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Biabreakable

Dynasty Kareem Hunt Cleveland Browns

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2 hours ago, Dr. Dan said:

Quite the bold claim... I'm intrigued 

I mean for RB's.  

I just don't see anything less than 1100/300/8 with West as his only competition for carries.  

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25 minutes ago, ryno1980 said:

Even if you're right, Ware was 10th among RBs last year in yards from scrimmage despite missing 2 3/4 games. 

If Hunt is more talented than Ware, it's possible he produces very similar numbers with 250 touches. 

And with Tyreek Hill running more downfield routes, there's a hole to fill in the short passing game (Ware's targets went  down slightly when Hill emerged in the second half). 

Ware also had some big games when left guard Parker Ehinger (torn ACL after 5 games) played, running off the left side. Chiefs activated him off PUP last week so that's possibly a big boost for Hunt. 

Yup. I love his upside, I would simply prefer to get a little lucky and hope he falls close to the low end of his ADP because I think there will be more players I prefer over him at his high end ADP.

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He is a mid fourth now.  Will creep into the late third as season approaches 

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19 minutes ago, zoonation said:

I mean for RB's.  

I just don't see anything less than 1100/300/8 with West as his only competition for carries.  

That's what I meant too... I'm intrigued. A top 10 RB for round 3 or 4 value is very nice. I didn't think his potential was that high. He crept up on me... Might have to target 4.01

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2 minutes ago, zoonation said:

He is a mid fourth now.  Will creep into the late third as season approaches 

Experts are pushing for him as a 3rd pick and advocating taking him as the first rookie RB. 

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1 minute ago, Ilov80s said:

Experts are pushing for him as a 3rd pick and advocating taking him as the first rookie RB. 

One week from my draft. With our keepers he may not make it to me at 3.12/4.01. That sucks. Too bad I can't trade down from 2.01

 

Stranger things have happened in my league. Hoping one of Mixon/Abdullah/and now Hunt make it to me at 3.12 in a keeper PPR

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I pulled the trigger at 4.08 yesterday cuz I knew he wasn't making it back.  Feel good about it.  

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1 minute ago, Dr. Dan said:

One week from my draft. With our keepers he may not make it to me at 3.12/4.01. That sucks. Too bad I can't trade down from 2.01

 

Stranger things have happened in my league. Hoping one of Mixon/Abdullah/and now Hunt make it to me at 3.12 in a keeper PPR

How many keepers?   If 24 guys are already gone none of those guys are making it back to the 3.12 turn (5.12 turn, really)

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Just now, Dr. Dan said:

One week from my draft. With our keepers he may not make it to me at 3.12/4.01. That sucks. Too bad I can't trade down from 2.01

 

Stranger things have happened in my league. Hoping one of Mixon/Abdullah/and now Hunt make it to me at 3.12 in a keeper PPR

 Got him in the 7th Saturday when the Ware injury was unknown and I am very tempted to trade him now before anyone sees him play and potentially not be very good. 

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Just now, Ilov80s said:

 Got him in the 7th Saturday when the Ware injury was unknown and I am very tempted to trade him now before anyone sees him play and potentially not be very good. 

Not be very good?  This dude is what MJD used to go as for Halloween!

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7 minutes ago, zoonation said:

Not be very good?  This dude is what MJD used to go as for Halloween!

Not sure exactly what you mean, but Hunt could struggle or just be ok. Right now, he's never played a down and I hear him being mentioned by some analysts as a borderline RB1. Seems like the odds are against, right? 

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34 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Experts are pushing for him as a 3rd pick and advocating taking him as the first rookie RB. 

After the Ware injury I completely understand why they are pushing him as the top rookie RB this season.  He has the clearest path to the most touches.  And if it was choice, for this season, between Hunt, McCaffrey and Cook I take Hunt six days a week and twice on Sunday (I think Mixon is in an almost guaranteed early season timeshare and has the worst offensive line of the bunch in front of him).

Before I got too far down the anti-Hunt road (and I'm not anti-Hunt) I thought I would do some more due diligence as it realates to my league: I just checked the DD configured for my league with the rankings (Dodds 25%, Henry 38%, MT 22% & Woods 16%) and Hunt is the 14th ranked RB.  Murray, Fournette, Crowell, Gurley, Cook, Hunt, L.Miller, Lynch, McCaffrey, Ingram.  

Personally I take Murray (no question), Crowell (no question), probably Gurley (I just think he is far more talented than Hunt) and possibly Lynch (yes it's a 1 PPR league but I think Lynch is on the very short list of RBs who could lead the league in TDs).

Truth is I could see someone taking Hunt over any one of those guys except Murray. Injuries be damned! Murray is on a rising team with a good-probably-great offensive line and a run, run, run offensive philosophy.  It's foolish to let Henry concern you. He's probably the most valuable backup RB in the fantasy realm so if you draft Murray you must reach a little early for Henry and plan to lock that roster spot for him all year which can cause problems but it would be well worth it IMO.  

I probably still take Crowell over Hunt nine times out of ten, because I do think he is a truly gifted runner with a very good offensive line but Hunt has a pretty good line too and the team around him is much better so I get that opinion may just be mine.

Yeah, I wouldn't want to anchor my RB corps with Hunt but...in a pinch, I could see it.

Edited by Chaka
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4 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Not sure exactly what you mean, but Hunt could struggle or just be ok. Right now, he's never played a down and I hear him being mentioned by some analysts as a borderline RB1. Seems like the odds are against, right?

I know of people attempting to unload him in dynasty because they don't believe he'll be any more valuable than he is now and they're not convinced he's the long term answer regardless. 

I don't know about redraft. The season hasn't started yet so when people look at their rosters I doubt they see any blatant deficiencies. I'd be more inclined to wait for those handful of owners who are going to need RB help after the first month or so before looking to move him. If Hunt is your RB3/4 I think it's very much a risk worth taking. And of course, there's a chance that you never should have debated moving him in the first place. 

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43 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Not sure exactly what you mean, but Hunt could struggle or just be ok. Right now, he's never played a down and I hear him being mentioned by some analysts as a borderline RB1. Seems like the odds are against, right? 

I didn't like Hunt during the draft. I was dreading GB taking him TBH. Him and Foreman. I just don't see the reasoning for the hype... just because Ware was so good in relief last year, suddenly we can expect Hunt to be even better? The volume will be there but I'm not so convinced the talent is. KC doesn't have an amazing offense in general... I don't know. I'd be happy with him as my RB3, and if he's there 3.12 I will gladly take him 4.01 (1 less round for keeper value if he does pan out). The upside is there but I will shoot for him as my RB3 if I can. I am not so sure I'd want him as my RB1. RB2, heck yes (although if Chaka is right, Crowell will be my RB2 easily). 

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8 minutes ago, Franknbeans said:

What are you guys getting for him?

I was thinking of offering him for Martavis

Hard pass 

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30 minutes ago, ponchsox said:

Hard pass 

Hunt and Martavis run the ball and catch the ball.  They don't pass.  Try to keep up, please.

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24 minutes ago, BINGBING said:

Hunt and Martavis run the ball and catch the ball.  They don't pass.  Try to keep up, please.

He asked if he should trade Hunt for Martavis. My answer was no way.

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18 minutes ago, Franknbeans said:

I wasn't offering him to you ?

I think he's saying you shouldn't do it.  I'd agree. 

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2 hours ago, Franknbeans said:

What are you guys getting for him?

I was thinking of offering him for Martavis

I offered Baldwin & Rishard Matthews for him today and was turned down in a FFPC 750 dynasty.

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5 minutes ago, Cowboysfan8 said:

I haven't read anything about this guys ability to protect the passer.

Does anyone have any info on this?

 

KC coaches were very high on his pass protection ability in multiple public statements.  He hasn't been perfect to date, but overall he's done a good job and is completely willing to engage

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2 hours ago, Franknbeans said:

What are you guys getting for him?

I was thinking of offering him for Martavis

Traded him for Abdullah in dynasty. I know Ameer's market value is probably lower, but I think he's the more talented back. Hunt fell to me to me pretty deep in our rookie draft and I took him as BPA, but I'm only lukewarm on his talent, so I decided to exchange him for a player that I've always liked a lot.

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1 hour ago, ponchsox said:

He asked if he should trade Hunt for Martavis. My answer was no way.

I see my awful attempt at comedy failed.

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30 minutes ago, Bronco Billy said:

 

KC coaches were very high on his pass protection ability in multiple public statements.  He hasn't been perfect to date, but overall he's done a good job and is completely willing to engage

He's better at PP than West already.  This guy will be fed like a wagyu steer!  Do you boys like marbling on your ribeye?   If so, skip lunch and saddle up to this trough!

 

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He's not going to be doing much pass blocking. He profiles as a major receiving weapon. RBs that catch a lot of passes usually aren't asked to pass block very often. 

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5 hours ago, EBF said:

Traded him for Abdullah in dynasty. I know Ameer's market value is probably lower, but I think he's the more talented back. Hunt fell to me to me pretty deep in our rookie draft and I took him as BPA, but I'm only lukewarm on his talent, so I decided to exchange him for a player that I've always liked a lot.

Makes sense. I tend to like Ameer a bit more than Hunt as a player as well. I do think Hunts situation is better than Ameers though.

More likely than not I would project Hunt for more points than Ameer this season and Hunt is a bit younger than Ameer as well. 

Points are what wins leagues, so although stylistically I think Ameer may be a better player than Hunt, it doesn't mean Hunt won't outscore him.

I guess I could see going either way here.

Given the excitement about Hunt and the unknown about Abdullah though, I would likely be asking for more than just Ameer straight up for Hunt.

Edited by Biabreakable
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5 hours ago, BINGBING said:

I see my awful attempt at comedy failed.

I chuckled. ;) 

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5 hours ago, EBF said:

Traded him for Abdullah in dynasty. I know Ameer's market value is probably lower, but I think he's the more talented back. Hunt fell to me to me pretty deep in our rookie draft and I took him as BPA, but I'm only lukewarm on his talent, so I decided to exchange him for a player that I've always liked a lot.

I'm not sure AA will ever be more than he's been. The Lions seem intent on using a committee, and AA isn't leaned on as a receiving back. 

Im very high on AA, and think he's got the talent to be a feature back - but the Lions obviously don't.

rignt now the chiefs see Hunt as a feature back. And he's going to have every chance to take the job and run with it (pun intended).  So while AA is the guy you draft hoping he'll eventually get a role to match his talent, Hunt is the guy you draft hoping his talent matches his role. 

Some have asked "why is he so valuable" - see: Kelly in WAS. Clearly a hard worker, kelly is kind of a JAG. But he's a JAG with a feature back role on an above average offense. So Kelly gets volume touches and hat results in FFB points.

and right now, for better or worse, that seems like Hunt's floor - maybe he's JAG with volume touches in an above average offense. 

I'd rather have that than AA. I took Hunt over AA in my redraft for those reasons. 

 

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5 hours ago, Cowboysfan8 said:

I haven't read anything about this guys ability to protect the passer.

Does anyone have any info on this?

Earlier in the thread I posted a link to Andy Reid saying that Hunt was good in pass protection. Which based on watching Hunt in college doesn't surprise me. Hunt is a very well rounded player who can do everything well.

He is a rookie so I am sure there are ways he can improve in this area of pass protection, but Hunt should be good enough that it doesn't keep him from earning playing time, as shown by Reid having no hesitation about naming Hunt the starter once it was known that Ware would miss games.

Charcandrick West when he was in had a lot of pass protection assignments and I think his role in the offense is pretty steady. He had the same number of receptions in 2015 and 2016 although West played a lot more in 2015. 

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23 minutes ago, Hot Sauce Guy said:

I'd rather have that than AA. I took Hunt over AA in my redraft for those reasons. 

 

Hunt over Abdullah in redraft seems fine to me. I like AA more as a runner, but Hunt is in the better situation. Could certainly have the better 2017.


In dynasty, I put more emphasis on the talent. Situations can change quickly. I see AA as more likely to stick around and be relevant over multiple seasons because I think he's better. He looked sensational last year and, if not for the injury, we might be talking about 2016 as his breakout year.

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Concern for Ameers outlook not helped by the Lions starting tackles being injured, Riddick being more of a thread for time share and high value passing targets and Hunt likely getting goal line opportunities that Ameer may not. Also better defense of the Chiefs supporting the use of RB a bit more than with the Lions.

eta - I guess RIcky Wagner is doing well. I thought I had heard he was injured a few weeks ago, but if he was I guess it wasn't anything major. He played 37 snaps in most recent Lions game and played well. 

Edited by Biabreakable
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Matt Waldman's article this morning strongly implies that Hunt is NOT particularly proficient in pass-blocking. For what that is worth (for me it is worth quite a bit, as I certainly value Matt's opinion on these matters pretty highly)

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3 minutes ago, Keith1 said:

Matt Waldman's article this morning strongly implies that Hunt is NOT particularly proficient in pass-blocking. For what that is worth (for me it is worth quite a bit, as I certainly value Matt's opinion on these matters pretty highly)

 

I guess I trust my owns eyes and also the opinions of the coaches who will make the decisions more.

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35 minutes ago, Keith1 said:

Matt Waldman's article this morning strongly implies that Hunt is NOT particularly proficient in pass-blocking. For what that is worth (for me it is worth quite a bit, as I certainly value Matt's opinion on these matters pretty highly)

Link?

What were the comments?

It is very possible to criticize a player for poor technique or missing an assignment without that meaning anything in regards to the players playing time and trust from the coaches.

I didn't notice anything terrible about Hunts blocking during preseason. But certainly possible I missed a play or assignment that he had an error or that he performed poorly.

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6 minutes ago, Biabreakable said:

Link?

What were the comments?

It is very possible to criticize a player for poor technique or missing an assignment without that meaning anything in regards to the players playing time and trust from the coaches.

I didn't notice anything terrible about Hunts blocking during preseason. But certainly possible I missed a play or assignment that he had an error or that he performed poorly.

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/apps/article.php?article=waldmantop10P3

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All I need to know is that Reid unequivocally has named Hunt the starter.

 

Whether Waldman likes his passblocking carries zero weight with me in terms of fantasy impact.

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1 minute ago, TripItUp said:

All I need to know is that Reid unequivocally has named Hunt the starter.

 

Whether Waldman likes his passblocking carries zero weight with me in terms of fantasy impact.

Exactly. If he isn't good at pass blocking, then the Chiefs won't ask him to pass block much. We don't get fantasy points for successfully picking up a blitz so who cares. David Johnson barely was asked to pass block last year. Same with Lev Bell and Zeke. RBs that can potentially catch 50 passes don't spend many pass plays at home blocking, 

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6 hours ago, Biabreakable said:

Concern for Ameers outlook not helped by the Lions starting tackles being injured, Riddick being more of a thread for time share and high value passing targets and Hunt likely getting goal line opportunities that Ameer may not. Also better defense of the Chiefs supporting the use of RB a bit more than with the Lions.

eta - I guess RIcky Wagner is doing well. I thought I had heard he was injured a few weeks ago, but if he was I guess it wasn't anything major. He played 37 snaps in most recent Lions game and played well. 

This is certainly no replacement for Decker since he appears to be one of the better young LT prospects in the NFL, but Greg Robinson has potentially turned a corner. He has been pretty good so far in preseason. We all know he's as talented as any LT out there, but it now seems like he might be ready to use those gifts to at least be an average NFL starter. 

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13 minutes ago, TripItUp said:

All I need to know is that Reid unequivocally has named Hunt the starter.

 

Whether Waldman likes his passblocking carries zero weight with me in terms of fantasy impact.

 

9 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Exactly. If he isn't good at pass blocking, then the Chiefs won't ask him to pass block much. We don't get fantasy points for successfully picking up a blitz so who cares. David Johnson barely was asked to pass block last year. Same with Lev Bell and Zeke. RBs that can potentially catch 50 passes don't spend many pass plays at home blocking, 

It's not like KC has Aaron Rodgers throwing footballs... let's get real. KC's offense doesn't depend on the pass, it utilizes their RBs heavily. 

 

ilove80s... trying to figure out if you like the guy or don't... 

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16 hours ago, zoonation said:

How many keepers?   If 24 guys are already gone none of those guys are making it back to the 3.12 turn (5.12 turn, really)

Most keepers are late round picks (for example I'm keeping Diggs (6) Ajayi (7) and Crowell (9)

 

Almost all of the "stud" RBs had their keeper contracts expire so they are available. 12 players up to 3 keepers each (or less)

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If Hunt fails it will be because he's a JAG. His athletic profile screams JAG. He had great college production, but it was at Toledo so the quality of the competition is questionable. Actually, he reminds me of another MAC player from this draft. 

Hunt as a true freshman ran for 800 yards and 6 TDs. I don't care what school you are at, that's a great season for a true freshman. As a sophomore, he goes OFF. 8.0 ypc, 1600 yards and 16 TDs. Then he goes nuclear in their bowl game with 271 yards and 5 TDs. Again, I don't care what you school you are at, those are eye popping numbers from a true sophomore. His junior season is a big step back as he gets suspended 2 games, then gets hurt and misses some time. He only finishes with 900 yards and 12 TDs. Finally, his senior year not only does he rebound, he adds a new dimension to his game. Hunt has 1400 yards and 10 TDs, but adds in 41 receptions for 400 yards and a TD. 

The guy he reminds me of is Corey Davis. Hits the ground running as a true freshman, dominates the MAC for their entire career (Hunt had a little bump with his suspension and injury). Davis finished with 5290 yards and 52 TDs. Hunt finished with 5500 yards and 45 TDs. The difference is Corey Davis didn't compete in any of the athletic testing so we really don't know what kind of athlete he is. Hunt did and we know he's nothing special athletically. 

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13 minutes ago, Dr. Dan said:

 

It's not like KC has Aaron Rodgers throwing footballs... let's get real. KC's offense doesn't depend on the pass, it utilizes their RBs heavily. 

 

ilove80s... trying to figure out if you like the guy or don't... 

I don't have a clear answer. The situation is really nice, but people are talking about valuing him as a late 2nd, early 3rd round pick for redraft. That is very high for a 3rd round RB that played in the MAC and is not all that athletic. 

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Yeah, Hunt's sparq scores were below average.  I think I heard on a podcast 28th percentile. 

Of course, several HOF runningbacks likely didn't have great sparq scores so it's obviously not an end all be all indicator.  

Edited by TripItUp

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2 minutes ago, TripItUp said:

Yeah, Hunt's sparq scores were below average.  I think I heard on a podcast 28th percentile. 

Of course, several HOF runningbacks likely didn't have great sparq scores so it's obviously not an end all be all indicator.  

Certainly not the end all indicator, but when we have a RB beating up on questionable competition and then we see that he's not actually fast or quick, it could be an indicator that he's not capable of translating his game from the MAC to the AFC West. 

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6 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

Certainly not the end all indicator, but when we have a RB beating up on questionable competition and then we see that he's not actually fast or quick, it could be an indicator that he's not capable of translating his game from the MAC to the AFC West. 

It could be an indicator, but the Chiefs confidence in him greatly outweighs those concerns for me.

I liked his value prior to this most recent ADP surge, but I do still think there is value as RB12 or lower.

Relatively High floor, high ceiling imho.

 

Edited by TripItUp
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