squistion

Colin Kaepernick Thread plus related anthem kneeling and NFL stuff

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1 hour ago, Cowboysfan8 said:

Tell lindsey that Elliott got 6 games and nothing was ever proven 

Maybe not proven to the satisfaction of a prosecutor, but it was proven to the satisfaction of the NFL after they thoroughly did their own investigation.

https://www.star-telegram.com/sports/nfl/dallas-cowboys/article166812367.html

NFL: Case against Elliott based on evidence, not ‘he said, she said’

In deciding to suspend Dallas Cowboys running Ezekiel Elliott for six games for violating the personal conduct policy, the NFL clearly believed the domestic violence accusations of his accuser, Tiffany Thompson, more than it did his claims of innocence.

But this was not a case of "he said, she said" in the mind of the NFL, the suspension was based on a thorough investigation and credible evidence, including some the Columbus Ohio prosecutor didn’t have, per Peter Harvey, a former attorney general of New Jersey and one of four independent advisors who helped counsel NFL commissioner Roger Goodell.

"There were over 100 exhibits to the investigation," Harvey said in a conference call with media Friday. "The investigative report exceeded 160 pages. We also reviewed, each of us individually, the submissions by Mr. Elliott’s representative. We studied both; we examined very carefully the defense arguments, and we came to the conclusion – at least, I reached the conclusion individually – that Mr. Elliott engaged in physical force against Ms. Thompson, and that it caused injury."

And while the Columbus prosecutor didn’t believe he had enough evidence to pursue a case, the burden of proof for the NFL isn’t as stringent as the court system. Still this case and investigation was bigger than “he said, she said”.

"Well it starts with ‘he said,she said’, which is why an investigation is conducted," Harvey said. "It became a lot more than ‘he said,she said’. For example, it’s uncommon for women to take photographs of their injuries the day that they occurred. She did that. She sent those photographs to third parties. The examination of the meta-data in her phone revealed the date and time on which those photographs were taken. They were taken the same day as Ms. Thompson alleged she was injured by Mr. Elliott."

"Also, there were third parties who observed injuries on her body and in real time, on the same day, she had a conversation with at least one of these persons about the injury and who caused it. In addition to that, the league brought in two medical experts who examined the photographs and offered expert opinions with respect to the timing of the injury. These medical experts corroborated many of the statements that Ms. Thompson made."

[...]

 

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23 minutes ago, squistion said:

Donald J. Trump‏ @realDonaldTrump 9m9 minutes ago

The NFL National Anthem Debate is alive and well again - can’t believe it! Isn’t it in contract that players must stand at attention, hand on heart? The $40,000,000 Commissioner must now make a stand. First time kneeling, out for game. Second time kneeling, out for season/no pay!

Replying to @realDonaldTrump

Rantt Media‏ @RanttMedia 24m24 minutes ago

President Donald Trump—who stood on the world stage in Helsinki and called the U.S. foolish then sided with Putin who personally ordered attacks on American democracy, and later invited him to the White House—dares to once again lecture us on patriotism.

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6 minutes ago, squistion said:

Maybe not proven to the satisfaction of a prosecutor, but it was proven to the satisfaction of the NFL after they thoroughly did their own investigation.

https://www.star-telegram.com/sports/nfl/dallas-cowboys/article166812367.html

NFL: Case against Elliott based on evidence, not ‘he said, she said’

In deciding to suspend Dallas Cowboys running Ezekiel Elliott for six games for violating the personal conduct policy, the NFL clearly believed the domestic violence accusations of his accuser, Tiffany Thompson, more than it did his claims of innocence.

But this was not a case of "he said, she said" in the mind of the NFL, the suspension was based on a thorough investigation and credible evidence, including some the Columbus Ohio prosecutor didn’t have, per Peter Harvey, a former attorney general of New Jersey and one of four independent advisors who helped counsel NFL commissioner Roger Goodell.

"There were over 100 exhibits to the investigation," Harvey said in a conference call with media Friday. "The investigative report exceeded 160 pages. We also reviewed, each of us individually, the submissions by Mr. Elliott’s representative. We studied both; we examined very carefully the defense arguments, and we came to the conclusion – at least, I reached the conclusion individually – that Mr. Elliott engaged in physical force against Ms. Thompson, and that it caused injury."

And while the Columbus prosecutor didn’t believe he had enough evidence to pursue a case, the burden of proof for the NFL isn’t as stringent as the court system. Still this case and investigation was bigger than “he said, she said”.

"Well it starts with ‘he said,she said’, which is why an investigation is conducted," Harvey said. "It became a lot more than ‘he said,she said’. For example, it’s uncommon for women to take photographs of their injuries the day that they occurred. She did that. She sent those photographs to third parties. The examination of the meta-data in her phone revealed the date and time on which those photographs were taken. They were taken the same day as Ms. Thompson alleged she was injured by Mr. Elliott."

"Also, there were third parties who observed injuries on her body and in real time, on the same day, she had a conversation with at least one of these persons about the injury and who caused it. In addition to that, the league brought in two medical experts who examined the photographs and offered expert opinions with respect to the timing of the injury. These medical experts corroborated many of the statements that Ms. Thompson made."

[...]

 

In the sworn statement, it becomes apparent that Elliott's accuser and ex-girlfriend, Tiffany Thompson, was upset at him and decided to enact vengeance by insanely trying to ruin his career. 

The statement details the situation, in which Thompson admits numerous times to making up the accusation. 

 

It says that Thompson shouted at Elliott that she was going to "ruin his career," and also that Thompson told her friend in a text to tell the police that the Cowboys star had dragged her out of the car, despite that being not true. 

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17 minutes ago, Cowboysfan8 said:

In the sworn statement, it becomes apparent that Elliott's accuser and ex-girlfriend, Tiffany Thompson, was upset at him and decided to enact vengeance by insanely trying to ruin his career. 

The statement details the situation, in which Thompson admits numerous times to making up the accusation. 

It says that Thompson shouted at Elliott that she was going to "ruin his career," and also that Thompson told her friend in a text to tell the police that the Cowboys star had dragged her out of the car, despite that being not true. 

The point is you acted if is the NFL had nothing but unproven allegations and as the bolded in the article indicated, that was far from being the case.

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2 minutes ago, squistion said:

The point is you acted if is the NFL had nothing but unproven allegations and as the bolded in the article indicated, that was far from being the case.

Apparently you missed this part -

The statement details the situation, in which Thompson admits numerous times to making up the accusation. 

 

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9 minutes ago, Cowboysfan8 said:

Apparently you missed this part -

The statement details the situation, in which Thompson admits numerous times to making up the accusation. 

Not everything she said was a false accusation. More from the article I quoted:

https://www.star-telegram.com/sports/nfl/dallas-cowboys/article166812367.html

[...]

"Her false statement that was revealed was she accused Mr. Elliott of yanking her out of a car on July 21st, really it’s the morning of the 22nd," Harvey said. "That did not happen. And she did ask one of her friends to tell the police that it did happen and the friend had the good sense not to do that. That is true. But as to other statements that she made, both to the Columbus DA as well as to NFL investigators, she was absolutely truthful about them. And by the way, the Columbus prosecutor knew about that false statement and still said to our investigators that he believed her and he believed that the injuries that she articulated to the Columbus DA’s office were caused by Mr. Elliott. He just didn’t believe he had sufficient evidence to prove the case based upon the criminal standard which as you know is beyond a reasonable doubt and that’s the highest standard known to American law.”

Thompson’s statements were corrorobated by photographs and testimony of medical professionals. Elliott’s defense included theories and affidavits from alleged witnesses who proved to be inconsistent and unreliable.

“They declined to be interviewed by the NFL’s investigators, which raised suspicions in our minds about the veracity of these witnesses,” Harvey said. “In at least one of the affidavits that I reviewed, the information was different in the affidavit than the witness gave to the NFL’s investigators when they talked to this particular witness. We also examined the arguments made by Mr. Elliott’s representatives, and the arguments seemed to be theoretical. They did not seem to be supported by any witness, any document, any other substantive evidence. And so as I evaluated the information, I came to the conclusion that physical force was used by Mr. Elliott against Ms. Thompson, that it caused her injury, and it violated, in my view, the personal conduct policy.”

 

Edited by squistion

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4 minutes ago, squistion said:

Not everything she said was a false accusation. From the article I linked above:

"Her false statement that was revealed was she accused Mr. Elliott of yanking her out of a car on July 21st, really it’s the morning of the 22nd," Harvey said. "That did not happen. And she did ask one of her friends to tell the police that it did happen and the friend had the good sense not to do that. That is true. But as to other statements that she made, both to the Columbus DA as well as to NFL investigators, she was absolutely truthful about them. And by the way, the Columbus prosecutor knew about that false statement and still said to our investigators that he believed her and he believed that the injuries that she articulated to the Columbus DA’s office were caused by Mr. Elliott. He just didn’t believe he had sufficient evidence to prove the case based upon the criminal standard which as you know is beyond a reasonable doubt and that’s the highest standard known to American law.”

Thompson’s statements were corrorobated by photographs and testimony of medical professionals. Elliott’s defense included theories and affidavits from alleged witnesses who proved to be inconsistent and unreliable.

“They declined to be interviewed by the NFL’s investigators, which raised suspicions in our minds about the veracity of these witnesses,” Harvey said. “In at least one of the affidavits that I reviewed, the information was different in the affidavit than the witness gave to the NFL’s investigators when they talked to this particular witness. We also examined the arguments made by Mr. Elliott’s representatives, and the arguments seemed to be theoretical. They did not seem to be supported by any witness, any document, any other substantive evidence. And so as I evaluated the information, I came to the conclusion that physical force was used by Mr. Elliott against Ms. Thompson, that it caused her injury, and it violated, in my view, the personal conduct policy.”

 

Yeah, I'm aware of what Goodell thinks. What else ya got?

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2 hours ago, squistion said:

Donald J. Trump‏ @realDonaldTrump 9m9 minutes ago

The NFL National Anthem Debate is alive and well again - can’t believe it! Isn’t it in contract that players must stand at attention, hand on heart? The $40,000,000 Commissioner must now make a stand. First time kneeling, out for game. Second time kneeling, out for season/no pay!

Andrew Brandt‏ @AndrewBrandt 2h2 hours ago

Not in contract, no.

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Can we have a Trump baby float with his phone and a football in his hand? 

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Trump: hand on heart. 

Lmfao.  I’d say no way anyone falls for this disingenuous nonsense, but watch the rally take shape. 

Again, America has jumped the shark.  

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1. Trump looks terrible after his meeting in Helsinki. 

2. Trump tries to double down, looks even worse. 

3. Trump changes the subject- “Look at all those awful NFL people disrespecting the flag!” 

Seems to work every time. 

 

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20 minutes ago, timschochet said:

1. Trump looks terrible after his meeting in Helsinki. 

2. Trump tries to double down, looks even worse. 

3. Trump changes the subject- “Look at all those awful NFL people disrespecting the flag!” 

Seems to work every time. 

 

If only people could think critically about what “disrespecting” the  actually means.  

But picture books and all that...

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48 minutes ago, timschochet said:

1. Trump looks terrible after his meeting in Helsinki. 

2. Trump tries to double down, looks even worse. 

3. Trump changes the subject- “Look at all those awful NFL people disrespecting the flag!” 

Seems to work every time. 

 

For his base maybe. People have already made up their minds on how they feel about this issue.  His tweeting about it is just noise now just like 80% of his tweets. 

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Writing Dude  🏈  📰‏Verified account @Andrew_Garda Jul 20

NFL protest refresher:

1) your job is not like their job

2) your influence is not their influence

3) it's not about the flag or military

4) do you yell at people buying beer/peeing/talking during anthem

5) do you call the senators/reps who just cut VA benefits again?

https://twitter.com/Andrew_Garda/status/1020278339377000448

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:yes: 

New York Giants owner Steve Tisch rips Trump, says NY Giants players will not be punished for national anthem kneeling:

“We support our players. They are not going to be punished. There is not going to be any punitive action taking place against them.”

https://www.northjersey.com/story/sports/nfl/giants/2018/07/20/ny-giants-steve-tisch-says-team-wont-punish-players-kneeling/808452002/

Edited by squistion

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RIP Tony Sparano . By all accounts a good guy

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5 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Crazy the rection that kneeling players have received and then the Brewers pitcher gets a standing ovation after his racist, sexist, homphobic tweets went viral.

I am not saying we should bury the pitcher (he was in HS) but why is he getting a standing ovation? 

My guess is the crowd if not the whole state of Wisconsin is full of racists and they were embracing one of their own. 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, HellToupee said:

My guess is the crowd if not the whole state of Wisconsin is full of racists and they were embracing one of their own. 

 

 

Trump won Wisconsin. So you might be on to something.

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