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rockaction

CNN Threatens To Out/Doxx User Behind Trump Bodyslam Video - Now Just Bickering and Bad Put-Downs

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This is literally insanity.  CNN has fired Reza Aslan for tweeting that Trump was "a piece of ****."  They parted ways with Kathy Griffin for obvious reasons.  And of course, they just fired two reporters for a negative Tump story that failed to meet their editorial standards.  Some liberals are upset about that, but there's no groundswell of liberals who  think those are free speech issues. 

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7 minutes ago, rockaction said:

Two points: 

1) He uses the word "dox." I'll trust him over an internet guy named mass raider.

2) It's so egregious even he can't believe it.  

Yeah, you find any definition of dox that fits this, you let me know. 

Lame hill you're dying in here.

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2 minutes ago, rockaction said:

Two points: 

1) He uses the word "dox." I'll trust him over an internet guy named mass raider.

2) It's so egregious even he can't believe it.  

Trust me, someone who has dealt with Constitutional law and statutory interpretation issues for a living, over either of them:

There are no free speech or federal criminal acts here.  Assange looks like a complete moron with an agenda here, in addition to sounding like a hypocrite in such an obvious and overwhelming way that it makes me wonder if it's intentional for some reason. 

You can criticize CNN here if you want to be a baby about it (they could have run the guy's name if they chose, anything short of that is an act of mercy towards him). But citing the First Amendment here, or appealing to the worlds most famous and reckless doxxer for moral or legal guidance on the subject, is beyond silly.

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12 minutes ago, rockaction said:

Two points: 

1) He uses the word "dox." I'll trust him over an internet guy named mass raider.

2) It's so egregious even he can't believe it.  

The number of things so egregious even Assange can't believe it (according to his Twitter feed) is rather impressively large.

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2 minutes ago, Henry Ford said:

The number of things so egregious even Assange can't believe it (according to his Twitter feed) is rather impressively large.

But yet a tiny faction of the hyperboles contained in the two Trump threads.  

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Either out him or not...CNN is a media organization and the guy has to live with the ramifications of his actions but spare me the June Cleaver parenting of how the guy should live his life going forward and how if he doesn't he is definitely going to get grounded...

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10 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

Trust me, someone who has dealt with Constitutional law and statutory interpretation issues for a living, over either of them:

There are no free speech or federal criminal acts here.  Assange looks like a complete moron with an agenda here, in addition to sounding like a hypocrite in such an obvious and overwhelming way that it makes me wonder if it's intentional for some reason. 

You can criticize CNN here if you want to be a baby about it (they could have run the guy's name if they chose, anything short of that is an act of mercy towards him). But citing the First Amendment here, or appealing to the worlds most famous and reckless doxxer for moral or legal guidance on the subject, is beyond silly.

I never said it implicated the First. Ever. In fact, I used the words "state actor."

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7 minutes ago, Henry Ford said:

The number of things so egregious even Assange can't believe it (according to his Twitter feed) is rather impressively large.

Touche. 

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8 minutes ago, rockaction said:

I never said it implicated the First. Ever. In fact, I used the words "state actor."

Yeah, the only first amendment issue here is that, as a media company, CNN obviously has the right to publish this guy's name if they want to.  

Most of the criticism being directed at CNN (at least from what I've seen on this forum) is just that -- criticism.  CNN is behaving unethically (but legally) in this instance, and they deserve to get called on it.  There's no conflict between thinking that Trump is an idiot for having tweeted out that gif in the first place and also thinking that CNN has no defensible business behind tracking down some random guy on Reddit just for having created the gif.  Random #######s on Reddit, 4chan, or whatever aren't newsworthy.

 

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7 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Yeah, the only first amendment issue here is that, as a media company, CNN obviously has the right to publish this guy's name if they want to.  

Most of the criticism being directed at CNN (at least from what I've seen on this forum) is just that -- criticism.  CNN is behaving unethically (but legally) in this instance, and they deserve to get called on it.  There's no conflict between thinking that Trump is an idiot for having tweeted out that gif in the first place and also thinking that CNN has no defensible business behind tracking down some random guy on Reddit just for having created the gif.  Random #######s on Reddit, 4chan, or whatever aren't newsworthy.

What if CNN had tracked him down and discovered that he was a Russian agent, or an employee at Fox News, or a Republican political operative?

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1 hour ago, Sinn Fein said:

Second, this guy played with fire and is close to getting burned. If you don't want someone to learn what you post online - too bad.  Don't post something you are embarrassed to attach your name to. I have no sympathy for anyone outted online 

Speaking as somebody who has 35,000+ posts on a public but anonymous message board, it might not surprise you to know that I do have sympathy for these people.  Okay, granted, I do not make it a habit to post about "How come there are so many Jews in the news media?" but I do like to trot out arguments here that I'm not yet 100% committed to just to see how they hold up under scrutiny.  Also, I would post way, way less if I had to attach my name to any of this, mainly just because I value my own privacy and there's no reason why my friends or coworkers should necessarily know my ideological views.  Most of the stuff I post here I never share with anybody IRL.  Except for my hatred of Tom Brady, which I'm fairly vocal about.  

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2 minutes ago, [scooter] said:

What if CNN had tracked him down and discovered that he was a Russian agent, or an employee at Fox News, or a Republican political operative?

The people behind awful postings on reddit, like the one in question, have been reported on in many cases in the past.

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Yeah, I disagree with Ivan that it isn't news.  At least in a 24 hour news cycle, it's news.  What is it like in r/thedonald?  What type of person does this?  Is it kids?  Grown men?  Are they sincere?  Or just looking for LOLZ.  Maybe a bit of both?  It's a public interest story, but a story.  It probably seems worse for CNN to do it, and not some other outlet, but it's not a crazy story.  Particularly because of the guy's other content (which is, of course, the stuff that he doesn't want associated with him). 

It's certainly no less news than profiles on Trump voters feeling alienated in California or whatever. 

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3 minutes ago, [scooter] said:

What if CNN had tracked him down and discovered that he was a Russian agent, or an employee at Fox News, or a Republican political operative?

Do you want to apply that same standard to the literally millions of people who post stupid stuff on Reddit and 4chan?  CNN should go after them because hey who knows maybe that's actually Bill Kristol who came up with the Dat Boi meme?

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3 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:
9 minutes ago, [scooter] said:

What if CNN had tracked him down and discovered that he was a Russian agent, or an employee at Fox News, or a Republican political operative?

Do you want to apply that same standard to the literally millions of people who post stupid stuff on Reddit and 4chan?  CNN should go after them because hey who knows maybe that's actually Bill Kristol who came up with the Dat Boi meme?

If that "stuff" can be perceived as a potential threat to CNN, and a major political figure distributes it to millions of people, and the poster continues to endorse it after it gets worldwide distribution.............yes, I want to apply the same standard to that.

 

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1 minute ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Do you want to apply that same standard to the literally millions of people who post stupid stuff on Reddit and 4chan?  CNN should go after them because hey who knows maybe that's actually Bill Kristol who came up with the Dat Boi meme?

Memes that are retweeted by the President of the United States are newsworthy. 

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2 hours ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

So no different than Trump refusing to give CNN press access if they don't apologize for things they've said to him?  

Other than the fact that the 2 are TOTALLY different?

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2 hours ago, Bojang0301 said:

CNN essentially threatening the person if they were to revoke their apology. I took the text they wrote as if they strong armed the person to apologize then said if they were to revoke/post about CNN again they would retaliate. 

No, CNN agreed to the person's request, but reserved the right to write another story, IF he didn't uphold his end of the bargain, that HE came up with. 

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rockaction, you went full Trumpkin.  You never go full Trumpkin.

Edited by Dedfin
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11 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:

Speaking as somebody who has 35,000+ posts on a public but anonymous message board, it might not surprise you to know that I do have sympathy for these people.  Okay, granted, I do not make it a habit to post about "How come there are so many Jews in the news media?" but I do like to trot out arguments here that I'm not yet 100% committed to just to see how they hold up under scrutiny.  Also, I would post way, way less if I had to attach my name to any of this, mainly just because I value my own privacy and there's no reason why my friends or coworkers should necessarily know my ideological views.  Most of the stuff I post here I never share with anybody IRL.  Except for my hatred of Tom Brady, which I'm fairly vocal about.  

I'm fairly certain that if you were outed as the author of every single post that you've ever posted on this site, all would still be well in your life.

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It became news when the President tweeted out his stuff. I'm not sure how anyone can argue against the public desire to understand what, if any, interaction they might have had from Trump people given that he was also making anti-Semitic material. 

I agree CNN was a little too heavy handed with the statements about why they weren't releasing his name, but he had apparently already apologized and deleted his content before that was published. So if you are faulting CNN for that you are basically faulting them for tracking him down at all, which seems ridiculous. 

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2 hours ago, Henry Ford said:

They contacted him for a quote and he asked them not to use his name, saying that he's going to turn over a new leaf.  They agreed to his terms.  That's not a threat or blackmail.

"CNN is not publishing “HanA**holeSolo’s” name because he is a private citizen who has issued an extensive statement of apology, showed his remorse by saying he has taken down all his offending posts, and because he said he is not going to repeat this ugly behavior on social media again. In addition, he said his statement could serve as an example to others not to do the same.

CNN reserves the right to publish his identity should any of that change."

It sure sounds like they're absolutely ready to publish his identity if he isn't a good boy going forward.  His privacy and risk of exposure isn't being acknowledged because CNN is respectful of his rights as a private citizen that made a ####### meme.  It's being acknowledged because of his apology, showing remorse, taking down his posts, and not repeating his behavior.  Even if this isn't a threat in some legal context it is completely embarrassing for an international media giant to act his way.

I love that people can go to bat for CNN as the free press under fire, but don't respect the rights of a guy that made a meme versus the mondo transnational lawyered-up media corp.  Good lord.  

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It is particularly newsworthy because the president has retweeted content produced by white nationalists or alt-righties or whatever term you want to use for our culture's online bigots many times. He has also refused to explain how he comes across some of these things and why he doesn't check on the producer of the content before giving that person a massive stage for their speech. If there's anyone to be mad at here other than the bigot himself, it's Trump for making him newsworthy.

Edited by TobiasFunke

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1 minute ago, Ren Ho3k said:

"CNN is not publishing “HanA**holeSolo’s” name because he is a private citizen who has issued an extensive statement of apology, showed his remorse by saying he has taken down all his offending posts, and because he said he is not going to repeat this ugly behavior on social media again. In addition, he said his statement could serve as an example to others not to do the same.

CNN reserves the right to publish his identity should any of that change."

It sure sounds like they're absolutely ready to publish his identity if he isn't a good boy going forward.  His privacy and risk of exposure isn't being acknowledged because CNN is respectful of his rights as a private citizen that made a ####### meme.  It's being acknowledged because of his apology, showing remorse, taking down his posts, and not repeating his behavior.  Even if this isn't a threat in some legal context it is completely embarrassing for an international media giant to act his way.

I love that people can go to bat for CNN as the free press under fire, but don't respect the rights of a guy that made a meme versus the mondo transnational lawyered-up media corp.  Good lord.  

What rights are those, exactly? 

Oh, right.  My favorite fictional right of conservatives: the nonexistent right to consequence-free speech.

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3 minutes ago, Ren Ho3k said:

"CNN is not publishing “HanA**holeSolo’s” name because he is a private citizen who has issued an extensive statement of apology, showed his remorse by saying he has taken down all his offending posts, and because he said he is not going to repeat this ugly behavior on social media again. In addition, he said his statement could serve as an example to others not to do the same.

CNN reserves the right to publish his identity should any of that change."

It sure sounds like they're absolutely ready to publish his identity if he isn't a good boy going forward.  His privacy and risk of exposure isn't being acknowledged because CNN is respectful of his rights as a private citizen that made a ####### meme.  It's being acknowledged because of his apology, showing remorse, taking down his posts, and not repeating his behavior.  Even if this isn't a threat in some legal context it is completely embarrassing for an international media giant to act his way.

I love that people can go to bat for CNN as the free press under fire, but don't respect the rights of a guy that made a meme versus the mondo transnational lawyered-up media corp.  Good lord.  

I have repeatedly said that the whole "CNN meme" "story" is ridiculous bull####.  That said, publishing a story about something thousands of people are discussing on Twitter is a reasonable thing for a news organization involved in the story to do.  And if they left the guy's name out because he said "please, I'll be a good boy, just give me a chance to not have my name out there" they can say "we reserve the right..."

Again, I think they should have just published it, but it sounds like he's happier with this arrangement.

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5 minutes ago, knowledge dropper said:

I am completely shocked that I can't find anyone in the real world that will defend CNN, but come on here and it's the same guys blinded by Trump hate....,:no:

Yeah, I'm shocked that your circle of friends is devoid of differing opinions, too. Crazy world.

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20 minutes ago, Arsenal of Doom said:

It became news when the President tweeted out his stuff. I'm not sure how anyone can argue against the public desire to understand what, if any, interaction they might have had from Trump people given that he was also making anti-Semitic material. 

I agree CNN was a little too heavy handed with the statements about why they weren't releasing his name, but he had apparently already apologized and deleted his content before that was published. So if you are faulting CNN for that you are basically faulting them for tracking him down at all, which seems ridiculous. 

Not just anti-semitic.  I haven't seen that many uses of the "n"-word since my last family reunion.

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28 minutes ago, Henry Ford said:

I'm fairly certain that if you were outed as the author of every single post that you've ever posted on this site, all would still be well in your life.

Personally, I could never let this happen.  It would ruin me.

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38 minutes ago, [scooter] said:

If that "stuff" can be perceived as a potential threat to CNN

No, it really can't be.  It's tasteless and puerile, but it's just not reasonable to view some idiotic post made by an idiotic redditor as a genuine threat to CNN.  

Now, Trump's tweet itself could certainly be viewed as a threat, especially in the context of his ongoing hostility toward the media.  But even then, it's not a threat of actual physical violence.  

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Well, the 4chan (and Daily Stormer, and r/TheDonald) discussion of "war" noted by a staffer here has been documented for the rest of the world to read.  Really great stuff.  Glad that's in existence. Seems like a really righteous group of folks.

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40 minutes ago, Ramsay Hunt Experience said:

Memes that are retweeted by the President of the United States are newsworthy. 

I agree, but the story here is "President RTs Juvenile Meme," not "Redditor Comes Up with Juvenile Meme on Reddit."

I could get behind your idea of a legitimate news story asking "Who are these people really?" and digging into this little corner of the internet.  Even then, I strongly believe it should be done in such a way to preserve the privacy of people who have voluntarily chosen to remain anonymous. 

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What is the timeline?

HanSolo seemed to have come out with an apology well before CNN found him.  

When did he go hard delete on all his accounts? I assume that was prior to the apology.

This seems like Pizzagate stuff, CNN may not have even really talked to him that much.  There isn't any indication they made any threats to do anything without his apology coming out first.

 

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2 minutes ago, culdeus said:

What is the timeline?

HanSolo seemed to have come out with an apology well before CNN found him.  

When did he go hard delete on all his accounts? I assume that was prior to the apology.

This seems like Pizzagate stuff, CNN may not have even really talked to him that much.  There isn't any indication they made any threats to do anything without his apology coming out first.

 

According to CNN they had reached out to talk to him but he hadn't responded before the apology and him deleting his stuff. 

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3 minutes ago, IvanKaramazov said:
43 minutes ago, [scooter] said:

If that "stuff" can be perceived as a potential threat to CNN

No, it really can't be.  It's tasteless and puerile, but it's just not reasonable to view some idiotic post made by an idiotic redditor as a genuine threat to CNN.  

Now, Trump's tweet itself could certainly be viewed as a threat, especially in the context of his ongoing hostility toward the media.  But even then, it's not a threat of actual physical violence.  

If Trump's tweet can be viewed as a threat, then CNN has a right and obligation to investigate the sources related to that threat -- especially when that source responds to Trump's tweet with "I am honored!!". Add in the fact that the source once wrote "500,000 dead Muslims is a good start" and CNN is totally justified in thinking that this guy could never be anything but 100% harmless.

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6 minutes ago, Arsenal of Doom said:
10 minutes ago, culdeus said:

What is the timeline?

HanSolo seemed to have come out with an apology well before CNN found him.  

When did he go hard delete on all his accounts? I assume that was prior to the apology.

This seems like Pizzagate stuff, CNN may not have even really talked to him that much.  There isn't any indication they made any threats to do anything without his apology coming out first.

According to CNN they had reached out to talk to him but he hadn't responded before the apology and him deleting his stuff. 

It looks like at least one other media outlet tried to contact him via reddit or email on Sunday and/or Monday, at which point he was already deleting his reddit posts (link). Then sometime on Monday CNN emailed him and called a phone number that they thought was associated with him. He did not answer the phone or respond to the emails.

On Tuesday, the guy posted the apology to reddit.

After that, he called CNN and confirmed his identity.

Wednesday morning, he called CNN again to confirm that he was not threatened in any way.

 

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3 hours ago, Sinn Fein said:

Don't we already have a nothingburger thread?

First, who cares who created the meme?  I don't find that newsworthy - it was a childish meme, and I have laughed at a lot worse. The news was Trump tweeting it - and even then the story is more "look at the idiot president" not OMG Trump is threatening to beat up CNN reporters. It is part of a larger story about trump chilling free speech - but leave it there. 

Second, this guy played with fire and is close to getting burned. If you don't want someone to learn what you post online - too bad.  Don't post something you are embarrassed to attach your name to. I have no sympathy for anyone outted online 

:goodposting:

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49 minutes ago, ScottNorwood said:

Personally, I could never let this happen.  It would ruin me.

Nonsense. Your work in the "fictional wheelhouse threads" thread warrants a congressional seat at a minimum.

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Henry Ford is right, Freedom of Speech is a right against our government, not a right against our peers.  What you guys are talking about is privacy, specifically internet privacy.

Quote

"There’s always some opinion you’re not socially allowed to hold, in every society, and there’s always at least one taboo that has no basis in reality." - Paul Graham, computer programmer and author.

 

Quote

"And in practice, as there’s no shortage of people who will try to silence dissenting opinions using any means necessary, the only way to guarantee the wider Freedom of Speech today is by guaranteeing Privacy – to allow opinions to be posted and stand on their own, without connecting them to the identity of the posting individual. It doesn’t have to be strict anonymity as pseudonymity (posting under a nom de guerre) works just as well, but it does require strict privacy.  You don’t have Freedom of Speech without Privacy (which remains your own responsibility)." -Rick Falkvinge, head of privacy at Private Internet Access

 

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4 minutes ago, knowledge dropper said:

No.  Just astute adults that can recognize the obvious.  

Sorry.  My mistake.

I'm shocked that your circle of friends is devoid of astute adults that can recognize the obvious. 

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23 minutes ago, tonydead said:

Henry Ford is right, Freedom of Speech is a right against our government, not a right against our peers.  What you guys are talking about is privacy, specifically internet privacy.

 

 

And I'm a huge fan of internet privacy.  Unfortunately, our government is not and our laws are not. 

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1 minute ago, Henry Ford said:

Sorry.  My mistake.

I'm shocked that your circle of friends is devoid of astute adults that can recognize the obvious. 

:lmao: 

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It's so strange.  The once powerful CNN has turned into a tabloid. Fake News! 

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2 hours ago, TobiasFunke said:

What rights are those, exactly? 

Oh, right.  My favorite fictional right of conservatives: the nonexistent right to consequence-free speech.

Unless you're Colin Kaepernick. 

Edited by Zow
ETA: Based on the people liking this post, perhaps the dead-pan sarcasm I intended with my response designed to point out the hypocrisy didn't come across well enough. Hopefully this clears that up.
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