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2017-18 NBA (Playoffs): A gasping, wheezing thread begs message board poster arguing how Jordan never lost a Finals to just let it die in peace (3 Viewers)

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as they are not giving up anything to obtain those players..
Unless the cap comes in significantly higher than expected, they would need to find a home for one of Bradley, Smart, or Crowder without taking much current salary back. 

 
Unless the cap comes in significantly higher than expected, they would need to find a home for one of Bradley, Smart, or Crowder without taking much current salary back. 
I have thought for awhile that Bradley will be the odd man out...I like him but he is in the last year of his deal and is going to cash in nicely (look at last offseason's contracts and he is far better than many of those guys)...I just don't see his contract fitting into what the C's need to do in the future to close the gap with the Cavs and Warriors...

 
Unless the cap comes in significantly higher than expected, they would need to find a home for one of Bradley, Smart, or Crowder without taking much current salary back. 
As acting Nuggets GM of the thread, we are happy to take Crowder and offer Malik Beasley and a top 10 protected 2018 first rounder.

 
Rumors (I repeat rumors) are both Blake Griffin and Gordon Hayward are on the Celtics radar screen and there is mutual interest...if they land one of them and Fultz that would be a great start to the offseason...would put them in a position to make some more deals to round out the roster as they are not giving up anything to obtain those players...

http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/report-celtics-threat-sign-blake-griffin
I'm not a Celtics fan at all but I'd like to at least see them and San Antonio (or any other teams) be in position to not make GSW v. Cavs IV a foregone conclusion.

 
Avery Bradley is definitely the kind of guy a terrible franchise will give a gabillion dollars to. 
Yup...after Turner got his contract he must have cracked open a bottle of Veuve...in all fairness for some franchises they are not going to get anywhere close to an "elite" free agent so I'm sure their thinking is we have to give $ to someone...not gonna win you a title with that move but I guess it's better then the alternatives (I think)...

 
I'm not a Celtics fan at all but I'd like to at least see them and San Antonio (or any other teams) be in position to not make GSW v. Cavs IV a foregone conclusion.
Will be interesting to see how much of the gap the C's can close...the first step was getting the ping pong balls right...now the question is how much of what they do is for now or for few years from now...I'm guessing Ainge is trying to pull off both...close the gap but still be in position to overtake decisively in a couple of years and remain at that level for a far longer period then the KG/Pierce/Allen era...

 
Rumors (I repeat rumors) are both Blake Griffin and Gordon Hayward are on the Celtics radar screen and there is mutual interest...if they land one of them and Fultz that would be a great start to the offseason...would put them in a position to make some more deals to round out the roster as they are not giving up anything to obtain those players...

http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/report-celtics-threat-sign-blake-griffin
As a Celtics fan, yes on Hayward and no on Griffin. Blake has shown no reason to believe that he can be healthy and his game is based on athleticism that won't age well into a 3-4 year deal. 

I'm willing to take our chances adding Hayward, Fultz and Zizic to this year's core for a one year run at the Cavs, then do a mini-rebuild around the kids plus next year's Nets lottery pick. I'm still of the belief that the Celtics should try to trade Bradley or IT4 this offseason but I'm also willing to give it one last shot with this core.

 
Rumors (I repeat rumors) are both Blake Griffin and Gordon Hayward are on the Celtics radar screen and there is mutual interest...if they land one of them and Fultz that would be a great start to the offseason...would put them in a position to make some more deals to round out the roster as they are not giving up anything to obtain those players...

http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/report-celtics-threat-sign-blake-griffin
This is almost as bad as every single quality free agent will join the lakers every single year. This pre draft and pre free agent period can get kind of silly.

If they sign both those guys, then Lowry is coming to Sixers simply based on the fact that he grew up in the area. 

Celtics are in a weird spot though in that sure, you want them to try for championships now and also set up for future runs, but I'm not really sure that is possible, or a good idea. Even if they pull those 2 and get fultz I don't see their chances getting much better. If they think hey are that close they should really trade that pick and attempt to get butler. 

 
As a Celtics fan, yes on Hayward and no on Griffin. Blake has shown no reason to believe that he can be healthy and his game is based on athleticism that won't age well into a 3-4 year deal. 

I'm willing to take our chances adding Hayward, Fultz and Zizic to this year's core for a one year run at the Cavs, then do a mini-rebuild around the kids plus next year's Nets lottery pick. I'm still of the belief that the Celtics should try to trade Bradley or IT4 this offseason but I'm also willing to give it one last shot with this core.
Agree and disagree...I really don't understand what you mean one last shot with this core...this core has no shot unless they add...they are what they are...that being said they are in the middle of rebuilding they are just fortunate to do it while being good which is unusal...they are adding Fultz (probably), more than likely someone like Hayward, they have the Nets pick next year as well as three #1's in 2019, Zizic is coming over this year and Yabu probably the year after and current players like Brown, Rozier and Smart are not close to being finished products...this team is heading down a great path and their is no reason to think there best days are not ahead of them...

 
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This is almost as bad as every single quality free agent will join the lakers every single year. This pre draft and pre free agent period can get kind of silly.

If they sign both those guys, then Lowry is coming to Sixers simply based on the fact that he grew up in the area. 

Celtics are in a weird spot though in that sure, you want them to try for championships now and also set up for future runs, but I'm not really sure that is possible, or a good idea. Even if they pull those 2 and get fultz I don't see their chances getting much better. If they think hey are that close they should really trade that pick and attempt to get butler. 
I have no clue what Lowry has to do with the C's rumor...the article does not say they are adding both just that they are on the radar for both which is no surprise since the Haywood rumor has been out there for over a year and the C's supposedly have sniffed around Griffin in the past as well...not sure what you want them to do but I think adding Fultz and an all star level player like Haywood who is only 27 without giving up any core assets and still having Brooklyn's pick next year is a very big step forward for this team...it may not get them past the Cavs in 2018 but it definitely closes the gap and puts them in a nice spot to accomplish that in a few years...

 
The Celtics core of IT4, Bradley, Horford, Smart, Crowder. By the time that Fultz, Brown and the future picks hit their stride, almost all of those guys will be long gone from the Celtics. This next season is it for that group as a whole IMO with only (possibly) Smart being here for the next upswing.

 
I will say this:  A one-year starting five IT4, Bradley, Horford, Hayward and Griffin? If healthy (which is a GIGANTIC if), that's a hell of lineup.I can't imagine how they'd fit under the cap without gutting the bench depth though.

 
The Celtics core of IT4, Bradley, Horford, Smart, Crowder. By the time that Fultz, Brown and the future picks hit their stride, almost all of those guys will be long gone from the Celtics. This next season is it for that group as a whole IMO with only (possibly) Smart being here for the next upswing.
Smart is 23 and Crowder will be 27 next month...not sure why they would be long gone and if they are they are getting something for them...I agree that Bradley will probably be gone due to $ but if you are adding Fultz under a rookie deal that is fine (and again they may get something for him)...IT just turned 28 and had by far his best season...he is not old and if they want to move on from him I would assume it will not be for nothing...Horford is the one guy with a short shelf-life...

 
The Celtics core of IT4, Bradley, Horford, Smart, Crowder. By the time that Fultz, Brown and the future picks hit their stride, almost all of those guys will be long gone from the Celtics. This next season is it for that group as a whole IMO with only (possibly) Smart being here for the next upswing.
This may explain my post from before better. They have their expectations stretched too far. I think they are more likely to be slightly better then average for the next 8 years rather then committing to a run now or in the future. 

 
This may explain my post from before better. They have their expectations stretched too far. I think they are more likely to be slightly better then average for the next 8 years rather then committing to a run now or in the future. 
So you have zero expectations for Fultz, Brown's development, Zizic, next year's Brooklyn pick and the two additional #1's in 2019?  You don't think Ainge can land another free agent or trade for another stud?  They will not add anything to a team that just finished with 52 wins and the #1 seed in the East that only has one core player (Horford) that is probably past his prime? 

 
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Rumors (I repeat rumors) are both Blake Griffin and Gordon Hayward are on the Celtics radar screen and there is mutual interest...if they land one of them and Fultz that would be a great start to the offseason...would put them in a position to make some more deals to round out the roster as they are not giving up anything to obtain those players...

http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/report-celtics-threat-sign-blake-griffin
Here is my hot take on that. I would try to go get Porzingis. He already seems to not like the Knicks and he fits what the Celtics need with a rim protector, and stretch 4. I know it won't happen, but the 1st pick and Brown for him seems to be a win/win. 

Edit. This is instead of Blake, but still go get Hayward. 

 
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Smart is 23 and Crowder will be 27 next month...not sure why they would be long gone and if they are they are getting something for them...I agree that Bradley will probably be gone due to $ but if you are adding Fultz under a rookie deal that is fine (and again they may get something for him)...IT just turned 28 and had by far his best season...he is not old and if they want to move on from him I would assume it will not be for nothing...Horford is the one guy with a short shelf-life...
Trying to pay them all could be a problem. This is why a lot of peoe keep saying they should start cashing in some assets. 

 
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Here is my hot take on that. I would try to go get Porzingis. He already seems to not like the Knicks and he fits what the Celtics need with a rim protector, and stretch 4. I know it won't happen, but the 1st pick and Brown for him seems to be a win/win. 
Funny you mention that because he is the guy I think they would open up the vault for as well...I just don't see that happening as he is about all the Knicks have and I can't see them wanting to watch him play for Boston for the next decade or so...

 
Funny you mention that because he is the guy I think they would open up the vault for as well...I just don't see that happening as he is about all the Knicks have and I can't see them wanting to watch him play for Boston for the next decade or so...
That is why it is stupid. Fultz could be the same guy for the Knicks for a decade. It isn't like they are getting 3 role players for a stud. 

 
Trying to pay them all could be a problem. 
They can figure it out because Fultz and Brown (and next year's Brooklyn pick if they keep it) are on rookie deals so it would flow nicely...yes you have to make some moves like moving on from a Bradley but they are in a very unique position due to the Brooklyn trade...

 
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So you have zero expectations for Fultz, Brown's development, Zizic, next year's Brooklyn pick and the two additional #1's in 2019?  You don't think Ainge can land another free agent or trade for another stud?  They will not add anything to a team that just finished with 52 wins and the #1 seed in the East that only has one core player (Horford) that is probably past his prime? 
No, and I'm not trying to rain on celtic's fans dreams. Maybe it is the spoils of having belicheck and Brady, but the sports media in that pocket in the northeast seems to think an NBA team can build a dynasty-life team for 10-13 years. 

What the spurs have done has been pretty amazing, and I'm not sure any other franchise can have that kind of track record for Over 10 years in a row span. I just think the celtics need to commit more to either making a real push in the next 2 years, or commit more to te future. 

Im sure they will add to the team, but other teams in the league should improve as well. A pull of heyward and fultz will be nice for them, but I'm not sure it will get them much farther. Will add talent to an already loaded and packed guard position, and will not address the lack of defense in the paint or some other areas of need 

 
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Here is my hot take on that. I would try to go get Porzingis. He already seems to not like the Knicks and he fits what the Celtics need with a rim protector, and stretch 4. I know it won't happen, but the 1st pick and Brown for him seems to be a win/win. 

Edit. This is instead of Blake, but still go get Hayward. 
Porzingis is not worth the 1st pick. And I also think he is a center, not a PF going forward. Forwards in today's NBA will always be better playing up a position, if they are capable of doing it. Teams want bigger guards and more athletic bigs that can switch everything.

 
Here is my hot take on that. I would try to go get Porzingis. He already seems to not like the Knicks and he fits what the Celtics need with a rim protector, and stretch 4. I know it won't happen, but the 1st pick and Brown for him seems to be a win/win. 

Edit. This is instead of Blake, but still go get Hayward. 
I love Porzingis but I'd hesitate to give up Fultz and Brown to get him -- Only because next year's draft will be loaded with stretch 4 talent.

 
No, and I'm not trying to rain on celtic's fans dreams. Maybe it is the spoils of having belicheck and Brady, but the sports media in that pocket in the northeast seems to think an NBA team can build a dynasty-life team for 10-13 years. 

What the spurs have done has been pretty amazing, and I'm not sure any other franchise can have that kind of track year for 10 straight years. I just think the celtics need to commit more to either making a real push in the next 2 years, or commit more to te future. 

Im sure they will add to the team, but other teams in the league should improve as well. A pull of heyward and fultz will be nice for them, but I'm not sure it will get them much farther. Will add talent to an already loaded and packed guard position, and will not address the lack of defense in the paint or some other areas of need 
We will have to agree to disagree,,,due to the Brooklyn deal the C's are in a unique position...they are in solid cap shape have the #1 pick this year with a chance of having the same pick next year...if we were simply talking about this team without those Brooklyn picks or Brown who was acquired with a Brooklyn pick than it would be a totally different story...

 
We will have to agree to disagree,,,due to the Brooklyn deal the C's are in a unique position...they are in solid cap shape have the #1 pick this year with a chance of having the same pick next year...if we were simply talking about this team without those Brooklyn picks or Brown who was acquired with a Brooklyn pick than it would be a totally different story...
Best part is we should be able to find out and watch and see. I'm sure this is a bit of a homer take, but I like the Sixers situation better then the celtics. You guys get a lot of immediate gratification and hope for the future, but i think the hope for the future with the Sixers is a little better and stronger (as long as colangelo doesn't do anything stupid....)

 
modogg said:
Best part is we should be able to find out and watch and see. I'm sure this is a bit of a homer take, but I like the Sixers situation better then the celtics. You guys get a lot of immediate gratification and hope for the future, but i think the hope for the future with the Sixers is a little better and stronger (as long as colangelo doesn't do anything stupid....)
I think you see the C's as an old team...they have no age other then Horford...they are a team coming off of an Eastern Conference Finals with the #1 pick in the draft (and possibly the same next year) and potential to add an impact free agent or veteran thru trade...the Sixers have some nice young pieces and the future looks bright but Embiid has played about 30 games in three years, Okafor is a disappointment, Simmons missed a full year and Noel is already gone as well as the fact they have won a total of 75 games the past four years...this team has a ways to go before they get near where the C's are... 

 
Boston said:
Rumors (I repeat rumors) are both Blake Griffin and Gordon Hayward are on the Celtics radar screen and there is mutual interest...if they land one of them and Fultz that would be a great start to the offseason...would put them in a position to make some more deals to round out the roster as they are not giving up anything to obtain those players...

http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/report-celtics-threat-sign-blake-griffin
Boston's leading afternoon sportstalk show spent the entire afternoon asking which they would prefer and not one caller said "the one Brad Stevens wants most" so the town doesnt really understand where its bread is buttered and is still da same buncha frontrunnin losahs theyve always been.

 
I think you see the C's as an old team...they have no age other then Horford...they are a team coming off of an Eastern Conference Finals with the #1 pick in the draft (and possibly the same next year) and potential to add an impact free agent or veteran thru trade...the Sixers have some nice young pieces and the future looks bright but Embiid has played about 30 games in three years, Okafor is a disappointment, Simmons missed a full year and Noel is already gone as well as the fact they have won a total of 75 games the past four years...this team has a ways to go before they get near where the C's are... 
I think where we may differ too is the value placed in the celtics young talent. I think jaylen brown is equivalent to Justin Anderson on the Sixers. Fultz has the chance to be a special talent, but I'm not sure the celtics have the top talent on their roster like the Sixers. I would take Embiid, and probably Simmons, over anybody on that roster. A lot of unheralded guys on Sixers roster that  are good role players forward. Covington really should be in conversation for all-defense team, etc. 

 
Boston said:
We will have to agree to disagree,,,due to the Brooklyn deal the C's are in a unique position...they are in solid cap shape have the #1 pick this year with a chance of having the same pick next year...if we were simply talking about this team without those Brooklyn picks or Brown who was acquired with a Brooklyn pick than it would be a totally different story...
That's a fallacy...they are in decent shape this year (and even then they have to make moves to sign Hayward or Griffin), but after that they have to make major moves one way or another on Thomas, Bradley, and Smart.  

 
I dont see Hayward leaving Utah. He is a king around there and that team has a solid young core. He gets more money to stay and should be a top 4 in the west going forward. 

 
Boston's leading afternoon sportstalk show spent the entire afternoon asking which they would prefer and not one caller said "the one Brad Stevens wants most" so the town doesnt really understand where its bread is buttered and is still da same buncha frontrunnin losahs theyve always been.
Could not agree with that more...

 
The only thing of substance worth discussing for 2017-2018 is the Cavs & Warriors. Maybe the Celts make it a little interesting, but let's be real, still a two horse race next season. 

The Warriors are clearly the superior team, so what can the Cavs do; so far I've seen an Irving for CP3 and Love for PG trade discussed on various outlets. While these trades will make noise, I don't think it'll really do anything to help the Cavs improve. Chris Paul is 32 and Irving is awesome, not a huge fan of that move, although CP3 will spread it around a little better, you need Irving's awesome scoring ability against the high powered Warriors. I can understand the argument from both sides, but I like the Irving side. Paul George for Love I find a little more interesting and might bump them a small notch, but still won't get them close to being the better team. 

The first thing the Cavs really need to address is their bench, they need some talent - it was a nice career for Williams, but he shouldn't be resigned. JR Smith / Shumpert, meh. I don't know what the answer is, but if they don't address this, they have zero chance IMO.

 
That's a fallacy...they are in decent shape this year (and even then they have to make moves to sign Hayward or Griffin), but after that they have to make major moves one way or another on Thomas, Bradley, and Smart.  
Not a fallacy...the Bradley move has been mentioned a few times...as for IT it is a simple keep him or not...it would be an issue if keeping him wasn't an option......that is not a bad position to be in...

 
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I think where we may differ too is the value placed in the celtics young talent. I think jaylen brown is equivalent to Justin Anderson on the Sixers. Fultz has the chance to be a special talent, but I'm not sure the celtics have the top talent on their roster like the Sixers. I would take Embiid, and probably Simmons, over anybody on that roster. A lot of unheralded guys on Sixers roster that  are good role players forward. Covington really should be in conversation for all-defense team, etc. 
If Jaylen Brown turns out to be the equivalent of Justin Anderson the C's future just took a big step backwards...

 
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