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College Admissions Questions (1 Viewer)

Here's how things went for my daughter.

  Very strong in math and artsy since she was a munchkin.  Top 10 in a top 100 HS.  Last April we set up 8 tours of colleges for engineering.  On our way to our first stop (Cornell) we realized that architecture was a better fit.  Readjusted our schedule and visited about 7 schools that fit.  Most of the schools we looked at were 60-70K/year.  

    Decided to let her take SAT's and ACT's without any coaching as we didn't want for her to feel additional pressure. (It's amazing the pressure these kids have versus when I was her age)Took ACT's once and scored very well.  Took SAT's twice and got perfect score on math (+20) second try(English score dropped by 20).  Her essay was about how she started a business when she was 9 ("Yolks for folks" we had chickens and she sold the eggs).  Cornell was E.D. school until 2 weeks before deadline.  Changed E.D. to Northeastern as it was in a city (Boston) and closer to home. 

   She was accepted at Notheastern and given a 14k/year academic scholarship for four years.  Over 60k kids have applied to NU and about 3k were accepted.  We're very proud of her getting into the architecture program as it is a 5 year masters program. 

  Here's what I think worked for her:

Early Decision-->at least 2x better chance of getting accepted. (admissions at one of schools we visited said E.D. she picks,  regular admissions fills quotas) 

Essay-->Make it unique and interesting to read.

Pressure-->Don't overdue it.  The kids know what's at stake and in our case she did great without it. 

Be Unique-->Have a strong art (tuba, accordian, etc.) passion.

 
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squidrope said:
Here's how things went for my daughter.

  Very strong in math and artsy since she was a munchkin.  Top 10 in a top 100 HS.  Last April we set up 8 tours of colleges for engineering.  On our way to our first stop (Cornell) we realized that architecture was a better fit.  Readjusted our schedule and visited about 7 schools that fit.  Most of the schools we looked at were 60-70K/year.  

    Decided to let her take SAT's and ACT's without any coaching as we didn't want for her to feel additional pressure. (It's amazing the pressure these kids have versus when I was her age)Took ACT's once and scored very well.  Took SAT's twice and got perfect score on math (+20) second try(English score dropped by 20).  Her essay was about how she started a business when she was 9 ("Yolks for folks" we had chickens and she sold the eggs).  Cornell was E.D. school until 2 weeks before deadline.  Changed E.D. to Northeastern as it was in a city (Boston) and closer to home. 

   She was accepted at Notheastern and given a 14k/year scholarship for four years.  Over 60k kids have applied to NU and about 3k were accepted.  We're very proud of her getting into the architecture program as it is a 5 year masters program. 

  Here's what I think worked for her:

Early Decision-->at least 2x better chance of getting accepted. (admissions at one of schools we visited said E.D. she picks,  regular admissions fills quotas) 

Essay-->Make it unique and interesting to read.

Pressure-->Don't overdue it.  The kids know what's at stake and in our case she did great without it. 

Be Unique-->Have a strong art (tuba, accordian, etc.) passion.
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Congrats!  My son visited Northeastern for engineering and really liked it. Was impressed by the Co-Op programs in particular. It’s on his list for schools that he will likely apply to (he’s a junior).  He won’t be doing early decision there, however. 

P.S. Good luck to your daughter in architecture school. I dropped out of the program after a year!

 
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bigbottom said:
Congrats!  My son visited Northeastern for engineering and really liked it. Was impressed by the Co-Op programs in particular. It’s on his list for schools that he will likely apply to (he’s a junior).  He won’t be doing early decision there, however. 

P.S. Good luck to your daughter in architecture school. I dropped out of the program after a year!
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The co op program was a big part of her decision to go there.  When we visited last year we dropped in on the arc. building unannounced and got a tour by a student.  She was leaving the next day to do a coop in Phili? to design zoo's.   To get her Architecture license she'll need lots of hours in addition to the degree.  NU was/is a perfect fit.

Good luck to your son and

Thanks...slacker ;)

 
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My daughter has many friends who have been rejected by most of the schools they applied.  These are good/nice/bright kids with SAT/ACT scores as good or better than hers, unfortunately I think they fail due to being one dimensional.  Have a passion and let it show.  It sucks to hear the news when they get rejected.  Make sure your kid stands out and E.D.    

 
Link

Interesting point in this article that decreasing college acceptance rates is not because colleges are harder to get into, but because “colleges are just getting better and better at getting students to apply."

Harvard at 4.5%. Has it ever been lower?

 
cashman88 said:
Link

Interesting point in this article that decreasing college acceptance rates is not because colleges are harder to get into, but because “colleges are just getting better and better at getting students to apply."

Harvard at 4.5%. Has it ever been lower?
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No.  Never lower.  

I don't have the numbers for Harvard, but Stanford's numbers are similar. The class of 2000 had a 16.2% admit rate.  Circa 2010, the admit rate was ~9-10% and last year, the admit rate was 4.2%.  Stanford recently announced they won't publish their admit rate this year presumably because it keeps going down.

My daughter's dream school was Stanford so she/we made an informed decision to roll the dice and apply early.  She hit the goal post--deferred to the regular round.  10% were accepted early, 7% deferred and the rest rejected.  The deferred crew historically have been admitted at a 15-20% rate (vs ~2% for other regular decision applicants) but ultimately, she was rejected.  Where we erred was understanding how hard it would be to get in regular decision at other schools and it hurts a little knowing we would have had a much better chance if she'd chosen to apply early to others.   It's really tough as a white female.  It's even harder if you're Asian (Indian or Chinese).

Thankfully, she's over Stanford (albeit after some tears) and has some great choices.  She's narrowed it down to Berkeley, UVA and a school in Canada and is deciding whether she wants to try and fight through the Harvard wait list.

ETA:  Happy to answer questions about what we've learned in this crazy experience.

 
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Nigel said:
Literally makes me nauseous reading that. Feel like I failed her. 
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You’ve done a great job, she’s going to love college and be happy and successful. And you’re going to love having her close to home. 

She had made her mind up on G’town and you weren’t going to change it. Plus if she had gotten in, she always would have believed she’d have gotten into Georgetown too and there would be a tiny resentment that you didn’t let her apply there. 

 
Here’s a fun story: parents at Sidwell Friends School (premier DC school where the Obama kids went) try to anonymously sabotage their kids’ classmates college admissions 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/on-parenting/when-parents-are-so-desperate-to-get-their-kids-into-college-that-they-sabotage-other-students/2019/04/02/decc6b9e-5159-11e9-88a1-ed346f0ec94f_story.html?utm_term=.1ebb3513e8d5

The highly respected college Counselor is leaving for a rival school because he’s sick of the insane parents 

 
bigbottom said:
Wasn’t Georgetown her top choice?  If so, you weren’t going to succeed in convincing her not to apply there. 
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it was, and you're probably right. But I feel like I could have done more research and presented her a more realistic view of her chances to get into the schools she was applying to, and a better way to work the "game theory" as @The_Man referred to it. I guess I thought she was more special than she is (as an applicant), apparently, and that she'd put herself in a position where it would all take care of itself. Not beating myself up over it too much but I just wish I'd been more on top of it.

 
The_Man said:
Here’s a fun story: parents at Sidwell Friends School (premier DC school where the Obama kids went) try to anonymously sabotage their kids’ classmates college admissions 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/on-parenting/when-parents-are-so-desperate-to-get-their-kids-into-college-that-they-sabotage-other-students/2019/04/02/decc6b9e-5159-11e9-88a1-ed346f0ec94f_story.html?utm_term=.1ebb3513e8d5

The highly respected college Counselor is leaving for a rival school because he’s sick of the insane parents 
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JFC, this is insane. That article makes me wonder how much “help” kids get with college admissions. Maybe it’s just me, but my son did literally everything and just showed us and a lady we knew that had experience in admissions. I can only imagine how many essays get written mostly by others based on some of these scandals. 

 
stbugs said:
JFC, this is insane. That article makes me wonder how much “help” kids get with college admissions. Maybe it’s just me, but my son did literally everything and just showed us and a lady we knew that had experience in admissions. I can only imagine how many essays get written mostly by others based on some of these scandals. 
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From what I’ve heard, folks in admissions can usually tell when someone other than the kid has written the essay. 

 
Most of the kids discussed in this thread seem like smart, motivated, hard working overachievers. They will be successful in life no mater what school they go to. Once they start school and get in a groove this stuff will be ancient history and there will be lots of happy fulfilling times ahead. As parents you did it right instilling solid values and work ethic in them. Remember that when you want to beat yourself up over this process.  :hifive:

 
bigbottom said:
From what I’ve heard, folks in admissions can usually tell when someone other than the kid has written the essay. 
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It wouldn’t surprise me. It’s not even about writing it, but just polishing it or coaching on ideas. That bribery scandal makes you wonder about how much goes on that isn’t widespread enough to get caught. It’s kind of sad and scary when you think about the kids without resources.

I guess I take comfort and have pride knowing how independent my oldest is. He wanted me to read his essay, but he handled the entire application process. I have 0 worries about him in college or after. I’m still waiting for him to decide where he wants to go because he wants to find out if he got additional scholarships from South Carolina Honors College. I still think he liked Clemson’s Honors College better but it’s more expensive (way stingier on scholarships) and he’s thinking about graduate school costs on top (maybe medical school or masters).

 
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Kraft... said:
Most of the kids discussed in this thread seem like smart, motivated, hard working overachievers. They will be successful in life no mater what school they go to. Once they start school and get in a groove this stuff will be ancient history and there will be lots of happy fulfilling times ahead. As parents you did it right instilling solid values and work ethic in them. Remember that when you want to beat yourself up over this process.  :hifive:
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You are right. When it comes to bad eggs, it seems to come back to the parents in all these articles. 

 
stbugs said:
It wouldn’t surprise me. It’s not even about writing it, but just polishing it or coaching on ideas. That bribery scandal makes you wonder about how much goes on that isn’t widespread enough to get caught. It’s kind of sad and scary when you think about the kids without resources.

I guess I take comfort and have pride knowing how independent my oldest is. He wanted me to read his essay, but he handled the entire application process. I have 0 worries about him in college or after. I’m still waiting for him to decide where he wants to go because he wants to find out if he got additional scholarships from South Carolina Honors College. I still think he liked Clemson’s Honors College better but it’s more expensive (way stingier on scholarships) and he’s thinking about graduate school costs on top (maybe medical school or masters).
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Regarding the bolded, this is absolutely the case. We have someone who will work with my son with respect to possible topics and providing feedback on various drafts (but she won’t be writing any of the essays).  I know this is a luxury many students don’t have. Frankly, the primary reason we have someone to help is so his mother and I won’t be involved (and ultimately become over-involved). He gets to write about what he wants to write about. 

 
bigbottom said:
Regarding the bolded, this is absolutely the case. We have someone who will work with my son with respect to possible topics and providing feedback on various drafts (but she won’t be writing any of the essays).  I know this is a luxury many students don’t have. Frankly, the primary reason we have someone to help is so his mother and I won’t be involved (and ultimately become over-involved). He gets to write about what he wants to write about. 
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We were surprised to find out this service was included in my wife's employee benefits (J&J). We sent them copies of my daughters essays and they would send back very thorough, detailed recommendations (much more than I was expecting). It was really very helpful and didn't cost us anything. And you're right, my daughter took their advice much better than she takes mine.

 
bigbottom said:
Regarding the bolded, this is absolutely the case. We have someone who will work with my son with respect to possible topics and providing feedback on various drafts (but she won’t be writing any of the essays).  I know this is a luxury many students don’t have. Frankly, the primary reason we have someone to help is so his mother and I won’t be involved (and ultimately become over-involved). He gets to write about what he wants to write about. 
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Yeah, I probably should have worded it as more than just reviewing/providing feedback. I was thinking of providing the idea or rewriting to the point where it’s not really the student’s essay or idea. I’m sure all of the folks in here have done testing prep or got help on the application process. We did although the one mistake we made was doing more ACT prep. In the end his SAT score was better (he submitted that) than the ACT so I wish we did more SAT prep as his score might have been better.

 
bigbottom said:
From what I’ve heard, folks in admissions can usually tell when someone other than the kid has written the essay. 
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every one I talked to in admissions said the same thing.

It makes me wonder though, can they really tell or are they just providing a united front on the issue to dissuade as many cheaters as possible?

 
squidrope said:
 These are good/nice/bright kids with SAT/ACT scores as good or better than hers, unfortunately I think they fail due to being one dimensional.  Have a passion and let it show.  
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I don't think one dimensional is an issue any more.  

What I learned in the process was that colleges, now more than ever, love a student who has passion and an uber strength in one item.

In previous decades, colleges tried to build their intelligence diversity via getting kids who were well rounded, in the hopes of having a well rounded campus intelligence wise.

Now a days many colleges are building their intelligence diversity differently.  Instead of building around well rounded kids, they now try to build around kids who have singular talents and then try and get as many of the different singular talents on campus as possible to give the well rounded look.

 
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bigbottom said:
Congrats!  My son visited Northeastern for engineering and really liked it. Was impressed by the Co-Op programs in particular. It’s on his list for schools that he will likely apply to (he’s a junior).  He won’t be doing early decision there, however. 
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My brothers family rhas 2 kids in Northeastern right now, a high school senior who will be going to Northeastern in the fall and a 4th child entering Northeastern Grad School in the fall (she went to Trinity undergrad).   

They all have great things to say about it.

When I visited a ton of schools with my daughter a few years ago, Northeastern was the most impressive to me (I was an engineer before I retired so it was easy to see how good this was for kids).

 
bigbottom said:
From what I’ve heard, folks in admissions can usually tell when someone other than the kid has written the essay. 
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I'm skeptical.  If you know the kid, then sure, it is pretty easy.  But how would someone who has never met you or seen your writing elsewhere have any clue about how you may write?

 
NewlyRetired said:
every one I talked to in admissions said the same thing.

It makes me wonder though, can they really tell or are they just providing a united front on the issue to dissuade as many cheaters as possible?
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What percentage of essays get read??  I'm guessing it would depend on the school and amount of resources available.  Private elite schools much higher percentage vs state schools with less resources very small percentage...   

 
NewlyRetired said:
My brothers family rhas 2 kids in Northeastern right now, a high school senior who will be going to Northeastern in the fall and a 4th child entering Northeastern Grad School in the fall (she went to Trinity undergrad).   

They all have great things to say about it.

When I visited a ton of schools with my daughter a few years ago, Northeastern was the most impressive to me (I was an engineer before I retired so it was easy to see how good this was for kids).
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Northeastern is a very good school.  Visited with my son a few years back. 

 
Galileo said:
I'm skeptical.  If you know the kid, then sure, it is pretty easy.  But how would someone who has never met you or seen your writing elsewhere have any clue about how you may write?
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I am skeptical too but there are many articles on line that say it is possible.

I also saw this on another chat about this topic.  I don't know how valid it is but it is interesting

"College admissions officers may not be able to prove who you specifically hired and paid to write an application essay or to produce a recommendation, but they do utilize software programs to check for idiosyncrasies in your application as a whole, to determine if even one of your essays was copied from another source or if you purchased responses from multiple vendors. They can search for phrases and sentences that sound unusually similar. Software programs can also check for writing consistency. One response sounds like an 11th grader with a 600 SAT writing ability yet another response reads like someone at Ivy League college level with an 800 SAT writing ability. The last thing any of these top 20 colleges want to waste time on are on deceptive applicants trying to game the application. They need to whittle down the pile by April 1st and can only afford to admit the right people. Anything questionable and you run the risk of getting rejected in less than 2 minutes, no questions asked. Remember, these colleges are not required to provide any explanation at all regarding why an applicant was admitted, waitlisted, or rejected.

 
stlrams said:
What percentage of essays get read??  I'm guessing it would depend on the school and amount of resources available.  Private elite schools much higher percentage vs state schools with less resources very small percentage...   
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I have no idea.  I do know that every college my daughter applied to read her essay because she got comments on it from every college.  But that is only one student.

I know the essays are used to help "break ties" for the students competing for merit scholarships, and similarly they may be used for the kids competing at the bottom of the acceptance list.  But it would not shock me that some kids in the middle (definitely in but not competing for the small amount of merit scholarships) essays are skipped.

 
NewlyRetired said:
I have no idea.  I do know that every college my daughter applied to read her essay because she got comments on it from every college.  But that is only one student.

I know the essays are used to help "break ties" for the students competing for merit scholarships, and similarly they may be used for the kids competing at the bottom of the acceptance list.  But it would not shock me that some kids in the middle (definitely in but not competing for the small amount of merit scholarships) essays are skipped.
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That was my thought that essays are only read if you are on the bubble especially at state schools.  We didn't get any comments for my son after applying to BU, UConn, Bentley, Babson and Bryant.  

 
stlrams said:
What percentage of essays get read??  I'm guessing it would depend on the school and amount of resources available.  Private elite schools much higher percentage vs state schools with less resources very small percentage...   
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Don't know for sure, but my guess is similar to yours with different reasoning.  I think at the elite schools, there are so many applicants with similar stats that they have to look more at the soft side of the app for differentiation.  

 
squidrope said:
My daughter has many friends who have been rejected by most of the schools they applied.  These are good/nice/bright kids with SAT/ACT scores as good or better than hers, unfortunately I think they fail due to being one dimensional.  Have a passion and let it show.  It sucks to hear the news when they get rejected.  Make sure your kid stands out and E.D.    
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This really should not go overlooked.  Whatever that passion may be, show your level of commitment to it.  If two candidates both were 4+ point GPA's, athletes, active in clubs,  volunteers, strong test scores, what is going to set one apart from the other?  Are they just active to list stuff on their resume, or they getting deeply involved with whatever their activities are.  is there something they are passionate enough about to progress to a level of accomplishment in the activity.  Are they sharing their experience and using their skills and passion as a tool for greater good.  For example, both of the students I mentioned earlier may claim a love of soccer and played on their HS team for 4 years, maybe they are both even captains of their team.   Now imagine one of those candidates also helped coach a youth team...or maybe they put in the time and effort to start a summer soccer program for underprivileged kids.  That level of commitment can be a real difference maker.   And it does not matter if these individuals intend to play soccer in college.  Even if your passions change, by showing a deep level of commitment and passion for something is a sign that you will more than likely do that with whatever endeavor you choose next.

Here is an interesting article/blog that addresses this in the context of elite school applicants.  Yes, the guy writing this is plugging his test prep service (no I am not affiliated with it nor do I endorse it), but the general message he is focused on here regarding this idea of developing an area strength is important to be able to set yourself apart form all those other top students.  https://blog.prepscholar.com/how-to-get-into-harvard-and-the-ivy-league-by-a-harvard-alum

 
NewlyRetired said:
I am skeptical too but there are many articles on line that say it is possible.

I also saw this on another chat about this topic.  I don't know how valid it is but it is interesting

"College admissions officers may not be able to prove who you specifically hired and paid to write an application essay or to produce a recommendation, but they do utilize software programs to check for idiosyncrasies in your application as a whole, to determine if even one of your essays was copied from another source or if you purchased responses from multiple vendors. They can search for phrases and sentences that sound unusually similar. Software programs can also check for writing consistency. One response sounds like an 11th grader with a 600 SAT writing ability yet another response reads like someone at Ivy League college level with an 800 SAT writing ability. The last thing any of these top 20 colleges want to waste time on are on deceptive applicants trying to game the application. They need to whittle down the pile by April 1st and can only afford to admit the right people. Anything questionable and you run the risk of getting rejected in less than 2 minutes, no questions asked. Remember, these colleges are not required to provide any explanation at all regarding why an applicant was admitted, waitlisted, or rejected.
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This sort of thing I could see...

 
The_Man said:
Here’s a fun story: parents at Sidwell Friends School (premier DC school where the Obama kids went) try to anonymously sabotage their kids’ classmates college admissions 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/on-parenting/when-parents-are-so-desperate-to-get-their-kids-into-college-that-they-sabotage-other-students/2019/04/02/decc6b9e-5159-11e9-88a1-ed346f0ec94f_story.html?utm_term=.1ebb3513e8d5

The highly respected college Counselor is leaving for a rival school because he’s sick of the insane parents 
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A counselor tried to sabotage my wife's family.  Three kids:

  • The counselor didn't tell the oldest he had gotten National Merit.  The family didn't know about NM and didn't ask about it.
  • Family moved to my town, where the middle kid (my wife) got National Merit.
  • Family moved back to the original town, and the counselor didn't tell the youngest she had gotten NM.  By then, the family knew enough to find out without her.
I can't believe they didn't get that counselor fired.

 
Tick said:
My daughter chose Alabama yesterday during her campus visit.  3 of the 5 families touring the honors dorms were from Michigan (spring break week).  She made the same choice I made in her position 30 years ago (free decent school in a warm climate vs. expensive better school in a cold climate).  She's going for pre-med, so she just wanted to get out of undergraduate with no debt from a good enough school to get into med school.

My wife said people students stopped to help them when they were looking at a map, the weather was great, everyone was cheerful, and the whole tour was perfect.  Interestingly, that's the exact report I gave her after visiting Oklahoma, and all but the good weather was true at A&M, though the cadet corps are a bit goofy.
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Congrats and Roll Tide. 

My daughter is also going to Alabama.  Thankfully, she had early admission and eliminated that stress.  Now the roommate search is almost worse than the college admission process. 

If your daughter is looking for a roommate, let me know.  My daughter is in the honors program, but looking at Pres or one of the other suite style dorms, but still considering the honors dorms. 

 
Galileo said:
I'm skeptical.  If you know the kid, then sure, it is pretty easy.  But how would someone who has never met you or seen your writing elsewhere have any clue about how you may write?
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I'm guessing it's because a 17-year-old isn't going to write like an accomplished novelist, no matter how smart he or she is.  Also, because the point of the essay (or so I'm told) isn't about how well you can write, but how much you reveal of yourself.  And authenticity is difficult when you're writing an essay for someone else.  Then again, I might just be a rube to believe all that stuff.

Edit:  Plus all the technological stuff also mentioned - pretty cool.

 
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Tick said:
A counselor tried to sabotage my wife's family.  Three kids:

  • The counselor didn't tell the oldest he had gotten National Merit.  The family didn't know about NM and didn't ask about it.
  • Family moved to my town, where the middle kid (my wife) got National Merit.
  • Family moved back to the original town, and the counselor didn't tell the youngest she had gotten NM.  By then, the family knew enough to find out without her.
I can't believe they didn't get that counselor fired.
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My high school guidance counselor had no clue I even was in a class of 300. Her only input for me for college was to recommend Miami of Ohio because "it is the Harvard of Midwest".

When I was riding with her to a debate tournament, she asked me if I had taken the SAT and ACT yet. When I told her yes and what my scores were, her eyes widened a bit when she realized that I had the highest ACT score and top 5 SAT score in the class. She proceeded to ask me what my last name was (as that was how students were divided among the 3 guidance counselors) and her face went white when she realized that I was hers and she had no clue who I even was.

The result was...nothing. She proceeded to do nothing else to help me in any way. Never asked me what my plans were, never gave me info on colleges, applications, scholarships, etc. Zip. 

Some people just suck at their jobs.

 
Nigel said:
Literally makes me nauseous reading that. Feel like I failed her. 
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I wouldn't feel that way, and while it is evident the ratio is ridiculously skewed towards ED, I still don't like the process of it.  (1) It forces kids to make a decision much earlier in the process, therefore forcing parents to start the visiting process without knowing which schools are interested in their child (we are currently about $3k in on visits and I foresee another $1.5k to be spent).  My junior daughter plays lacrosse in the spring, so we have to do the tours now and in the fall, as her schedule makes it very hard to visit schools upon general acceptance (unless she just gets into 1-2).  Frankly, it is just lazy admissions processing.  They want to lock in the core of their numbers upfront, and therefore incentivize kids to apply early by making it easier, in a sense.

I do have a question for the masses who have been through the early ED process (or people that just know).  Is scholarship money offered less those who apply ED?  They have you locked in, so I really can't see what the motivation would be to give kids money at that point, but maybe I am wrong?  TIA.

 
GroveDiesel said:
My high school guidance counselor had no clue I even was in a class of 300. Her only input for me for college was to recommend Miami of Ohio because "it is the Harvard of Midwest".

When I was riding with her to a debate tournament, she asked me if I had taken the SAT and ACT yet. When I told her yes and what my scores were, her eyes widened a bit when she realized that I had the highest ACT score and top 5 SAT score in the class. She proceeded to ask me what my last name was (as that was how students were divided among the 3 guidance counselors) and her face went white when she realized that I was hers and she had no clue who I even was.

The result was...nothing. She proceeded to do nothing else to help me in any way. Never asked me what my plans were, never gave me info on colleges, applications, scholarships, etc. Zip. 

Some people just suck at their jobs.
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#humblebrag

 
I guess maybe I don't get the whole Early Decision thing. What's the penalty for  other following through if you're admitted early decision. And is there some sort of national database that prevents you from applying early decision for more than one school? 

 
The_Man said:
Here’s a fun story: parents at Sidwell Friends School (premier DC school where the Obama kids went) try to anonymously sabotage their kids’ classmates college admissions 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/on-parenting/when-parents-are-so-desperate-to-get-their-kids-into-college-that-they-sabotage-other-students/2019/04/02/decc6b9e-5159-11e9-88a1-ed346f0ec94f_story.html?utm_term=.1ebb3513e8d5

The highly respected college Counselor is leaving for a rival school because he’s sick of the insane parents 
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1988...Semi-finals of High School Ultimate Frisbee East Coast Championships...we've traveled from NY for the weekend...we're match against Sidwell Friends in the semis...We go out on the field and look across at the seven guys on Sidwell's starting team.  WTF?!?!  They look like they're 30 years old...several of them have beards.  And one guy who just showed up is introducing himself to his "teammates".  I knew those !@#$%ers were cheating!  Thanks for confirming my suspicions.

 
GroveDiesel said:
I guess maybe I don't get the whole Early Decision thing. What's the penalty for  other following through if you're admitted early decision. And is there some sort of national database that prevents you from applying early decision for more than one school? 
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For us, the school counselor controlled sending the rec letters so she "policed" the EA/ED rules.  

In terms of not following through, some think the school that gets scorned will blacklist the school in future years so your child would have to accept they might be be screwing future grads.  I also think that if the new school gets wind that the kid broke an ED agreement, they will rescind their offer.

 
After all the dust/tears settled my daughter is in at BC and waitlisted at N'wstrn, Claremont McKenna and Vandy. She'll lock in her spot with BC of course but if any of the waitlist spots open up for her she'll likely jump on it. She's contacted her admissions officer at each of the three to express her continued interest and will send them each updated grades, etc. That said the only one she realistically has any shot at, given their histories of how they work the waitlists, is Vandy. So that's the one we're focusing on.

To that end, my wife is flying to Nashville with her a week from Sunday. She has an interview lined up with the admissions guy on Monday morning and is signed up for a 'Dore for a Day visit where she'll have lunch and attend classes with a student that afternoon. My SIL also knows someone in a position of power there and has reached out to him...pulling out all the stops in a last-ditch effort to show interest in a school that quite frankly she wasn't overly interested in until she got rejected everywhere else. Most likely all a big waste of time and money but have to give it a shot.

But honestly I kind of hope she comes home thinking Nashville isn't for her, and maybe BC is the best landing spot after all even if Vandy ends up offering her. This whole process has exposed some emotional fragility that makes the idea of her being too far from home terrifying for me. And I don't mean just typical disappointment about how things with this process have gone, but some profound unhappiness/feelings of loneliness that she's apparently masked for a long time. I think a large part of her being so anti-BC is a false notion that "getting away" will make everything better. The good news is she's agreed to getting some help to work some of this stuff out. In the meantime it hurts like heck to know how sad she is. :(

 
GroveDiesel said:
I guess maybe I don't get the whole Early Decision thing. What's the penalty for  other following through if you're admitted early decision. And is there some sort of national database that prevents you from applying early decision for more than one school? 
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So, it is more of an honor thing than anything else, however, you can get blackballed.  Let's say you apply to a NESCAC school (Middlebury) and then back out - there is a very good chance that those schools talk to one another, and you run a greater risk of not getting in to one of those other schools in regular admission.  Now if it is a financial thing (you did not get enough $$) or mom is sick, you will likely be fine.  You also can damage your high school's reputation - no biggie if you are going to be gone, but again, your guidance counselor (who now has egg on their face) won't work for you in general admissions, or may even let those schools know you backed out of an ED.  Remember, these schools want your $$, so why risk giving a slot to kid who has already shown they may back out.  Plus, if you have siblings at that high school, good luck winning over the guidance department again.  

I think ti really boils down to whether you believe schools share info - I went to a NESCAC school, and I am telling you, probably 80% of the kids that applied to one, applied to multiple.  I am sure there are other groups of schools that get a wave of the same kids applying, and probably talk to one another (Ivies, Lehigh/Layfayette/Dickinson/Muhlenberg, etc.).  If you apply early to Oregon, and pull out, and the remainder of your pool includes Oberlin and Monmouth U, I doubt you would have a problem, since I can't imagine those schools would have much crossover...but this is just from info I have read.

 
Reading this makes me crazy.  My youngest kid just started HS and makes mostly A's and a few B's, but as he says he's "majoring" in baseball. 

We're pretty sure that he'll go somewhere to play, and we've told him that better grades give him way more options.  

On the scary side...............his top choice is Vandy.................Older son got a 50% D1 scholarship to a public D1 university here in Texas.  I quickly did the math that the youngest would have to get approximately 88% at Vandy to get me out at the same cost.  And if you don't know, baseball does not give out fully schollys to anyone. 

To those that are sweating this, good luck.  Make the best of a learning situation and go forward and utilize it for a positive.

 
Nigel said:
After all the dust/tears settled my daughter is in at BC and waitlisted at N'wstrn, Claremont McKenna and Vandy. She'll lock in her spot with BC of course but if any of the waitlist spots open up for her she'll likely jump on it. She's contacted her admissions officer at each of the three to express her continued interest and will send them each updated grades, etc. That said the only one she realistically has any shot at, given their histories of how they work the waitlists, is Vandy. So that's the one we're focusing on.

To that end, my wife is flying to Nashville with her a week from Sunday. She has an interview lined up with the admissions guy on Monday morning and is signed up for a 'Dore for a Day visit where she'll have lunch and attend classes with a student that afternoon. My SIL also knows someone in a position of power there and has reached out to him...pulling out all the stops in a last-ditch effort to show interest in a school that quite frankly she wasn't overly interested in until she got rejected everywhere else. Most likely all a big waste of time and money but have to give it a shot.

But honestly I kind of hope she comes home thinking Nashville isn't for her, and maybe BC is the best landing spot after all even if Vandy ends up offering her. This whole process has exposed some emotional fragility that makes the idea of her being too far from home terrifying for me. And I don't mean just typical disappointment about how things with this process have gone, but some profound unhappiness/feelings of loneliness that she's apparently masked for a long time. I think a large part of her being so anti-BC is a false notion that "getting away" will make everything better. The good news is she's agreed to getting some help to work some of this stuff out. In the meantime it hurts like heck to know how sad she is. :(
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That sucks. I know my son had UNC as his favorite and your daughter didn’t get in there (my son’s still on the waitlist but has pretty much middle fingered them). He was really disappointed but after visiting the Honors Colleges at Clemson and USC, he’s more amped about them than he was about UNC.

It just sucks to here how disappointed and lonely she is because I can’t imagine this process has helped that. Might be way better to be closer. Unless you are there all the time, being on campus and just living outside of the house will be a large separation. She’s going to feel like she’s at BC and not at home, but close enough that if she needs something even just a dinner out, it’s easy.

I’d highly recommend making sure she stays on campus all the time. I’ve seen a couple bad experiences for kids in the neighborhood where the parents bought a house for a daughter to live off campus that helped her alienate herself and she dropped out. She baby sat for us and was a really nice and happy girl so sucked to hear that and she enjoyed her first year. Her parents regret thinking that would be better for her. The other case was a kid who drove home every weekend (2.5 hours) and I didn’t know him but that certainly wasn’t healthy.

 
chet said:
For us, the school counselor controlled sending the rec letters so she "policed" the EA/ED rules.  

In terms of not following through, some think the school that gets scorned will blacklist the school in future years so your child would have to accept they might be be screwing future grads.  I also think that if the new school gets wind that the kid broke an ED agreement, they will rescind their offer.
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What a racket. Would be awesome if people started fighting back and suing these universities for this garbage. We seriously need to begin to dismantle the way universities work these days. Seems like a total scam when you consider how many undergrad classes are taught by freaking TAs at most colleges. We managed to screw up higher education in a major way.

 
stbugs said:
 The other case was a kid who drove home every weekend (2.5 hours) and I didn’t know him but that certainly wasn’t healthy.
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This is my daughter. 

We are towards the end of sophomore year and she has never once stayed over on the weekend.   I was in no way a partier in college but I loved every minute of it.  She barely tolerates it and just counts the minutes until she can come home.

 
GroveDiesel said:
What a racket. Would be awesome if people started fighting back and suing these universities for this garbage. We seriously need to begin to dismantle the way universities work these days. Seems like a total scam when you consider how many undergrad classes are taught by freaking TAs at most colleges. We managed to screw up higher education in a major way.
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I think the way that the radical left is ruining higher education in North America is much worse but that's another topic for another day.

 
GroveDiesel said:
I guess maybe I don't get the whole Early Decision thing. What's the penalty for  other following through if you're admitted early decision. And is there some sort of national database that prevents you from applying early decision for more than one school? 
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Besides the "blackball" issue other raised, I though (don't know for sure) that the student's parents had to sign a guaranty of the 1st year tuition - so if the kid backs out, the parents are still on the hook for the tuition.  Though I guess it's possible for a parent to challenge that obligation, since the school could easily fill that student's spot with another paying customer.  But I wouldn't want to be the parent who spends the legal fees trying to challenge that process.

 
Unbelievable Boston Globe story today - can't link because I'm out of monthly story views. A DC dad bought the Harvard fencing coach's house - assessed at $550,000 - for a million bucks. Then he sold it 3 years later at a $325,000 loss. What happened in the meantime? The DC dad's son was admitted to Harvard as a recruited fencer.

 
The_Man said:
Unbelievable Boston Globe story today - can't link because I'm out of monthly story views. A DC dad bought the Harvard fencing coach's house - assessed at $550,000 - for a million bucks. Then he sold it 3 years later at a $325,000 loss. What happened in the meantime? The DC dad's son was admitted to Harvard as a recruited fencer.
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This type of stuff probably happens way more often than we think. Us middle classers (I’m probably way better off than most so I shouldn’t be too mad) don’t get much in the way of aid and we certainly can buy houses. If our kids aren’t a great diversity option, then don’t even bother applying to top tier schools.

 
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