What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

Re-Ranking the fantasy Rookies (1 Viewer)

KellysHeroes

KellysHeroes

Footballguy
After round 1 last night lets rank the rookies that were slected

#1 Elliot - ofcourse

#2 Coleman - its early but currently I like Coleman since he fits the new age WR proto-type (Smaller but super fast and shifty)  However he has a lot of drops in college and isn't as good after the catch

#3 Goff - I know nobody outside of superflex / 2 QB leagues will take him this high but I think he looks like the real deal and is on a good team, if your looking for a safe pick take Goff

#4 Doctson - very old for a rookie but also very good and in a productive system with a good chance to start

#5 P Lynch - this is a reach but I love the situation hes in.  He won't start but won't take long for Sanchez to play himself out of the starter gig.

#6 Wentz - this more of me passing on Treadwell but Wentz has the tools to become an NFL starter

#7 Treadwell - hes too slow, theres vets out of the league that are better than him and just as fast if not faster.  Won't ever be a WR1 IMHO

#8 Fuller - nothing more but a lid-lifter for Hopkins.  A reach by the Texans IMO.   

Once the RBs get taken tonight a lot of rankings will change or begin to be created but I'd like to see some early birds.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I also like Coleman over Doctson. Hue is a good coach and will find ways to get him the ball. I was ok with Doctsons age until he went to a team with a couple good WRs in front of him. He could be 25 before he even really gets a chance. 

 
In our RFA in a dynasty and no one has put a bid on Sanchez yet. He may be worth something starting in Denver.

 
unless you're in a 2 qb leagues those rankings don't make sense to me.

really no point in making this list until we see what happens over the next couple of rounds.

I'd bump Treadwell up - prob to #2 at this point - even though i don't love the Vikings offense

 
I think far too often we make too much about where a player ends up, either good or bad.  We drooled when Monte Ball went to Denver but we forgot Monte Ball wasn't as good as the other options

 
fruity pebbles said:
I also like Coleman over Doctson. Hue is a good coach and will find ways to get him the ball. I was ok with Doctsons age until he went to a team with a couple good WRs in front of him. He could be 25 before he even really gets a chance. 
Click to expand...
I don't think Garcon or Crowder will hold him back. There's a lot of receptions there if he's better than Garcon. If you like him you have to think he's better than 2016 Garcon.

 
I don't think the NFL draft ordering of Coleman, Doctson, Treadwell changes the dynasty ordering of Treadwell, Doctson, Coleman. But it does push them closer together, mostly by dropping Treadwell's value half a step. It also makes it harder for Henry to legitimately be taken ahead of any of them. It can still happen depending on who takes him, but in a PPR league these are all highly drafted guys with good team matches and clear routes to WR1. Fuller being taken so high could push him over some of Thomas, Carroo, Shepard, and Boyd but only if those players drop to the 3rd. His value will mainly be deep threat and potentially not on the stat sheet, but he ended up on a team with no WR2 and no TE, so he's in line to start. 

 
The position bumped Coleman a bit for me. Atleast enough to make him the clear #2 behind Zeke. I didnt like that the Skins had the opportunity to draft Doctson and traded out for a 6th with the possibility of losing him. 

 
fruity pebbles said:
I also like Coleman over Doctson. Hue is a good coach and will find ways to get him the ball. I was ok with Doctsons age until he went to a team with a couple good WRs in front of him. He could be 25 before he even really gets a chance. 
Click to expand...
I'm guessing either Jackson or Garcon gets released or traded soon.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
thriftyrocker said:
I don't think the NFL draft ordering of Coleman, Doctson, Treadwell changes the dynasty ordering of Treadwell, Doctson, Coleman. But it does push them closer together, mostly by dropping Treadwell's value half a step. It also makes it harder for Henry to legitimately be taken ahead of any of them. It can still happen depending on who takes him, but in a PPR league these are all highly drafted guys with good team matches and clear routes to WR1. Fuller being taken so high could push him over some of Thomas, Carroo, Shepard, and Boyd but only if those players drop to the 3rd. His value will mainly be deep threat and potentially not on the stat sheet, but he ended up on a team with no WR2 and no TE, so he's in line to start. 
Click to expand...
You're in denial bro. Treadwell was never better than Coleman. Now he went to the Vikings where WR go to die. Lolol I wouldn't take him in the top 5. 

 
Milkman said:
You're in denial bro. Treadwell was never better than Coleman. Now he went to the Vikings where WR go to die. Lolol I wouldn't take him in the top 5. 
Click to expand...
Treadwell was never an elite prospect but neither was Coleman. They are both dynasty WR2 prospects with little competition and now pretty high pedigree. Once the Vikings go back inside next season, don't have any concerns about WR potential in Minnesota. Wallace, Cordarrelle, and Charles Johnson all had their own problems unrelated to Minneapolis.

 
Dezbelief said:
They both have 1 year left on their contracts. Coleman and Crowder have the opportunity to step up.
Click to expand...
That's not really relevant. Guys get cut with years left all the time. One of them will be cut.

Crowder was a find for them but he's a #3.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Dr. Octopus said:
I'm guessing either Jackson or Garcon gets released or traded soon.
Click to expand...
I would think Jackson might have some value even with only one year left on his contract given the only two speed receivers(that are more than special teamers) are already off the board. He would look pretty good in ATL/CIN/NYG/CLE to me.

 
thriftyrocker said:
Treadwell was never an elite prospect but neither was Coleman. They are both dynasty WR2 prospects with little competition and now pretty high pedigree. Once the Vikings go back inside next season, don't have any concerns about WR potential in Minnesota. Wallace, Cordarrelle, and Charles Johnson all had their own problems unrelated to Minneapolis.
Click to expand...
Enjoy your bust then. Coleman and Doctson are the only two WR prospects in this draft I have a lot of interest in. There's a couple more I might like if they land somewhere nice. Treadwell def wasn't one of them and should never have been anyones #1 WR. 

 
1. Zeke

.

.

.

.

2-3.  Coleman/Doctson.  Coleman should get force fed the ball.  I like where doctson landed.  Give them both a year or so  and I could see them both being solid fantasy starters.

.

.

4. Treadwell might be dead in the Bridgewater.  I like the guy though.

5.-??? Not picked yet. 

13+. Fuller.  He seems more like a speed gimmic WR to me.  Hands concern me a lot.  I would not use a 1st on him.

Not sure where I put the QBs yet.  I don't usually rank QBs high since I find it's easy to trade for ones in my leagues and they are too expensive either.

 
While milkman's brusqueness is certainly off-putting, I think he's right. Treadwell will be a lift to the Vikings' offense but I can't see how he can ever produce big numbers playing with Teddy and in that offense.

I think you're looking at a line like 70/1000/8, which isn't terrible but not great either.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
just joined a super flex dynasty league so I appreciate these rankings. I think in pretty much any format Elliot is number one. 2-12 isn't so simple. 

 
Andy Dufresne said:
I think you're looking at a line like 70/1000/8, which isn't terrible but not great either.
Click to expand...
Kelvin Benjamin is a top 25 startup pick and had those numbers in his only season. I agree yardage is the danger to upside. I would be afraid that those 70 receptions would only be in the 800s, really. I think there is upside in receptions though. 70 receptions would be 24% market share based on Bridgewater having 292 completions last year. Rookie year that might be accurate but expectation if he "hits" I think is higher, 80s. TD range of 5-10, hard to predict, more upside once Peterson's role is reduced in 2017+. If he is a 85, 1000+ type of player then he'll be very valuable and be worth his current startup cost. 

 
I think one has to view drafting a rookie for their 2nd or 3rd and on seasons.  With that being the case, I really like the landing spots of both Doctson and Treadwell.  I don't think Coleman leaps either, personally.  I don't see RG3 being the answer in Cleveland (I don't think they see it either), so Coleman will likely have a rookie QB next year while I think Doctson will have one of the better and underrated QBs in the league and Tread will have a very good athletic QB on a team transitioning out of a run based offense that plays in a dome.

 
Milkman said:
You're in denial bro. Treadwell was never better than Coleman. Now he went to the Vikings where WR go to die. Lolol I wouldn't take him in the top 5. 
Click to expand...
I think it actually puts all three much closer together because dynasty rankings shouldn't be based on what happened in one night..it's called dynasty for a reason.

Treadwell got what looks like the weaker spot but Peterson is freaking 31 years old and a "possession" receiver with the talent of Treadwell could be a target monster in a year from now.  We saw what guys like Boldin and Crabtree did in scenarios where sometimes you just throw it 9 times a game for 8 yards and let them do the rest.  And Treadwell is good after the catch.

Coleman is a lot to like but...it's the Browns and they have 25 legitimate needs.  They are pretty much the collective talent of an expansion team in a division with 3 very good teams.  And, one thing they really need is a good long-term QB.  You can't catch what is never thrown, grasshoppers. 

So then there is Doctson. Older but more polished.  Has guys around him (which I agree with Doc Oc that DJAX or Garcon is not long for the team).  But. Doctson is also on the best team of the bunch in terms of where thye are and where the collective arrow is pointing and he looks like he may have the best QB. 

If I had a top 4 FF rookie pick, I'd say this is the easiest year you can imagine. Just sit in your spot and if you are #1, you take Elliot (although I'm not a fan of RB dynasty, I'm not going to argue the logic here), if you are #2 or #3 you take your preference and don't sweat it because you're not going to be wrong or right over a three year window, and if you are #4 you take the last guy standing, which is still a nice tier-breaking point (depending on what is yet to come, of course).

 
Last edited by a moderator:
For dynasty owners the 1st round was not very exciting unless you own the #1 rookie pick.  At his point, it is Elliott and a huge gap- then everyone else in a bunch.  Pick your poison.  One thing is for certain, the value of the #1 rookie pick is off the charts.   

 
Who will lead the Vikings in rushing/receiving touchdowns in 2017?  I'll take Treadwell.  You can take any other player you want.  

He's instantly their best red zone receiver.  The presumed heir apparent at rb is not a goal line back.  Diggs is a decent receiver but nothing special.  I can see high receptions and double digit tds from him in year two.  

 
Andy Dufresne said:
While milkman's brusqueness is certainly off-putting, I think he's right. Treadwell will be a lift to the Vikings' offense but I can't see how he can ever produce big numbers playing with Teddy and in that offense.

I think you're looking at a line like 70/1000/8, which isn't terrible but not great either.
Click to expand...
Think the answer to that question is Norv Turner.  Treadwell seems to have the pedigree and IF he is truly that capable, Norv is known to find ways to make those types of guys saturated with targets.  Plus, the short-sightedness of this is people think the Vikes run too much. Sure, but they won't have Peterson forever. He is already 31.  People talk about Bridgewater's lack of an arm but IF (again, if) Treadwell is really that good a player, then he can make his fantasy noise with what he does after the catch.

 
matttyl said:
That tier grows by 1 tonight, I believe, with where Henry lands.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I was leaving the door open for that. He was the guy in my head.  I guess there is a spot somewhere he could go where it suddenly becomes preference or need and we can justify Henry over this guy and that guy. I don't know where that spot might be but let's just say the Giants or Colts or someone picks him, There will be a case. 

Personally, if he goes somewhere where there are other RBs or young Rbs (Miami, Chicago, Oakland, etc), I think it muddies the waters and makes the first tier more solid.  My personal thought is I will give a WR, TE, and certainly a QB a few grace seasons to maneuver through the depth chart but it is really hard to do with a RB.  You draft a 22 year old guy that has to set behind some aging incumbent or whatever and before you know it that guy is watching the next team rb being drafted.

 
  1. Zeke Elliott
  2. Doctson
  3. Corey Coleman
  4. Fuller
  5. Treadwell
  6. Wentz
Only ranking currently taken players.  Goff not ranked because he got drafted by Jeff Fisher.  He'll never be startable in a non-2 QB league.

 
Milkman said:
You're in denial bro. Treadwell was never better than Coleman. Now he went to the Vikings where WR go to die. Lolol I wouldn't take him in the top 5. 
Click to expand...
Wait, one of your arguments for Coleman over Treadwell is that Minnesota is where WR's go to die?   Yeaaaaaaaah.  Ummmmm.  Ok. 

 
SayWhat? said:
Wait, one of your arguments for Coleman over Treadwell is that Minnesota is where WR's go to die?   Yeaaaaaaaah.  Ummmmm.  Ok. 
Click to expand...
No I always liked Coleman more than Treadwell. Coleman is an NFL level athlete Treadwell is not. Both were drafted to bad spots but Treadwell is in a worse spot. 

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Before the draft Coleman was #1 on my board with Doctson #2. Elliott landed in heaven so I think I have to move him to the #1 spot but I'm not in love with the talent. He's ok but not special. Running behind that OL though you don't have to be. 

 
KellysHeroes said:
After round 1 last night lets rank the rookies that were slected

#2 Coleman - its early but currently I like Coleman since he fits the new age WR proto-type (Smaller but super fast and shifty)  However he has a lot of drops in college and isn't as good after the catch   
Click to expand...
Coleman's run after the catch abilities is actually one of his strengths.  

 
Milkman said:
No I always liked Coleman more than Treadwell. Coleman is an NFL level athlete Treadwell is not. Both were drafted to bad spots but Treadwell is in a worse spot. 
Click to expand...
The Vikings and 31 other NFL clubs disagree with this assessment.

It is going to be very hard to buy into anything you are pitching if your blanket statements are running counter to the entire industry consensus.  There are zero of 32 teams who had Treadwell removed from their boards due to him not being an NFL level athlete.  That is absurd.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Shutout said:
The Vikings and 31 other NFL clubs disagree with this assessment.

It is going to be very hard to buy into anything you are pitching if your blanket statements are running counter to the entire industry consensus.  There are zero of 32 teams who had Treadwell removed from their boards due to him not being an NFL level athlete.  That is absurd.
Click to expand...
Yeah well it's the same thing I said about Melvin Gordon last year.......shrug.

 
Milkman said:
Yeah well it's the same thing I said about Melvin Gordon last year.......shrug.
Click to expand...
Stop.  Anybody on this board can point to one time they were right. It doesn't make you wrong in this case but it also doesn't mean you are a guru. 

I said last year Gordon wasn't anywhere close to Gurley but in my opinion that was a much easier call and I'm saying now that I think Treadwell will be fine.  Different year, different player, different scenarios. 

Bottom line, you're going to have to give something believable and logical to get traction and starting it off by saying he isn't an NFL level athlete is not a good first thought. 

What is it EXACTLY that leads you to your conclusion. COnvince me (and I'm not biased...I'm listening..build your case).

 
Shutout said:
I think far too often we make too much about where a player ends up, either good or bad.  We drooled when Monte Ball went to Denver but we forgot Monte Ball wasn't as good as the other options
Click to expand...
Montee Ball was not any worse of a prospect than any of the other guys that year.  They were all taken within 20 picks of each other in the NFL draft.  Ball's rookie ADP wasn't out of whack with that either as Lacy/Bernard went ahead of him in most drafts and Bell in many as well.

I get what you're saying, just a bit of an odd example.

 
Milkman said:
Yeah well it's the same thing I said about Melvin Gordon last year.......shrug.
Click to expand...
Just for the hell of it I clicked on your name and saw your post history, and went back to the first page of it to see the first time you mentioned any specific player by name.  Here is what you wrote....

"Just got done watching some Evans, Watkins, and Lee tape. Evans looks like a less explosive slower Vincent Jackson. Watkins looks more like an NFL WR than Evans. Strong hands tough receiver. Watkins almost looks like a rb when he's running in traffic. Marqise Lee on the other hand jumps off the screen at me. He looks like Reggie Wayne. I'm not sure he has Wayne's hands but that's who he reminds me of. At this point I would like to watch more on him and read up more but I would take Lee in front of Evans and Watkins.

Lee>>>>>Watkins>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Evans."

Just sayin'.....

 
FreeBaGeL said:
Montee Ball was not any worse of a prospect than any of the other guys that year.  They were all taken within 20 picks of each other in the NFL draft.  Ball's rookie ADP wasn't out of whack with that either as Lacy/Bernard went ahead of him in most drafts and Bell in many as well.

I get what you're saying, just a bit of an odd example.
Click to expand...
I just use him as an example I guess because I personally was always so against him. I never thought he was that good and when Denver drafted him, he became so coveted.  So, to me, he is an example of a guy who was both overrated and then situationally overrated further.

 
Things could still change today but this has got to be the first time ever that my clear cut top 4 players entering the rookie draft not only are still the top 4 players but remained in exact order of how I ranked them.

I'm not happy about this because I don't own picks in 1-4 range. My optimism for what might be available in 5-8 range has dwindled considerably but the value of picks 1-4 is higher than I would have placed it yesterday, which does not help me any.

 
I could see a RB or 2 jumping into my top 5 yet.  Not that i think theyre going to be that great.  I'm just really not thrilled by this WR class.

 
Yeah I that's why I don't like watching tape first. Lee exposed himself for the athlete he wasn't and I jumped off that train very quickly. I never owned him. 

Treadwell is not athletic enough and he landed in a terrible spot. Draft at your own risk. 

 
matttyl said:
Just for the hell of it I clicked on your name and saw your post history, and went back to the first page of it to see the first time you mentioned any specific player by name.  Here is what you wrote....

"Just got done watching some Evans, Watkins, and Lee tape. Evans looks like a less explosive slower Vincent Jackson. Watkins looks more like an NFL WR than Evans. Strong hands tough receiver. Watkins almost looks like a rb when he's running in traffic. Marqise Lee on the other hand jumps off the screen at me. He looks like Reggie Wayne. I'm not sure he has Wayne's hands but that's who he reminds me of. At this point I would like to watch more on him and read up more but I would take Lee in front of Evans and Watkins.

Lee>>>>>Watkins>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Evans."

Just sayin'.....
Click to expand...
Ouch.

 
Elliot probably untouchable now, I think most would rank him somewhere between RB 3-5 overall.

Then a bunched up 2-4 with Coleman, Doctson & Treadwell. I think the order of these guys in drafts will really vary greatly in between different leagues. I honestly have a hard time putting them in order right now as well. One nice positive and bump to those picks value is that they all ended up in situations where they could be "THE" guy for their team as opposed to the #2 behind a guy like OBJ, AJG or Hopkins where they might see lighter coverage but a lot fewer targets.

Fuller way down there, likely will be in the early second round range of drafts where he is worth a gamble compared to late round nfl draftee's like Dorsett last year. Think this was a pick that makes more football sense than fantasy sense as he's not likely to see a lot of volume. I'm thinking his fantasy upside is something like Reid era DJax when Maclin was healthy and they ate into each others targets (except I don't see Fuller eating into Hopkins targets a ton.)

Still a lot to see today, couple of juicy spots for RB's and/or Hunter Henry and some other WR's but I think its unlikely anyone surpasses the current top 4.

 
Milkman said:
No I always liked Coleman more than Treadwell. Coleman is an NFL level athlete Treadwell is not. Both were drafted to bad spots but Treadwell is in a worse spot. 
Click to expand...
What is it about Treadwell that makes him not an NFL athlete?  Is it that he runs like TO and Hopkins?  Pretty sure they turned out ok. 

Also, you can hardly call Minnesota a worse spot than the Browns... Can you hear yourself?

 
Milkman said:
Yeah I that's why I don't like watching tape first. Lee exposed himself for the athlete he wasn't and I jumped off that train very quickly. I never owned him. 

Treadwell is not athletic enough and he landed in a terrible spot. Draft at your own risk. 
Click to expand...
Yeah sort of like the way Jarvis Landry and Keenan Allen aren't athletic enough to have a fantasy impact

 
Milkman said:
Yeah I that's why I don't like watching tape first. Lee exposed himself for the athlete he wasn't and I jumped off that train very quickly. I never owned him. 

Treadwell is not athletic enough and he landed in a terrible spot. Draft at your own risk. 
Click to expand...
Want to see your thoughts on the 2014 RB class?

" It's good to see someone else sees Sankey as the top back in this draft. I think it's close between him and Seastrunk. "

Or " I guess I'm in the minority here I love Sankey. I think he could be the best RB in this class. I was watching some tape on him and he reminds me of Ray Rice. He looks like he has all the tools to be a 3 down back in the NFL. He has great vision and it seems like he doesn't need that much room to break big runs. Great hands as well. "

Or this juicy quote about C Mike in 2013 - "Personally I base it on combine numbers, prototypical size, preseason production (he was flashing like crazy man), and the situation he has been put in. I mean what don't you like about him? I mean lol at keeping him off the field next year. His floor is solid RB2 in three years and his ceiling is top 5 RB for the next 6 years. "

How about we just say that sometimes you're wrong about things and leave it at that?

 
Last edited by a moderator:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

ignatiusjreilly
How many first-round QBs will actually pan out?
Replies
12
Views
370
ignatiusjreilly
ignatiusjreilly
JohnnyU
My Top 5 WRs in the 2024 class, plus notes on 3 more
2
Replies
94
Views
3K
Max Power
Max Power
barackdhouse
My own Top 5 worst & best preseason takes
Replies
25
Views
849
rockaction
rockaction

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 2 (members: 0, guests: 2)
Top