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Dynasty & Redraft: RB Saquon Barkley, N.Y. Giants

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9 minutes ago, phillyspecial said:

What?! Since 2006, both Mannings and Big Ben have won Super Bowls. All were first round picks. 

Sorry ... Only one 1st round QB drafted after 2006 has won a Superbowl 

Edited by monk

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15 minutes ago, monk said:

How many points does your fantasy league give for wins?

My bad I thought we were discussing if the NYG should have drafted a qb or not.

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32 minutes ago, pantherclub said:

and racking up a total of 1 win

Exactly. Which is why the Colts should trade/release Andrew Luck. The guy has racked up a total of 1 win despite touching the ball every play. Same with the Falcons at Matt Ryan. They paid the dude 130 and they only racked up a total of 1 win. They should've cut him or traded him and blindly drafted the best available QB in the draft.

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Between 2009 and 2014 (6 year span) only 5 of 17 1st round QBs are starting QBs today. That's a  29% success rate. Of those 5 ...3 were #1 picks and the only year that has produced more than 1 current starter was 2012 (Luck and Tannehill) .

The likely hood of even 2 of the 5 QBs drafted in 2018 still starting in 5-6 years is pretty low

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23 hours ago, pantherclub said:

My bad I thought we were discussing if the NYG should have drafted a qb or not.

It doesn’t really matter. Because the answer is no, they would have been foolish to pass up on a talent like Barkley. 

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37 minutes ago, Otis said:

It doesn’t really matter. Because the answer is no, they would have been foolish to pass up on a talent like Barkley. 

Agreed.  Barkley has been one of those rare examples of being over-hyped before the draft and actually exceeding expectations. He may be the best running back in the league alteady. You don't pass on that for marginal Talent at quarterback.

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Saw enough of Rosen last night to feel very good about passing on him for Barkley. He's terrible, has a terrible attitude and is a concussion waiting to happen every time he hits the ground. This guy will absolutely not be a franchise QB and I would bet a lot of money on that ... I give him 3 years 

The only QB that you could argue the Giants could have taken ahead of Barkley is Darnold, who has looked pretty good so far. I'm not convinced that Darnold will improve much over what we have seen so far. He has landed in a pretty good situation with a good line, excellent running game and a schedule that has worked out nicely for him so far. I fully expect the turnovers that plagued him in college to show up real soon 

In the long run, I  actually think Josh Allen may be the next best QB behind Mayfield but was not deserving of the #2 pick in the draft ... The Giant would have been ripped if they made that choice.

 

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Saquon Barkley - RB -  Giants

Saquon Barkley rushed 14 times for 43 yards and one touchdown and caught 9-of-10 targets for 51 yards in the Giants' 23-20, Week 7 loss to the Falcons on Monday night.

It's the first time this season Barkley has been held to fewer than 100 yards from scrimmage, but he made up for it with a boat load of catches, the short touchdown, and a two-point conversion at the end of the game. Barkley just did not have much room to work with on the ground behind this pitiful offensive line and against a defense that got DT Grady Jarrett back from injury. Barkley still remains an elite RB1 no matter the matchup and will get the Redskins in Week 8.

Oct 22 - 11:28 PM

 

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Why can't Tua be ready this year !!!!!!!

Cant we defer the pick until 2020 !!!!! Please !!

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The Giants offensive scheme is a joke. I’m sure this isn’t news to anyone. At some point you have to have Saquon stay in to block at least a few times so you can take shots down the field and not be as predictable. Then maybe when he does release he’ll have some space to do more. Him releasing into the flat every single time just necessitates that Eli check down to him with 2 or more guys closing or get sacked. Or put in another TE or FB to block and actually give the weapons time to get open. You can have 6 blocking and between Odell Shep SB and Engram they can get open if given some time. Commenting from an actual football perspective, obviously for fantasy the checkdowns to Barkley are gold in ppr.

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Just now, Cobbler1 said:

The Giants offensive scheme is a joke. I’m sure this isn’t news to anyone. At some point you have to have Saquon stay in to block at least a few times so you can take shots down the field and not be as predictable. Then maybe when he does release he’ll have some space to do more. Him releasing into the flat every single time just necessitates that Eli check down to him with 2 or more guys closing or get sacked. Or put in another TE or FB to block and actually give the weapons time to get open. You can have 6 blocking and between Odell Shep SB and Engram they can get open if given some time. Commenting from an actual football perspective, obviously for fantasy the checkdowns to Barkley are gold in ppr.

This. He's just releasing into the flat and the Falcons just flooded the flat the other night and got a rush as you said because he wasn't even chipping guys.  . 

Side to side running is usually pursuable, and that what he's doing right now.  

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Yeah I can't believe how little he stays in to block. Good for fantasy purposes though. 

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During the MNF game they flashed a statistic that Barkley has accounted for 39% of the Giants offensive yardage going into the game.

The last two running backs to be in similar territory as rookies? Marshall Faulk and Eric Dickerson.

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What happens with his usage now that they're in "evaluation" mode? A lot of his production has been volume-based (not that he's not incredibly talented, just...are they going to risk running him into the ground this year)

Edited by rockaction

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23 hours ago, Cobbler1 said:

The Giants offensive scheme is a joke. I’m sure this isn’t news to anyone. At some point you have to have Saquon stay in to block at least a few times so you can take shots down the field and not be as predictable. Then maybe when he does release he’ll have some space to do more. Him releasing into the flat every single time just necessitates that Eli check down to him with 2 or more guys closing or get sacked. Or put in another TE or FB to block and actually give the weapons time to get open. You can have 6 blocking and between Odell Shep SB and Engram they can get open if given some time. Commenting from an actual football perspective, obviously for fantasy the checkdowns to Barkley are gold in ppr.

Have you seen him try to stay in and "block"?

He gets flat out run over once or twice a game (about all they let him block for).  Like he doesn't know what to do or doesn't want to.  Hopefully he gets better over time.

eta - ATL game - was is Jarret? that quite literally lifted him off his feet and pushed him back into Eli?

Edited by matuski
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7 minutes ago, matuski said:

 ATL game - was is Jarret? that quite literally lifted him off his feet and pushed him back into Eli?

That was pretty funny, actually. He got trucked. 

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42 minutes ago, matuski said:

Have you seen him try to stay in and "block"?

He gets flat out run over once or twice a game (about all they let him block for).  Like he doesn't know what to do or doesn't want to.  Hopefully he gets better over time.

eta - ATL game - was is Jarret? that quite literally lifted him off his feet and pushed him back into Eli?

Right yeah I’m with you that it doesn’t look like he’s any good at it. Still he can chip a DE or they can leave in a extra TE or FB so SB can release and the extra big guy can block some. It just seems they aren’t coming close to maximizing their offensive talent because their line is so bad but they won’t do anything to help those scrubs.

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On 10/24/2018 at 8:43 AM, matuski said:

Have you seen him try to stay in and "block"?

He gets flat out run over once or twice a game (about all they let him block for).  Like he doesn't know what to do or doesn't want to.  Hopefully he gets better over time.

eta - ATL game - was is Jarret? that quite literally lifted him off his feet and pushed him back into Eli?

You have no idea what your're talking about ... He did exactly what is expected of a RB going one on one against a 300lb D-lineman ... He got between the D-lineman and the QB.  Eli on the other hand froze and curled up in a ball essentially sacking himself. 

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9 minutes ago, monk said:

You have no idea what your're talking about ... He did exactly what is expected of a RB going one on one against a 300lb D-lineman ... He got between the D-lineman and the QB.  Eli on the other hand froze and curled up in a ball essentially sacking himself. 

No need to get personal, I'm a huge fan of the RB.  He will get better at pass blocking.  I don't see an argument in your post that he is good at it so i think we agree.

eta - in that instance I would expect him to throw a shoulder, go low.... something other than get carried along and discarded on the way to the QB.  He looked surprised that he was in the path of a 300lb lineman.

eta again - I agree on Eli there, but we werent discussing Eli.

Edited by matuski

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8 minutes ago, monk said:

You have no idea what your're talking about ... He did exactly what is expected of a RB going one on one against a 300lb D-lineman ... He got between the D-lineman and the QB.  Eli on the other hand froze and curled up in a ball essentially sacking himself. 

Sure that’s true. I don’t think that’s the entirety of the perception though. He got beat for a sack once by what I think was a db and trucked another time for a pressure I think that time was by a LB. 

 

Edit: I don’t see any sacks from Dbs so I guess it was just a pressure. Either way he looked bad outside of Jarrett play also. I still think he needs to stay in and chip more or the Giants need to mix up their formations/personnel so when he releases it isn’t just a free for all on Eli.

Edited by Cobbler1

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3 hours ago, matuski said:

No need to get personal, I'm a huge fan of the RB.  He will get better at pass blocking.  I don't see an argument in your post that he is good at it so i think we agree.

 eta - in that instance I would expect him to throw a shoulder, go low.... something other than get carried along and discarded on the way to the QB.  He looked surprised that he was in the path of a 300lb lineman.

eta again - I agree on Eli there, but we werent discussing Eli.

I don't think he's bad at all ... I've never seen a RB win most of the time in that situation. Aside from punt returns, RB pass protection might be the most unenviable situation in football. 250  to 300 pounds coming at you full speed is usually a losing situation. 

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Saquon Barkley rushed 20 times for 67 yards and caught 4-of-5 targets for 33 yards in the Giants' Week 10 win over the 49ers.

It's Barkley's eighth 100-yard game in nine contests as a pro. There wasn't much running room to be found, and Barkley's biggest play was a 23-yard catch across the middle on a third down on the final game-winning drive with the Giants still down 23-20. Bigger days are ahead obviously, and the Giants will head home on a short week to face the Bucs' bottom-barrel defense in Week 11.

Nov 12 - 11:41 PM

 

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46 minutes ago, shadyridr said:

Will he ever run for 100 yards again? This oline is brutal. 

O-Line actually had one of their best pass blocking games of their season. Run blocking is a work in progress.

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36 minutes ago, The Frankman said:

O-Line actually had one of their best pass blocking games of their season. Run blocking is a work in progress.

I do think he tries to bounce too much outside as well. He is a rookie after all so he will learn. 

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On 11/13/2018 at 7:54 AM, shadyridr said:

I do think he tries to bounce too much outside as well. He is a rookie after all so he will learn. 

This was arguably the most important knock on his college game. @FreeBaGeL posted some really telling numbers on his inside run stats at PSU several times over the summer. I do agree he’s likely to improve here. Plus he should be a safe RB1 going forward since he’ll likeky demand volume based on talent/pedigree. But this also isn’t a new problem for Barkley and may be worth factoring in for a guy who is seemingly the consensus # 1 startup dynasty player in the hobby. 

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Saquon Barkley rushed 27 times for a season-high 142 yards and two touchdowns, tacking on another receiving touchdown for good measure in the Giants' Week 11 victory over the Bucs.

Even Barkley's lack of involvement in the passing game can't be knocked since one of his three targets on the day resulted in a touchdown. A big outing was expected given that the Bucs were without stud defenders Kwon Alexander (torn ACL), Vinny Curry (ankle), and Lavonte David (knee), but Barkley exceeded all expectations in hitting season-high marks in carries, rushing yards, and touchdowns. The generational talent is now remarkably on pace for 253/1,164/11 on the ground and 102/864/5 receiving. He's obviously a matchup-proof commodity that should close the year in elite company.

Amazing what better run blocking and a willingness to run inside more will do.

Edited by The Frankman

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5 minutes ago, shadyridr said:

 

I understand what you mean, but he can very easily drop that number on the Eagles, a lot of analysts have mentioned Saquon leaving yards on the field by trying to bounce so much. The PFF Giants O-Line grades should be out and I expect them to be positive.

Edited by The Frankman

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I turned down many solid trade offers this summer and I couldn't be happier that I rejected all of them. This guy is carrying my team and is so much fun to watch.

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2 hours ago, az_prof said:

I turned down many solid trade offers this summer and I couldn't be happier that I rejected all of them. This guy is carrying my team and is so much fun to watch.

Definitely a special talent but a lot of guys will be questioning his usage after this week:
 

Quote

Saquon Barkley rushed 13 times for 101 yards and one touchdown and caught 7-of-8 targets for 41 yards and an additional touchdown in the Giants' 25-22, Week 12 loss to the Eagles.

Barkley did all of his damage in the first half, curiously receiving just four carries and five touches total after the break. He wasn't injured, but the Giants sat him out the second series of the third quarter, and the offense never moved the ball the rest of the way. Barkley started out hot with a 13-yard touchdown catch on a screen before then breaking off a 51-yard rushing score late in the second quarter to stake the G-Men to a 19-3 lead they'd eventually blow. The 13 carries were Barkley's fewest since Week 4. He'll get a tough draw against the Bears next week.

 

Edited by The Frankman

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15 minutes ago, The Frankman said:

Definitely a special talent but a lot of guys will be questioning his usage after this week:
 

 

Really? I'll take 33 fantasy points myself and keep him healthy.

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He is the best RB in the NFL, right?

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2 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

He is the best RB in the NFL, right?

Gurley. Saquon is awesome, but Gurley.  

Edited by rockaction

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1 minute ago, rockaction said:

Gurley. Saquon is awesome, but Gurley.  

No way

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4 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

He is the best RB in the NFL, right?

Id say him 1st and Zeke 2nd.

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4 minutes ago, rockaction said:

Gurley. Saquon is awesome, but Gurley.  

I get the argument but I think Gurley is really benefitting from a great offense. 

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1 minute ago, shadyridr said:

No way

Really, shady. I'll admit, I have Saquon in my main league and he killed it for me, but I've got Gurley as the best. Saquon being even close to Elliott and Gurley should tell us all we need to know. Super elite upper tier, this guy. Love him.  

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We are watching a golden age of running backs at a devalued position.  

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10 minutes ago, rockaction said:

Really, shady. I'll admit, I have Saquon in my main league and he killed it for me, but I've got Gurley as the best. Saquon being even close to Elliott and Gurley should tell us all we need to know. Super elite upper tier, this guy. Love him.  

Look at Gurley 2 years ago in a bad offense. He sucked. That's what Barkley is working with this year with a possible worse offensive line and he is the #2 overall RB.

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Just now, shadyridr said:

Look at Gurley 2 years ago in a bad offense. He sucked. That's what Barkley is working with this year with a possible worse offensive line and he is the #2 overall RB.

Yeah, that's why I'm not arguing with you heavily. Crappy O-line, lousy QB for Barkley. Combine numbers off the charts. Just think the blocking bit might bite him, that's all. Not a real argument. I think Zeke is the best pure runner there is, though. Always falling forward for two or three more yards. Golden age of backs right now.  

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