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== OFFICIAL OAKLAND RAIDERS 2018 thread ==

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3 minutes ago, Cold Dead Hands said:

only because the defense has been so bad

Hope I'm wrong but this doesn't seem like a good pick.  the D needs impact players.  

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2 minutes ago, BustedKnuckles said:

but Reggie isnt just a silent fixture in the war room...im sure he has lots of input 

Not $10 million per year input. For better or worse the decisions lay at Gruden's feet. 

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1 minute ago, BustedKnuckles said:

then its a good pick...not sure why some are complaining 

Well, look.  We all thinking defense.  All spring.  

Thing about Miller is he was a RT, and then moved to LT to last year, and had a bit of a down year.  But I submit that RT is more important in the AFC West, with the pass rushers that line up on the right side.  With McGlinchy and Roquon gone, the Raiders moved down because they knew we can get Miller.  

I disagree that we had bigger needs.  Our OTs were in a dire state.  It's just not a sexy pick.  

If he is a good RT, it was worth it, that's a fact.  

We have a ton of draft capital left.  And really, with McKenzie's propensity for getting good FA and late rounders, we should expect some real players from this draft.  

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2 minutes ago, BustedKnuckles said:

whats the drop off after Miller? if its steep then they almost had to take him 

Kiper has the next avail OT Tyrell Crosby at 55, so yeah, it's viable given that much dropoff imo.

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Just now, 32 Counter Pass said:

Not $10 million per year input. For better or worse the decisions lay at Gruden's feet. 

right...but im sure Grudens not dumb enough to not utilize someone like Reggie while drafting...he doesnt seem like an egomaniac 

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4 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

Hope I'm wrong but this doesn't seem like a good pick.  the D needs impact players.  

Tackle is a bigger need IMO. They can sign Bowman. Mack and Irvin can generate pass rush. If Carr gets injured they are done. 

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5 minutes ago, BustedKnuckles said:

whats the drop off after Miller? if its steep then they almost had to take him 

Look man, you can't talk me off this cliff! The poor kid can't even spell his name right! Kolton with a "k"???

For real though, it was defense or bust for me, and with how many positions of need on the defensive side of the ball, with available players who were better fits and better talents, I can't help but be disappointed.

Edited by Moonshine

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My thinking has always been that the improvement on defense needs to come from coaching.  They have ALREADY drafted a ton of defense.  We need Guenther to get more from these kids than Norton did. 

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They must be banking on Guenthers scheme and the players already in house on defense. Gruden did hint at that during his very first press conference. "We need the young guys to contribute!" I'm assuming he was directing that at Conley, Obi, Joseph, Lee, Ward etc...

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1 minute ago, Moonshine said:

Look man, you can't talk me off this cliff! The poor kid can't even spell his name right! Kolton with a "k"???

For real though, it was defense or bust for me, and with how many positions of need on the defensive side of the ball, who were better fits and better talents, I can't help but be disappointed.

your avatar fits this post perfectly lol....im with Mass raider...it wasnt sexy but it was needed...i bet we get some good defensive guys with all the picks we have left

 

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Just now, BustedKnuckles said:

your avatar fits this post perfectly lol....im with Mass raider...it wasnt sexy but it was needed...i bet we get some good defensive guys with all the picks we have left

 

You're probably right, and I tend to trust Mass' observations about the team. I'm sure I'll come around to it, but tonight I'm just going to drink and think about what could have been.

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Not a huge fan of pick considering how bad our D is. BUT team is nothing w/o healthy Carr & Gruden sounds like he wants to run Lynch, et all. Not splashy but will agree with 32CP & massraider.

Meant to add - seems like we could have dropped down again. Maybe we use those picks for 2nd day D??

Edited by raidergil

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Just now, Moonshine said:

You're probably right, and I tend to trust Mass' observations about the team. I'm sure I'll come around to it, but tonight I'm just going to drink and think about what could have been.

and MY avatar fits this draft ...no ragrets lol

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You guys know I'm a salary cap guy, and OT is one of those spots, like edge rusher or pass rushing DT, that just never makes it to free agency.  Not for a bargain.  

If you need to find a OT, there are never many in free agency.  Tough to fill those spots there, for reasonable money.  Draft those spots, and fill in LB, OG, RB, and even WR in free agency.  

If Penn is gone after next year, who are our OTs?  Need is not in doubt.  Is Kolton Miller a good player is the question.  

 

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I think the best player there was Derwin. He was a stud alpha male from day 1 at FSU.  Hope OBi works out!

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Gave up pick #75.  There you go.  #10 pick is now Kolton Milller/Martavius/4th rounder.

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Martavius is in the last year of his deal.  So I don't like that. But that's a need.  Coop/Bryant/Jordy/Roberts.  Sold.  

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4 minutes ago, massraider said:

I think the best player there was Derwin. He was a stud alpha male from day 1 at FSU.  Hope OBi works out!

Derwin is the guy I've wanted for a couple months now. Your reasoning makes sense, but it blows a little that the guy I think would have made a profound impact on our defense was available and we passed.

Getting Martavis is bonkers though.

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1 minute ago, Moonshine said:

Derwin is the guy I've wanted for a couple months now. Your reasoning makes sense, but it blows a little that the guy I think would have made a profound impact on our defense was available and we passed.

I feel you, and I wanted defense too.  It's just in my nature to spin things to the positive.  Bryant trade makes that easier, ha.  

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Just now, massraider said:

I feel you, and I wanted defense too.  It's just in my nature to spin things to the positive.  Bryant trade makes that easier, ha.  

You're helping keep me sane man, so spin away.

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2 minutes ago, massraider said:

A true deep threat is a need.  Coop gonna be in the slot a lot this year.  

He better keep his nose clean though. Already been suspended once. Clearly focusing on getting Carr some help this offseason.

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4 minutes ago, massraider said:

A true deep threat is a need.  Coop gonna be in the slot a lot this year.  

Love the trade for Bryant.  Moving Cooper around will be great.  If Bryant can keep his head screwed on straight, he can put up great numbers and draw coverage.  

Now address the D.  Package some of these later picks together and move up!   

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6 minutes ago, fruity pebbles said:

High 3rd seems like a lot for Bryant.

WE HAVE 2 3RD ROUNDERS...WE GET A QUALITY NFL WR AND STILL HAVE A 3RD RD PICK....SMILE :D

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McKenzie clarified, we traded Cards pick, #79 for Bryant, not #75.  

 

#######g Steelers tweeted the wrong pick.  LOL

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It's hard to imagine a WR, QB, OG, or OT in round 2 and 3, so we bout to get a lot of defense over next few days.  

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7 hours ago, DocHolliday said:

Last year's draft was disappointing for sure.  But, drafts should not be graded until 3 years later:  Injuries happen and  learning curves are different for all players. 

I want to see BPA on D this draft.  Pick after pick.  To mix it up a little, snagging a WR and OT midrounds would be nice too. 

 

3 minutes ago, massraider said:

It's hard to imagine a WR, QB, OG, or OT in round 2 and 3, so we bout to get a lot of defense over next few days.  

My hopes for WR and OT have been met.   Mass sees what's coming and that is a lot of D.  That is going to make me real happy.  

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5 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

 

My hopes for WR and OT have been met.   Mass sees what's coming and that is a lot of D.  That is going to make me real happy.  

I thank massraider for the positivity. Gruden knows what he has in Carr & is gonna build around him. We got a potential 10 yr OL guy & WR with huge talent that needs to prove it. Gruden got what he needed Day 1, now lets go build rest of team.

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I LOVE the trade for Bryant; steal of the entire draft so far.

There is a ton of depth on defense in this draft.

Edited by Garrett

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4 minutes ago, raidergil said:

I thank massraider for the positivity.

I'm an old man, and been a draft geek for 30 years, since I was about 15.

The one thing I know for a fact is that the best drafters of all time (Bill Walsh, Jimmy Johnson, and Belichick) all knew the same thing:  They aren't gonna bat .500 consistently.  They were always celebrated for their picks, but those picks were always sandwiched around bad bad picks.  They all figured out that the answer was to get as many as possible, because one Tom Brady makes up for drafting Adrian Klemm, JR Redmond, Greg Robinson-Randall, Dave Stachleski, Jeff Marriott, and Antwan Harris (Players the Pats took in front of Brady).

Reggie gets that, and with the team willing to trade down, and play the compensatory pick game, it dramatically improves our odds of getting good players.  

The other thing I know for a fact is that the draft community is constantly guilty of groupthink.  One guy says something, someone else picks up on it, and it becomes 'known'.  It's silly.  

I mean, how many of us have scouted Kolton Miller? I sure haven't.  How much can I really hate a guy I don't know sheet about?

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Rapaport:

 

As the first round comes to close, a few teams are discussing coming back into the first round — The #Bears and the #Raiders.

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25 minutes ago, massraider said:

I'm an old man, and been a draft geek for 30 years, since I was about 15.

The one thing I know for a fact is that the best drafters of all time (Bill Walsh, Jimmy Johnson, and Belichick) all knew the same thing:  They aren't gonna bat .500 consistently.  They were always celebrated for their picks, but those picks were always sandwiched around bad bad picks.  They all figured out that the answer was to get as many as possible, because one Tom Brady makes up for drafting Adrian Klemm, JR Redmond, Greg Robinson-Randall, Dave Stachleski, Jeff Marriott, and Antwan Harris (Players the Pats took in front of Brady).

Reggie gets that, and with the team willing to trade down, and play the compensatory pick game, it dramatically improves our odds of getting good players.  

The other thing I know for a fact is that the draft community is constantly guilty of groupthink.  One guy says something, someone else picks up on it, and it becomes 'known'.  It's silly.  

I mean, how many of us have scouted Kolton Miller? I sure haven't.  How much can I really hate a guy I don't know sheet about?

Well if you do end up looking at the tape, I'd love to hear your thoughts. Scouting is admittedly not a strength of mine, so I'd love to hear any insights.

Edited by Moonshine

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Marty B could be Jerry Porter 2.0. We can look forward to Gruden complaining about his lack of passion then calling him a unicorn when he has a good game.

I recognize the upside but he comes with two big risks:
1. Failed drug test and suspension (Is teh next one 1 year?)
2. Attitude

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Fairly underwhelming. I wanted d, with that pick and feel we didn't get enough for moving down 5 spots. AZ just got a potential franchise QB for a 3rd and a 5th. :shrug:  

bryant is a dangerous guy for the locker room. I don't see him responding well to grudens rah rah attitude. 

 

We'll see. 

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A few names I will be looking for tonight that I hope will be under consideration:

 

Maurice Hurst

Lorenzo Carter

Harold Landry

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58 minutes ago, ICON211 said:

A few names I will be looking for tonight that I hope will be under consideration:

 

Maurice Hurst

Lorenzo Carter

Harold Landry

I'd also add Justin Reid to that list. I'd be thrilled if any of those names are called on Day 2.

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DAY 2 POSSIBILITIES 

 

EDGE Harold Landry, Boston College | 6’2, 252 | Athleticism: 87th percentile | Age: 22

Where He Wins: Pure speed and explosion off the edge. Even if he didn’t have moves or counters, tackles would fear Landry because of his ability to run the arc. That alone will create production. His flexibility to turn the corner and take a tight angle towards the quarterback might be the best in this class. The outside threat allows him to set up the inside move. Understands he needs to locate the quarterback when getting depth.

Forecast: Deal with injuries in 2017, but his 2015 and 2016 stuff is high high end tape. A natural pass rusher and that is what matters most. Don’t be too concerned about his run fits on the outside.

 

 DL Maurice Hurst, Michigan | 6’1, 292 | Athleticism: N/A | Age: 23

Where He Wins: Burst off the snap to shoot gaps or attack edges of interior offensive linemen. Hurst is so quick that he takes advantage of any error on the inside. Late on a reach block? Hurst is in the backfield. Hesitate to fill for a pulling lineman? Hurst will make a play. Likely fits as a 3-technique in a one gap defense, but has plenty of snaps at 1-technique in a NASCAR package. Plays low, which helps carry the momentum he created. Plays with timing and vision to separate and make plays on the ball.

Forecast: Interior disruption is king, and Hurst offers it most consistently in this class. Hurst was held out of the Combine with a heart concern, but he has since been cleared.

 

CB Joshua Jackson, Iowa | 6’0, 196 | Athleticism: 82nd percentile | Age: 22

Where He Wins: Plays inside and outside. Slow plays his footwork to mirror in routes then drives on the ball off breaks. Anticipates certain routes and understands he has sideline help. Very good in isolation in the red zone. It is his ball in the air, and Jackson’s receiver background likely plays a role in that.

Forecast: Likely an outside corner who will attack the football in the air. Ball skills are an important part of his game, and it is not just the interception numbers.

 

EDGE Lorenzo Carter, Georgia | 6’5, 250 | Athleticism: 96th percentile | Age: 22

Where He Wins: A true force player. Rotates between playing off the ball, on the edge and even takes snaps in the slot. So sound at accomplishing his assignment on the edge and in space, forcing ball carriers inside then shedding to make the tackle. Does the same in coverage. Athleticism equals a pass rushing ceiling, even though he is a bit lost in that area. Chews up ground on blitzes.

Comparison: Jamie Collins, Browns

Forecast: One of the few edge players who might be better in space than as a pass rusher. He’s comfortable and aggressive where other edge players have difficulties. Question is if his athleticism will translate into disruption.

 

 S Justin Reid, Stanford | 6’1, 207 | Athleticism: 96th percentile | Age: 21

Where He Wins: Exceptional athlete, and it shows when covering ground laterally or attacking ball carriers upfield. Combination of quickness and explosion allows him to play the ball in the air at the catch point to cause incompletions. Stanford asked him to line up in a variety of spots. In the box, as a safety and even played man to man in some instances. Play recognition can lead to tackles for loss.

Forecast: Reid had eight or nine visits during the process, so expect him to be a top 40 selection.

 

 LB/EDGE Genard Avery, Memphis | 6’1, 248 | Athleticism: 87th percentile | Age: ?

Where He Wins: Exciting prospects because he combines athleticism, bend and closing quickness. With that said, he isn’t strictly a pass rusher. He often works as a true off ball linebacker and is asked to cover receivers in the slot. A front seven weapon who is equally as talented to chase and defend the run or rush the passer, especially with his natural leverage advantage and flexibility.

Comparison: LB Haason Reddick, Cardinals

Forecast: Does have trouble knifing through blockers in his path. Luckily I don’t have to decide where he is being used, but he can win in multiple roles.

 

EDGE Sam Hubbard, Ohio St | 6’5, 270 | Athleticism: 64th percentile | Age: 23

Where He Wins: At his best when space is created. Able to turn the corner or change direction on one step, which is uncommon at 270 pounds. Will take advantage of inside lanes when looping inside.

Forecast: Hubbard’s athletic profile is an odd one. He posted a ridiculous 6.84 3-cone… then a 4.95 forty. He wins in space, not on contact, which is a bit of a conundrum based on his size.

 

 LB Fred Warner, BYU | 6’3, 236 | Athleticism: 80th percentile | Age: 21

Where He Wins: Exactly the combination of athleticism and aggression you want at the position. Warner often knifes through lanes or gaps or gets in front of blocks with his speed and quickness. On top of that Warner flashes when blitzing or sticking with a tight end or back in coverage when asked to do either.

Comparison: LB Shaq Thompson, Panthers

Forecast: Many BYU prospects are overaged. That is not Warner. He can come in and make an instant impact if afforded the opportunity.

 

 EDGE Josh Sweat, FSU | 6’5, 251 | Athleticism: 95th percentile | Age: 21

Where He Wins: Insane athlete. Sweat can fire up the field in a hurry, instantly putting an offensive tackle in panic mode to get a deep drop set. If Sweat has space, he will win and disrupt the backfield. Held up in run defense well.

Comparison: EDGE Danielle Hunter, LSU

Forecast: FSU often used sweat as a tight edge instead of a true edge, where he would be afforded more space. In fact, often it seemed he was reactive rather than asked to be disruptive. Hopefully that changes. He gets a bit lost when his initial momentum is stopped, lacking a counter. I hope he lands with a coach who can coach.

 

DL Nathan Shepherd, Fort Hays State | 6’4. 315 | Athleticism: 64th percentile | Age: ?

Where He Wins: Wants to get upfield and disrupt rather than stay at the line of scrimmage. Explosion plus power plus balance. He uses heavy hands and hips to work behind interior offensive linemen.

 

BEST OF THE REST - 

S Jessie Bates, Wake Forest

EDGE Kemoko Turay, Rutgers

 S Ronnie Harrison, Alabama

DL Deadrin Senat, USF

LB Dorian O’Daniel, Clemson

EDGE Obo Okoronkwo, Oklahoma

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