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== OFFICIAL OAKLAND RAIDERS 2018 thread ==

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1 minute ago, Chadstroma said:

Dude. Seriously? 

Alternative explanation. Cook and Manuel are not that good and we just over reached looking for add someone to replace them. 

Now go away before I have to taunt you a second time.

Exactly. Remember the speculation when Gruden hired he may push Cook against Carr because he spoke so glowingly about Cook coming out of college? If he really wants to mess with Carr then he should start talking about how these #1 picks set them up to find a franchise QB :rolleyes:

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50 minutes ago, BustedKnuckles said:

Let's recap...DA Raiders dealt one of the best defensive players in football.... traded for a QB who was signed to start but failed to make the team..... and are in the process of releasing a receiver they gave a third-round pick for back in April.... all in the last eight hours.

And the cherry on the turd sundae of the Mack trade is giving the Bears a 2nd rd pick. ?

Then they cut a player they used a 3rd pick to acquire LY. Just 2 more data points that justify my complete lack of confidence in the staff/front office.

I am so done with this team. They can’t move to Vegas soon enough as far as I am concerned.

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Released Bryant? Didn't they just trade a 3rd for him? 

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4 minutes ago, flapgreen said:

Released Bryant? Didn't they just trade a 3rd for him? 

He was facing an indefinite suspension -- his second. 

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13 minutes ago, flapgreen said:

Released Bryant? Didn't they just trade a 3rd for him? 

We like the high risk, high reward moves. If you go for them you have to live with the downside too

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Okay so what was the final deal for Mack? I see the Bears signed him for $100 billion and all but what was the actual trade?

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1 minute ago, Chaka said:

Okay so what was the final deal for Mack? I see the Bears signed him for $100 billion and all but what was the actual trade?

The Bears gave up first-round picks in 2019 and 2020, a third-round pick in 2020 and a sixth-round pick in 2019 to acquire Mack earlier Saturday, a source told ESPN. In return, the Bears also received s a second-round pick in 2020 and a conditional fifth-round pick in 2020.

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Florio says Bryant is facing a suspension.

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Just now, Chaka said:

Florio says Bryant is facing a suspension.

Yep. His second indefinite one. Nobody has ever come back from two.  

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We get two 1's, a 3 and a 6.

We send Mack, a 2, and a conditional 5th.

As reported but not official.

Edited by Chadstroma

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You can only have one player in this extreme deviation from the mean of NFL contracts and have any chance of building a playoff contender.  If the Raiders doubled down and did it with Carr and Mack it would have been a self inflicted disaster.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/oakland-raiders/contracts/

Go pull up the contracts from any team you think is doing anything right and show me the one that has two 20-25 million a year players...

There is no way I would have chosen to keep Mack over Carr.  Mack got 20 million more guaranteed than Derek did; if that was the price, the Raiders were forced to trade him.

Edited by Garrett
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Raiders are likely looking at 2 1st round picks between 15 and 25 the next 2 years, probably closer to 15 this year and 25 the next.  Educated guess. 

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Just now, flapgreen said:

Raiders are likely looking at 2 1st round picks between 15 and 25 the next 2 years, probably closer to 15 this year and 25 the next.  Educated guess. 

The Bears are still the worst team in their own division until proven otherwise.  I guess a lot of any speculation comes down to their QB play moving forward though.  I think the pick(s) are as likely to be 5 as 25; it will be interesting to see how it plays out.

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7 minutes ago, Garrett said:

The Bears are still the worst team in their own division until proven otherwise.  I guess a lot of any speculation comes down to their QB play moving forward though.  I think the pick(s) are as likely to be 5 as 25; it will be interesting to see how it plays out.

Not even close. I'll come back in here when the time comes. 

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17 minutes ago, Garrett said:

The Bears are still the worst team in their own division until proven otherwise.  I guess a lot of any speculation comes down to their QB play moving forward though.  I think the pick(s) are as likely to be 5 as 25; it will be interesting to see how it plays out.

I disagree. Adding Mack clearly makes them better than Detroit. 

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21 minutes ago, flapgreen said:

Raiders are likely looking at 2 1st round picks between 15 and 25 the next 2 years, probably closer to 15 this year and 25 the next.  Educated guess. 

Though I do not expect top 5 picks from them, I think you are coloring your view with homer colored lenses.

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Chuckie's team looking like Trump's cabinet.

Only the best people ?

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3 minutes ago, Vector said:

Chuckie's team looking like Trump's cabinet.

Only the best people ?

There is a politics section. Keep your politics posts there buddy.

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Waived

PlayerPos.Ht.Wt.Exp.College

Ateman, MarcellWR6-4216ROklahoma State

Baugh, MarcusTE6-4247ROhio State

Blacknall, SaeedWR6-2208RPenn State

Brown, PharaohTE6-52461Oregon

Bryant, MartavisWR6-42104Clemson

Butler, JamesRB5-9210RIowa

Butler, PaulTE6-6252RCalifornia (Pa.)

Cabinda, JasonLB6-1243RPenn State

Carter, JarellCB5-101961Trinity International

Cook, ConnorQB6-42153Michigan State

Cowser, JamesLB6-32453Southern Utah

Davis, AntwuanCB5-11196RTexas

Edwards Jr., MarioDE6-32804Florida State

Flagel, ConnorDT6-5296RCentral Missouri

Hamilton, AntonioCB6-01903South Carolina State

Hunt, CameronG6-42651Oregon

Kirkland, DenverG/T6-43353Arkansas

Leavitt, DallinS5-10203RUtah State

Mauger, QuincyS6-02062Georgia

Pringle, RayseanCB6-01911Southern Utah

Simmons, JordanG6-33391USC

Soto, ShakirDL6-32901Pittsburgh

Victor, AzeemLB6-2240RWashington

Ware, JylanT6-73172Alabama State

Whitney, IsaacWR6-22041USC

Wright, GabeDT6-33094Auburn

Yurachek, RyanFB6-0240RMarshall

RELEASED THE FOLLOWING PLAYERS:

Table inside Article

PlayerPos.Ht.Wt.Exp.College

Aboushi, OdayOL6-53156Virginia

Stone, JamesC6-32903Tennessee

Wright, ShareeceCB5-111848USC

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Trivia time!! The Raiders got 2 1sts when they shipped Gruden to Tampa Bay. What Pro Bowl quality, once-in-a-decade players did they parley those picks into?

Why, cornerback Phillip Buchanan and defensive end Tyler Brayton, of course.

:whistle:

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3 minutes ago, Ed Wood said:

Trivia time!! The Raiders got 2 1sts when they shipped Gruden to Tampa Bay. What Pro Bowl quality, once-in-a-decade players did they parley those picks into?

Why, cornerback Phillip Buchanan and defensive end Tyler Brayton, of course.

:whistle:

I thought it was Buchanan and Napoleon Harris? A MLB

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1 hour ago, Bruno2 said:

I thought it was Buchanan and Napoleon Harris? A MLB

Could be. Just grabbed from a column I read and did not double check...

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2 minutes ago, Ed Wood said:

Could be. Just grabbed from a column I read and did not double check...

Thanks for the insight.  Everyone can celebrate here when the Bears win the Super Bowl after winning 5, 6, 3, and 5 games the last 4 years.

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this is a GREAT move for Oakland..they're not winning this year, they're not winning next year.but they want the building blocks..Oakland figures to win about 5-6 games this season, maybe less than that..

Chicago is BY FAR one of the 4-5 worst teams in the NFL.  I've got Chicago, Indy, Oakland,  Detroit and Buffalo., I can't imagine Chicago winning 5 games, they might win 3 or 4 games.so Oakland is looking at having 2 top 5 picks in next years draft. and probably a top 10 in 2020 when Chicago once again wets the bed.

this was a brilliant move for Oakland!!!

there's simply no other way to look at this.they've freed up a TON of cap space for next year, and acquired TOP picks in the process..

 

 

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4 minutes ago, DocHolliday said:

I hate being a raiders fan today.   

Condolences.  

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18 minutes ago, Tanner9919 said:

this is a GREAT move for Oakland..they're not winning this year, they're not winning next year.but they want the building blocks..Oakland figures to win about 5-6 games this season, maybe less than that..

Chicago is BY FAR one of the 4-5 worst teams in the NFL.  I've got Chicago, Indy, Oakland,  Detroit and Buffalo., I can't imagine Chicago winning 5 games, they might win 3 or 4 games.so Oakland is looking at having 2 top 5 picks in next years draft. and probably a top 10 in 2020 when Chicago once again wets the bed.

this was a brilliant move for Oakland!!!

there's simply no other way to look at this.they've freed up a TON of cap space for next year, and acquired TOP picks in the process..

 

 

I think Chicago is going to be better than 5 wins with their defense as it is now. trent dilfer won a superbowl with a great defense and pretty below average offense. Chicago is approaching that level with this trade. 

I do agree, Chicago has a ways to go. It's going to be a big kick to the balls to Bear fans when they are .500 at the midway point looking at the very tough second half of their schedule. This has potential to be a top 15 pick, which is always nice. 

I can see a scenario where the Bears are 9-7 and looking at potential playoffs. but I dont see them at .500 this season. so oakland has an opportunity to land a playmaker.

and who knows. maybe trubisky falls flat and absolutely blows and this turns into a top 10 pick. could happen.

 

ETA: if I were a raiders fan I'd be pretty bummed about this trade. Chicago fans should be pumped. Just as I would be stoked if GB landed him. 

Edited by Dr. Dan

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Lost in all this is the hope and feeling that Arden Key is the 2nd coming of Mack.

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Raiders released QB E.J. Manuel.

After both Manuel and Connor Cook bombed as Derek Carr's backup over the past two seasons, the Raiders have moved on to future failed backup AJ McCarron. New coach Jon Gruden is throwing darts, and doing so with alarmingly poor accuracy.

 

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46 minutes ago, Tanner9919 said:

this is a GREAT move for Oakland..they're not winning this year, they're not winning next year.but they want the building blocks..Oakland figures to win about 5-6 games this season, maybe less than that..

Chicago is BY FAR one of the 4-5 worst teams in the NFL.  I've got Chicago, Indy, Oakland,  Detroit and Buffalo., I can't imagine Chicago winning 5 games, they might win 3 or 4 games.so Oakland is looking at having 2 top 5 picks in next years draft. and probably a top 10 in 2020 when Chicago once again wets the bed.

this was a brilliant move for Oakland!!!

there's simply no other way to look at this.they've freed up a TON of cap space for next year, and acquired TOP picks in the process..

 

 

The Bears won 5 games last year.  They got rid of Fox, have a QB that is no longer a rookie and have added Mack, Roquan and weapons at receiver.  They are definitely better than last year and are not one of the 4-5 worst teams in the NFL.  

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2 hours ago, Bruno2 said:

Lost in all this is the hope and feeling that Arden Key is the 2nd coming of Mack.

Raiders fans can hope.

Gruden said the Raider D wasn't very good even WITH Mack last year. Fair enough. But can you imagine how great Mack could be this year--and elevate the D with him--if Key and Hall and Hurst are the players the Raiders think they may be. Mack was having to fight off two and sometimes three guys last year. Those days were potentially over. Now they are over but for the wrong reason.

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27 minutes ago, Dr. Dan said:

I think Chicago is going to be better than 5 wins with their defense as it is now. trent dilfer won a superbowl with a great defense and pretty below average offense. Chicago is approaching that level with this trade. 

I do agree, Chicago has a ways to go. It's going to be a big kick to the balls to Bear fans when they are .500 at the midway point looking at the very tough second half of their schedule. This has potential to be a top 15 pick, which is always nice. 

I can see a scenario where the Bears are 9-7 and looking at potential playoffs. but I dont see them at .500 this season. so oakland has an opportunity to land a playmaker.

and who knows. maybe trubisky falls flat and absolutely blows and this turns into a top 10 pick. could happen.

 

ETA: if I were a raiders fan I'd be pretty bummed about this trade. Chicago fans should be pumped. Just as I would be stoked if GB landed him. 

Chicago had the makings of a solid defense before Mack. A decent front 3, a decent secondary and if Smith is as advertised and adding Mack along with a healthy Floyd and Trevathan- IMO the best LB corps in the league. 

The offense is all riding on Trubisky developing or not. If he doesn't.... I can see a top 15 pick over the next two years as the Bears won't have the money to get a FA QB to replace him and not the 1st rounders to draft one. If he makes decent progression this year, I think we can expect a 15-20 pick and a playoff slot pick in 2020. 

How much value the Raiders get out of this trade is all about the Bear QB. 

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3 minutes ago, Ed Wood said:

Raiders fans can hope.

Gruden said the Raider D wasn't very good even WITH Mack last year. Fair enough. But can you imagine how great Mack could be this year--and elevate the D with him--if Key and Hall and Hurst are the players the Raiders think they may be. Mack was having to fight off two and sometimes three guys last year. Those days were potentially over. Now they are over but for the wrong reason.

As a man who's been twice divorced. I know how to move on. It is what it is, Mack ain't coming back and this is obviously Grudens team. What choice do I (we) have but to hope for the best. Go Raiders! 

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2 minutes ago, Chadstroma said:

How much value the Raiders get out of this trade is all about the Bear QB. 

:goodposting:

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Just now, Chadstroma said:

We got a 7th from Seattle for Shalom Luani

Along with throwing away a 3rd on Martavis and a 5th on McCarron. Great draft management right there.

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1 minute ago, Chaka said:

Along with throwing away a 3rd on Martavis and a 5th on McCarron. Great draft management right there.

I'd take that risk again, but I might drive a harder bargain for it to be a fourth. I'm surprised you'd call it throwing it away. See: your work in the Josh Gordon thread. Not perfectly analogous situations, but a bit on point. 

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Can one person explain why putting 50 million a year into two players was going to help the Raiders?

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2 minutes ago, Garrett said:

Can one person explain why putting 50 million a year into two players was going to help the Raiders?

I don't think I can. Trubisky is still on his rookie deal, so that's not a concern for the Bears. 

What's weird, though, is most people are calling it a win-lose trade either way. I think it's lose-lose. The Bears might be an eight win team next year. The Raiders are going to have to find a dynamo, two position All-Pro in the draft to replace Mack. Good luck with that. 

The teams don't make sense for each other. I guess Mack really forced hands here.  

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22 minutes ago, rockaction said:

I'd take that risk again, but I might drive a harder bargain for it to be a fourth. I'm surprised you'd call it throwing it away. See: your work in the Josh Gordon thread. Not perfectly analogous situations, but a bit on point. 

Gordon>>>>>>Bryant and no one would give a 3rd for Gordon.

 

ETA: Except Gruden who would give two firsts apparently.

Edited by Chaka
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43 minutes ago, Chadstroma said:

Chicago had the makings of a solid defense before Mack. A decent front 3, a decent secondary and if Smith is as advertised and adding Mack along with a healthy Floyd and Trevathan- IMO the best LB corps in the league. 

The offense is all riding on Trubisky developing or not. If he doesn't.... I can see a top 15 pick over the next two years as the Bears won't have the money to get a FA QB to replace him and not the 1st rounders to draft one. If he makes decent progression this year, I think we can expect a 15-20 pick and a playoff slot pick in 2020. 

How much value the Raiders get out of this trade is all about the Bear QB. 

absolutely 

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Just now, Chaka said:

Gordon>>>>>>Bryant and no one would give a 3rd for Gordon.

Yeah, Gordon > Bryant, and if I accept your premise (bolded), I accept that it's a different situation and you're emphasizing that the Raiders were cavalier in what they gave up for him. 

I'm not sure I can do that. Bryant changes games, too, though not to the extent of Josh Gordon.  

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7 minutes ago, rockaction said:

I don't think I can. Trubisky is still on his rookie deal, so that's not a concern for the Bears. 

What's weird, though, is most people are calling it a win-lose trade either way. I think it's lose-lose. The Bears might be an eight win team next year. The Raiders are going to have to find a dynamo, two position All-Pro in the draft to replace Mack. Good luck with that. 

The teams don't make sense for each other. I guess Mack really forced hands here.  

right, but maybe that's what made Chicago the most attractive trade partner. 

 

GB was interested. so they could have given their own and/or NO 2019 pick. both are expected to be playoff teams. that doesnt help the raiders much. 

BUF and CLE interested. not bad. weird for buffalo to be into that but I guess build defense first. CLE is better than they have been. 

Maybe Chicago was offering what seemed to be the highest picks of all teams interested 

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Pinero to IR too. Who's kicking the ball in Oakland or are they planning to give a future first to acquire Aguayo from the waiver wire?

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