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MFL - Position Updates 3/6

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On 6/8/2018 at 0:52 PM, Hankmoody said:

I am sad I missed the Khaili Mack ride, no one was biting on offers.

Thoughts on Irvin?  Might he be able to get 35+ solos and 10 sacks playing opposite?

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2 hours ago, matttyl said:

Thoughts on Irvin?  Might he be able to get 35+ solos and 10 sacks playing opposite?

I don't know enough about Gunther's version of the 4-3 but he's got a ton going against him in any event.  Irvin's experience playing SAM in the Gus version may make him more valuable in that role so I don't know how much he'll truly be playing down and if he'll keep the designation.  I also think Arden Key will be a stud if he's able to stay clean and he'll cap Irvin in any regard.  The 3-8 sacks Key gets keep Irvin from double digits and therefore starting viability.  I'm not interested, I want DL with more upside than that.  35/5 guys are all over the waiver wire.

 

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Irvin has been playing RDE during the OTAs

https://twitter.com/FB_FilmAnalysis/status/1006648019431772160

Guess we could see Mack playing on the strong side in their "new" 4-3, I would guess they won't want Irvin to set the edge on the strong side, but rather have him in more pure pass rush situations on the weak side.

I would say he is a nice add as a DE3 or DE4 in non tackle heavy leagues. It's not like there is a ton of depth at DE in leagues where you have to start 2. He had a nice production at LB the last 2 seasons, if he can even reproduce 75% of that production at DE it makes him a DE2 in 12 teams leagues.

And here is the DC speaking about Irvin as DE in a press conference:

https://www.raiders.com/video/bruce-irvin-comfortable-in-new-role-along-the-defensive-line

 

Really under the radar right now

Edited by tonato

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On 5/26/2018 at 4:29 PM, Shane Falco said:

 

Does Rotoworld have a contest with another site to try to be first?  They seem a bit knee jerk with changes and hours later make a contradictory post that the guy they just moved to LB will "in the mix at DE"

 

Really?  Everything about Lawson so far this year is that he is a DE.  But Roto wants him to be a LB?

They do these knee jerk reactions in the spring, that seem pointless.  I tweeted the Rotoworld guy about it.  His reasoning for the Raiders moves was that these players went to a 3-4 team, and until they showed they would be a 4-3 defense, it made more sense to put Key at LB, and Hall/Hurst at DE.  In a 3-4, those positions would make more sense for those particular players.  Frankly, that doesn't fly. 

  • The Raiders being a true 3-4 the last few years is news to me.  They had elements of it, like Mack and Irvin dropping into coverage.  But this was nothing like a 3-4 defense.  They had ZERO players on their team that were 3-4 DE types, 5 techniques.  Mario Edwards could potentially fill that role, but he DIDN'T actually play that role.  The Raiders had two DEs that can play LB, that does NOT mean a team is running a 3-4.  They ALWAYS had two DTs on the field, and they were lined up as a 1 and 3 tech.  It looked like a 4-3 most of the time.  But what do I know, I only watched every snap of preseason and regular season. 
  •  He also made the statement that Hall played NT in college, so that fit with a 3-4 scheme.  That is such a weak ####### argument, I cannot believe he made it.  Every DT in college at some point, lines up as a NT.  Hall is 6', 300 lbs.  This is not Vince Wilfork.  He's not a 3-4 NT, and this guy knows that.  Also, I don't really know if it's true, because  I never saw Sam Houston State, which I am sure I have in common with the guy from Rotoworld.
  •   Hurst/Hall are as classic a 3 Tech size as one can get. They were clearly DTs, and would ONLY be inside penetrators.  
  • Norton came from SEA. 3-4 defense?  No.  Classic 4-3.  
  • Guenther replaced him, from Cincy. 3-4 defense?  No.  Classic 4-3.

There were some rumblings a few years ago about the team being multiple.  Somehow, that gets turned into BreezeIDP rearranging every player to a 3-4 defense.  

 

And that's just my team.  
 

 

Edited by massraider
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I haven't seen any positive news about Carl Lawson since he moved from a DE to LB designation. But, now I have a guy in one of my leagues relentlessly pursuing him by offering me trades. Started with Oren Burks straight up for Lawson and now he's offering Markus Golden and Dion Jordan for him. Did I miss some positive development regarding Lawson?

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30 minutes ago, northern exposure said:

I haven't seen any positive news about Carl Lawson since he moved from a DE to LB designation. But, now I have a guy in one of my leagues relentlessly pursuing him by offering me trades. Started with Oren Burks straight up for Lawson and now he's offering Markus Golden and Dion Jordan for him. Did I miss some positive development regarding Lawson?

I own him and haven't seen anything new on him.  He is a decent flyer in big play leagues (which I am in) but if you are in a standard league I would take the chance on Burks at this point.  

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2 hours ago, northern exposure said:

I haven't seen any positive news about Carl Lawson since he moved from a DE to LB designation. But, now I have a guy in one of my leagues relentlessly pursuing him by offering me trades. Started with Oren Burks straight up for Lawson and now he's offering Markus Golden and Dion Jordan for him. Did I miss some positive development regarding Lawson?

Lawson is supposedly having a really good camp. *shrugs*

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There hasn't been tons of news but what I've seen is all positive. To me it looks like it's all stemming from 1 or 2 initial articles, though. Hype train parroting the same quotes (one from Lawson and one from Cordy Glenn) plus an article this week from a CBS writer. **EDIT: Also found an article yesterday raving about his 3 sacks in 4 plays and how he's dominating camp. Grain of salt? Equally as important as INTs by the QB in camp? **

Definitely a good stash with both starting DEs in front of him in the final year of their contracts. If he gets OLB it's big-play scoring or bust, I'd imagine. Even if that's where he sticks this year it's possible he goes to DE next year with Cincy unlikely to resign Dunlap/Johnson. Looks like a high upside player but his designation in 3/4 takes away a bit of the luster for me. 3/4 DE sets the edge too often and OLB is not as likely to be tackle heavy. 

Edited by Flying Elvis

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CIN isn't even 3-4, he's just playing SAM like he did last year.  If I could stash him I would, there's a decent chance he ends up with a different role once Johnson's gone.  They are going to re-sign Dunlap for sure though so his ceiling is perhaps limited.

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On 6/13/2018 at 11:17 AM, massraider said:

They do these knee jerk reactions in the spring, that seem pointless.  I tweeted the Rotoworld guy about it.  His reasoning for the Raiders moves was that these players went to a 3-4 team, and until they showed they would be a 4-3 defense, it made more sense to put Key at LB, and Hall/Hurst at DE.  In a 3-4, those positions would make more sense for those particular players.  Frankly, that doesn't fly. 

  • The Raiders being a true 3-4 the last few years is news to me.  They had elements of it, like Mack and Irvin dropping into coverage.  But this was nothing like a 3-4 defense.  They had ZERO players on their team that were 3-4 DE types, 5 techniques.  Mario Edwards could potentially fill that role, but he DIDN'T actually play that role.  The Raiders had two DEs that can play LB, that does NOT mean a team is running a 3-4.  They ALWAYS had two DTs on the field, and they were lined up as a 1 and 3 tech.  It looked like a 4-3 most of the time.  But what do I know, I only watched every snap of preseason and regular season. 
  •  He also made the statement that Hall played NT in college, so that fit with a 3-4 scheme.  That is such a weak ####### argument, I cannot believe he made it.  Every DT in college at some point, lines up as a NT.  Hall is 6', 300 lbs.  This is not Vince Wilfork.  He's not a 3-4 NT, and this guy knows that.  Also, I don't really know if it's true, because  I never saw Sam Houston State, which I am sure I have in common with the guy from Rotoworld.
  •   Hurst/Hall are as classic a 3 Tech size as one can get. They were clearly DTs, and would ONLY be inside penetrators.  
  • Norton came from SEA. 3-4 defense?  No.  Classic 4-3.  
  • Guenther replaced him, from Cincy. 3-4 defense?  No.  Classic 4-3.

There were some rumblings a few years ago about the team being multiple.  Somehow, that gets turned into BreezeIDP rearranging every player to a 3-4 defense.  

 

And that's just my team.  
 

 

Had similar concerns with how Rotoworld handled Khalil Mack last summer. Definitely some knee jerk going on from time to time. Have seen several players switch positions multiple times over the summer in the past.

I think Evan and the guys there do a generally good job with the depth charts but every so often they make a change based on speculation from one interview during OTA's.

Edited by J Giles Band

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On 8/3/2018 at 3:05 PM, saintfool said:

Lawson is supposedly having a really good camp. *shrugs*

 

 

Maybe they knew Roto was moving him back to DE, now a DE...again

 

Bengals coach Marvin Lewis expects DE Carl Lawson to remain a sub-package player in 2018.

Lawson notched 8.5 sacks on just 477 rookie snaps, but the Bengals still have Michael Johnson and Carlos Dunlap. "The biggest thing that was true for Carl at Auburn, and still continues here in the NFL after his first season, is that by limiting his exposure, we're going to get more production," Lewis said. "He’s not that big of a person and so to go out and bang with the big guys all the time is not going to be beneficial to him, and what he’s going to get done at the end of the game when you need him to." Lawson could force Lewis' hand if he picks up where he left off as a rookie. Aug 14 - 5:40 PM

Source: Katherine Terrell on Twitter

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8 hours ago, Shane Falco said:

 

 

Maybe they knew Roto was moving him back to DE, now a DE...again

 

Bengals coach Marvin Lewis expects DE Carl Lawson to remain a sub-package player in 2018.

Lawson notched 8.5 sacks on just 477 rookie snaps, but the Bengals still have Michael Johnson and Carlos Dunlap. "The biggest thing that was true for Carl at Auburn, and still continues here in the NFL after his first season, is that by limiting his exposure, we're going to get more production," Lewis said. "He’s not that big of a person and so to go out and bang with the big guys all the time is not going to be beneficial to him, and what he’s going to get done at the end of the game when you need him to." Lawson could force Lewis' hand if he picks up where he left off as a rookie. Aug 14 - 5:40 PM

Source: Katherine Terrell on Twitter

:thumbup:

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https://forums.footballguys.com/forum/topic/758507-preseason-notes/#comment-20386292

Final Player Position Updates (Published Mon Sep 4 10:51:02 p.m. ET 2017)
Player Position Updates (Published Tue Aug 22 7:50:49 p.m. ET 2017)
Player Position Updates (Published Wed Jul 19 5:32:30 p.m. ET 2017)
Player Position Updates (Published Tue Jun 13 6:35:11 p.m. ET 2017)
Player Position Updates (Published Tue May 9 11:33:32 p.m. ET 2017)
Player Position Updates (Published Tue Apr 4 11:54:29 p.m. ET 2017)

Final Preseason Player Position Updates (Published Mon Sep 5 12:11:37 a.m. ET 2016)
Preseason Player Position Updates (Published Sun Aug 21 11:09:10 p.m. ET 2016)
Preseason Player Position Updates (Published Thu Aug 18 12:47:30 a.m. ET 2016)
Preseason Player Position Updates (Published Wed Jul 13 7:36:25 p.m. ET 2016)
Preseason Player Position Updates (Published Wed Jun 8 7:32:22 p.m. ET 2016)
Preseason Player Position Updates (Published Tue May 3 5:01:17 p.m. ET 2016)

They seem to be a tad earlier this year:

Player Position Updates for August (Published Wed Aug 8 8:54:45 p.m. ET 2018)
Player Position Updates for July (Published Tue Jul 10 10:18:33 p.m. ET 2018)
Player Position Updates for June (Published Fri Jun 8 12:42:53 a.m. ET 2018)
Player Position Updates for May (Published Fri May 4 12:45:46 a.m. ET 2018)
Player Position Updates for March (Published Mon Mar 5 9:23:01 p.m. ET 2018)

Looks like last two years had one has been prior to week 3 PS games then another after final cuts, but they missed that this year unless it's posted tonight or early tomorrow.  Have we seen any changes on Roto?

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On 8/15/2018 at 11:03 PM, Shane Falco said:

 

 

Maybe they knew Roto was moving him back to DE, now a DE...again

 

Bengals coach Marvin Lewis expects DE Carl Lawson to remain a sub-package player in 2018.

Lawson notched 8.5 sacks on just 477 rookie snaps, but the Bengals still have Michael Johnson and Carlos Dunlap. "The biggest thing that was true for Carl at Auburn, and still continues here in the NFL after his first season, is that by limiting his exposure, we're going to get more production," Lewis said. "He’s not that big of a person and so to go out and bang with the big guys all the time is not going to be beneficial to him, and what he’s going to get done at the end of the game when you need him to." Lawson could force Lewis' hand if he picks up where he left off as a rookie. Aug 14 - 5:40 PM

Source: Katherine Terrell on Twitter

He's a DE on Roto, sooooo.......

Gonna be touch and go, I have final draft tomorrow night, hopefully no one is on the ball, I should be able to get him as 4th DE.  

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The following player position changes will be made on Monday, September 3rd, to bring our player database up-to-date with the Rotoworld.com depth charts:

CAR: Marquis Haynes from DE to DT

CHI: Khalil Mack from DE to LB

CIN: Carl Lawson from LB to DE

CLE: Carl Davis from DE to DT

CLE: Briean Boddy-Calhoun from CB to S

DAL: Datone Jones from DT to DE

DAL: Tyrone Crawford from DE to DT

DET: Ricky Jean-Francois from DE to DT

DET: Quandre Diggs from CB to S

JAX: Taven Bryan from DT to DE

JAX: Lerentee McCray from DE to LB

LAR: Ethan Westbrooks from DT to DE

LAR: Dominique Easley from DE to LB

LAR: Justin Lawler from DE to LB

NE : Keion Crossen from CB to S

NE : Jason McCourty from CB to S

NYG: Kamrin Moore from CB to S

OAK: Frostee Rucker from DT to DE

OAK: Shilique Calhoun from LB to DE

OAK: Treyvon Hester from DE to DT

SF : Jullian Taylor from DT to DE

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Jullian Taylor from DT to DE is one to watch / stash if roster space and need meet. Good press during preseason and Armstead is the only threat to PT. 

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2 minutes ago, matttyl said:

Lawson expectations?

He should not be on the wire with the press he's received and his preseason work so grab him now or someone else will. Certainly not a start-him-every-week guy but he looks like a guy that will force the staff to play him full time. Michael Johnson is already expendable so next year Lawson is opposite Dunlap full time. 

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2 hours ago, matttyl said:

Lawson expectations?

low tackle numbers.  feast or famine.  They have 4 DEs worth playing.  

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10 hours ago, drewd_21 said:

The following player position changes will be made on Monday, September 3rd, to bring our player database up-to-date with the Rotoworld.com depth charts:

DET: Quandre Diggs from CB to S

Hmm. He's moved back to S. Productive last season as Safety. He's should get lots of snaps playing slot/safety hybrid. Not a ton of tackles, iirc, but good for deflections and big plays.

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