Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
BigSteelThrill

Bernie Sanders HQ! *A decent human being.

Recommended Posts

38 minutes ago, KiddLattimer said:

Between this and skipping the vote on internet privacy Bernie has been quickly eroding the faith I had in him

Tim Kaine once said "Nobody walks the line between insider and outsider better than Bernie — nobody."  Sometimes I think the reason they dislike him isn't because he acts like a big populist, but because he pretends not to be one of them.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, ren hoek said:

When he hired people like Sirota, Gray and Nina Turner, I thought he might finally take the gloves off.  Maybe even moreso after the heart attack.  He's 78, what has he got to lose?  But I was wrong. 

I don't know if he's just too ignorant or naive to see the party clearly rejects his policy views, but they clearly do, and he keeps siding with them over and over again.  

Whatever his actual intents are, the end result is always the same: not laying a glove on the party chieftains, funneling his grassroots support behind a manifestly corrupt political party, and going out weak when push comes to shove.  

My amateur take on it is I think he just doesn't have the stomach to "go down as Nader" and getting blamed for 2016 got to him. Chris Hedges mentioned a conversation between he, Bernie and Kshama Sawant where she was pushing Bernie to go harder and/or 3rd party but Bernie refused saying the Nader thing. 

That all said he's done a lot to move the ball up the hill so I'm hoping someone with a little more DGAF (cough... Nina... cough) keeps it going. I really like that she's flirting with the People's Party movement, hope it's more than just words.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
54 minutes ago, HellToupee said:

Bernie probably found plenty of rea$on$ to act like this. Everything is a work with career pols , we’re the rubes

Feels like that sometimes.  I hope it isn't true because I do trust him but with Washington you never know.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, KiddLattimer said:

My amateur take on it is I think he just doesn't have the stomach to "go down as Nader" and getting blamed for 2016 got to him. Chris Hedges mentioned a conversation between he, Bernie and Kshama Sawant where she was pushing Bernie to go harder and/or 3rd party but Bernie refused saying the Nader thing. 

That all said he's done a lot to move the ball up the hill so I'm hoping someone with a little more DGAF (cough... Nina... cough) keeps it going. I really like that she's flirting with the People's Party movement, hope it's more than just words.

I think, like Sawant said, the Democratic party is a "graveyard" for progressives.  All of Sanders' momentum to change the party structure from within is dead in the water with Joe Biden.  I agree it's good to see Nina & co. concentrating behind an independent party.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, ren hoek said:

I think, like Sawant said, the Democratic party is a "graveyard" for progressives.  All of Sanders' momentum to change the party structure from within is dead in the water with Joe Biden.  I agree it's good to see Nina & co. concentrating behind an independent party.  

Yea Biden particularly kills it, especially with a Kamala VP. Even Pete or Warren would have been at least some progress

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, ren hoek said:

 

I don't know if he's just too ignorant or naive to see the party clearly rejects his policy views, but they clearly do, and he keeps siding with them over and over again.  

 

This is so bizarre to me.  My son (23) went out with many others his age and campaigned for him.  From the start, he mentioned that everyone his age he knew hated Biden, even before the primaries started and he turned into the gaffe machine.  What a waste of all that human capital. These kids are not happy at all.  They might not turn out to vote as usual, but I doubt they are clinging to the party in the future the way they have in the past.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

David Sirota @davidsirota

Kamala Harris landed a punch on Biden once and she gained 12 points in the polls. Had Biden faced that kind of sustained criticism for weeks and months, he mighta been defeated.

After that, everyone basically went silent about Biden for months. Now he’s the nominee.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"Congratulations to Kamala Harris, who will make history as our next Vice President. She understands what it takes to stand up for working people, fight for health care for all, and take down the most corrupt administration in history. Let’s get to work and win."

Bernie working overtime shilling for Joe Biden and Kamala Harris.  How does he tell straightup lies like this with a straight face?  Is he naive, ignorant or just corrupt?  What exactly does he think they're going to stand for when they assume power?  Because it's not going to be the progressive causes he claims to care about.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"The function of the sheepdog candidate is to give left activists and voters a reason, however illusory, to believe there's a place of influence for them inside the Democratic party, if and only if the eventual Democratic nominee can win in November."

Black Agenda Report, -5/15

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, ren hoek said:

"The function of the sheepdog candidate is to give left activists and voters a reason, however illusory, to believe there's a place of influence for them inside the Democratic party, if and only if the eventual Democratic nominee can win in November."

Black Agenda Report, -5/15

One wonders whether these people have ever heard of the concept of incrementalism. I mean, for Pete's sake. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, rockaction said:

One wonders whether these people have ever heard of the concept of incrementalism. I mean, for Pete's sake. 

He's been doing this stuff for like 30 years.  Things just keep getting incrementally worse and more corrupt all the time, no matter which party is in power, and Sanders keeps endorsing it.  He keeps endorsing them even after they betray him right out in the open.  The most charitable explanation for it is that Bernie Sanders is the dumbest, most naive fool in politics.  I know he's smarter than this.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, ren hoek said:

He's been doing this stuff for like 30 years.  Things just keep getting incrementally worse and more corrupt all the time, no matter which party is in power, and Sanders keeps endorsing it.  He keeps endorsing them even after they betray him right out in the open.  The most charitable explanation for it is that Bernie Sanders is the dumbest, most naive fool in politics.  I know he's smarter than this.  

I disagree. The left has succeeded in almost everything it has tried to do since the sixties aside from avoiding war and losing their agenda against the rise of our military-industrial complex. The Civil Rights Act of 1964, The Great Society, The War On Poverty, entitlements through the roof, deficit spending, guaranteed health care for the poor, guaranteed health care for the elderly, bailouts for corporations and unions at the public teat in a nod to command economy, you name it. Yes, they haven't achieved single-payer health insurance yet. Big deal. We must look like raging Marxists to our betters from 1918. And then the social program undertaken since the fifties. Contraception on demand as a natural right. Abortion as a natural right. Gay marriage as a natural right. Have I mentioned that natural rights stem from a Judeo-Christian understanding of God? I mean, what the heck do you want? What more could you possibly be granted on the left? If anything, the left has been ascendant. It's eviscerated every right-leaning thing in its path in America aside, again, from military adventurism. But even that adventurism is couched in language that would make Woodrow Wilson blush in its international and humane concern. 

I submit that Sanders is smart, knows this, and will smile all the way to his grave having accomplished all of this.

Edited by rockaction

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, ren hoek said:

"Congratulations to Kamala Harris, who will make history as our next Vice President. She understands what it takes to stand up for working people, fight for health care for all, and take down the most corrupt administration in history. Let’s get to work and win."

Bernie working overtime shilling for Joe Biden and Kamala Harris.  How does he tell straightup lies like this with a straight face?  Is he naive, ignorant or just corrupt?  What exactly does he think they're going to stand for when they assume power?  Because it's not going to be the progressive causes he claims to care about.  

On the contrary, Biden is expected to adopt some of Bernie's positions on

Immigration Reform - "If Democratic presidential candidate Joe Biden is elected in November, he is expected to use many of those same levers to undo Mr. Trump’s changes and even end some immigration enforcement measures that have been in place for decades....  Mr. Biden has also said he would pursue a bill providing a pathway to citizenship for the 11 million immigrants in the country who lack permanent legal status, a task made easier if Democrats take back control of the Senate."

Education Reform including tuition-free public college for families making less than $125k per year. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, rockaction said:

I disagree. The left has succeeded in almost everything it has tried to do since the sixties aside from avoiding war and losing their agenda against the rise of our military-industrial complex. The Civil Rights Act of 1964, The Great Society, The War On Poverty, entitlements through the roof, deficit spending, guaranteed health care for the poor, guaranteed health care for the elderly, bailouts for corporations and unions at the public teat in a nod to command economy, you name it. Yes, they haven't achieved single-payer health insurance yet. Big deal. We must look like raging Marxists to our betters from 1918. And then the social program undertaken since the fifties. Contraception on demand as a natural right. Abortion as a natural right. Gay marriage as a natural right. Have I mentioned that natural rights stem from a Judeo-Christian understanding of God? I mean, what the heck do you want? What more could you possibly be granted on the left? If anything, the left has been ascendant. It's eviscerated every right-leaning thing in its path in America aside, again, from military adventurism. But even that adventurism is couched in language that would make Woodrow Wilson blush in its international and humane concern. 

I submit that Sanders is smart, knows this, and will smile all the way to his grave having accomplished all of this.

I guess we have a different definition of ‘the left’ ‘getting what it wants’ then, because last I checked a massive surveillance state, endless war, expansive prison systems, corporate bailouts, CIA regime change operations, targeting of civil dissidents, and torture are not ‘progressive’ in any sense.  That’s not ‘progressive,’ it’s oligarchy.  We live in a rigged oligarchy, it is not ‘left’ or even ‘right’ by any reasonable measure, it is a fascist, corporate-run oligarchy.  

I’m not a fan of collectivist policy but I’d gladly settle for it if it meant ending the wars, ending corporate stranglehold over politics, ending mass incarceration, ending our militarized police state.  You mention civil rights, gay rights, abortion etc.  I mean I think most people agree those are worthwhile considerations, but even if they don’t, these are social issues that cost the ruling class nothing.  

For all the song and dance about social justice, I see very little push back against the criminal justice system from either party either.  Prisoners are used as slave labor, we don’t even have an official end to slavery going for us.  All they’re good for is empty virtue signaling and demagoguing Trump.  

The current Democratic nominees do not pose a threat to this system.  They are already signaling they have no interest in changing any of this.  Which is why it’s astonishing to watch Sanders sell his people out to consolidate them behind the so-called Democratic wing of this rotten institution.  

  • Thinking 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well you certainly make a forceful argument.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, johnnycakes said:

On the contrary, Biden is expected to adopt some of Bernie's positions on

Immigration Reform - "If Democratic presidential candidate Joe Biden is elected in November, he is expected to use many of those same levers to undo Mr. Trump’s changes and even end some immigration enforcement measures that have been in place for decades....  Mr. Biden has also said he would pursue a bill providing a pathway to citizenship for the 11 million immigrants in the country who lack permanent legal status, a task made easier if Democrats take back control of the Senate."

Education Reform including tuition-free public college for families making less than $125k per year. 

For any FBGs over that threshold, let's discuss added some rental property to your portfolio to get you below this threshold.

 

  • Laughing 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/28/2020 at 2:28 PM, johnnycakes said:

On the contrary, Biden is expected to adopt some of Bernie's positions on

Immigration Reform - "If Democratic presidential candidate Joe Biden is elected in November, he is expected to use many of those same levers to undo Mr. Trump’s changes and even end some immigration enforcement measures that have been in place for decades....  Mr. Biden has also said he would pursue a bill providing a pathway to citizenship for the 11 million immigrants in the country who lack permanent legal status, a task made easier if Democrats take back control of the Senate."

Education Reform including tuition-free public college for families making less than $125k per year. 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/09/08/finance-202-publicly-biden-is-tough-wall-street-privately-his-camp-is-offering-reassurance/
 

Biden staffers have privately assured bankers not to read too much into their “task force” exercise.  That it was just a performative gesture to make progressives feel like they would have a voice in his administration.  Just so you know.  

I understand people want to get Trump out and Biden is the only conceivable “choice” to accomplish this.  But please stop acting like this guy was ever serious about enacting left policy goals.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Was searching through my email for ActBlue donations as proof that the Gravel kids still owe me my Gravel buttons I donated for way back.  Then saw that I gave a $2.70 donation to Bernie when it was just him and Joe Biden.  I might as well just given it to Joe Biden himself :X

Guy didn't put up nearly enough fight to make me think he was ever serious about coming through for the people that believed in him.  More important to him to stay in good graces with the enemy than to use his power for people that are suffering.  Can't even bring himself to say Assange's name. 

Joe Biden ####s on him every other day and he still is pushing this alarmist BS and telling us to support Kamala Harris.  Total sellout.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, ren hoek said:

Was searching through my email for ActBlue donations as proof that the Gravel kids still owe me my Gravel buttons I donated for way back.  Then saw that I gave a $2.70 donation to Bernie when it was just him and Joe Biden.  I might as well just given it to Joe Biden himself :X

Guy didn't put up nearly enough fight to make me think he was ever serious about coming through for the people that believed in him.  More important to him to stay in good graces with the enemy than to use his power for people that are suffering.  Can't even bring himself to say Assange's name. 

Joe Biden ####s on him every other day and he still is pushing this alarmist BS and telling us to support Kamala Harris.  Total sellout.  

What's this?  Are you calling Bernie a sellout?  I call him a team player.  From what I've seen Bernie is campaigning pretty hard for Biden.  And if Biden gets elected, he's going to owe the Bernie Bros some love.  That's a big part of the reason why I'm voting for Biden.  I'll be mighty disappointed if all he pays is lip service to Bernie's agenda.  

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, johnnycakes said:

What's this?  Are you calling Bernie a sellout?  I call him a team player.  From what I've seen Bernie is campaigning pretty hard for Biden.  And if Biden gets elected, he's going to owe the Bernie Bros some love.  That's a big part of the reason why I'm voting for Biden.  I'll be mighty disappointed if all he pays is lip service to Bernie's agenda.  

Has he even paid lip service to Bernie's agenda though? 

I agree though that Bernie is just being a team player. As much as I'd love him to continue the fight he made a deal to run as a Democrat and he's living up to it. I get that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, KiddLattimer said:

Has he even paid lip service to Bernie's agenda though? 

I agree though that Bernie is just being a team player. As much as I'd love him to continue the fight he made a deal to run as a Democrat and he's living up to it. I get that.

On a couple of items he has....  on immigration reform, Biden is on record saying he favors a path to citizenship for the 11 million or whatever illegal aliens.  And on the education front, Biden has floated the idea of an income tax hike on wealthier Americans to pay for free public college for families making $125k or less.  So there is some hope there.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Isn't Biden also saying he'll expand ACA? I know it's not all the way to complete single payer, but it does attempt to address healthcare concerns, which is a pretty important component of Sanders' platform.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, johnnycakes said:

On a couple of items he has....  on immigration reform, Biden is on record saying he favors a path to citizenship for the 11 million or whatever illegal aliens.

To rooms full of rich donors, Biden is on record saying he would punish business owners for "hiring illegals."  The Obama admin deported two million+ undocumented people, and built the cages that Trump now uses to dehumanize immigrants.  

When confronted about this record by Carlos Rojas and other immigration activists- who campaigned for Barack Obama in 2008- Biden told them to go vote for Trump.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, johnnycakes said:

On a couple of items he has....  on immigration reform, Biden is on record saying he favors a path to citizenship for the 11 million or whatever illegal aliens.  And on the education front, Biden has floated the idea of an income tax hike on wealthier Americans to pay for free public college for families making $125k or less.  So there is some hope there.  

That's good to know, I'm assuming the worst but I would be thrilled if he/they surprise me

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
55 minutes ago, ren hoek said:

Was searching through my email for ActBlue donations as proof that the Gravel kids still owe me my Gravel buttons I donated for way back.  Then saw that I gave a $2.70 donation to Bernie when it was just him and Joe Biden.  I might as well just given it to Joe Biden himself :X

Guy didn't put up nearly enough fight to make me think he was ever serious about coming through for the people that believed in him.  More important to him to stay in good graces with the enemy than to use his power for people that are suffering.  Can't even bring himself to say Assange's name. 

Joe Biden ####s on him every other day and he still is pushing this alarmist BS and telling us to support Kamala Harris.  Total sellout.  

So the alternative to Trump is....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, EZD222 said:

So the alternative to Trump is....

Jorgensen, the PSL, the Greens, Jesse Ventura write-in, staying home...

All of those are contributing less to the continued collapse of humanity than supporting Biden/Trump.  

  • Laughing 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
46 minutes ago, ren hoek said:

Jorgensen, the PSL, the Greens, Jesse Ventura write-in, staying home...

All of those are contributing less to the continued collapse of humanity than supporting Biden/Trump.  

I made that mistake in 2016. Never again. Any other candidate I'd consider it, but not Trump.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, EZD222 said:

I made that mistake in 2016. Never again. Any other candidate I'd consider it, but not Trump.

Well I think you chose right, and Clinton/Trump voters chose wrong.  Clinton seemed like a surefire bet to deliver another ground war in Asia.  If she'd won I think we'd be seeing similar levels of corruption and possibly an even more warlike military, the media would just be more credulous about it.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.