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Dynasty & Redraft: WR Christian Kirk, Cardinals

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19 hours ago, SameSongNDance said:

No and I'm expecting Williams to start in two receiver sets. This has more to do with most of Kirk's snaps coming out of the slot, behind Fitz during the preseason. It's pure speculation on my part. 

I think your speculation is right on as to why Williams is starting & not Kirk.

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Threads like this are pure gold for people who procrastinate all of their prep work until the night before the draft and only have the budget for under the radar rookies that draw comparisons to ODB.

Gracias.

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Christian Kirk is expected to "get more opportunities" in Week 2 against the Rams.

This falls with comments from coach Steve Wilks. Kirk and Chad Williams combined for five targets in the season opener. Kirk's rookie status has him behind Williams in two-wide sets, but we like his chances of overtaking the starting role.

Source: azcardinals.com 

Sep 15 - 6:25 PM

Edited by Faust

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Christian Kirk (back) was held out of Thursday's practice as a precaution after getting in a car accident on Wednesday.

He was rear-ended on the highway by a woman who attempted to hit and run, though Kirk followed her and took down her license plate number. Kirk doesn't appear to be hurt and should be fine for Week 3 against the Bears. The rookie remains off the re-draft radar.

Source: Darren Urban on Twitter 

Sep 20 - 4:47 PM

 

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Anyone watch the Cards first 2 games and have an opinion on this kid?  The box score for any Cardinal is less than pretty so far but I know that doesn’t tell the whole story.  Is the “heir apparent to Fitz” still the working theory on him?

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2 hours ago, That one guy said:

Anyone watch the Cards first 2 games and have an opinion on this kid?  The box score for any Cardinal is less than pretty so far but I know that doesn’t tell the whole story.  Is the “heir apparent to Fitz” still the working theory on him?

It’s really hard to tell with the mess the offense is right now. He’s got good hands and runs good routes. Rosen really likes him, so we really need to see what happens once Rosen takes the reigns.

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Christian Kirk caught 7-of-8 targets for 90 yards in Sunday's Week 3 loss to the Bears.

After catching 5-of-7 targets for 31 yards over the first two games of the season, Kirk lead the Cardinals across the board in targets, catches and yards on Sunday. His highlight on the day was a 32-yard catch in the 4th quarter from Sam Bradford. Kirk was then Josh Rosen's favorite target, seeing three targets on the two possessions that Rosen helmed. For now, Kirk is still only a speculation add at best as the Arizona offense is not one to expect a lot of consistent production from for their best players, let alone an ancillary option. Sep 23 - 8:02 PM

 

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I love the setup for Kirk now with Rosen in and FItz banged up with a hamstring injury. All stars seem to be aligning for a possible if not probable breakout. If you can still pick this guy up for free in your league the risk/reward opp is off the charts imo.

 

Quote

 

Don't sleep on Christian Kirk, especially in keeper leagues. Wasn't gonna mention him till after waivers ran, but this guy could be the new #1 in an offense that will be playing from behind 90% of the time this year and there is return TD upside as well. There is also his long standing connection with the new ARZ QB (his roommate) since HS. Rosen & Kirk. In last week's game, when Rosen came in he went to Kirk 57% of the time (admittedly brief period of time 3 of 7 targets) with his targets. Kirk caught 3 of his 4 completions (75%) and Kirk ended up with 90 yards on the day. I was very worried Kirk would have been hyped this week but most sites missed the boat on Kirk. If he had scored a TD he would probably be up there with Boyd and Calvin Ridley as top adds this week, but his situation has improved greatly and pretty much got swept under the rug. Talent is there and here comes opportunity knocking. He has been named by some as a baby OBJ in his profile. Pure hype I know, but there is a lot to like here now with QB chemistry, situation and game flow. ROsen is a huge unkown but even if he throws picks he should still lean greatly on Kirk, just as Eli Manning sux at QB but can make OBJ more than a viable start.

I've seen setups like this turn to gold in the past. His price is probably free if he is in still the FA pool after waivers ran.

 

 

Edited by mnmplayer
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1 hour ago, mnmplayer said:

I love the setup for Kirk now with Rosen in and FItz banged up with a hamstring injury. All stars seem to be aligning for a possible if not probable breakout. If you can still pick this guy up for free in your league the risk/reward opp is off the charts imo.

 

 

I totally agree. He's worth an add because Rosen and him have a really good connection.

I was looking at targets earlier, and here's Kirk's targets and receptions through three weeks:

2 targets, 1 reception

5 targets, 4 receptions

8 targets, 7 receptions

He is a pretty decent route runner for a rookie, and has very good hands. It will be very interesting to see how this plays out.

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24 minutes ago, kutta said:

I totally agree. He's worth an add because Rosen and him have a really good connection.

I was looking at targets earlier, and here's Kirk's targets and receptions through three weeks:

2 targets, 1 reception

5 targets, 4 receptions

8 targets, 7 receptions

He is a pretty decent route runner for a rookie, and has very good hands. It will be very interesting to see how this plays out.

On pace for 64 recs, but more importantly, trending up. 3 of his 12 recs came from Rosen in the last 4 minutes of the last game, which is clearly a lot more attention than Bradford gave him over the first 11.5 quarters of the year which supports the theory that Rosen will boost Kirk's opps. Sample size is ultra small, but the narrative is being supported right away.

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This isn't necessarily just about Kirk, but I'm still amazed at how the WRs were ignored in rookie drafts.

The Big-8 RBs were a thing. The Big-4 WRs were vastly underrated, as well as guys like Miller, Pettis, & Washington.

It might be the single biggest screw-up by the FF community (as a whole) in our hobby's history.

Edited by Football Jones
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25 minutes ago, Football Jones said:

This isn't necessarily just about Kirk, but I'm still amazed at how the WRs were ignored in rookie drafts.

They were drafted in my drafts.

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2 hours ago, Football Jones said:

This isn't necessarily just about Kirk, but I'm still amazed at how the WRs were ignored in rookie drafts.

What are you basing this on?

Here is rookie ADP from MFL after June 1st 660 drafts.

1.	Barkley, Saquon NYG RB	1.07	1	7	643
2.	Penny, Rashaad SEA RB	5.46	1	103	664
3.	Guice, Derrius WAS RB*	5.55	1	145	645
4.	Michel, Sony NEP RB	6.30	1	114	656
5.	Jones, Ronald TBB RB	7.85	1	210	654
6.	Freeman, Royce DEN RB	8.23	1	58	651
7.	Chubb, Nick CLE RB	8.83	2	153	648
8.	Johnson, Kerryon DET RB	9.67	2	86	657
9.	Moore, D.J. CAR WR	10.27	1	241	660
10.	Ridley, Calvin ATL WR	10.89	2	159	647
11.	Kirk, Christian ARI WR	15.89	3	198	649
12.	Sutton, Courtland DEN WR	16.03	2	275	647
13.	Smith, Roquan CHI LB	16.21	2	146	462
14.	Mayfield, Baker CLE QB	18.09	1	299	653
15.	Gallup, Michael DAL WR	18.35	2	183	663
16.	Edmunds, Tremaine BUF LB	18.68	3	175	460
17.	Miller, Anthony CHI WR	19.55	2	310	661
18.	Gesicki, Mike MIA TE	19.93	2	243	656
19.	Rosen, Josh ARI QB	21.21	1	311	643
20.	Jackson, Lamar BAL QB	21.22	2	288	648
21.	Darnold, Sam NYJ QB	23.71	1	317	644
22.	Washington, James PIT WR	23.99	2	289	649
23.	Hines, Nyheim IND RB	25.97	5	243	660
24.	Hurst, Hayden BAL TE	26.92	3	261	659
25.	Pettis, Dante SFO WR	28.66	10	350	650
26.	James, Derwin LAC S	28.72	2	213	448
27.	Ballage, Kalen MIA RB	29.94	6	222	641
28.	Goedert, Dallas PHI TE	30.19	5	206	655
29.	Evans, Rashaan TEN LB	30.20	2	361	440
30.	Allen, Josh BUF QB	30.67	2	331	638
31.	Chubb, Bradley DEN LB	31.00	2	315	458
32.	Vander Esch, Leighton DAL LB	32.85	8	284	432
33.	Chark, D.J. JAC WR	33.85	5	377	651
34.	Smith, Tre'Quan NOS WR	34.71	2	379	656
35.	Davenport, Marcus NOS DE	36.01	6	339	445
36.	Wilkins, Jordan IND RB	38.18	9	286	644
2 hours ago, Football Jones said:

The Big-8 RBs were a thing.

Yes. This is partially influenced by recent history. Last season having multiple RB enter the top 12 at the position, as well as 1st round WR not doing much in recent drafts either.

Getting early action on a rookie player makes them a better trade asset than a guy who isn't doing anything.

2 hours ago, Football Jones said:

The Big-4 WRs were vastly underrated, as well as guys like Miller, Pettis, & Washington.

With the benefit of hindsight, where do you think the WR should have been drafted? After 3 weeks of regular season play?

2 hours ago, Football Jones said:

It might be the single biggest screw-up by the FF community (as a whole) in our hobby's history.

I think you are overstating the case in a lot of instances here, but curious as to what you think was screwed up?

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@Biabreakable sorry I couldn't quote the relevant part of your text for some reason. You said: "Getting early action on a rookie player makes them a better trade asset than a guy who isn't doing anything". This true but the error I think for a lot of drafters was assuming (presumably based on 2017) that all of these rookies would get not only early action, but early action that would make them a productive asset with more value than the WRs. 

Now hindsight is great but the RBs haven't provided that at all. I wouldn't count Guice, but the action so far that Chubb, Michel, Penny and Freeman have got has arguably been underwhelming. Jones has had no action at all. Kerryon has been OK I guess.

Miller, Washington, Moore and Pettis haven't done a whole lot either to be fair. Sutton, Ridley and Kirk have shown a bit more. We've probably just been spoilt by the instant production of previous recent classes, but it seemed (to me anyway) that the obsession with rookie RBs in drafts was a bit too reactionary and ignored the genuine high-end talent of a few of the WRs. That has played out to some extent.

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51 minutes ago, Biabreakable said:

What are you basing this on?

Here is rookie ADP from MFL after June 1st 660 drafts.


1.	Barkley, Saquon NYG RB	1.07	1	7	643
2.	Penny, Rashaad SEA RB	5.46	1	103	664
3.	Guice, Derrius WAS RB*	5.55	1	145	645
4.	Michel, Sony NEP RB	6.30	1	114	656
5.	Jones, Ronald TBB RB	7.85	1	210	654
6.	Freeman, Royce DEN RB	8.23	1	58	651
7.	Chubb, Nick CLE RB	8.83	2	153	648
8.	Johnson, Kerryon DET RB	9.67	2	86	657
9.	Moore, D.J. CAR WR	10.27	1	241	660
10.	Ridley, Calvin ATL WR	10.89	2	159	647
11.	Kirk, Christian ARI WR	15.89	3	198	649
12.	Sutton, Courtland DEN WR	16.03	2	275	647
13.	Smith, Roquan CHI LB	16.21	2	146	462
14.	Mayfield, Baker CLE QB	18.09	1	299	653
15.	Gallup, Michael DAL WR	18.35	2	183	663
16.	Edmunds, Tremaine BUF LB	18.68	3	175	460
17.	Miller, Anthony CHI WR	19.55	2	310	661
18.	Gesicki, Mike MIA TE	19.93	2	243	656
19.	Rosen, Josh ARI QB	21.21	1	311	643
20.	Jackson, Lamar BAL QB	21.22	2	288	648
21.	Darnold, Sam NYJ QB	23.71	1	317	644
22.	Washington, James PIT WR	23.99	2	289	649
23.	Hines, Nyheim IND RB	25.97	5	243	660
24.	Hurst, Hayden BAL TE	26.92	3	261	659
25.	Pettis, Dante SFO WR	28.66	10	350	650
26.	James, Derwin LAC S	28.72	2	213	448
27.	Ballage, Kalen MIA RB	29.94	6	222	641
28.	Goedert, Dallas PHI TE	30.19	5	206	655
29.	Evans, Rashaan TEN LB	30.20	2	361	440
30.	Allen, Josh BUF QB	30.67	2	331	638
31.	Chubb, Bradley DEN LB	31.00	2	315	458
32.	Vander Esch, Leighton DAL LB	32.85	8	284	432
33.	Chark, D.J. JAC WR	33.85	5	377	651
34.	Smith, Tre'Quan NOS WR	34.71	2	379	656
35.	Davenport, Marcus NOS DE	36.01	6	339	445
36.	Wilkins, Jordan IND RB	38.18	9	286	644

Yes. This is partially influenced by recent history. Last season having multiple RB enter the top 12 at the position, as well as 1st round WR not doing much in recent drafts either.

Getting early action on a rookie player makes them a better trade asset than a guy who isn't doing anything.

With the benefit of hindsight, where do you think the WR should have been drafted? After 3 weeks of regular season play?

I think you are overstating the case in a lot of instances here, but curious as to what you think was screwed up?

I think it's pretty evident the RBs were overdrafted & by quite a large margin. I saw a lot of leagues go 1-8 RBs which by virtually everyone's account at this point was a mistake in dynasty leagues.

Of course it's hindsight (duh), but thats what we have to go on right now. There's a lot to be played out yet, but I'm very confident we'll look back at this class & realize the FF community (as a whole) made a rather big mistake by overvaluing the RBs & undervaluing the WRs.

Edited by Football Jones
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Very few people were on the WR train. I saw a lot of "the RBs are the value & I see no WR who deserves to be drafted high". Comments along those lines.

With the data we have right now, the way it's looking, WRs should've been drafted much higher. You typically could get Ridley, Sutton, Kirk, & Moore in the late 1st/early 2nd & guys like Miller, Pettis & Washington in the late 2nd/early 3rd

Even the likes of Jackson & Gesicki went higher than many of the top WRs in some leagues. Not trashing any particular player because this was a great class, but it's crystal clear the WRs were WAY underdrafted in the typical dynasty league.

Edited by Football Jones

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18 hours ago, RushHour said:

@Biabreakable sorry I couldn't quote the relevant part of your text for some reason. You said: "Getting early action on a rookie player makes them a better trade asset than a guy who isn't doing anything". This true but the error I think for a lot of drafters was assuming (presumably based on 2017) that all of these rookies would get not only early action, but early action that would make them a productive asset with more value than the WRs. 

Now hindsight is great but the RBs haven't provided that at all. I wouldn't count Guice, but the action so far that Chubb, Michel, Penny and Freeman have got has arguably been underwhelming. Jones has had no action at all. Kerryon has been OK I guess.

Miller, Washington, Moore and Pettis haven't done a whole lot either to be fair. Sutton, Ridley and Kirk have shown a bit more. We've probably just been spoilt by the instant production of previous recent classes, but it seemed (to me anyway) that the obsession with rookie RBs in drafts was a bit too reactionary and ignored the genuine high-end talent of a few of the WRs. That has played out to some extent.

Yeah Rush I am not saying it is always the right thing to do, focus on rookie players who will actually produce something right away. Some times that is being short sighted. However it does influence how I will rank rookie players to a degree, although I do give rookies 3 years to prove themselves, I usually have a pretty good idea of what they can do by year two of their careers.

Eveery once in awhile a player emerges in their 4th or 5th season in the league. For example maybe Phillip Dorsett will actually be worth something now. But most of the time, and especially with RB they are going to show who they are by their 3rd season. Jay Ajayi for example was injured and mostly worthless his rookie year, but broke out in his second season (which if Foster had stayed healthy, may have never happened).

So while I can agree with you that some times this short term thinking is an error, most of the time it isn't. For RB and WR you are usually going to see them shine in their first two seasons if they are going to.

Yeah the RB have been all the rage and this is an overreaction to what happened in 2017 with several rookie RB all showing their worth. Some folks thought this RB draft class was as good as 2017. I never really agreed with that, but there are some good players there from 2018. Most of them are not looking like they will break out this year though, at least at this time. That could change quickly however.

Part of the RB being overvalued from the 2018 draft class is related to how poorly WR have done in recent draft classes as well though. So if you are looking at a long wait for the WR to become useful, I do understand wanting to take a shot at RB instead.

It has only been 3 weeks. My outlook on these players when I rank them is 3 seasons. In my view it would be premature to change anything about how I ranked them.

Edited by Biabreakable

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18 hours ago, Football Jones said:

I think it's pretty evident the RBs were overdrafted & by quite a large margin. I saw a lot of leagues go 1-8 RBs which by virtually everyone's account at this point was a mistake in dynasty leagues.

Of course it's hindsight (duh), but thats what we have to go on right now. There's a lot to be played out yet, but I'm very confident we'll look back at this class & realize the FF community (as a whole) made a rather big mistake by overvaluing the RBs & undervaluing the WRs.

Well I do not have the same perspective about this as you do. I think it is too early to judge how the players were ranked prior to the regular season.

Lets at least get 8 weeks played before calling what has happened so far evident.

There is a short sightedness in looking for early production on any rookie player, but it is just as short sighted to make judgements about those evaluations after only 3 weeks of regular season play.

If you feel as strongly about this as your statements sound however, how do you think the rookie should be ranked right now?

With the benefit of 3 weeks of regular season play to help guide you.

 

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13 minutes ago, Biabreakable said:

Well I do not have the same perspective about this as you do. I think it is too early to judge how the players were ranked prior to the regular season.

Lets at least get 8 weeks played before calling what has happened so far evident.

There is a short sightedness in looking for early production on any rookie player, but it is just as short sighted to make judgements about those evaluations after only 3 weeks of regular season play.

If you feel as strongly about this as your statements sound however, how do you think the rookie should be ranked right now?

With the benefit of 3 weeks of regular season play to help guide you.

 

I know what you're getting at, but the heart of my statement is if rookie drafts were held today, it would look vastly different. The biggest difference would be in the RBs & WRs. That's really all I'm saying.

To expand, I believe this trend will continue. The RBs were way overdrafted & the WRs way underdrafted, IMO.

My board doesn't look much different than it did pre-rookie draft. I've always had the WRs much higher than was typical starting at 2 & sprinkled in throughout the late-middle 1st. Now, that doesn't mean I would've taken a WR at 2. I didn't have that high of a pick, but I likely would've traded down to take a WR & gained compensation if had a pick in the top-5 & seeing how highly the RBs were ranked.

Edited by Football Jones

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28 minutes ago, Football Jones said:

I know what you're getting at, but the heart of my statement is if rookie drafts were held today, it would look vastly different. The biggest difference would be in the RBs & WRs. That's really all I'm saying.

To expand, I believe this trend will continue. The RBs were way overdrafted & the WRs way underdrafted, IMO.

My board doesn't look much different than it did pre-rookie draft. I've always had the WRs much higher than was typical starting at 2 & sprinkled in throughout the late-middle 1st. Now, that doesn't mean I would've taken a WR at 2. I didn't have that high of a pick, but I likely would've traded down to take a WR & gained compensation if had a pick in the top-5 & seeing how highly the RBs were ranked.

I see. Well that would be an interesting discussion to me.

How would people rank the rookies right now?

Maybe this should be a new topic. To stay on this one where would people rank Christian Kirk right now?

The last rookie rankings I did was early June post draft. I had Kirk at 14 overall.

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7 minutes ago, Biabreakable said:

I see. Well that would be an interesting discussion to me.

How would people rank the rookies right now?

Maybe this should be a new topic. To stay on this one where would people rank Christian Kirk right now?

The last rookie rankings I did was early June post draft. I had Kirk at 14 overall.

I hesitate to post my rankings because I'm in trade negotiations involving some of them. I've had other people ask & I may do that at some point, but likely not until the offseason. I typically don't post rankings for selfish reasons (the trade thing), but I'm reconsidering it.

There's also the issue of not updating my board. There no doubt would be changes to my original rankings, but I haven't done that yet. I typically don't officially do anything with my board until the offseason & I'll simply adjust "on the fly" with trades & such. 

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1 minute ago, Football Jones said:

I hesitate to post my rankings because I'm in trade negotiations involving some of them. I've had other people ask & I may do that at some point, but likely not until the offseason. I typically don't post rankings for selfish reasons (the trade thing), but I'm reconsidering it.

There's also the issue of not updating my board. There no doubt would be changes to my original rankings, but I haven't done that yet. I typically don't officially do anything with my board until the offseason & I'll simply adjust "on the fly" with trades & such. 

I do pretty much the same. 

I started a new topic and I remembered miqes list that samples many rankings pre combine, post combine pre NFL draft, and post NFL draft as I would like to discuss it some more.

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11 minutes ago, Biabreakable said:

I see. Well that would be an interesting discussion to me.

How would people rank the rookies right now?

Maybe this should be a new topic. To stay on this one where would people rank Christian Kirk right now?

The last rookie rankings I did was early June post draft. I had Kirk at 14 overall.

I don't typically do rookie rankings per se. I did have Barkley #1 of course. After that, I had Penny as my top RB, and Kirk as my top WR. 

I drafted Penny at 1.04, and Kirk at 2.01. I've been a Kirk fan early on, and would definitly take him ahead of Penny now. So I guess I'd have Kirk in the top 6 or 7, and Penny below that.

I don't have the energy to rerank all the rookies, but there's definitely WR's moving up.

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Would anyone drop Marquis Goodwin now with Jimmy G out for Kirk?

I just wonder if Goodwin will even be a real thing now and if Kirk with an aging Larry across from and a young QB trying to make his name will be a better bet down the stretch.

I'll take any advice...thank you

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1 minute ago, thehoch said:

Would anyone drop Marquis Goodwin now with Jimmy G out for Kirk?

I just wonder if Goodwin will even be a real thing now and if Kirk with an aging Larry across from and a young QB trying to make his name will be a better bet down the stretch.

I'll take any advice...thank you

I think if I was desperate for WR help right now, I would take the gamble.

I'm high on Kirk for keeper/dynasty purposes, but what the AZ offense will be is totally up in the air.  As others have noted, he has the opportunity for volume going for him, an OC that doesn't seem committed yet to giving the ball to DJ 30 times a game, and a chance for an injection of some confidence or positive change with Rosen.  But, there's a lot of moving parts there - Fitz stays banged up, the Cards stay stupid with DJ, Rosen doesn't suck.

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1 hour ago, rschroeder1 said:

I think if I was desperate for WR help right now, I would take the gamble.

I'm high on Kirk for keeper/dynasty purposes, but what the AZ offense will be is totally up in the air.  As others have noted, he has the opportunity for volume going for him, an OC that doesn't seem committed yet to giving the ball to DJ 30 times a game, and a chance for an injection of some confidence or positive change with Rosen.  But, there's a lot of moving parts there - Fitz stays banged up, the Cards stay stupid with DJ, Rosen doesn't suck.

I think rsch.... nailed it. It's truly a gamble, and it's just really hard to say. A lot will depend on Sunday, but by then it may be too late.

I think I would do it because I'm a Cardinals fan and believe in Kirk, but I fully admit my glasses are tainted.

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1 hour ago, thehoch said:

Would anyone drop Marquis Goodwin now with Jimmy G out for Kirk?

I just wonder if Goodwin will even be a real thing now and if Kirk with an aging Larry across from and a young QB trying to make his name will be a better bet down the stretch.

I'll take any advice...thank you

I dropped Goodwin this week.  I don't think Beathard has the skill set to utilize him.

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Should we call him Captain Kirk right now and leave room to make him the Admiral of he blows up?

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 Snagged this guy as my WR3 this week, in 2 leagues where I am in a massive point hole thanks to running up against a team that started half the Rams buzzsaw, and Cousins in another.

 I see this as an excellent chance to gamble on someone as a flyer for a rest -of-season difference maker.(like above, I'm down on Marquise Goodwin, and similar type WR3s)

 I recall a similar narrative type story some years ago when Brandon Marshall was "roommates" with his current QB (in the offseason) in a season where he blew up. Rosen and Kirk spent a lot of time together in the preseason, and were roommates in the past.

 This is the definition of a speculative gamble, but looking at what has transpired, (and last week) it certainly seems like Rosen might be looking for Kirk often.  Its not like ARI is going to be a defensive juggernaut and they should be playing from behind consistently the rest of the year.

 Punched him in as a WR3 in 2 leagues.   Not terribly excited yet, but I see some upside over many of the WR3 types. One long TD wouldn't shock me in the slightest @ home vs. Seattle.  Tomorrow, I'll be watching.

 

 TZM

Edited by TZMarkie

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Kirk somehow is still in waivers in my league. I'm thinking about dropping Chris Henry for him. It's a PPR redraft. I have the feeling that the minute I'm dropping Henry, he will go off but Kirk looks pretty good and seems to have a good connection with Rosen. Not sure on that one.

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Christian Kirk has run 59 percent of his routes on the outside this season.

Kirk will run most of his Thursday night routes against Broncos RCB Bradley Roby, who's allowed the fourth-most yards in the league. The Cardinals should feature Kirk with Larry Fitzgerald facing shutdown CB Chris Harris in the slot. Kirk has been Josh Rosen's top target since taking over for Sam Bradford. We like Kirk as an upside FLEX this week.

Source: Thursday Night Matchups 

Oct 17 - 7:35 PM

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13 hours ago, Dr. Dan said:

Thinking of dropping Coutee for Kirk. I figure kirk is basically the #1 wr vs #3 on Houston

I am on board with this: Kirk = #1 wr for Arizona. 

Getting a #1 at the end of the bench is something hard to pass up.  While Coutee is very interesting, I think that Kirk's floor is higher than Coutee's (especially given his issue with his hammys and the current state of the Houston offense).  And I think Kirk's ceiling is at least equal to Coutee's.

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Gotta admit that it looks like I was wrong about Kirk's role this season. Definitely on my radar for a WW move.

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16 hours ago, Dr. Dan said:

Thinking of dropping Coutee for Kirk. I figure kirk is basically the #1 wr vs #3 on Houston

Been thinking about it, and I find this argument compelling, so I just pulled the trigger.  

Now need to decide whether to start Kirk or Corey Davis in my flex spot.

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52 minutes ago, themeistersinger said:

Been thinking about it, and I find this argument compelling, so I just pulled the trigger.  

Now need to decide whether to start Kirk or Corey Davis in my flex spot.

The evaluation of ARZ #1 WR vs HOU #3 WR (maybe #2 WR) needs to take the QB play into account though.

Would you rather have 5% of a million dollars or 50% of a thousand?

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49 minutes ago, Dizzy said:

The evaluation of ARZ #1 WR vs HOU #3 WR (maybe #2 WR) needs to take the QB play into account though.

Would you rather have 5% of a million dollars or 50% of a thousand?

If Fuller is out, and Coutee is #2, then I'd prefer Coutee.  I also don't think Watson is a solid gold QB.  The #3 WR in Green Bay or LA Rams isn't the same as the #3 receiver in Houston.

And while Rosen might toss picks, those don't count against the WR stats, although of course they do end drives and take the team off the field.

Biggest risk tonight is probably David Johnson blasting through the Broncos weak rush defense and Rosen doesn't have to throw.

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Love how he is trending up as the new #1 in ARZ and enjoying his somewhat slow, steady, methodical, turtle like breakout. The multi-TD 100+ yards explosion game hasn't occurred on my bench (yet), however, this could be the night Kirk torches Roby on a national stage and becomes a household name (well not really a household name, but take notice). I could see him put up 1-2 TDs and 100+ yards easy tonight if Roby holds to form. Kirk has been good on his catch rate (25 of 31, 80%) and if his talent ever got exploited with one of those monster 10-15 target type games look out.

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16 minutes ago, mnmplayer said:

Love how he is trending up as the new #1 in ARZ and enjoying his somewhat slow, steady, methodical, turtle like breakout. The multi-TD 100+ yards explosion game hasn't occurred on my bench (yet), however, this could be the night Kirk torches Roby on a national stage and becomes a household name (well not really a household name, but take notice). I could see him put up 1-2 TDs and 100+ yards easy tonight if Roby holds to form. Kirk has been good on his catch rate (25 of 31, 80%) and if his talent ever got exploited with one of those monster 10-15 target type games look out.

Posts like this make me do bad things with my lineups...

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4 minutes ago, tkrull said:

Posts like this make me do bad things with my lineups...

Agreed. I'm not starting him. He's my WR6 behind Green, Cooks, Boyd, Edelman and Baldwin. Not saying to start him (unless you have to fill a WR3ish type spot), just saying he could hit tonight.

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