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What player would you pick to start a franchise? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter dhockster
- Start date
Don't Noonan
Footballguy
Marcus Mariota
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
Russell Wilson
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Joey Bosa or Marcus Peters are at the top of the best defenders under 25 list for me.-OZ- said:
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
Yeah but I think hes 4-5 Years more developed than the kids on the list. Gimme the sub 30 super bowl winner. I wanna win now.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Yeah this week was bad. But if you had watched him most weeks he'd be on your list. Plus he seems like a genuinely good guy.dhockster said:
True. I don't know if I'd take bosa over Mack but they're both on the short list.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Mack or Aaron Donald are both 26 so age is not that important of a consideration. All three guys are disruptive and would make a great foundation to build upon.
Peters is a ball hawk but I'm probably wrong on that call - he's been grading out pretty much middle of the pack this year and gave up two TDs last night.
Fantasy Man
Footballguy
Wentz if QBs are eligible. Donald if not. I am a little surprised the league doesn't have any youngish slamdunk HOF OTs. It seemed like we always have seen one or two over the last 25 years.
Al O'Pecia
Footballguy
I'll add Jalen Ramsey (CB, Jaguars) to that best defenders list. Ramsey will be shutting down #1 receivers for a long time to come. He's only 22 years old.
Ramsey continues stellar start to season
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Man In The Box
Footballguy
I know it’s really early in his pro career, but I love Watson. Always have. He has “it”.
So did Kaep. And RG3. I'll be sure to re-visit this comment in a year or two.
Rodgers is only 33 and is the most complete QB in the league. There is no weakness in his game; still has mobility, one of the best arms and quickest releases, his memory is legendary, progressions, I mean the guy is an all-time great. I'd pick him in a heartbeat.
Non-QB ... Watt was the no-brainer pick for years his value-added was higher than most QBs in the league. I think Mack is getting close to that title - not QUITE as dominant but still the best defensive player in the league.
Man In The Box
Footballguy
Ok, you do that. Just an opinion, not sure where you’re hostility is coming from. Anyway, he’s a much better passer than either of the guys you mentioned, and he’s a winner. Who knows what RG3 would have been had he not been riddled with injuries. His rookie year was pretty special.
I'm gonna disagree hard on this ... the knocks on Watson are that you can time his release with a sundial, his accuracy on everything from check-downs/slants to deep-balls is scattershot at times, and he lacks elite vision of the field. Those are three items that are very hard to fix and can be very exploitable at the NFL level. I'm warning you to give him a couple years before you proclaim him the next big thing.
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dhockster
Footballguy
I think the only real presumption is if you are starting a franchise, you want the player you pick to be a part of that franchise for as long as possible, assuming that they are as great as you think they are. Rodgers would lose consideration from a lot of people because he probably will only be around 5-7 years. But you might win a couple championships with Rodgers in those 5-7 years, so it might be worth it to take him.
Man In The Box
Footballguy
I’ve read a lot of the same opinions on him before. You’re not telling me anything new here. I like what I see with my eyes when I watch him. Having different opinions is one of the great thing about sports. Right now all we can say is “we’ll see”
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
How is Aaron Rodgers not unanimous? 5 more years of HoF caliber...
Short Corner
Footballguy
Aaron Donald
wikkidpissah
Footballguy
Wentz, if only to rescue him from Doug Pederson
Concept Coop
Footballguy
Concept Coop
Footballguy
Exactly. And all of these young guys look great now--Wentz, Dak, Mariota, etc. But wait until they're making 25M a year--will their teams still be legitimate threats? That's a strong maybe for all of those guys. Rodgers is a guy you can give monster money to and still compete for super bowls.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
The best prospects at offensive tackle the last several years many of those have turned out to be busts or just ok.
Matt Kalil
Luke Joeckel (now playing guard for the Seahawks)
Greg Robinson
Ereck Flowers
There have been some ok guys like Eric FIsher, Jake Matthews, Taylor Lewan but none of them really stand out to me as guys so good you would want to start your team with them.
Joe Thomas is really the last rock solid stud offensive tackle to come out from my perspective and that was a pretty long time ago and he is getting pretty old now.
Its a QB driven league now so understandable that QBs would be the main players to consider if starting a new team from scratch. Other top players to consider if not QB would be defenders who can affect the QB. Donald is a good choice there. Mack and Bosa also good choices I think.
At cornerback I don't think any of them have been better than Xavier Rhodes but I would still take a young QB over him. Not sure which QB that would be at this point. They all have some flaws. I guess I would go with Russell Wilson who has proven more than the other young QBs to this point.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
For this kind of question I think about it as if you were playing Madden and had a fantasy draft where all players are thrown back to the pool to select from. So I would be looking to go younger than Rodgers is right now. But if only looking at the next 5 years in your decision I could see Roders being the pick.
I wouldn't take him, but thats just because I hate the Packers. He is very good.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Man, such a waste of talent. He's one of the guys I almost feel bad for (as bad as you can feel for a multi millionaire making his living playing a game with Uber respect from his fans). Too bad he couldn't have played for a competent team. Also shows how the position isn't close to QB in impact.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
Agreed.
A decade or so ago I was more willing to look at it from the perspective of building a good offensive line as the foundation of a team. Kind of like what Jacksonville tried to do as an expansion team, or what the Browns have done as an expansion team. Remember people talking about how great the Browns offensive line looked before the season started?
It hasn't translated into success for those teams, so my opinion about starting a team that way has changed from what it used to be.
I still come from the point of view of building a good defense because that is the kind of football I like. But with all the penalties they call on defenders now and the way the game has changed, that doesn't seem like the best way to build a team anymore.
Going way back when doing this with computer football games I used to take Rod Woodson first overall and keep building the defense, then offensive line. But that is because I have full control of how the QB plays in such games and I could develop them as well as skill players. For the way real football is now I think you have to start with the QB.
⚡DEADHEAD⚡
Footballguy
Rodgers will play for 7-9 more years and probable be in the playoffs each of those years. In 7-9 years, most of the players mentioned in this thread won't be playing or will be a backup. And the problem is we don't know who.
Wonder where RG3 or Kaepernick would have been on this list 4 years ago. Neither of those dudes play anymore.
-OZ-
Footballguy
That's actually a fair point. Even though I firmly believe in Mariota and Winston, injuries do happen (obviously). 7 years ago flacco was looking like a possible top franchise qb, Freeman looked pretty good, Schaub had just come off a pro bowl year. Not to mention Vick had come back.
I still take Mariota or Winston but my top priority is getting an elite coach.
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
Think Wilson can which i why I chose him. Rodgers would be my second choice. Just like my cornerstone a little younger.
kcfflguy
Footballguy
If you have the first overall pick this is true.
But I keep thinking, if the draft goes on, how high would the first non-QB go?
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
Most of the names coming up most often are insane to me. Wentz? Dak? Mariota? Winston? Goff? What the heck?
OK, they're young and have shown promise, but the vast vast majority of guys that fall into that bucket never end up becoming great. Realistically you're probably going to end up with mostly Ryan Tannehill type players out of these guys with a few RG3's mixed in, and maybe two Philip Rivers with an outside shot that even one of them ends up becoming truly great.
This is like saying you'd take Christian McCaffrey first overall in a startup dynasty draft because he has twice as long left in his career as David Johnson or Le'Veon Bell.
Back to the question at hand, it's Rodgers easily. If this really happened I think probably 30ish of the 32 NFL GMs would go that direction, with maybe a couple of Russell Wilson picks mixed in as he's the only other real option. Maybe 1 or 2 would go with an elite pass rusher like Watt or Miller as a stretch.
OK, they're young and have shown promise, but the vast vast majority of guys that fall into that bucket never end up becoming great. Realistically you're probably going to end up with mostly Ryan Tannehill type players out of these guys with a few RG3's mixed in, and maybe two Philip Rivers with an outside shot that even one of them ends up becoming truly great.
This is like saying you'd take Christian McCaffrey first overall in a startup dynasty draft because he has twice as long left in his career as David Johnson or Le'Veon Bell.
Back to the question at hand, it's Rodgers easily. If this really happened I think probably 30ish of the 32 NFL GMs would go that direction, with maybe a couple of Russell Wilson picks mixed in as he's the only other real option. Maybe 1 or 2 would go with an elite pass rusher like Watt or Miller as a stretch.
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-OZ-
Footballguy
1. Hasn't worked so well for the Texans yet.
2. Basically you want the chiefs, or broncos from a few years ago. Kinda agree with the philosophy.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Maybe a crazy question but are you sure Russell is much better than the young guys? Sure he has won, but a lot of that credit goes to the run game, defense and line.
The reason I'm a huge Mariota fan is his character and leadership, which is similar to Russell. IMO they're very similar players.
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FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
I would not personally choose Wilson but I was speaking from a GM's standpoint in that particular sentence, and NFL GMs have clearly shown that they place a ton of value in "winning" and Super Bowls.
ETA: Wilson's efficiency stats also dwarf those guys. By his second season in the NFL Wilson already had two 100+ QB rtg seasons as well as an 8.2 and 7.9ypa season (and those aren't even his career bests). None of that young crew has even a single season matching those marks.
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