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***Chicago Bears Thread*** Poles is playing 5D chess! (6 Viewers)
- Thread starter flapgreen
- Start date
twistd
Footballguy
I’m reading that the Bears are in the running for Landry. If the Bears trade for Landry and sign him to a big extension I think it will turn out to be as stupid as the Glennon signing. Landry is a pretty good slot receiver, that is it. He has produced because of massive volume. The Bears need an X receiver, not a pretty good slot receiver.
The Bears need more than one WR. Landry would be a massive upgrade over what they have (although I'm hoping for a strong Meredith comeback) and he fills a need. I don't think it would be like the Glennon signing at all.
twistd
Footballguy
They certainly need help at the WR position. But the tag is $14 million for Landry. I think that is the type of money he is looking for. That is way, way too much money for a slot receiver. That is what I fear. They would have to give up pick compensation, and sign him to a sizable extension. That is my problem with it.
flapgreen
Footballguy
I'm fine with paying Landry 14 million, but not along with a good pick. I think Miami will end up rescinding the tag, though. They're not going to get a good pick, along with getting another team to sign Landry to a contract that he will accept. That's a ton for any receiver. I think it's more likely they sign a guy like Wlison, along with another mid-tier wr and draft a 3rd. Pace has shown he's aggressive at going after positions where the team is weak. Gonna need to re-sign Fuller and another CB, too. The Bears still need a lot more talent, but they're slowly adding more.
And they'll need to extend Goldman and Amos. Maybe Callahan, too.
Deranged Hermit
Not cool & Pissed
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
found it
NBC Sports Chicago's John Mullin reports the Bears and Dolphins "have had conversations" about a trade involving Jordan Howard and Jarvis Landry.
According to Mullin, the discussed deal would send Howard and the No. 8 pick to Miami in exchange for Landry, the No. 11 pick, and a third-round selection. Howard has been the engine of the offense since the Bears selected him in the fifth round of the 2016 draft, gaining 2,858 yards from scrimmage in two seasons. Mullin reports new coach Matt Nagy has concerns about Howard's fit in his offense, however, specifically in the passing game. Pro Football Focus has charted Howard with 14 drops in just two seasons.
Source: NBC Sports Chicag
NBC Sports Chicago's John Mullin reports the Bears and Dolphins "have had conversations" about a trade involving Jordan Howard and Jarvis Landry.
According to Mullin, the discussed deal would send Howard and the No. 8 pick to Miami in exchange for Landry, the No. 11 pick, and a third-round selection. Howard has been the engine of the offense since the Bears selected him in the fifth round of the 2016 draft, gaining 2,858 yards from scrimmage in two seasons. Mullin reports new coach Matt Nagy has concerns about Howard's fit in his offense, however, specifically in the passing game. Pro Football Focus has charted Howard with 14 drops in just two seasons.
Source: NBC Sports Chicag
flapgreen
Footballguy
I get it's a "fit" thing but Bears shouldn't even consider this without at least an additional 3rd rounder. The 8th for 11th and a 3rd rounder is essentially a wash. So trading Howard for Landry along with a huge contract would be foolish. No thanks
RBM
Footballguy
Would only show the stupidity of this organization never goes away, and attaches itself to anyone that enters Halas Hall.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
RBM
Footballguy
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-OZ-
Footballguy
Howard is a fine back but he's replaceable. Not his fault, most backs are replaceable.
If they cost the same, Landry would help the bears more than Howard and they could fairly easily sign or rest a new running back to pair with Cohen.
But considering how much more they'd have to pay Landry, it wouldn't be a smart trade.
flapgreen
Footballguy
Let the games begin!
On #Dolphins Jarvis Landry, again: #NFL teams had no indication from Miami in terms of his trade price. The #Bears/Jordan Howard trade report came off like an attempt by Miami to stimulate offers. Bit it was a standstill. With Landry signing tag, Miami will have to figure it out.
On #Dolphins Jarvis Landry, again: #NFL teams had no indication from Miami in terms of his trade price. The #Bears/Jordan Howard trade report came off like an attempt by Miami to stimulate offers. Bit it was a standstill. With Landry signing tag, Miami will have to figure it out.
RBM
Footballguy
Disagree and it’s not even close imo. Howard can take over a game any week. He’s not as replaceable as you think. Landry isn’t doing that. He’d be a reliable chain mover for Mitch, but nothing more. He’s not threatening any D downfield, not changing any games.
-OZ-
Footballguy
He's had some great games for sure. Maybe when his team improves he'll be more consistent but he sure hasn't been consistent yet.
A reliable chain mover would be huge for the bears.
I don't think they should make the trade, but I do think finding another very good RB is easier than a consistent receiver.
RBM
Footballguy
That’s my big thing. He’s been so good on a historically bad/vanilla offense.-OZ- said:
I hate how the rb position got to a point where good workhorse types were this under-appreciated. I think the position is making a big comeback now though. They’re back in the first round, top ten even with regularity and they’re carrying offenses again.
Boone22
Footballguy
Agreed but I was also agreeing with the idea that he’s not a game changer. He’s a reliable compiler who may or may not get the same number of targets as he got in Miami if he were to go to the Bears. If he gets significantly less targets, then he becomes an Albert Wilson type player.
I see what you are saying, but I would think if they acquired Landry, than Landry becomes the centerpiece of the passing game. 140 targets would be likely, plus Trubisky's strength is throwing in between the numbers.
I understand the Wilson connection to Nagy, but man, Wilson has done almost nothing to think he's even a good #3 WR. If the Nagy connection didn't exist, would anyone even be talking about Wilson?
Landry is a #1 WR in my opinion, maybe its not in the ideal, Julio Jones kind of way, but he can absolutely have a passing game built around him. I'd rather have him than any other FA WR.
Statorama
gangster
Landry, to me, is a "between the 20's" kinda guy. He's the guy that gets you near the redzone so someone else can pound it in or take a jump pass. He's nice to have (REAL nice to have) but you can't break the bank for a dude like that when you don't have the supporting cast to make him effective. Landry is basically a younger Edelman (please don't make me pull out the historical stats and their relative size comparison), but the Bears don't have Gronk, Brady, Cooks, etc. to free him up to do what he can do.
IMO, the expectation level if the Bears acquire Landry should be kept in the real world. With the current cast of the Bears, you're looking at Landry being their version of Crabtree. 80-90 catches, 900-1000 yards and 6 TDs or so (which is not shabby) seems realistic. Bears would also expect him to be the kind of guy that manages to get open on those 3rd and 4's and get you a first down. That puts him into 1999 Bobby Engram territory (88/947/4)....and I aint emptying the wallet for Bobby Engram
Edit to add: Engram had a whopping 148 targets in 1999. Wow.
IMO, the expectation level if the Bears acquire Landry should be kept in the real world. With the current cast of the Bears, you're looking at Landry being their version of Crabtree. 80-90 catches, 900-1000 yards and 6 TDs or so (which is not shabby) seems realistic. Bears would also expect him to be the kind of guy that manages to get open on those 3rd and 4's and get you a first down. That puts him into 1999 Bobby Engram territory (88/947/4)....and I aint emptying the wallet for Bobby Engram
Edit to add: Engram had a whopping 148 targets in 1999. Wow.
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RBM
Footballguy
Important stat to keep in mind before anointing Landry a number 1....under 9ypc last year.
Boone22
Footballguy
I tend to see this as an Alex Smith thing rather than a knock on Wilson. Or any of the other WRs they’ve had in KC, not named Tyreek Hill in the last few years. Smith never throws to his #2 or #3 WR. His progression always seems to go Hill, Kelce, dump off to RB. So I’m not sure we can dismiss the skills of any of the KC WR #2 or #3 in that offense as long as Alex was the QB.
It’ll be interesting to see if any other WRs emerge in KC this year with Maholmes at QB.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Completely agreed. If they could get a similar player cheap that would be prudent.
ETA: funny thing, and maybe I'm wrong here, but I was just thinking that Calvin Ridley reminds me of a more athletic Jarvis Landry.
Interesting that you went with Engram, just that you reached that far back.
True. Perhaps a better QB and team would help? (And yes, I do think the bears and trubisky are improvements over the fins last year)
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RBM
Footballguy
Is that important? Cutler/Moore were awful, and the offense was very un-creative. He's been over that every other year of his career.
I think 100 catches 1,100 yards and 8 TD's is well within reason, with upside for more if Trubisky makes a leap. Landry is a much better WR than Edelman ever was in my opinion. Landry would have been a monster in NE.
I guess I'm in the minority here, but I see Landry as being more in line with Hines Ward where he is a #1 caliber player, though not an excellent downfield threat. I'd rather have him then your more downfield #1 WR's like Cooks or Hill or even Jeffery. There's something to be said for extreme reliability, especially with an inexperienced QB.
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Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Statorama
gangster
That's not an insane comparison. Looking at Hines Ward season by season you could argue that Landry, by careers end, will blow past Ward's numbers regardless of where he lands.
And don't get me wrong, if he magically appeared in Bears camp for free he'd be fantastic to have. But I'd also be a little worried about bringing such a volitle guy onto a young team.
flapgreen
Footballguy
Pace has given me no reason to be hopeful in Free agency due to his past mistakes, but I'd love to see Robinson, Wilson, and Burton signed. About 25ish for those 3. Pair them with Shaheen, Cohen, and Howard and they might have something special. Fuller and and a mid-tier CB for about 20 total. Would leave around 45 left. Extend Goldman and Amos. Then we're onto something.
Then in draft, go after a couple edge guys, OLBS, and a tackle or guard
Then in draft, go after a couple edge guys, OLBS, and a tackle or guard
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-X-
Footballguy
Yeah, but remember that Fox was HC, so you can't put all the FA blame on Pace. The GM and HC have to agree on FA decisions. It wasn't like Pace was picking up guys and forcing Fox to accept them. It was a collaborative failure, with more of a lean towards what Fox thought was acceptable.
Landry is another BMarsh (bad locker room guy), but not as good and too pricey. Pass. Not sold on Robinson. Damaged goods.
Albert Wilson? Come on down.
Any players you guys like from the combine?
Some guys that caught my eye (more or less outside of the big names):
WR Valdes-Scantling
CB Tolliver
FS/SS Apke
OLB Tremaine Edmunds (his bro isn't bad)
OLB Vander Esch
OLB Carter
DE Sweat (convert to OLB)
TE Gesicki (could use him as hybrid TE/WR)
Landry is another BMarsh (bad locker room guy), but not as good and too pricey. Pass. Not sold on Robinson. Damaged goods.
Albert Wilson? Come on down.
Any players you guys like from the combine?
Some guys that caught my eye (more or less outside of the big names):
WR Valdes-Scantling
CB Tolliver
FS/SS Apke
OLB Tremaine Edmunds (his bro isn't bad)
OLB Vander Esch
OLB Carter
DE Sweat (convert to OLB)
TE Gesicki (could use him as hybrid TE/WR)
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Hawkeye21
Footballguy
The reason I'm hopeful is that I think he has a more competent coaching staff with him to help make decisions on players. Pace wasn't making all those decision on his own the last few years, I'm sure Fox had his opinions on guys.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
A mid round guy that I would love to see the Bears draft at WR is Allen Lazard from Iowa State. I think he's the big, possession type guy the Bear's are missing.
http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/allen-lazard?id=2559854
http://www.nfl.com/draft/2018/profiles/allen-lazard?id=2559854
Deranged Hermit
Not cool & Pissed
Robinson not tagged. Go get em boys.
flapgreen
Footballguy
Rappaport: A fascinating move by the #Bears to transition tag CB Kyle Fuller at $12.97M. This gives them past the July 15 franchise tag deadline to do a long-team deal, which they want to do. Last year, they didn't pick up his 5th-year option thanks to injury. When healthy, he was a star.
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The Tick
Footballguy
Honestly not my preferred path. Seemed like he was willing to work with them and give them a shot at match/beat regardless without setting this artificial salary starting point for him. Really interested to see what his market will be. Either way, I am glad we will most likely be able to keep him and that we didn't use one of the franchise tags.
