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Alabama church wants its own police force (1 Viewer)

joffer

Footballguy
Makes sense.  How else would they enforce Sharia law?

http://abc3340.com/news/local/briarwood-presbyterian-church-seeks-lawmakers-approval-to-establish-police-force

Briarwood Presbyterian Church in Vestavia Hills is trying to establish its own police force.

The move requires approval from state lawmakers. The bill, sponsored by Rep. Arnold Mooney (R-Shelby County) cleared its first major hurdle Wednesday. The House Public Safety Committee gave its OK.

Briarwood Presbyterian Church calls this a way to create a safer campus in a fallen world.

Some lawmakers argue allowing a private church to have its own police force could begin a slippery slope.

“What do we do when other church affiliates come and ask for the same thing?” questioned Rep. Mary Moore (D-Birmingham). “They're not a college. They're a church and they're a church asking for police jurisdiction.”

Many questions were posed during Wednesday’s committee meeting.

“Who do the officers answer to?” asked Rep. Chris England (D- Tuscaloosa).

“They would answer to the leadership of the section of the church,” a representative from the church answered.

Rep. Connie Rowe (R- Jasper) is a former police chief. She supports allowing Briarwood to create its own force.

“They will conduct their own investigations,” explained Rowe. “They will conduct their own security. They will make their own arrests and instead of calling on the local law enforcement agency to take over the particular situation they're trying to control, they will do that themselves. All they will utilize from their other law enforcement agencies is their lock up facilities.”

Rowe says she would also consider requests from other churches to do the same.

England is concerned about transparency.

“Situations and arrests you would think normally need to be made, they can make their own determinations and decisions about whether that needs to happen,” said England.

Now that the proposal is out of committee, it moves to the full House for consideration.

 
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I only skimmed the article, but to play devil's advocate...  If a university can have its own "police force" on its own campus, why not a church?

 
Are you referring to campus security or something else?
I think he's referring to this:

“What do we do when other church affiliates come and ask for the same thing?” questioned Rep. Mary Moore (D-Birmingham). “They're not a college. They're a church and they're a church asking for police jurisdiction.”

 
“Who do the officers answer to?” asked Rep. Chris England (D- Tuscaloosa).

“They would answer to the leadership of the section of the church,” a representative from the church answered.

What could go wrong?

 
I'm sure when some other less white, less conservative and perhaps less Christian Church/school asks for the same everyone will be just as on board.

 
Are you referring to campus security or something else?
Actual police. The campus police officers at the University of Maryland are actual law enforcement officers employed by the University of Maryland. There is a lot of animosity between the campus police & the local (county) PD

Still think bouncers would be cheaper.

 
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I only skimmed the article, but to play devil's advocate...  If a university can have its own "police force" on its own campus, why not a church?
Large state universities can have 50k+ people on their campus.  That's a decent sized city and it makes sense for there to be a dedicated police force.  If there's 50,000 people gathering at this church 24/7 most days, they can have a police force too.

 
I'm sure when some other less white, less conservative and perhaps less Christian Church/school asks for the same everyone will be just as on board.
Personally, this is all for the area and community to figure out and I dont care one bit either way. I do question why people throw statements out like yours. There is no way to prove or disprove any of it. I fail to see how anything good comes from this? 

 
Personally, this is all for the area and community to figure out and I dont care one bit either way. I do question why people throw statements out like yours. There is no way to prove or disprove any of it. I fail to see how anything good comes from this? 
Because pretty much every time a conservative church and it's allies push through some new power or exception for them the second someone who isn't in their club wants it it's all Hell No! I would cite the numerous times schools have decided it was fine to send home conservative religious tracts with students until anyone else not so conservative and or Christian  wants in on the action. They shut it down instead. Those are easy to find examples.

In this case they want power that is reserved for secular authorities. When the local mosque wants an armed force that only answers to them and their religious interpretation do you really think for one second the Alabama legislature is going to get that to a vote? I can hear the cries of Sharia law from here.

 
Personally, this is all for the area and community to figure out and I dont care one bit either way. I do question why people throw statements out like yours. There is no way to prove or disprove any of it. I fail to see how anything good comes from this? 
It's cool tohate anything white. And double it if they are Christians. 

 
Dr Oadi said:
It's cool tohate anything white. And double it if they are Christians. 
Yeah as an old white guy I am all about hating whites you got me. Is that really all you got? Sad.

 
I didnt read the link, just what was pasted, so sorry if this was addressed. How do they intend on handing out punishment? I see they will use local jails....then what? 

 
Or private security. A full police department is excessive.
According to that other site I posted they claim it is to get around having to employ off-duty police for security..  

Some critics of the bill have questioned why the church and school need a police department, but it's essentially a way of hiring a police officer full-time, as opposed to relying on off-duty police officers to assist the church, Johnston said.

"We've got over 30,000 events a year that take place at Briarwood - going on all day, all night, at the school, at the church, at the seminary," Johnston said. "We have to hire policemen all the time. It would be so much easier to have someone on staff."

Johnston said he doesn't know of any other churches in Alabama that have their own police departments, but he said it's more similar to a small college having its own police department. "Briarwood is larger than most of the colleges that have police," he said.

The language of the bill echoes the language of the law allowing colleges to have their own police departments, he said.

Briarwood has two large campuses, with the church and Birmingham Theological Seminary off Acton Road at Interstate 459, and at the affiliated Briarwood Christian School on Cahaba Valley Road.

"It would only be for patrolling the campuses, north and south," Johnston said. "There wouldn't be any patrolling of neighborhoods."

The church currently hires off-duty officers from area police departments, but there aren't always enough officers available, Johnston said. "They get short-handed," he said. "We have one guy that we have to have almost full-time supervising security," he said.

The police department would essentially be that officer in a full-time position working for the church, he said.

It would not involve a jail or other facilities - basically an officer and an official car, he said. "I couldn't imagine it would be something more than that," Johnston said. "If there is an arrest on campus, the local jurisdiction would be called and they would come pick the person up."

 
30,000 events a year? That would mean 82 a day every day. That's more than 3+ events an hour every hour of every 24 hour day. See those numbers strike me as a bit odd and perhaps intentionally inflated. Which also makes me wonder about everything else that was said.

 
I'm sure that when a Mosque forms its own police force, nobody will freak out. 
Sounds like they don't really want their own police force per se. 

"The police department would essentially be that officer in a full-time position working for the church", he said

 
BowieMercs said:
Actual police. The campus police officers at the University of Maryland are actual law enforcement officers employed by the University of Maryland. There is a lot of animosity between the campus police & the local (county) PD

Still think bouncers would be cheaper.
Kent State has it own police force as well

 
30,000 events a year? That would mean 82 a day every day. That's more than 3+ events an hour every hour of every 24 hour day. See those numbers strike me as a bit odd and perhaps intentionally inflated. Which also makes me wonder about everything else that was said.
Beat me to it.

 
So why the need for an official designation by the state? Hire a retired officer, let him.liason and supervise security. You say you only need one guy well there you go. No need for a vote by the legislature just hire a guy and buy a car. I am sure the locals would let one of their own have a radio.

 
SacramentoBob said:
Large state universities can have 50k+ people on their campus.  That's a decent sized city and it makes sense for there to be a dedicated police force.  If there's 50,000 people gathering at this church 24/7 most days, they can have a police force too.
Is your argument that this should be reserved for campuses of a certain size?  How about small, private universities with 3K enrollment?

Look, I think this whole idea is silly.  But, again, playing devil's advocate, if it's OK for a college, why not a church?  And, before you ask, NCCommish, you know that I don't particularly care which religion the church is.

 
So why the need for an official designation by the state? Hire a retired officer, let him.liason and supervise security. You say you only need one guy well there you go. No need for a vote by the legislature just hire a guy and buy a car. I am sure the locals would let one of their own have a radio.
Agreed. And how much crime are they experiencing that they need full time security? Hopefully nothing that one or two full time security guys can't handle.

 
back in my day the NYC Catholic parishes did have their own police forces - they were called the Clergy.

and, lemme tell ya, one would've rather been busted by the real coppers than by the good folks 'of the cloth'   :boxing:

 
Is your argument that this should be reserved for campuses of a certain size?  How about small, private universities with 3K enrollment?

Look, I think this whole idea is silly.  But, again, playing devil's advocate, if it's OK for a college, why not a church?  And, before you ask, NCCommish, you know that I don't particularly care which religion the church is.
Me either. I'd be against it for anyone. The state has no business sanctioning a church police force. The obviously easy fix for their alleged problem isn't being taken instead we need the power of the state to do this? Why? It seems to suggest far more in play then just hiring one guy. If all they need is one guy this solution is using a nuke to take out a fly. It makes no sense unless that isn't the real desired result.

So no church cops please from any church.

 
NCCommish said:
I'm sure when some other less white, less conservative and perhaps less Christian Church/school asks for the same everyone will be just as on board.
I'm sure I'm bad at taking the temperature of the room, but is everyone on board with this?

 
You guys really don't see the difference between a state university and a church??

 
God helps those who help themselves. In the Bible God makes it pretty clear he doesn't like to be tested. He's busy he can't be personally Goding for you all the time. So go see a doctor.

 

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