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Just now, msommer said:

So Trump already had Leonard Cohen killed. What's up with that?

"Gays music" 

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Just now, Otis said:

"Gays music" 

He probably perceived "First we take Manhattan" as a threat

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1 hour ago, Otis said:

Anyone else notice that in his meeting with Obama, Trump looked more somber than ever.  He was like a deer in the headlights. Like he just sat through a meeting with the president and the gravity of this finally hit him, and -- even for a guy with his bravado -- he walked out feeling like "holy ####, I'm woefully unprepared, what the hell have I gotten myself into."

 

I definitely remember 2008, a day or two after the election, and Obama got his first trip to the White House and that first real national security briefing as President-Elect. He'd run on a platform of bashing W's wars, the foreign policy, Gitmo, Patriot Act, slamming McCain as "Bush's Third Term"...

It was immediately after that meeting that Obama's mood changed. Stuff started getting scrubbed from the campaign website. Stopped making certain promises and using some of the anti-war language in his speeches. It was physically visible on his face immediately after that meeting.

Gitmo is still open, by the way, and Obama set the record for longest time served as President in wartime.

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1 minute ago, money.never.sleeps said:

something that is long gone in this world..

Two chicks at the same time is still available. So I'm told. 

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33 minutes ago, FreeBaGeL said:

Really really good article.

One thing I don't get though is why that drives them to Trump in particular.  Trump is city.  He's New York.  I'm not sure anyone has seen him wearing anything other than a suit.  Born rich with everything handed to him.  Rides around in limos and on his private jet.  Not religious.  Has he even ever had a boss?  He even has the big orange hair of someone from the Hunger Games capitol.

He seems to be the absolute embodiment of everything the article claims they hate/fear.  Is it just because he said "I'm going to make jobs"?

If the elites look down upon you and call you stupid, that's an identifying mark that really resonates with rural types.

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5 minutes ago, money.never.sleeps said:

something that is long gone in this world..

The Silmarillion?

Too soon?

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1 hour ago, mr roboto said:

It's cause he says what they are thinking. He's gamed the elites' system. Made money off of them. I'm pretty sure when he got called out on his own personal use of work visa employees he basically said 'well yeah. I took advantage of every rule I could.'  Even though restricting this program is a part of his platform. 

I guess.  The more I think of it though, I dunno.  I'm wrestling with it a bit.

My wife grew up on a farm in rural Florida.  I guess that's less relevant since she has lived with me in the city for the last 10 years, but I knew her when she lived on the farm and there's no way she would have voted for someone like Trump.

Her folks still live out there.  Their big life's work after she left for school was to sell everything they had and buy a big plot of land out in the middle of nowhere and her dad built three houses there.  One for them and one for each of his other two daughters (thankfully I dodged that bullet).  They find Trump disgusting.  My FIL is the kind of guy who thinks men should act like gentlemen.  He's the kind of guy who greeted me at the door with a shotgun the first time I took his daughter out.  Trump is the kind of guy that he'd punch in the face, not root for.  I guess I should be more thankful that my in-laws are able to see through all those things mentioned in the article and reject a candidate that supports sexism and racism.  I'm almost certain the entire rest of her extended family voted for Trump.

It's definitely interesting how much these things can color who we are.  I think my youth is pretty unique relative to most FBGs as I'm a white guy that grew up in a predominately black area.  I was one of about 100 white kids in my high school of 2200 students.  So much like they feel disenfranchised when people act like they're just a bunch illiterate hicks I feel the same way when people characterize black people as just a bunch of lazy entitled moochers.  Remember those crazy high costs for living in the city that Jayrod's article was referencing?  Those are the prices they're trying to pay, and not being able to pay them doesn't mean they're not working hard.

I don't even know what point I'm getting at here or if I'm even moving towards one.  Just kind of rambling.  I would like to think that sexism and racism would be a dealbreaker for everyone no matter the circumstances, but I guess that's not the case and that article helps understand it.  It's not really even the rural crowd that bothers me though.  I live in a nice neighborhood around a bunch of well-off white Christians with signs in their yards for Trump, a guy whom even Jesus would probably be like "woah now, even I can't save that guy".  One of my friends out here is a well-off white guy with a hispanic wife and four half-hispanic daughters.  He's like the biggest Trump supporter I've seen.  Spends all day talking up Trump on facebook.  He's LDS and he hates Mitt Romney for not endorsing Trump.  Mitt Freaking Romney.  I don't get it. 

Edited by FreeBaGeL
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3 minutes ago, FreeBaGeL said:

I guess.  The more I think of it though, I dunno.  I'm wrestling with it a bit.

My wife grew up on a farm in rural Florida.  I guess that's less relevant since she has lived with me in the city for the last 10 years, but I knew her when she lived on the farm and there's no way she would have voted for someone like Trump.

Her folks still live out there.  Their big life's work after she left for school was to sell everything they had and buy a big plot of land out in the middle of nowhere and her dad built three houses there.  One for them and one for each of his other two daughters (thankfully I dodged that bullet).  They find Trump disgusting.  My FIL is the kind of guy who thinks men should act like gentlemen.  He's the kind of guy who greeted me at the door with a shotgun the first time I took his daughter out.  Trump is the kind of guy that he'd punch in the face, not root for.  I guess I should be more thankful that my in-laws are able to see through all those things mentioned in the article and reject a candidate that supports sexism and racism.  I'm almost certain the entire rest of her extended family voted for Trump.

It's definitely interesting how much these things can color who we are.  I think my youth is pretty unique relative to most FBGs as I'm a white guy that grew up in a predominately black area.  I was one of about 100 white kids in my high school of 2200 students.  So much like they feel disenfranchised when people act like they're just a bunch illiterate hicks I feel the same way when people characterize black people as just a bunch of lazy entitled moochers.  Remember those crazy high costs for living in the city that Jayrod's article was referencing?  Those are the prices they're trying to pay, and not being able to pay them doesn't mean they're not working hard.

I mean sure, there were the ####heads that spent their day taking $400 uninsured ambulance rides they had no intention of paying for to get to the doctor so they could try and dupe them out of some prescription meds before stopping by and collecting their food stamps on the way back home to drugs and tv, but those were certainly the outliers.  No different than the outliers among the extended family and friends of my wife's family that sit around all day out in the country collecting government disability for the last 8 years on their sprained wrist while complaining about whiney entitled black people accepting government handouts.  But the majority of the folks I knew were nothing like that.  They worked hard, but all that stuff costs more in the city than it does in the country and they didn't get the same opportunities I did, and they just needed a little help.

I don't even know what point I'm getting at here or if I'm even moving towards one.  Just kind of rambling.  I would like to think that sexism and racism would be a dealbreaker for everyone no matter the circumstances, but I guess that's not the case and that article helps understand it.  It's not really even the rural crowd that bothers me though.  I live in a nice neighborhood around a bunch of well-off white Christians with signs in their yards for Trump, a guy whom even Jesus would probably be like "woah now, even I can't save that guy".  One of my friends out here is a well-off white guy with a hispanic wife and four half-hispanic daughters.  He's like the biggest Trump supporter I've seen.  Spends all day talking up Trump on facebook.  He's LDS and he hates Mitt Romney for not endorsing Trump.  Mitt Freaking Romney.  I don't get it. 

Ten years ago the rustbelt wouldn't have voted for a Trump either.  A lot can change in a decade.

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1 hour ago, Otis said:

Anyone else notice that in his meeting with Obama, Trump looked more somber than ever.  He was like a deer in the headlights. Like he just sat through a meeting with the president and the gravity of this finally hit him, and -- even for a guy with his bravado -- he walked out feeling like "holy ####, I'm woefully unprepared, what the hell have I gotten myself into."

Probably just learned about the terms of our treaty with the alien overlords.

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2 hours ago, Otis said:

Anyone else notice that in his meeting with Obama, Trump looked more somber than ever.  He was like a deer in the headlights. Like he just sat through a meeting with the president and the gravity of this finally hit him, and -- even for a guy with his bravado -- he walked out feeling like "holy ####, I'm woefully unprepared, what the hell have I gotten myself into."

He finally had to sit face to face with the guy he's made wild and unfounded accusations about for the last 5 years. His demeanor was a mix of embarrassment and cowardliness.  He probably had to fart too.

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24 minutes ago, FreeBaGeL said:

I guess.  The more I think of it though, I dunno.  I'm wrestling with it a bit.

My wife grew up on a farm in rural Florida.  I guess that's less relevant since she has lived with me in the city for the last 10 years, but I knew her when she lived on the farm and there's no way she would have voted for someone like Trump.

Her folks still live out there.  Their big life's work after she left for school was to sell everything they had and buy a big plot of land out in the middle of nowhere and her dad built three houses there.  One for them and one for each of his other two daughters (thankfully I dodged that bullet).  They find Trump disgusting.  My FIL is the kind of guy who thinks men should act like gentlemen.  He's the kind of guy who greeted me at the door with a shotgun the first time I took his daughter out.  Trump is the kind of guy that he'd punch in the face, not root for.  I guess I should be more thankful that my in-laws are able to see through all those things mentioned in the article and reject a candidate that supports sexism and racism.  I'm almost certain the entire rest of her extended family voted for Trump.

It's definitely interesting how much these things can color who we are.  I think my youth is pretty unique relative to most FBGs as I'm a white guy that grew up in a predominately black area.  I was one of about 100 white kids in my high school of 2200 students.  So much like they feel disenfranchised when people act like they're just a bunch illiterate hicks I feel the same way when people characterize black people as just a bunch of lazy entitled moochers.  Remember those crazy high costs for living in the city that Jayrod's article was referencing?  Those are the prices they're trying to pay, and not being able to pay them doesn't mean they're not working hard.

I don't even know what point I'm getting at here or if I'm even moving towards one.  Just kind of rambling.  I would like to think that sexism and racism would be a dealbreaker for everyone no matter the circumstances, but I guess that's not the case and that article helps understand it.  It's not really even the rural crowd that bothers me though.  I live in a nice neighborhood around a bunch of well-off white Christians with signs in their yards for Trump, a guy whom even Jesus would probably be like "woah now, even I can't save that guy".  One of my friends out here is a well-off white guy with a hispanic wife and four half-hispanic daughters.  He's like the biggest Trump supporter I've seen.  Spends all day talking up Trump on facebook.  He's LDS and he hates Mitt Romney for not endorsing Trump.  Mitt Freaking Romney.  I don't get it. 

Trump appealed to the frustration of America. And that frustration has been bubbling under the surface for years in all demographics. The Clintons represented the status quo. And the status quo absolutely sucks for a lot of people.

The frustration of America knows no demographic. The Clintons banked their campaign on people who needed them and their government to help them pay their bills. Trump banked his campaign on people who pay their own bills and are having a hard time doing so.

And that is the entire middle class. Cities and outskirts of cities and yes, the rural demographic. The pundits think white rural America won this for Trump.

No - pissed off American won this for Trump.

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10 hours ago, Doug B said:

Didn't say that.

Succinctly: a racist president in 2016 can't roll societal progress back. Trump can't undo things ... he can't make American society today anything like American society of 60 years ago.

I don't know if racist people will ever totally go away -- tribalism is strong in human beings. However, racist people -- especially if they act publicly on their racism -- will continue to be marginalized more and more as time passes.

A nice chronicle here of hate crimes today in the name of Trump.

https://mobile.twitter.com/i/moments/796417517157830656?m=1

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3 minutes ago, ChiefD said:

Trump appealed to the frustration of America. And that frustration has been bubbling under the surface for years in all demographics. The Clintons represented the status quo. And the status quo absolutely sucks for a lot of people.

The frustration of America knows no demographic. The Clintons banked their campaign on people who needed them and their government to help them pay their bills. Trump banked his campaign on people who pay their own bills and are having a hard time doing so.

And that is the entire middle class. Cities and outskirts of cities and yes, the rural demographic. The pundits think white rural America won this for Trump.

No - pissed off American won this for Trump.

:goodposting:

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7 minutes ago, Willie Neslon said:

He finally had to sit face to face with the guy he's made wild and unfounded accusations about for the last 5 years. His demeanor was a mix of embarrassment and cowardliness.  He probably had to fart too.

Same guy who used a national audience/ white house dinner  to call him out for 7 mins  on how he was a loser & not POTUS. WHOOPS  :scared:

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6 minutes ago, money.never.sleeps said:

Same guy who used a national audience/ white house dinner  to call him out for 7 mins  on how he was a loser & not POTUS. WHOOPS  :scared:

Exactly. The Left can't see both sides,  though. 

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12 minutes ago, ChiefD said:

The frustration of America knows no demographic. The Clintons banked their campaign on people who needed them and their government to help them pay their bills. Trump banked his campaign on people who pay their own bills and are having a hard time doing so.

And that is the entire middle class. Cities and outskirts of cities and yes, the rural demographic. The pundits think white rural America won this for Trump.

No - pissed off American won this for Trump.

Anyone lower or middle class who voted Trump for economic reasons didn't pay attention to the platforms of the candidates. I know it was never about their platforms in this election and it was largely rhetoric from both sides but if you voted for Trump over Hillary on an economic basis (and you are low-moderate income), you are a moron. The results actually bear this out, with Clinton winning among the lowest wage owners in the country.

If people want to say they voted for Trump to "send a message" or for immigration reasons or racist reasons or several other reasons that's fine, at least he's the right option to do that but for the love of god, if people voted Trump because the are having a hard time paying their bills, they made an awful choice.

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29 minutes ago, money.never.sleeps said:

You've definitely never sat at the "cool" table.    Ever... :no:

Figured you'd :whoosh:

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13 minutes ago, money.never.sleeps said:

Same guy who used a national audience/ white house dinner  to call him out for 7 mins  on how he was a loser & not POTUS. WHOOPS  :scared:

Big difference between the ribbing that goes on in that setting and what DT was doing. Obama was being funny, Trump was just being an #######.

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3 minutes ago, Willie Neslon said:

Big difference between the ribbing that goes on in that setting and what DT was doing. Obama was being funny, Trump was just being an #######.

No doubt.  Why it's so funny now. Most awkward sob throw your hands up  laughing moment in history.  

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Just now, money.never.sleeps said:

No doubt.  Why it's so funny now. Most awkward sob throw your hands up  laughing moment in history.  

This shtick sucks, fyi.

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25 minutes ago, money.never.sleeps said:

Same guy who used a national audience/ white house dinner  to call him out for 7 mins  on how he was a loser & not POTUS. WHOOPS  :scared:

That is the whole point of that dinner. To make fun of people. 

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2 hours ago, FreeBaGeL said:

One thing I don't get though is why that drives them to Trump in particular.  Trump is city.  He's New York.  I'm not sure anyone has seen him wearing anything other than a suit.  Born rich with everything handed to him.  Rides around in limos and on his private jet.  Not religious.  Has he even ever had a boss?  He even has the big orange hair of someone from the Hunger Games capitol.

He seems to be the absolute embodiment of everything the article claims they hate/fear.  Is it just because he said "I'm going to make jobs"?

 

"Class" in America is not about income. It's not about race. "Class" in America is defined differently. It's a particular social style. We almost have a social caste system. There's NASCAR guys, there's tattoo guys, fine wine and cheese party guys, Harley guys, each is full of guys who are in the same "class" regardless of their income. The guy who followed the Grateful Dead across the country in his VW microbus was in the same "class"  as the one who did it from his Porsche. 

Probably the best one to point to is your typical "white trash" class. Think of some white trash guy. Now imagine that guy wins the ####### lottery and is gifted a Billion with a B dollars. Guy is ###-over-teakettle rich. How's he gonna behave? He's the kind of trash idiot who would buy himself stupid stuff with his money. He'd buy himself a skyscraper, plate it in gold, and put his damn name right on the front. He'd buy a casino and name it after himself. He'd buy a restaurant, or a mail-order steak company, and name it after himself. He'd be big-shot rich trash guy making it rain everywhere, handing out party favors to everyone. Buy his own private jet then his own private airline, and put his damn name on every plane. Probably bankrupt every venture, and never learn from it, and just piss away his money on the next one. 

 

Trump is one of them. He behaves like their own Bubba who hit it big.

Edited by Walking Boot
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26 minutes ago, Jim11 said:

People like to make up lotsa #####, Can't believe you'd fall for it.

Speaking of people falling for made up stuff, in addition to removing the muslim ban from his website yesterday, Trump has now also completely reversed his policy on South Korea. http://www.vox.com/world/2016/11/10/13585524/donald-trump-phone-call-south-korea-park-geun-hye  Good news obviously, but it's going to be awesome watching everyone who voted for him turn on him as he reveals he's just another politician.

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1 hour ago, Northern Voice said:

Anyone lower or middle class who voted Trump for economic reasons didn't pay attention to the platforms of the candidates. I know it was never about their platforms in this election and it was largely rhetoric from both sides but if you voted for Trump over Hillary on an economic basis (and you are low-moderate income), you are a moron. The results actually bear this out, with Clinton winning among the lowest wage owners in the country.

If people want to say they voted for Trump to "send a message" or for immigration reasons or racist reasons or several other reasons that's fine, at least he's the right option to do that but for the love of god, if people voted Trump because the are having a hard time paying their bills, they made an awful choice.

Donald Trump's presidency is going to be a disaster for the white working class

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1 hour ago, Walking Boot said:

Trump is one of them. He behaves like their own Bubba who hit it big.

Well said.  Even though Trump was born rich, he lives this fantasy life poor people imagine rich people live like, or dream of living.  "I'm gonna have solid gold doorknobs, molding, and toilets.  I'm gonna bang exotic models with accents who are grateful to be with me because chicks dig dudes with money.  And my name isn't going to be on my shirt or my desk: it's gonna be in big letters on the ####### building.  I'm still gonna eat KFC, but I'm bringing the bucket on my private plane with my name written on it in gold."

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1 hour ago, Northern Voice said:

Speaking of people falling for made up stuff, in addition to removing the muslim ban from his website yesterday, Trump has now also completely reversed his policy on South Korea. http://www.vox.com/world/2016/11/10/13585524/donald-trump-phone-call-south-korea-park-geun-hye  Good news obviously, but it's going to be awesome watching everyone who voted for him turn on him as he reveals he's just another politician.

I'm not sure"everyone" who voted for him was 100% onboard with every campaign sound byte.

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49 minutes ago, Master of Past and Present said:

Portland, OR police are now considering the Trump protest to be a riot.

Riot - the unbeatable high!

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1 hour ago, Jim11 said:
2 hours ago, Northern Voice said:

A nice chronicle here of hate crimes today in the name of Trump.

https://mobile.twitter.com/i/moments/796417517157830656?m=1

People like to make up lotsa #####, Can't believe you'd fall for it.

As opposed to what?  Like you falling for David Koresh? 

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2 hours ago, Northern Voice said:

Anyone lower or middle class who voted Trump for economic reasons didn't pay attention to the platforms of the candidates. I know it was never about their platforms in this election and it was largely rhetoric from both sides but if you voted for Trump over Hillary on an economic basis (and you are low-moderate income), you are a moron. The results actually bear this out, with Clinton winning among the lowest wage owners in the country.

If people want to say they voted for Trump to "send a message" or for immigration reasons or racist reasons or several other reasons that's fine, at least he's the right option to do that but for the love of god, if people voted Trump because the are having a hard time paying their bills, they made an awful choice.

Excellent post.  

Trump just three card monty'd economically disenfranchised people.  

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1 hour ago, Master of Past and Present said:

Portland, OR police are now considering the Trump protest to be a riot.

Just wait until the #### really hits the fan. This is nothing.

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5 hours ago, jonessed said:

He spoke to them like he understood them.  It's not much, but it was a lot more than the Democrats offered.

JD Bell said it best when he said that he speaks "the common tongue"

 

 

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@Rove! @jonessed two guys who voted for Trump and can't admit it.  I VOTED FOR GARY JOHNSON!@!@!!!!!!! :lmao:

So sad, glad I'm not them! 

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14 hours ago, SoBeDad said:

If Trump made all these inroads into non-white voters, why did Hillary win the popular vote? She must've made inroads too. 

You realize Obama won the popular vote in 2012, right?

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19 hours ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

you didn't like people rubbing the ejection in your face.

If anyone is keeping track, I'm with Tobias on this one.  Maybe if you gave me time to build up to it.

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These protests are gross. It only makes everything worse. I can't stand Trump, but lets wait until he does something awful as President before we protest here. 

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18 hours ago, TobiasFunke said:

Trump will do nothing to improve race relations until he owns his own checkered past (Central Park Five, housing discrimination case), forcefully rejects the extremists attacking minorities online and in real life in his name, at least acknowledges that many African-Americans saw his birtherism as racism even if he wants to deny that as a factor in his mind, stops referring to the black community as a monolith that resides in hellish "inner cities," and shows at least some measure of empathy and desire for reconciliation.  These are very easy steps he could take that I think could do wonders to assuage the fear and anger and frustration that many minorities- black and otherwise- feel right now. He could do them in ten minutes.

I have a hard time believing he'll take on the more difficult tasks associated with race relations if he doesn't even bother to take on the easy ones.

Yes, I'm very much in a I'll believe it when I see it mode but it would be great if somebody could get to him and say "we've got a chance to do some historic things here" - I think that would appeal to him.  More likely he just takes cares of his cronies but one can hope.

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7 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

These protests are gross. It only makes everything worse. I can't stand Trump, but lets wait until he does something awful as President before we protest here. 

I heard an interview on NPR on the way home last night with one of the protestors who was talking about how he's not politically active and didn't even vote, but now "just had to do something." Just sounded like a total idiot.

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