timschochet
Footballguy
Oof
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Bernie Sanders HQ! *A decent human being. (8 Viewers)
- Thread starter BigSteelThrill
- Start date
Road Warriors
Footballguy
Truth, honesty and integrity. The 3 pillars of the Clinton campaign.
"Hillary Clinton campaign strategist Joel Benenson made an eyebrow-raising claim Friday on CNN, accusing Sen. Bernie Sanders (I., Vt.) of running the most negative Democratic primary campaign in history."
http://freebeacon.com/politics/clinton-strategist-claims-bernie-sanders-running-most-negative-democratic-campaign-ever/
AnonymousBob
Footballguy
To be fair, nobody could have seen this kind of attack/accusation coming from Mrs. Clinton. It's out of character going off her previous behavior.
timschochet
Footballguy
Well now when you stop and think about it he's got a point, after all I can think of a few examples such as, um
I got nothing.
I got nothing.
Anyone hear M. Moore on wtf?
Roger and Me was screened at camp David for George H. Dead silence except for George W. snorting/yucking it up.
Great story. Moore apparently friends with Barbara Bush's nephew who helped with Roger and Me. Moore had no idea he was the nephew until he saw him on stage during inauguration.
Whether u like moore or not it was a great listen.
Roger and Me was screened at camp David for George H. Dead silence except for George W. snorting/yucking it up.
Great story. Moore apparently friends with Barbara Bush's nephew who helped with Roger and Me. Moore had no idea he was the nephew until he saw him on stage during inauguration.
Whether u like moore or not it was a great listen.
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BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
A: Because they can. That's why.You think companies are rushing overseas because our tax rates are too low?You think that is the issue/answer with what he linked?
bakes
I am the Beer God!
Been saying this for years - flat tax on profits with the only credits being for jobs created in the US and a penalty for jobs outsourced. End every single targeted loophole.
The Commish
Footballguy
I've never suggested the President doesn't have impact in any fashion. I was specifically talking about the credit going specifically to an individual (such as the President). Truth is, even in the example above, it wasn't just him alone as is suggested in those sorts of posts I took issues with above. I don't disagree with anything you said in either of these posts. He does have influence. So do the rest of the politicians involved in those processes and activities.
renesauz
IBL Representative
I feel similarly...I'd take a closer look at some of the other Republican candidates, but probably end up not voting at all. BUT....would definitely vote HRC if it were against Trump. Would do a right in for timschochet before Trump.
renesauz
IBL Representative
slight edit..... CREATING 200K+/yr executive jobs and/or minimum wage type jobs shouldn't count
Which is a reality that you guys keep ignoring when you come up with "solutions" that make it less appealing to do business here.A: Because they can. That's why.You think companies are rushing overseas because our tax rates are too low?You think that is the issue/answer with what he linked?
It's really odd to me that so many on the left seem to be against simplifying the tax code. It seems to be the best way to limit the ability to pick winners and losers, thus getting most of the big money out of politics. I thought that was one of your biggest issues?
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fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
I don't think most liberals oppose simplifying the tax code in theory, it's just that all the Republican proposals to simplify it tend to be less progressive than our current tax code. We need more tax brackets, not fewer.
Adding more tax brackets does the opposite of simplifying the tax code- perhaps not "in theory", but in reality you certainly seem to be against it.
fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
The tax code is not complicated due to the different marginal tax rates. That's pretty much the easiest part of doing taxes.
PIK95
Footballguy
We don't trust the people in charge to do it right. Every time the big business lobby gets involved things go to helz. A perfect example was Obama Care. If it had the government option like it was supposed to we would be much better off. Single payer is pretty much the same thing I believe. Hopefully we get that going.Which is a reality that you guys keep ignoring when you come up with "solutions" that make it less appealing to do business here.It's really odd to me that so many on the left seem to be against simplifying the tax code. It seems to be the best way to limit the ability to pick winners and losers, thus getting most of the big money out of politics. I thought that was one of your biggest issues?A: Because they can. That's why.You think companies are rushing overseas because our tax rates are too low?You think that is the issue/answer with what he linked?
You're in favor of adding more tax brackets and making things more progressive, which inevitably will come with more loopholes, deductions, exemptions, etc. It would certainly make things more complicated, not less, and would lead to more big money trying to buy influence because they would have more to gain by doing so.
Don't you see why that is? Minimize the ability to pick winners and losers and you minimize the lobbying.We don't trust the people in charge to do it right. Every time the big business lobby gets involved things go to helz. A perfect example was Obama Care. If it had the government option like it was supposed to we would be much better off. Single payer is pretty much the same thing I believe. Hopefully we get that going.Which is a reality that you guys keep ignoring when you come up with "solutions" that make it less appealing to do business here.It's really odd to me that so many on the left seem to be against simplifying the tax code. It seems to be the best way to limit the ability to pick winners and losers, thus getting most of the big money out of politics. I thought that was one of your biggest issues?A: Because they can. That's why.You think companies are rushing overseas because our tax rates are too low?You think that is the issue/answer with what he linked?
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
Deductions, exemptions, etc. don't necessarily follow from having more tax brackets. You can theoretically have 20 different brackets that apply to all income, with no deductions or credits.
tommyboy
Footballguy
my tax return is about 80 pages. I pay someone 4 digits to prepare it. Its way past the point I could do it myself.
yeah, lets just simplifiy it. I have no problem paying my fair share of taxes, but theres no good reason to have businesses jump through millions of lines of tax code just to arrive at some number. And to make matters even more stupid, i pay federal, state, city, metro, business and transportation taxes from my business. I could get out of 3 of those taxes if I just move my office 2 miles.
Of course, but who is proposing that? You could also make the tax code more progressive with fewer brackets instead of more. There are a lot of things you could do in theory, but I'm talking about how things generally work in our current system- we just keep adding layers on top of layers of complexity.
HellToupee
Footballguy
Shula-holic
Footballguy
It's still laughable to me that the left thinks adding tax brackets is going to significantly impact "the 1%". Changing the tax brackets only affects earned income, not capital gains. Most of "the 1%" derives its income from capital gains. The debate that they want to have isn't really one that addresses the problem they bring up.
The Commish
Footballguy
Tend to agree here....the problem with "more tax brackets" are they usually are "in name only" by the time all the loopholes are established. Our tax code is a goat rodeo of epic proportions and needs a huge overhaul to match the sort of economy we have now. It has significantly evolved over the decades, but the code hasn't.
squistion
Footballguy
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Uh I think they can slide over Carson's detail to Sanders now...
To be fair, Bernie wants to go way beyond pretty much everyone else, including taxing capital gains as earned income. It'll never happen, but that's his plan.
I agree in general though- it's pretty pointless to focus on small changes in marginal tax rates, especially when you leave, or increase, the ridiculous amount of loopholes.
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Anthony Borbely
Footballguy
Saw my first Bernie bumper sticker here in metro Detroit:
Bernie Sanders
Not For Sale
Definitely an eye catcher.
Bernie Sanders
Not For Sale
Definitely an eye catcher.
Anthony Borbely
Footballguy
This is bothersome to someone like me, the rare (in here) truly undecided left of center voter. The same can be said about people that attack Bernie by using the "socialist" label. It takes the focus away from the issues.
ETA: By bothersome, I don't mean your post. I mean the message you conveyed by posting that.
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Uruk-Hai
Footballguy
Mario Kart
Footballguy
O'Malley is the best Democrat. I hope O'Malley can get to New Hampshire. He's the better bet.
Uruk-Hai
Footballguy
As a born-and-raised Marylander, I think I can speak for all of us for the Free State: no ####### way.
That's the real kicker, and I think it's often ignored when people talk about tax rates being low. Federal is only one part of the equation- when you add in state, local, city, payroll, property, sales, sin, gas, etc, etc, etc, it paints a much different picture. Plus all of the increases in "fees and surcharges" in many places, thinking it's more palatable/easier to sell than higher tax rates.tommyboy said:
Anthony Borbely
Footballguy
Her question of why would anyone vote for Bernie and the fact that she has not paid attention to the election thus far raises some interesting observations. First, Bernie is still an unknown to many voters so they have no idea of where he stands on the issues...much like how it was when he first decided to run. As people learn about Bernie, many have decided to support him.FWIW:My woman is an Obama voter. Not sure she voted for him during the re-election. She is an immigrant and a professional with a college degree. Absolutely loved Bill Clinton.
She has been totally checked out on this election. She watched a couple of the GOP debates with me but that is it. She works crazy hours and literally has paid next to zero attention this cycle.
She came home late last night and I had on the TV. She was sitting at the table eating some late dinner and she said..."God he is so old. He can't even comb his own hair. Why would anyone vote for this guy?"
The larger question raises my biggest concern regarding Bernie: how many people that will actually vote will know a lot about the actual issues...especially undecided voters. It seems the more people learn about Bernie the more they like. But how many actual voters will be educated voters?
Anthony Borbely
Footballguy
This is a major challenge for Bernie. He has been labeled as a Socialist and he is self-described as a Democratic Socialist. They are not one and the same and Bernie has to make sure people understand the difference. Bernie is not anti-capitalism. To me that is arguably the most important message for Bernie to convey to the public.
The_Man
Footballguy
Excitement for Hillary is palpable: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/01/31/bernie-sanderss-latest-eye-popping-crowd-in-iowa/
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
Uruk-Hai
Footballguy
What do you think he's gonna do after losing this? Will he run for Congress?
eta: I know! He can do Eastern Motors ads
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Higgs
Footballguy
So per the recent Iowa poll there are 13% of likely voters who are supporting O'Malley or or not committed. This 13% will decide the Caucus. The Democrat process in Iowa is that any group receiving less than 15% of the first caucus vote has to throw their support to any group receiving more than 15%, and in this case that will only be Hillary or Bernie. So where that vote goes will determine the winner.
In the Iowa poll Bernie has a 2 point lead in the second choice vote, so it look to be almost dead even going in. I'm predicting Bernie winning Iowa in an upset.
In the Iowa poll Bernie has a 2 point lead in the second choice vote, so it look to be almost dead even going in. I'm predicting Bernie winning Iowa in an upset.
John Bender
Footballguy
Any Bernie dudes got a real ground prediction for Iowa tomorrow?
Looks razor close, so I'm just curious really.
If he get's close and win's New Hampshire do we think the snowball starts rolling down hill from there?
Looks razor close, so I'm just curious really.
If he get's close and win's New Hampshire do we think the snowball starts rolling down hill from there?
Anthony Borbely
Footballguy
I am a left of center undecided voter. I am not a big Hillary fan but I am closer to her on the issues overall. If I had to vote right now I would vote for Bernie but I am pretty much 50-50 right now. Regardless of who wins, I will definitely vote for a Democrat this year because, with me being left of center, a Republican president (with a Republican house and senate) would be a disaster...even worse would be Trump winning.
If anyone aligns with Bernie on the issues, a Republican President and Republican house and senate would not only not pass anything Bernie stands for, they would go even farther right. That would make it much tougher for any of Bernie's ideas to ever get impemented in the future.
I know many detest Hillary and say they would never vote for her and many anti-establishment types think she will maintain the status quo and want change and that is fine. If you are a Hillary hater or anti-establishment type AND are left of center, is a Hillary presidency really worse than a Republican president and house and senate? The latter is much worse in my opinion.
For the record, this is the 10th presidential election for me and the first time I am 100% committed to voting for a Democrat. I have voted Republican in the past but this year is different for me because of the above and also the potential and likely nomination of one or more Supreme Court justices. I am only mentioning this to avoid hearing the "vote for whoever has a D by their name". I am doing exactly that this year and I believe my reasons are legit, but this year is the exception rather than the rule.
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