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Kid Rock for Senate

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31 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

I appreciate the honesty. What is different about the economy now from where it was the final year under Obama?

What are the things you wanted that he has delivered on (outside of the aforementioned economy)?

and what about the terrorist attack on the weekend?

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6 minutes ago, killface said:

and what about the terrorist attack on the weekend?

True. Almost had an ever bigger one in Oklahoma too and the Minnesota Mosque bombing could have been much much worse.

Edited by Ilov80s

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Can't we just remove the Michigan/Minnesota border, declare it one state, and give two Senators to Washington D.C.?

ETA: Best gerrymandering suggestion, ever!

Edited by Mister CIA

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2 minutes ago, Mister CIA said:

Can't we just remove the Michigan/Minnesota border, declare it one state, and give two Senators to Washington D.C.?

That's not going to work at all 

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32 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:
36 minutes ago, Mister CIA said:

Can't we just remove the Michigan/Minnesota border, declare it one state, and give two Senators to Washington D.C.?

That's not going to work at all 

My bad. I mixed up Michigan/Minnesota and North Dakota/South Dakota.

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On 8/13/2017 at 0:36 PM, Ilov80s said:

They have also helped make us the wealthiest, most well defended country in the history of the world. Why would we want to put that in the hands of amateurs?

We aren't the wealthiest country in the history of the world, we are the most in debt country in the history of the world. Give me an open credit card and I can buy you a bunch of guns and make you as secure as you want. Our collection of professional politicians are taking us to a brink of financial disaster. Does that recommend kid rock for Senate? I'd say no.  But if any organization is put in debt to a point of 6 or 7 times it's yearly income it is not well run. What part of that is professional and competent?

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5 minutes ago, Hot Diggity Dog said:

We aren't the wealthiest country in the history of the world, we are the most in debt country in the history of the world. Give me an open credit card and I can buy you a bunch of guns and make you as secure as you want. Our collection of professional politicians are taking us to a brink of financial disaster. Does that recommend kid rock for Senate? I'd say no.  But if any organization is put in debt to a point of 6 or 7 times it's yearly income it is not well run. What part of that is professional and competent?

You're talking yourself into it, aren't you?

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Just now, roadkill1292 said:

You're talking yourself into it, aren't you?

No. I'm saying if your argument against kid rock is we don't need him because we are all good with our current leadership you are whistling past the grave yard. 

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58 minutes ago, Hot Diggity Dog said:

We aren't the wealthiest country in the history of the world, we are the most in debt country in the history of the world.

No.

Edited by Ilov80s

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1 minute ago, GROOT said:

Only if the little person (AKA. midget) in his band will be his running mate.

:mellow:  Joe C died quite a few years back, unfortunately....

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1 minute ago, jomar said:

:mellow:  Joe C died quite a few years back, unfortunately....

Well Damn RIP

 

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not that I'd ever vote for Kid Rock, but he's a much better human being than Trump or Ted Nugent

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1 minute ago, jomar said:

not that I'd ever vote for Kid Rock, but he's a much better human being than Trump or Ted Nugent

This is about Kid Rock. There are parting gifts before you leave.Thanks for sharing.

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On 8/13/2017 at 10:17 AM, Stealthycat said:

our Dem/Rep leaders right now have failed - I see no reason not to give people like Kid Rock, Jesse Ventura, Trump etc equal consideration. The professional politicians have driven the US into 20 trillion in debt, have created the largest employer in the world (US Govt) and disastrously manage everything they touch.

so yeah - I think we can be better as a country and the elected officials are accountable for where we are, right now

And our way to get there is by electing unqualified celebrities?

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On 8/15/2017 at 5:24 AM, Hot Diggity Dog said:

We aren't the wealthiest country in the history of the world, we are the most in debt country in the history of the world. Give me an open credit card and I can buy you a bunch of guns and make you as secure as you want. Our collection of professional politicians are taking us to a brink of financial disaster. Does that recommend kid rock for Senate? I'd say no.  But if any organization is put in debt to a point of 6 or 7 times it's yearly income it is not well run. What part of that is professional and competent?

Do you think electing a guy who has had six of his companies file bankruptcy is going to help or hurt this problem?

 

 

 

And... you may want to take an economics class or two. 

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15 minutes ago, Zow said:

And our way to get there is by electing unqualified celebrities?

someone has to get elected

career politicians are not the solution - obviously

Kid Rock - why the hell would he do this? It'll get in the way of everything he does and loves. Maybe ... just maybe, he really cares.

That has great potential vs a career politician 

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44 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

I almost thought that article went on for too long -- once they couldn't locate actual people who were allegedly running the (alleged) polling firm, I figured that the point had been made; this poll was not credible -- but then it went on to point out the kinds of effects that these fake polls could actually have. Kid Rock For Senate is actually being taken seriously by some yayhoos (and even by some of the above average intellects of FBGs) based on nothing more than rumors drummed up by a bunch of Pepe trolls.

You guys know that Trump has dementia, don't you?

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13 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

someone has to get elected

career politicians are not the solution - obviously

Kid Rock - why the hell would he do this? It'll get in the way of everything he does and loves. Maybe ... just maybe, he really cares.

That has great potential vs a career politician 

If my mom needed surgery, I'm not anywhere close to the best option even though I'd "really care."

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Let him run.  Let him win.  Let's see how this works out for Michigan.  I'd like to watch. 

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19 minutes ago, roadkill1292 said:

I almost thought that article went on for too long -- once they couldn't locate actual people who were allegedly running the (alleged) polling firm, I figured that the point had been made; this poll was not credible -- but then it went on to point out the kinds of effects that these fake polls could actually have. Kid Rock For Senate is actually being taken seriously by some yayhoos (and even by some of the above average intellects of FBGs) based on nothing more than rumors drummed up by a bunch of Pepe trolls.

 

I like longform Internet journalism and math more than the average bear but I find a lot of stuff on 538 to be hopelessly arcane

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35 minutes ago, Brony said:

Let him run.  Let him win.  Let's see how this works out for Michigan.  I'd like to watch. 

Buckeye?

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3 hours ago, Zow said:

If my mom needed surgery, I'm not anywhere close to the best option even though I'd "really care."

Neither are 300 doctors that have killed a helluva lot of people. 

Good thing being a politician doesn't require a degree and vast amounts of training - but you took that into consideration when making the analogy, right?

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If only I could run under the name of an established incumbent who is no longer running.....maybe I can even get his old yard signs and use them. 

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27 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

Neither are 300 doctors that have killed a helluva lot of people. 

Good thing being a politician doesn't require a degree and vast amounts of training - but you took that into consideration when making the analogy, right?

No doubt. 

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the worst politicians are the ones that's been doing it for a career

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4 hours ago, Stealthycat said:

the worst politicians are the ones that's been doing it for a career

Why? 

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4 hours ago, Stealthycat said:

the worst politicians are the ones that's been doing it for a career

James Madison started in politics at the age of 23.

Lincoln spent most his time after the age of 25 either holding office or running for office.

Henry Clay was appointed to his first political position at 26.

FDR started at 28.  Teddy around 23.

Sam Rayburn elected to Texas HoR at 25.

 

 

 

 

 

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8 hours ago, Ilov80s said:
12 hours ago, Stealthycat said:

the worst politicians are the ones that's been doing it for a career

Why? 

 

Complex answer but in a nutshell .... they don't care. They have their money, their wealth, their retirement. They live a world of $5,000 suits, and $250 lunches being flown all over the world private jets, best hotels, all paid for by you the taxpayer. They can pass every law, no laws, good laws, bad laws .......... it doesn't matter, they've got it made anyway. 

 

OrtonToOlsen    you listed 5. How many have moved through congress since 1925 ? 

 

Bottom line ....... we live in a nation where the Govt employee's more people than any single entity on the planet. That same Govt gets it money from 1 source - taxation. We are 20 Trillion dollars in debt. We will see Social Security fail in 8 years. We see inner cities a killing fields, drugs rampant, 15-20 million people here illegally, 100 million on some form of social aid. 

I could go on and on but you think our Govt has succeeded? Really ?

 

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10 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

Bottom line ....... we live in a nation where the Govt employee's more people than any single entity on the planet. That same Govt gets it money from 1 source - taxation.

What's wrong with self employment? 

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Just now, Ilov80s said:

What's wrong with self employment?

what ?

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3 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

what ?

What is the government of the United States? It is the people. There is no royal family, dictator or ruling class. The citizens of the country are responsible for it's governing. So what is wrong if we hire lots of us to work for us and do things like guard the borders, investigate organized crime, track terrorists and defend the country? You would prefer we have private companies handling things like defense?

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19 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

 

Complex answer but in a nutshell .... they don't care. They have their money, their wealth, their retirement. They live a world of $5,000 suits, and $250 lunches being flown all over the world private jets, best hotels, all paid for by you the taxpayer. They can pass every law, no laws, good laws, bad laws .......... it doesn't matter, they've got it made anyway. 

 

I think you are overly glamorizing what it's like to be a career politician and work your way up from a school board to a county job to State Senate to House of Reps, etc. The people wearing expensive clothes, with huge stock portfolios and private jets aren't  average congressman. The ones that are rich and have fancy jets are the ones that got rich first like Trump and if Kid Rock were to win. 

Also they don't have it all that made. They have to constantly get re-elected. 

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4 minutes ago, Ilov80s said:

What is the government of the United States? It is the people

used to be. The people serve the Govt now. Sure, the election system is still in place but with the massive problems we as a country are facing, very hard to say our Gov is serving us anymore

 

1 minute ago, Ilov80s said:

I think you are overly glamorizing what it's like to be a career politician and work your way up from a school board to a county job to State Senate to House of Reps, etc. The people wearing expensive clothes, with huge stock portfolios and private jets aren't  average congressman. The ones that are rich and have fancy jets are the ones that got rich first like Trump and if Kid Rock were to win. 

Also they don't have it all that made. They have to constantly get re-elected

 

I think you're under glamorizing and the rare Jesse Ventura, Arnold Swartzenegger, Trump election is rare. Those guys truly have to win the people over vs the political party grooming someone.

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Just now, Stealthycat said:

used to be. The people serve the Govt now. Sure, the election system is still in place but with the massive problems we as a country are facing, very hard to say our Gov is serving us anymore

 

We voted in all of those leaders. They are representing the country. People might not like how they are representing us, but the election process played itself out in 2016 just as did in 1976. As for the massive problems we have, they are the same problems we have always had. Also, when has the United States not had massive problems? This isn't anything new. 

 

Just now, Stealthycat said:

I think you're under glamorizing and the rare Jesse Ventura, Arnold Swartzenegger, Trump election is rare. Those guys truly have to win the people over vs the political party grooming someone.

What is your evidence that say a random House member from Oklahoma is living like George Clooney? 

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1 hour ago, Ilov80s said:

We voted in all of those leaders. They are representing the country. People might not like how they are representing us, but the election process played itself out in 2016 just as did in 1976. As for the massive problems we have, they are the same problems we have always had. Also, when has the United States not had massive problems? This isn't anything new

20 trillion in debt is new

100 million on social care is new

Chicago Murders in 2017 so far this year– 448

According to an FBI crime report, there were an estimated 1,197,704 violent crimes committed around the nation in 2015. 15,696 murders. 90,185 rapes. There were an estimated 327,374 robberies nationwide, which accounted for an estimated $390 million in losses. Property crimes resulted in losses estimated at $14.3 billion

The National Center for Missing & Exploited Children (NCMEC) reports that the number of registered sex offenders in the United States has increased by nearly a quarter in the last five years. The total in the most recent survey was 747,408, up from 606,816 in 2006, the first year NCMEC did a count.

Based on an analysis of prior research, the Johns Hopkins study estimates that more than 250,000 Americans die each year from medical errors

Heroin overdose deaths rose from 10,574 in 2014 to12,990 in 2015, an increase of 23 percent. Overdose deaths involving synthetic opioids other than methadone rose from 5,544 in 2014 to 9,580 in 2015, an increase of 73 percent

 

all new

1 hour ago, Ilov80s said:

What is your evidence that say a random House member from Oklahoma is living like George Clooney?

 

are you serious? you do know how they dress, eat, live, fly etc right? do you know their salary? do you know about their health care and retirement plans ?

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42 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

20 trillion in debt is new

Not new

42 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

100 million on social care is new

Social care has grown as has the country, but it is obviously not a new deal despite the name. 

42 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

Chicago Murders in 2017 so far this year– 448

According to an FBI crime report, there were an estimated 1,197,704 violent crimes committed around the nation in 2015. 15,696 murders. 90,185 rapes. There were an estimated 327,374 robberies nationwide, which accounted for an estimated $390 million in losses. Property crimes resulted in losses estimated at $14.3 billion

Violent crime is down   Chicago has had a problem with violent crime for a long time, the current state isn't very different from recent history.

Quote

The National Center for Missing & Exploited Children (NCMEC) reports that the number of registered sex offenders in the United States has increased by nearly a quarter in the last five years. The total in the most recent survey was 747,408, up from 606,816 in 2006, the first year NCMEC did a count.

 I don't believe sex offender registration began until the 90s, since then it has been updated to be more expansive in who is included, fight against internet porn, etc. We weren't even keeping track of sex offenders before then so isn't this an improvement? That is before getting into cultural shifts on the views of the is kind of thing. 

Quote

Based on an analysis of prior research, the Johns Hopkins study estimates that more than 250,000 Americans die each year from medical errors

How many lives do you estimate we are able to save/prolong with advancements in medicine that have taken place over the last 100-50-25 years?  Also, as that study notes, the deaths aren't due to bad doctors but issues with insurance and coordination of care, etc. Systematic. The data from that study was 2000-2008. Lawmakers have responded. The ACA provided health insurance to more people than ever before, guaranteed pre-existing conditions would be covered and created electronic records. This is a massive attempt to improve this problem. 

Quote

Heroin overdose deaths rose from 10,574 in 2014 to12,990 in 2015, an increase of 23 percent. Overdose deaths involving synthetic opioids other than methadone rose from 5,544 in 2014 to 9,580 in 2015, an increase of 73 percent

I agree that drug overdoses are a serious issue that needs addressing- particularly prescription opioids. We have been battling drug use for a long time. We had Prohibition, that great failed social experiment of the 1920s. While we have a new enemy in opioids, it comes after a concerted effort to combat another dangerous drug: nicotine. While someone can't OD on Marlboros, it absolutely was killing people in huge numbers, but we have been able to reverse decades of smoking trends. Cigarette consumption per capita is down to the lowest levels seen since the 1930s.

Quote

 

all new

Violence, sex crimes, drug use and health issues are not new to America or the human race. 

 

 

Edited by Ilov80s
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well we don't have any issues in the US except a statue or two - fantastic !  keep voting in the same people, be happy

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2 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

well we don't have any issues in the US except a statue or two - fantastic !  keep voting in the same people, be happy

The guy just eviscerated your entire argument and the best response you can muster is a DJ 3000 impression?"How does it keep up with the news like that?"

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11 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

well we don't have any issues in the US except a statue or two - fantastic !  keep voting in the same people, be happy

All the issues you mentioned are indeed issues. They aren't new issues and they are all issues that Kid Rock has neither the expertise nor the experience necessary to address them. 

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2 hours ago, Stealthycat said:

20 trillion in debt is new

100 million on social care is new

Chicago Murders in 2017 so far this year– 448

According to an FBI crime report, there were an estimated 1,197,704 violent crimes committed around the nation in 2015. 15,696 murders. 90,185 rapes. There were an estimated 327,374 robberies nationwide, which accounted for an estimated $390 million in losses. Property crimes resulted in losses estimated at $14.3 billion

The National Center for Missing & Exploited Children (NCMEC) reports that the number of registered sex offenders in the United States has increased by nearly a quarter in the last five years. The total in the most recent survey was 747,408, up from 606,816 in 2006, the first year NCMEC did a count.

Based on an analysis of prior research, the Johns Hopkins study estimates that more than 250,000 Americans die each year from medical errors

Heroin overdose deaths rose from 10,574 in 2014 to12,990 in 2015, an increase of 23 percent. Overdose deaths involving synthetic opioids other than methadone rose from 5,544 in 2014 to 9,580 in 2015, an increase of 73 percent

 

all new

 

are you serious? you do know how they dress, eat, live, fly etc right? do you know their salary? do you know about their health care and retirement plans ?

Congressmen make what a couple hundred grand? Great pay but not crazy. They fly coach I believe and have to keep 2 homes. Health care and retirement I'm guessing is pretty great.

That all seems reasonable.

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2 minutes ago, The General said:

Congressmen make what a couple hundred grand? Great pay but not crazy. They fly coach I believe and have to keep 2 homes. Health care and retirement I'm guessing is pretty great.

That all seems reasonable.

They're millionaires due to speaking engagements, gerrymandering and incumbency, and the revolving lobbying door that includes both their wives and themselves. Public disclosure of their tax returns would be welcome for this debate. 

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2 minutes ago, rockaction said:

They're millionaires due to speaking engagements, gerrymandering and incumbency, and the revolving lobbying door that includes both their wives and themselves. Public disclosure of their tax returns would be welcome for this debate. 

If they are no this being paid illegally then that's fine by me. Talented people make good money.

Agreed that gerrymandering and lobbying issues, etc are very difficult problems that can all be improved.

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28 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

well we don't have any issues in the US except a statue or two - fantastic !  keep voting in the same people, be happy

I can tell you one guy who will not improve any of this while simultaneously screwing up many other things.

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55 minutes ago, The General said:

I can tell you one guy who will not improve any of this while simultaneously screwing up many other things.

the ones already in there is the answer

we ARE screwed up - in a bad bad way right now and the elected officials have 100% of the blame for it - they're elected and there to make sure we don't have 20 Trillion in debt, 100 million on social care, 60% of working age people not working, Social Security 10 years from bankrupt, etc etc

they're failing as miserably as can possible be to be honest

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6 hours ago, Stealthycat said:

 

Complex answer but in a nutshell .... they don't care. They have their money, their wealth, their retirement. They live a world of $5,000 suits, and $250 lunches being flown all over the world private jets, best hotels, all paid for by you the taxpayer. They can pass every law, no laws, good laws, bad laws .......... it doesn't matter, they've got it made anyway. 

 

OrtonToOlsen    you listed 5. How many have moved through congress since 1925 ? 

 

Bottom line ....... we live in a nation where the Govt employee's more people than any single entity on the planet. That same Govt gets it money from 1 source - taxation. We are 20 Trillion dollars in debt. We will see Social Security fail in 8 years. We see inner cities a killing fields, drugs rampant, 15-20 million people here illegally, 100 million on some form of social aid. 

I could go on and on but you think our Govt has succeeded? Really ?

 

Yeah, we're good.

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2 hours ago, Stealthycat said:

they're failing as miserably as can possible be to be honest

No they're not. That's silly hyperbole. There's 150+ examples of governments around the world failing more miserably, and only a handful doing better. To assume things couldn't possibly get worse is stupid and dangerous.

Governments tend to suck because they're tasked with solving extremely difficult and complex societal problems, and we elect officials based not on their ability to solve these problems, but on charisma, catchy slogans, and how much we identify with them. Choosing a rock star would be another step in the wrong direction.

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