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WR Tyreek Hill, MIA (5 Viewers)

I can tell HIll has become a polarizing figure on these boards...but as a neutral (non-Chief fan) observer he looks like the real deal to me.  Alex Smith's lack of arm strength simply means he'll catch more short passes and do his damage after the catch.

I've seen him slipping into the 5th round in 12 man's....and he's got a nice upside to outperform that area of the draft.  In a PPR league that starts 3 receivers I'm targeting him as my WR3

 
:rolleyes:  What is he superman now? There are plenty of strong WR's in the NFL, and they get jammed at the line. The dude is 185 pounds soaking wet. I think the secondary can jam him just fine. 

BTW, if we was such an amazing specimen why didn't he tear it up in college? I have seen zero proof that he can do the things you say he can do. Show me tape where he beat an elite #1 corner (off the line not on some trick play).

All I hear from you is nonsense that he is suddenly some superman. 
I'll see you in here after week 2 or 3 and we'll talk. 

 
He is beating double teams in camp, he'll have no problems shredding #1 corners.
Teammates in practice are very different than a top corner with a game on the line. Hill has many good corners/defenses on the docket the first 6 weeks, we can re-visit this then shall we?

Can he be productive? Perhaps, but the hype is getting out of control. I doubt he would have been an afterthought in college and a 5th round pick and then be becomes the next great super receiver. 

 
Teammates in practice are very different than a top corner with a game on the line. Hill has many good corners/defenses on the docket the first 6 weeks, we can re-visit this then shall we?

Can he be productive? Perhaps, but the hype is getting out of control. I doubt he would have been an afterthought in college and a 5th round pick and then be becomes the next great super receiver. 
I would say the hype is just getting where it should have been all along. He's been undervalued all off-season (talking dynasty here).

 
RushHour said:
I would say the hype is just getting where it should have been all along. He's been undervalued all off-season (talking dynasty here).
Funny he looks just like A. Hurns and J. Matthews in 2015......where are they now? Go ahead and over pay for an unproven gimmic player. I'm not buying. Sorry. 

 
Funny he looks just like A. Hurns and J. Matthews in 2015......where are they now? Go ahead and over pay for an unproven gimmic player. I'm not buying. Sorry. 
Your troll game needs work.

I'm excited to see what Hill can do this year. Lots of talent and should have even more opportunities.

He won't sneak up on anyone, but then again nobody in the league can run with him, so I think he'll have a good season.

 
TripItUp said:
He is beating double teams in camp, he'll have no problems shredding #1 corners.
With no real comment about Hill specifically, small shifty guys like Hill always look good in training camp where there is no real hitting or contact.

 
Any chance smith plays more aggressively with mahomes breathing down his neck? I expect smith to start the whole season, but it seems like he's played conservatively because that's what he thought they wanted. Then they draft mahomes and his job is in jeopardy (for the future) and he decides to let it rip maybe a little more often. 

 
The same Kelce who had 85 catches and 1,125 yard last season?  Okay. 

Reid is one of the top offensive play callers in the NFL. It is foolish to argue otherwise. 
Left out 4 TD's. And it took till last year for Reid to get him that fully involved. Hill is early in the process. He is obviously a beast, but Reid absolutely will hold back his potential at least this year IMO.

 
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Jed said:
Reid and Smith are a much bigger issue than his ability to beat the #1 corner.
This team is just 2 years removed from going more than an entire season without a WR catching a TD pass

 
Any chance smith plays more aggressively with mahomes breathing down his neck? I expect smith to start the whole season, but it seems like he's played conservatively because that's what he thought they wanted. Then they draft mahomes and his job is in jeopardy (for the future) and he decides to let it rip maybe a little more often. 
No. I dont think Smith cans spell "aggressively." I expect Hill and Kelce to do stuff with their 5 yard outs or quick slants and drags.

Something that does and will always bother me about Hill, imagine if Hill took a knee during the national anthem instead of punched his pregnant girlfriend. I wouldnt be able to have him on my fantasy team if he took a knee.  

Mahomes will be starting next year, no way Smith is leading this team with his dink and dunks next year. Thats good for Tyreek. 

 
This team is just 2 years removed from going more than an entire season without a WR catching a TD pass
Yeah, RBs and TEs thrive in this offense right now with Smith running things. Do you think Reid is scared to air it out or Smith just cant? 

 
Funny he looks just like A. Hurns and J. Matthews in 2015......where are they now? Go ahead and over pay for an unproven gimmic player. I'm not buying. Sorry. 
Guy trades away Tyreek end of last season. Clearly his stock has risen from that point to now and it is unhinging him that he may have made a mistake

 
Left out 4 TD's. And it took till last year for Reid to get him that fully involved. Hill is early in the process. He is obviously a beast, but Reid absolutely will hold back his potential at least this year IMO.
I didn't mention TDs because those can fluctuate.  

Kelce was 1st in the last year in targets for a TE (and 12th in the entire NFL). Kelce was not full involved the year before when he had 72-875 on 100 targets?  Okay. 

We can quibble all day about this player that year or that player this year, but Reid's success as an offensive play caller cannot be disputed.  Nearly every skill position player he gets his hands on has their most productive years under Reid.  

 
Guy trades away Tyreek end of last season. Clearly his stock has risen from that point to now and it is unhinging him that he may have made a mistake
Do you know what you do when you ASSume? If you read my posts, I traded him this summer, and in several cases netted 1st round picks. I have no regret. The guy did next to nothing in college, made his hay with some trick plays and special teams, and your ready to make him a #1 WR? I don't buy it. When he shows he can get free from an elite corner with the game on the line we can talk. I have yet to see any tape where that happened. 

 
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I wish this forum had a down vote button so Hoffman could see no one likes his postings.

 
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I think the detractors are missing some very key points:

1) tyreek is SPECIAL. He oozes talent. Why this didn't come out in college I don't know.  But he literally LIT up the NFL last yearaan undersized rookie.  And in many games he was The focal point of the offense when maclin was out. 

I don't care how much tape opposing teams have on him.  He's special to the point where you can know what he's going to do but stopping him from doing it is a whole other issue. That's what makes special players special.  

Do you think that opposing defenses had tape to watch on Steve smith after 10 seasons in the league?  Yet he still managed to beat opposing corners every week. Why?  BC he was a special player. I see tyreek as Steve smith lite.  Not as strong or powerful, but super tough and gritty player that plays way bigger than his size. And faster than smith and more versatile.  

Hes also got a nose for the end zone and he's a big play waiting to happen on every touch.  

2) the chiefs have put their faith in him to lead their WRs this year.  They are putting him in a position to showcase his skills and his versatility. So the opportunity is there. 

There's really nothing else to say that sums up why he will do well any better. 

You don't like him?  Don't draft him.  For me, if I can get him and Pryor as my wr2 and 3 this year I'm loving it. 

 
KC is forecast by Vegas to win 3 fewer games in 2017 - 9. they've finished bottom 7 or worse last 3 yrs in a row when it comes to total number of offensive possessions. Hill is a 1 trick pony who now becomes to focus of def. coordinators who will scheme him out of significance.I cant think of a more overrated player than Hill. his TD totals are unsustainable..

Reid's offense will still go thru the rb so it's better to take a shot at K. Hunt than a stab at Hill. we've seen the hyped WR fail in FF year after year after year..Hill will not buck that trend. 

 
I think the detractors are missing some very key points:

1) tyreek is SPECIAL. He oozes talent. Why this didn't come out in college I don't know.  But he literally LIT up the NFL last yearaan undersized rookie.  And in many games he was The focal point of the offense when maclin was out. 

I don't care how much tape opposing teams have on him.  He's special to the point where you can know what he's going to do but stopping him from doing it is a whole other issue. That's what makes special players special.  

Do you think that opposing defenses had tape to watch on Steve smith after 10 seasons in the league?  Yet he still managed to beat opposing corners every week. Why?  BC he was a special player. I see tyreek as Steve smith lite.  Not as strong or powerful, but super tough and gritty player that plays way bigger than his size. And faster than smith and more versatile.  

Hes also got a nose for the end zone and he's a big play waiting to happen on every touch.  

2) the chiefs have put their faith in him to lead their WRs this year.  They are putting him in a position to showcase his skills and his versatility. So the opportunity is there. 

There's really nothing else to say that sums up why he will do well any better. 

You don't like him?  Don't draft him.  For me, if I can get him and Pryor as my wr2 and 3 this year I'm loving it. 
than you not getting them.

 
KC is forecast by Vegas to win 3 fewer games in 2017 - 9. they've finished bottom 7 or worse last 3 yrs in a row when it comes to total number of offensive possessions. Hill is a 1 trick pony who now becomes to focus of def. coordinators who will scheme him out of significance.I cant think of a more overrated player than Hill. his TD totals are unsustainable..

Reid's offense will still go thru the rb so it's better to take a shot at K. Hunt than a stab at Hill. we've seen the hyped WR fail in FF year after year after year..Hill will not buck that trend. 
And I am still betting the under on KC wins

 
1) tyreek is SPECIAL. He oozes talent. Why this didn't come out in college I don't know.  But he literally LIT up the NFL last yearaan undersized rookie.  And in many games he was The focal point of the offense when maclin was out. 

I don't care how much tape opposing teams have on him.  He's special to the point where you can know what he's going to do but stopping him from doing it is a whole other issue. That's what makes special players special.
Attention Canton, please prepare a Bust for T. Hill right now. We are going to waive the requirement that a player get 1,000 yards in a season, 80 catches, or say 10 TD's, oh and that rule that you need to have a track record of more than one season, or that the player is retired, naaaaa waive that obviously Hill is the GOAT!!!  :lmao: :rolleyes:

This is the type of guy that is going to overpay and spend the season with a whole at his WR spot. I can't wait to see it. 

Randy Moss, Marvin Harrison, Beckham, Jerry Rice, move over we have T. Hill..... :thumbup:

 
Thought experiment.

In successive seasons, you give Alex Smith and Andy Reid the following receivers: Randy Moss, Terrell Owens, Jerry Rice.

What is the over / under on average performance of this trio?  80/900/9?

Now, repeat the experiment for Tyreek Hill based on his career resume.

 
Players that produced MORE fantasy points than T. Hill and then disappeared the next year.......

2015: 

J. Maclin (Same team, same situation) -non-factor in 2016

J. Matthews (I can remember the Hype this guy got :)  -was un-startable in 2016

A. Hurns  Ditto -was un-startable in 2016

J. Brown -was un-startable in 2016

2014:

B. Lefell

R. Randle

2013: 

J. Gordon

T. Smith

K. Wright 

H. Douglas

B. Hartline

M. Wallace

N. Washington 

Hill has done nothing in a game to show he can consistently beat one on one coverage with a teams top corner (which he will face every week in 2017). 85% of his production is from Special Teams (few #1 receivers play meaningful special teams snaps) and trick plays on the line where he beats linebackers and DE's to the corner (again this is not the type of play #1 WR's see on a weekly basis). 

I wonder how many players on the list above were over-drafted and KILLED their fantasy owners the next year.  Hill will be added to this list in 2017. 

People think I hate Hill, I don't! He is a great special teams/trick play player which makes him a great FLEX player. He is however not a #1 WR. Again, he did next to nothing in college, and got past 4 rounds in the draft for a reason. I can't wait to see the in-season posts this year when players are crying about how Hill is killing their team, while safer picks would have kept them competitive. 

"Icarus ignored his father's instructions not to fly too close to the sun; when the wax in his wings melted he tumbled out of the sky and fell into the sea",. 

 
Thought experiment.

In successive seasons, you give Alex Smith and Andy Reid the following receivers: Randy Moss, Terrell Owens, Jerry Rice.

What is the over / under on average performance of this trio?  80/900/9?

Now, repeat the experiment for Tyreek Hill based on his career resume.
According to some, T. Hill is already better than those players, so your argument is invalid. 

 
Attention Canton, please prepare a Bust for T. Hill right now. We are going to waive the requirement that a player get 1,000 yards in a season, 80 catches, or say 10 TD's, oh and that rule that you need to have a track record of more than one season, or that the player is retired, naaaaa waive that obviously Hill is the GOAT!!!  :lmao: :rolleyes:

This is the type of guy that is going to overpay and spend the season with a whole at his WR spot. I can't wait to see it. 

Randy Moss, Marvin Harrison, Beckham, Jerry Rice, move over we have T. Hill..... :thumbup:
Hey man I can't help it if I can see talent earlier than you can.   That's on you.  

By no means am I saying he's any of the guys you mentioned based on PRODUCTION.  I just have eyes and ears and I observe.  

I don't think the 4th rd is reaching at all for a guy who oozes talent and is the #1 wr on his team.  

But hey, differing opinions is what makes fantasy football fun.  

So if I'm wrong on Hill, I will personally come back into this thread and eat my crow. 

But if you are wrong, will you?  

It's much easier to take your stance than it is for me to take mine.  Like you said, hill hasn't caught 1000 yards receiving yet.  

The thing is, hill doesn't need to log 1000 yards receiving to score like a high end wr2.  He also runs the ball from the backfield.  He's a weapon. 

Anyway, I have no interest in any sort of back and forth with you.  BC it's all conjecture.  I go with my gut and my gut tells me I want this kid on my teams this year.  If I'm wrong so be it.  I've been wrong before!

but if I'm right, well than I've got an explosive playmaker in the 4th or 5th rd.  

 
He also runs the ball from the backfield.
How many #1 WR's run players from the backfield on a regular basis? The Chiefs are Paper-thin at WR, you think they are going to use Hill the same way not that he is the only vertical threat on the team? I doubt it. And when they do put him in the backfield, who is going to keep the defense from loading the box? 

 
Players that produced MORE fantasy points than T. Hill and then disappeared the next year.......

2015: 

J. Maclin (Same team, same situation) -non-factor in 2016

J. Matthews (I can remember the Hype this guy got :)  -was un-startable in 2016

A. Hurns  Ditto -was un-startable in 2016

J. Brown -was un-startable in 2016

2014:

B. Lefell

R. Randle

2013: 

J. Gordon

T. Smith

K. Wright 

H. Douglas

B. Hartline

M. Wallace

N. Washington 

Hill has done nothing in a game to show he can consistently beat one on one coverage with a teams top corner (which he will face every week in 2017). 85% of his production is from Special Teams (few #1 receivers play meaningful special teams snaps) and trick plays on the line where he beats linebackers and DE's to the corner (again this is not the type of play #1 WR's see on a weekly basis). 

I wonder how many players on the list above were over-drafted and KILLED their fantasy owners the next year.  Hill will be added to this list in 2017. 

People think I hate Hill, I don't! He is a great special teams/trick play player which makes him a great FLEX player. He is however not a #1 WR. Again, he did next to nothing in college, and got past 4 rounds in the draft for a reason. I can't wait to see the in-season posts this year when players are crying about how Hill is killing their team, while safer picks would have kept them competitive. 

"Icarus ignored his father's instructions not to fly too close to the sun; when the wax in his wings melted he tumbled out of the sky and fell into the sea",. 
Btw I also think it's funny how you're this new guy on the boards with your approx 240 posts and you're already pegging people like "this is the type of guy".

really, you shouldn't claim to know anything about any of us.  There are many long standing people in this forum who aware of each other's thought processes and tendencies with players and drafting.  And you're not one of them. 

I also see that you seem to be offending several others with your posts.  If you're looking to stay around these boards for a long time I recommend you change your tone and eat a little humble pie. 

People do get booted for being intense jagoffs.  

 
Btw I also think it's funny how you're this new guy on the boards with your approx 240 posts and you're already pegging people like "this is the type of guy".

really, you shouldn't claim to know anything about any of us.  There are many long standing people in this forum who aware of each other's thought processes and tendencies with players and drafting.  And you're not one of them. 

I also see that you seem to be offending several others with your posts.  If you're looking to stay around these boards for a long time I recommend you change your tone and eat a little humble pie. 

People do get booted for being intense jagoffs.  
Thanks for the advice, I'm so glad your here to "show me the ropes", I've been visiting these board since 2001 so, I think I'll be just fine. I don't need to eat any humble pie till I'm wrong. 

 
Btw I also think it's funny how you're this new guy on the boards with your approx 240 posts and you're already pegging people like "this is the type of guy".

really, you shouldn't claim to know anything about any of us.  There are many long standing people in this forum who aware of each other's thought processes and tendencies with players and drafting.  And you're not one of them. 

I also see that you seem to be offending several others with your posts.  If you're looking to stay around these boards for a long time I recommend you change your tone and eat a little humble pie. 

People do get booted for being intense jagoffs.  
Reminds me of the guy who posted here for years and had supposedly been a shock jock in Detroit, but then got banned several times for being disrespectful and trolling people. Can't remember all the account names, but one was something like J**US*T CU**Z (some weird combo of all caps and asterisks).

 
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Reminds me of the guy who posted here for years and had supposedly been a shock jock in Detroit, but then got banned several times for being disrespectful and trolling people. Can't remember all the account names, but one was something like J**US*T CU**Z (some weird combo of all caps and asterisks).
Show me where I have done any trolling? I state my opinions, back them up with facts, and then I defend them. The only time I get into debates is when some elitist on the boards tell me how I should post on "their boards",.  :rolleyes: . Everyone here should be treated here equally because everyone here had their posts in the 100's at some point. This is not some stuffly country club, there everyone has "the fourth" after their name so get off your high horse. 

As of now, I have an excellent rating in the community, and no "warning points", so you you can stop tell me how I should behave...

 
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Show me where I have done any trolling? I state my opinions, back them up with facts, and then I defend them. The only time I get into debates is when some elitist on the boards tell me how I should post on "their boards",.  :rolleyes: . Everyone here should be treated here equally because everyone here had their posts in the 100's at some point. This is not some stuff country club, there everyone has "the fourth" after their name so get off your high horse. 

As of now, I have an excellent rating in the community, and no "warning points", so you you can stop tell me how I should behave...
You say that you've "been visiting these board(s) since 2001" yet your hoffman0001 account has only been active since August 2012. Did you post under any other account names from 2001 until 2012 while you were "visiting" or did you just lurk for 11 years and remain silent before establishing this account?

 
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You say that you've "been visiting these board since 2001" yet your hoffman0001 account has only been active since August 2012. Did you post under any other account names from 2001 until 2012 while you were "visiting" or did you just lurk for 11 years and remain silent before establishing this account?
Let's see I took a few years away from posting and I forgot my log-in info. Is that OK, inspector? Perhaps you want to waterboard me? Seriously it should not matter how long anyone has been here, Everyone has equal status, and no one has the right to monitor or supervise the boards, outside of the moderators so why does everyone from the "old guard" feel they can push new people around? I wonder how many new users this site has lost over the years because if these attitudes?

Again, I don't troll, but I do defend my positions (or am I only "allowed" to do that after I have a 1,000 posts?) and yes, I will push back when some "board king", wants to tell ANYONE how it "should be",. Again, the moderators and staff, and do this all day, cause they have the authority. you, SIR do not. 

 
I'd love to stop having these discussions, if we could keep to the topics and not "keep score" about how long someone has been here, or how many posts they may have. 

 

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