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Is this forum still an Anti Trump Echo Chamber (Was: just a liberal echo chamber?)

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Just now, sn0mm1s said:

When facts and logic are no longer agreed upon then what is left? 

My point is that they are generally agreed upon in this forum, a weird little place where people demand facts supported by citations and there's a crew of bored lawyers waiting to poke holes in every flawed argument.

That's why this place feels like a "liberal echo chamber" now - because in the era of Trump, these things all cut the same way. That hasn't always been the case, and sure enough this place hasn't felt like a "liberal echo chamber" until recently. The timing isn't a coincidence.

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Just now, roadkill1292 said:

Wait, do you think that this board is mostly Christian or that mainstream America is largely Christian? 

Personally, I would guess that the vast majority here are at least nominally Christian.

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Just now, TobiasFunke said:

My point is that they are generally agreed upon in this forum, a weird little place where people demand facts supported by citations and there's a crew of bored lawyers waiting to poke holes in every flawed argument.

That's why this place feels like a "liberal echo chamber" now - because in the era of Trump, these things all cut the same way. That hasn't always been the case, and sure enough this place hasn't felt like a "liberal echo chamber" until recently. The timing isn't a coincidence.

I think there are differing opinions of the facts sometimes, or perceived opinions of the facts, whether right or wrong.

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3 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Personally, I would guess that the vast majority here are at least nominally Christian.

I agree with this.  Key word "nominally".

Edited by JohnnyU

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3 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Personally, I would guess that the vast majority here are at least nominally Christian.

Whatever the percentages, either nationally or on this bored, they're going down steadily.

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Just now, roadkill1292 said:

Whatever the percentages, either nationally or on this bored, they're going down steadily.

Gotta have a link for that :)

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2 minutes ago, James Daulton said:

This bored is mainstream if you look at the demographics of the participants.  Upper middle class, educated, non-christian white males. 

I suspect the primary distinguishing factor is education.  Anecdotal, but I don’t think it’s a reach that those who are interested in politics and debate have a reservoir of education to work with.  That’s why folks on this board tend to be anti-Trump.  Upper class white men are well represented here.  I think Christians are fairly well represented, too.  But, those with low education are robust in this country, especially rural areas, but are few and far between here.  Therein lies the difference.

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4 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

I think there are differing opinions of the facts sometimes, or perceived opinions of the facts, whether right or wrong.

Sorry but I have no idea what this means.

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11 minutes ago, roadkill1292 said:

Whatever the percentages, either nationally or on this bored, they're going down steadily.

Going down where?  Who's taking them down?

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6 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

Sorry but I have no idea what this means.

I'm sorry you didn't understand.

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10 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:
14 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Personally, I would guess that the vast majority here are at least nominally Christian.

I agree with this.  Key word "nominally".

One of the things that I actually appreciate about Trump is that he is slowly eroding the moral high ground once claimed by Christians in this country. He coerces Christians to repeatedly defend ideas and actions which would have been considered sacrilege just a few years ago.

Donald Trump is slowly turning all of America into a "nominally Christian" nation. Which is good, IMO.

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11 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Gotta have a link for that :)

Ok. But only if you think that it's not accurate (nationally, not this bored, there's no way to verify that here). I could indeed be wrong but it won't be any trouble to come up with church attendance figures just for starters.

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1 minute ago, roadkill1292 said:

Ok. But only if you think that it's not accurate (nationally, not this bored, there's no way to verify that here). I could indeed be wrong but it won't be any trouble to come up with church attendance figures just for starters.

it's board isn't it?  Only reason I mention that is because I've seen it used several times today.

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23 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Personally, I would guess that the vast majority here are at least nominally Christian.

I may be "nominally" Christian if you look at birth certificate, but I can assure you I am no longer a member of that cult

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5 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

it's board isn't it?  Only reason I mention that is because I've seen it used several times today.

More sarcasm?

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It wo̴uld go a long wa̷y for people to show our president some respect when r̴eferring to him.  If I call Hillary a pantsuit wearing crook or some other name (which I've stopped doing) I'll get jumped on by the anti-Tr̴ump clique.  Meanwhile references t̴o̶ the Ora̷nge one, or any number of other disr̴espectful references to the President get high fives.

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9 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

It wo̴uld go a long wa̷y for people to show our president some respect when r̴eferring to him.  If I call Hillary a pantsuit wearing crook or some other name (which I've stopped doing) I'll get jumped on by the anti-Tr̴ump clique.  Meanwhile references t̴o̶ the Ora̷nge one, or any number of other disr̴espectful references to the President get high fives.

It would go a long way if our President would show some respect when referring to most people.  

Respect is a 2 way street and for someone who blatantly shows lack of it getting some back is a stretch, regardless of the position that person holds   

Btw for the record I would be with your sentiments 100% if Trump acted the way you’re asking.  

Edited by dkp993
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4 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

It wo̴uld go a long wa̷y for people to show our president some respect when r̴eferring to him.  If I call Hillary a pantsuit wearing crook or some other name (which I've stopped doing) I'll get jumped on by the anti-Tr̴ump clique.  Meanwhile references t̴o̶ the Ora̷nge one, or any number of other disr̴espectful references to the President get high fives.

Maybe you should try to "jump on" people who are disrespectful to the president. I can't imagine how that might backfire on you. 

I mean what are people gonna do, come back at you with examples of the president himself being even more disrespectful? Nah, that seems far-fetched, to say the least. Surely any presidential candidate who is less respectful towards decent Americans than anonymous message board posters are towards politicians would be immediately rejected by any voter with a shred of decency, yes?

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12 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

It wo̴uld go a long wa̷y for people to show our president some respect when r̴eferring to him.  If I call Hillary a pantsuit wearing crook or some other name (which I've stopped doing) I'll get jumped on by the anti-Tr̴ump clique.  Meanwhile references t̴o̶ the Ora̷nge one, or any number of other disr̴espectful references to the President get high fives.

I agree with what you're saying, but this won't end well.

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6 minutes ago, dkp993 said:

It would go a long way if our President would show some respect when referring to most people.  

Respect is a 2 way street and for someone who blatantly shows lack of it getting some back is a stretch, regardless of the position that person holds   

Btw for the record I would be with your sentiments 100% if Trump acted the way you’re asking.  

This misses the point.  The moderators of the board have asked us not to be disrespectful towards politicians being discussed, yet references to the "Orange" one and similar names are repeated endlessly.  

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13 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

It wo̴uld go a long wa̷y for people to show our president some respect when r̴eferring to him.  If I call Hillary a pantsuit wearing crook or some other name (which I've stopped doing) I'll get jumped on by the anti-Tr̴ump clique.

I suppose your words are true on a technical level. Everyone stops doing something before they do it again.

But don't act like you've got a recent track record of treating Hillary with respect when you called her a criminal three weeks ago. :lmao:

At least make it through Sober February before proclaiming that you've changed your evil ways, okay?

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1 minute ago, [scooter] said:

I suppose your words are true on a technical level. Everyone stops doing something before they do it again.

But don't act like you've got a recent track record of treating Hillary with respect when you called her a criminal three weeks ago. :lmao:

At least make it through Sober February before proclaiming that you've changed your evil ways, okay?

Well she is a criminal.  Very different from making comments about appearance, calling him orange or fat, or commenting on his intelligence.  

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1 hour ago, JohnnyU said:

I believe a political echo chamber such as this one is mostly a place where people congregate to discuss political topics and have similar political beliefs and opinions, but do disregard differing opinions or beliefs most of the time.  Most posters here are democrats and have similar political beliefs and opinions and aren't very tolerant of differing opinions, or are very negative towards them.  I'm not saying every liberal / democrat poster here is like that all the time.  That is a fact IMO.

Most are Democrats?  That has never been the case in the past in this board...why now?

And I don’t  think people seek to disregard  opposing opinions at all.

Also I think this is a great both sides thing...neither side is tolerant of the other sides opinions.

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9 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

Well she is a criminal.  Very different from making comments about appearance, calling him orange or fat, or commenting on his intelligence.  

He is orange, fat, and has little intelligence. And, last I checked, she isn't a criminal. These are like baseline facts that need to be agreed upon to have any further discussion.

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14 minutes ago, roadkill1292 said:

Asking me to stop calling President Needy Amin names is a bridge too far.

Tweety Amin

Donny Moscow

President* Trump

FAUXTUS

 

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41 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

It wo̴uld go a long wa̷y for people to show our president some respect when r̴eferring to him. 

No.  Absolutely not.  No way.  Nope.  

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46 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

It wo̴uld go a long wa̷y for people to show our president some respect when r̴eferring to him.  If I call Hillary a pantsuit wearing crook or some other name (which I've stopped doing) I'll get jumped on by the anti-Tr̴ump clique.  Meanwhile references t̴o̶ the Ora̷nge one, or any number of other disr̴espectful references to the President get high fives.

Trump deserves very little.  I'm not ever sure Hillary really deserves all that much respect either.  I will not give Trump any respect until he shows me he deserves it.

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19 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

Well she is a criminal.  Very different from making comments about appearance, calling him orange or fat, or commenting on his intelligence.  

In response to allegations that Hillary Clinton is a criminal I posted tons of long, well-supported arguments as to why she was not. I did this despite being in a clear minority on this board. At no point did I complain about this place being a "conservative echo chamber." It was a heated but interesting discussion, and ultimately the Department of Justice has agreed with me.  They even said that with respect to the most popular theory of her alleged criminality, it wasn't a close call.

If you'd like to do the same regarding allegations that Trump is orange, fat and stupid, I would welcome it. 

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10 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

In response to allegations that Hillary Clinton is a criminal I posted tons of long, well-supported arguments as to why she was not. I did this despite being in a clear minority on this board. At no point did I complain about this place being a "conservative echo chamber." It was a heated but interesting discussion, and ultimately the Department of Justice has agreed with me.  They even said that with respect to the most popular theory of her alleged criminality, it wasn't a close call.

If you'd like to do the same regarding allegations that Trump is orange, fat and stupid, I would welcome it. 

Hillary is pretty fat too. And not too bright she lost to trump.  I don’t really care to debate these facts.  What purpose do the insulting names serve other than show our inability to have an adult conversation.   We could all grow up a little and improve the discussion around here.  

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3 minutes ago, Ramblin Wreck said:

Hillary is pretty fat too. And not too bright she lost to trump.  I don’t really care to debate these facts.  What purpose do the insulting names serve other than show our inability to have an adult conversation.   We could all grow up a little and improve the discussion around here.  

I fully agree here, with the “we” being emphasized.  The issues with the discussions around here are coming from both ends.  Way to much talking at then talking with.  Again both “sides” are doing this while pointing fingers the other way.  

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1 hour ago, butcher boy said:

It wo̴uld go a long wa̷y for people to show our president some respect when r̴eferring to him.  If I call Hillary a pantsuit wearing crook or some other name (which I've stopped doing) I'll get jumped on by the anti-Tr̴ump clique.  Meanwhile references t̴o̶ the Ora̷nge one, or any number of other disr̴espectful references to the President get high fives.

He doesn't show respect for the office or for others.   Why should anyone respect him?

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34 minutes ago, -fish- said:

He doesn't show respect for the office or for others.   Why should anyone respect him?

Which makes you no better than him. If he’s so horrible why not be better?

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1 hour ago, sho nuff said:

Most are Democrats?  That has never been the case in the past in this board...why now?

 

That isn't even debatable.   It is obvious this board is primarily made up with Democrats by the posts that are made.  I'm not blind you know.  I don't really care that it is, but just pointing out what most here already know.   I'm sorry you don't see that, but maybe you do and just have oppositional behavior disorder.

Edited by JohnnyU

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11 minutes ago, GoBirds said:

Which makes you no better than him. If he’s so horrible why not be better?

They're also confusing a difference of opinion on policy as personal disrespect.  I disagreed with just about everything Obama did, but I was never personally disrespected by him.  

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9 minutes ago, butcher boy said:

They're also confusing a difference of opinion on policy as personal disrespect.  I disagreed with just about everything Obama did, but I was never personally disrespected by him.  

I think everyone knows Trump doesn't have a filter and it is something I dislike about him, as well as most.  However, the promises he made during his campaign he is trying to fulfill and has come through on a lot of them.   That is more than a lot of Presidents do.  They make promises, then for one reason or another (like for the sake of national security, or some other reason) says they cannot fulfill some of those promises.

Edited by JohnnyU

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3 hours ago, [scooter] said:

I don't believe that anyone here thinks that this board reflects the mainstream level of support for Trump.

The phrase "echo chamber" implies that the thoughts of one particular group bounce around from person to person without being challenged or changed.

By that definition, I think that in many ways this forum is an echo chamber. But it's not a liberal echo chamber. It's an anti-Trump echo chamber.

Because liberal ideas get challenged all the time in this forum. But the one subject that almost everyone in this forum tends to agree on....is Trump.

And that's a hard pill to swallow for the MAGA guys, the Gary Johnson voters, or the "I'm-not-really-a-Trump-supporter-but-you-liberals-are-all-hypocrites" guys.

Great posting except the last sentence.  That last sentence is a symptom of the echo chamber:  You just lumped two groups of people who do not support Trump by definition in with the Trump supporters just because they take issue with some liberal ideas.  You did it in that sentence and you did it to me personally just a few day ago in this very thread.  You could have just left it with the fourth sentence, but, you just couldn't help yourself.  In that sense it still is a liberal echo chamber.

 

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1 hour ago, JohnnyU said:

That isn't even debatable.   It is obvious this board is primarily made up with Democrats by the posts that are made.  I'm not blind you know.  I don't really care that it is, but just pointing out what most here already know.   I'm sorry you don't see that, but maybe you do and just have oppositional behavior disorder.

Dude, anti-Trump is not synonymous with Democrat. I'm virulently anti-Trump. But I wouldn't register as a Democrat any sooner than I would register as a Republican.  Which is to say, no way in hell, never ever ever.

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1 hour ago, GoBirds said:

Which makes you no better than him. If he’s so horrible why not be better?

I'm not the President.  I'm not bringing disgrace to the United States or the White House.   Our elected leaders should have a higher standard than a guy that works from home in his boxers, don't you think?

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4 minutes ago, -fish- said:

I'm not the President.  I'm not bringing disgrace to the United States or the White House.   Our elected leaders should have a higher standard than a guy that works from home in his boxers, don't you think?

So now politicians are held in high esteem.....that's rich. I am jealous you can work in your boxers. 

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10 minutes ago, Herb said:

Dude, anti-Trump is not synonymous with Democrat. I'm virulently anti-Trump. But I wouldn't register as a Democrat any sooner than I would register as a Republican.  Which is to say, no way in hell, never ever ever.

Just because you wouldn't register as either doesn't mean the majority of this forum doesn't.  Don't even try to say this forum is just anti-Trump and not Democrat.  Don't even go there, because we all know it isn't.

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4 minutes ago, JohnnyU said:

Just because you wouldn't register as either doesn't mean the majority of this forum doesn't.  Don't even try to say this forum is just anti-Trump and not Democrat.  Don't even go there, because we all know it isn't.

This needs to be added to the constantly repeated Left statements......what number are we on?

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4 minutes ago, GoBirds said:

So now politicians are held in high esteem.....that's rich. I am jealous you can work in your boxers. 

It's truly a great gig.  I'm on year 3 of working from home and I can't see how I'd ever be able to go back to an office environment.   No commute,  no set hours and few distractions.   Once I train all of my clients to meet by video conference instead of in person, it will be even better.

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Just now, -fish- said:

It's truly a great gig.  I'm on year 3 of working from home and I can't see how I'd ever be able to go back to an office environment.   No commute,  no set hours and few distractions.   Once I train all of my clients to meet by video conference instead of in person, it will be even better.

I'm in the same boat.  I can work from home anytime I want, but usually only do most of it in the winter here in Minnesota.   As I approach retirement I find this very comforting and productive. 

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2 minutes ago, -fish- said:

It's truly a great gig.  I'm on year 3 of working from home and I can't see how I'd ever be able to go back to an office environment.   No commute,  no set hours and few distractions.   Once I train all of my clients to meet by video conference instead of in person, it will be even better.

Will you put on a shirt and tie for these and go pantless? That's what I would do. 

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2 minutes ago, GoBirds said:

Will you put on a shirt and tie for these and go pantless? That's what I would do. 

No tie.  I keep a couple dress shirts hanging on the back side of my home office door.    I put one on over my t-shirt.   To be honest, I'm usually in gym shorts, but sometimes if something comes up in the morning and I have to start sending emails I'll just go with the boxers through lunch.   I don't put on pants for videoconferences.

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2 minutes ago, -fish- said:

No tie.  I keep a couple dress shirts hanging on the back side of my home office door.    I put one on over my t-shirt.   To be honest, I'm usually in gym shorts, but sometimes if something comes up in the morning and I have to start sending emails I'll just go with the boxers through lunch.   I don't put on pants for videoconferences.

I keep ties and dress/sport coats hanging on my door in case I have to go to a meeting with doctors.

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I never sit down with my pants on, it’s saves the creases.  Old conductor trick. 

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