defeat Trump. While it is obvious Sanders would get well over 50% of the Black vote vs Trump the Democrats need a candidate that can enthusiastically capture over 80% of the Black vote. That is far more significant that Sanders ability to garner the support of youth that he currently can’t even get to come out to vote in the primaries in any significant number
I voted for Sanders super tuesday. Thing is the movement he is promising didn't show up.  Who did show up is black and suburban women voters. I'm supporting who the people are voting for, not the one people were busy to show up to vote for.

 
On an ideological scale where Trump is zero and Sanders is 100, where would you guys place Biden?  

In my view I'd say something like 85.  But it sounds like you guys think he's somewhere below a 50.
I would go far below 50.  (To be fair I don't think Trump is a zero either... he'll probably run left of Biden on some things as he did with Hillary... he'll probably also be lying)

The way I see it, Biden and Bernie are polar opposites on almost everything.

  • Bernie wants Medicare for All, Biden has repeatedly said he opposed it (even said as Pres he might consider vetoing it if it ever made it through)
  • Bernie wants to protect social security, Biden has historically tried to either cut it or offer it up as a bargaining chip.
  • Biden actively pushed for the Iraq war, even when it was clear there were no WMDs... Bernie opposes it. (this is my #1 issue and is a dealbreaker for me)
  • Bernie is against fracking and the oil companies, Biden has surrounded himself with oil money in his PACs
  • Bernie is against trade deals, Biden supported them
  • Bernie is against the Patriot act, Biden literally wrote it
  • Bernie supports legalizing marijuana and throwing out prior convictions, Biden wrote the crime bill that put many of them there
  • Bernie wants to get rid of student loan debt, Biden played a big role in preventing student loans from being discharged in the bankruptcy bill
This is not to say Biden is zero either. I think he does have a few good things he agrees with Bernie on like doing something about guns (Bernie's weakness), wants to get back into the Paris climate deal (though I have read that it is FAR too toothless, but it's a start), and will probably protect social rights like gay marriage, abortion etc (despite a history of voting against them) but that all said, I'm not certain he'll do anything more with these issues than give them lip service.

One additional concern I have (and I've heard @ren hoekmention this as well) is that Biden will be completely unchecked by democrat voters whenever he tacks right. I'm NOT a fan of Trump, but every single thing he does is blasted 24/7 by the media and a lot of it receives pushback. Just like with Bill Clinton and Obama, there will be virtually no resistance to any right wing policy that he supports and I find that terrifying.  Side note - there's a book called Listen Liberal by Thomas Frank that outlines this much better than I could.

 
The way I see it, Biden and Bernie are polar opposites on almost everything.

  • Bernie wants Medicare for All, Biden has repeatedly said he opposed it (even said as Pres he might consider vetoing it if it ever made it through)
  • Bernie wants to protect social security, Biden has historically tried to either cut it or offer it up as a bargaining chip.
  • Biden actively pushed for the Iraq war, even when it was clear there were no WMDs... Bernie opposes it. (this is my #1 issue and is a dealbreaker for me)
  • Bernie is against fracking and the oil companies, Biden has surrounded himself with oil money in his PACs
  • Bernie is against trade deals, Biden supported them
  • Bernie is against the Patriot act, Biden literally wrote it
  • Bernie supports legalizing marijuana and throwing out prior convictions, Biden wrote the crime bill that put many of them there
  • Bernie wants to get rid of student loan debt, Biden played a big role in preventing student loans from being discharged in the bankruptcy bill
Thanks for the response, I guess I just don't see most of these as "opposites," I see them as both wanting to move in the same direction but with Bernie being more aggressive.  

For example, yes, Bernie supports Medicare for All and Biden doesn't, and I agree with Bernie.  But Biden does seem to want to expand health care to more people, whereas Trump seems to want to repeal Obamacare without any plan to replace it. I think that's true of a lot of the subjects you raise. Bernie is better, but at least Biden wants to move us in the right direction, while Trump wants to move us in the wrong direction.

 
Thanks for the response, I guess I just don't see most of these as "opposites," I see them as both wanting to move in the same direction but with Bernie being more aggressive.  

For example, yes, Bernie supports Medicare for All and Biden doesn't, and I agree with Bernie.  But Biden does seem to want to expand health care to more people, whereas Trump seems to want to repeal Obamacare without any plan to replace it. I think that's true of a lot of the subjects you raise. Bernie is better, but at least Biden wants to move us in the right direction, while Trump wants to move us in the wrong direction.
I think that's a fair take on healthcare... Biden probably does want to improve it in a different way, though my gut feeling is that the healthcare lobby will prevent it (I could be wrong... I hope I am!)

The other stuff I disagree, but hopefully he surprises me. I know he has said things that indicate he might change on some of these issues, but most of it has been since he started running so I'm assuming it's just tacking Left for the sake of the primary. Again I hope I'm wrong! 

 
Thanks for the response, I guess I just don't see most of these as "opposites," I see them as both wanting to move in the same direction but with Bernie being more aggressive.  

For example, yes, Bernie supports Medicare for All and Biden doesn't, and I agree with Bernie.  But Biden does seem to want to expand health care to more people, whereas Trump seems to want to repeal Obamacare without any plan to replace it. I think that's true of a lot of the subjects you raise. Bernie is better, but at least Biden wants to move us in the right direction, while Trump wants to move us in the wrong direction.
KL’s post above is the perfect distillation of the post I was trying to make.  Biden has been so dead wrong on so many issues, so obviously bought by lobbyists of every stripe, that I don’t find a meaningful ideological difference between him and Trump.  Even if I did, I could never in a million years support him.    I view relaxed gun laws as a positive in Trump’s favor fwiw.  

Just for one example, I don’t think Trump believes in the drug war to the same extent Biden does.  Watch him talk about banning raves (link)- the smile that runs across his face when he talks about crushing the promoters and demolishing the buildings.  He is a fullbore police state authoritarian.  

The difference between Sanders & Biden is that Sanders’ positions appear to be formed by a strong ideological belief system, while Biden’s are formed by whoever is giving him the most money.  His SuperPAC is being run by corporate lobbyists for healthcare industry, finance, weapons manufacturers, etc.  Completely unacceptable.  

 
Bernie Sanders will suspend his campaign after Joe Biden won 3 primary states Tuesday, a source tells Axios

Followed by:

Sam Stein

@samstein

·

52s

Bernie aide to me just now throws cold water on report he is dropping out: "Nothing has changed since Faiz’s statement this morning"

 
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Feisty Sanders - I like it:

Eric Bradner @ericbradner · 12m

Bernie Sanders when @mkraju asked his timeframe for a decision:

"I'm dealing with a ####### global crisis." "Right now I'm trying to do my best to make sure that we don't have an economic meltdown and that people don't die. Is that enough for you to keep me busy for today?"

I think Bernie needs to drop out.  I also think reporters don't need to ask him about it - he knows whats going on, and will make a decision in due course.

 
Feisty Sanders - I like it:

Eric Bradner @ericbradner · 12m

Bernie Sanders when @mkraju asked his timeframe for a decision:

"I'm dealing with a ####### global crisis." "Right now I'm trying to do my best to make sure that we don't have an economic meltdown and that people don't die. Is that enough for you to keep me busy for today?"

I think Bernie needs to drop out.  I also think reporters don't need to ask him about it - he knows whats going on, and will make a decision in due course.
What is Bernies involvement in the global crisis? Voting in the Senate?

 
What is Bernies involvement in the global crisis? Voting in the Senate?
Well, I am sure he is offering his input into the language of the bills/amendments.

Either way - just a really odd time for a reporter to be pestering about the campaign.  There will be a better time to ask those questions.

 
Well, I am sure he is offering his input into the language of the bills/amendments.

Either way - just a really odd time for a reporter to be pestering about the campaign.  There will be a better time to ask those questions.
IMHO his response, the tone in particular, is problematic. Would it be so hard to say (actually repeat): "We are in the process of reevaluating our way forward, but at the moment the focus is on the global crisis of Covid-19, mitigating it's effects, for the benefits of the American people"

Instead he comes across as an angry old man who has issues controlling his temper - not exactly ideal leadership material

 
IMHO his response, the tone in particular, is problematic. Would it be so hard to say (actually repeat): "We are in the process of reevaluating our way forward, but at the moment the focus is on the global crisis of Covid-19, mitigating it's effects, for the benefits of the American people"

Instead he comes across as an angry old man who has issues controlling his temper - not exactly ideal leadership material
Meh - he is an angry old man.

He has no shot at the presidency.  But, I, for one, liked his response.

 
It is time for Sanders to bow out.

I am wondering if Biden hasn't given him that olive branch yet and that is why he isn't or if he just doesn't know when to bow out and will fight to the end. 

 

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