Stealthycat
Footballguy
are you asking if I'm an anti anti-gun person ?Captain Cranks said:
yes, yes I am !!
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Debate: Why even bother? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Captain Cranks
- Start date
yes, yes I am !!
Captain Cranks
Footballguy
See, this is where you go off the partisan rails for me. The president of the united states may have been colluding with a foreign adversary to sway our election and you act like it's no big deal. The Stormy Daniels thing? Sure...I can understand your attitude there. But can you honestly say from an objective basis that if this was Barrack Obama's campaign that may have been colluding with the Russians, the story would just be an attempt to sow discord?
Stealthycat
Footballguy
I hate Trump's tweeting most of the time, I understand that outlet, I just wish he did is presidentially vs like a guy 6 beer's into an eveningThe General said:The president, leader of the Republican Party, spends the majority of his time communicating with the country like a forum troll. He would probably be banned here in a few months
I think this gives the Dems the upper hand at the moment in this conversation.
Captain Cranks
Footballguy
So you're for the full deregulation of fully automatic guns, rocket launchers and military grade warfare?
Stealthycat
Footballguy
alleged Trump collusion with Russia - and its a big deal if it were real, I'm very sure it isn't however if I'm wrong I can admit that, and will join for his Ousting
if your side is wrong and it's all fluff by the media, made up what will ya'll say? sorry for wasting time and money or ???
Obama and Hillary and Russia - there are stories there from 2008-2016 .... no, the GOP never witch hunted any of them
I will admit, Obama was much more Presidential than Trump. I wish Trump was better, I do, at being Presidential
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Dickies is correct. People can be, and have been, swayed through good discussion over the years.
Your post is another example of why the discussion sucks. Grouping people as irrational and then acting like you get to dictate the rules is a horrible starting point to any rational discussion. Why would anyone engage this kind of mindset?
Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
I expect the left to achieve some return to control this fall. I believe the repudiation will be dramatic.
I honestly don't know if anyone is capable to the leadership I seek. Me, I am one to hold a grudge. I am also cognizant of the past and suspicious that those who have once transgressed will repeat the behavior. I have often wondered if true forgiveness is possible without forgetfulness as I lack that gift, or so it seems to me. I hope others are better than I am.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
I never said that.
Right now in the US, we have great common sense gun laws including the above mentioned weapons and many others. We have background checks, age limits. We have concealed weapons courses, high gun ownership numbers and crime has fallen over the past 10-20 years. We have literally hundreds of laws saying don't harm someone, don't hurt people, don't assault people, don't kill people with ANY weapons.
Right now, mass murder are rare, school shootings rare. They're glamorized, but rare, and the real gun crimes that are drug related and domestic violence aren't mentioned much and nobody cares much, that's a damn tragedy right there.
As I've said, the proposed new regulations are idiot created that'll do nothing to impact gun violence. Common sense? Better defend schools, gun free is a massive failure. Fast hard penalties - Cruz should be on trial right now, sentenced next week to death IMO. How can the Pulse shooters wife get off so quick and school shooters aren't tried for years? baffling to me
We have lots in place right now to stop gun crimes - the failures are NOT law abiding legal gun owners. That Democrats want to place that on us baffles me
Captain Cranks
Footballguy
Are you of the opinion that Mueller should shut down his investigation and that he's just wasting his time and taxpayer dollars?
Stealthycat
Footballguy
we don't know all the details of what's happening in the political ring
this is one of 3 ways IMO
- There is nothing there, and this whole thing is just to create chaos and division.
- There is a bit of something that's really nothing much and its being used to create chaos and division
- There is a LOT there and Trump will be impeached
2 of those 3 make Democrats look really bad. The 3rd one .... Nixon was clearly wrong, people saw what was happening. Bill Clinton lied under oath and to the nation, again clearly what happened. Trump if he did collude with Russia, what we're seeing is Russia kicking out diplomats, launching Satan 2 and if they helped Trump they're sure covering it well aint they? Nothing concrete anyone can see ... after how long ?
I'll bet on the first 2 being reality
Captain Cranks
Footballguy
Nor did I ever say I was anti-gun, but you probably assumed as much because I'm for stricter gun control. You're also for gun control. You just want to keep the line where it currently stands. You know what's strange about the mass murders in this country? The murderer is almost always using a weapon that is easily available to the public. These people aren't going out and finding heavily regulated weapons to do their bidding. So while I agree that you won't stop the crimes with stricter gun control laws, I do think you decrease the casualties when the crimes are committed. Do you think the kill count would be the same had the Las Vegas shooter not used bump stocks?
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Captain Cranks
Footballguy
This isn't just about Trump. It's about his campaign. I think it's already being proved that his campaign colluded with the Russians on some level. How far up the chain it goes we don't know. Regardless of whether it reaches Trump, we are learning about Russia's involvement in our election and should be implementing ways in which to prevent such tampering in the future. But instead, Trump and his followers would like to sweep it all under the rug, act like it's no big deal, and undermine the credibility of the press who is attempting to hold those responsibility accountable.
NREC34
Footballguy
Of course that’s what they want. After the years of Benghazi, emails, etc. they’ve put us all through. Even IF there’s nothing there (big if) screw them. Play by the rules and precedent YOU have set.
Dedfin
Footballguy
I'm just shocked that he's actually advanced past simply posting a rolling smile. He's learned to form sentences. I always try to encourage progress.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
depends on what you want to take from me if you're anti-gun or not I imagine and actually if I could write the law? I'd open up juvenile records so we can see who's violent and disturbed and add that to background checks, does that make me anti-gun ?
of course people use easy to acquire things - trucks, fertilizer, airplanes, knives etc - makes sense.
no, Paddock would easily have acquired illegally the guns he used - he was a millionaire, and Obama's fast and furious showed how lucrative gun running is, didn't it ?
but of all the school shootings, mass shootings, how many guns were illegally acquired? how many were not AR15 but shotguns, handguns, rifles ?
I want to stop these people before they act - I don't want to reduce their kill count and call that a success.
Captain Cranks
Footballguy
I can respect your opinion on guns. While I disagree with the conclusion, at least it's well reasoned and thoughtful. Regarding the Russia stuff, not so much. You seemingly want to dismiss facts that should be objective for both of us because of an unsupportable opinion that this is just a political witch hunt led by the DOJ and FBI who are historically managed by conservatives.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
the question said why bother ?
like I said, some people don't want to discuss, its intolerable and unacceptable to them for anyone to have a different view
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
He admitted that he had that story wrong. The PA stabbing was a few years ago and there was a stabbing in some other country that he got mixed up. It's all been straightened out.
Thunderlips
Footballguy
I'm not a Liberal....but I can't help think back to the barrage of relentless assaults about ANYTHING the Obamas did from just about every Right Wing media source. Two wrongs don't make a right......but I personally kind of enjoy putting the very same people who cried about Obamas suit color on the defensive about EVERY little Trump tick.Underachievers said:
Weebs210
Footballguy
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Me too. The guy is getting lit up for using Grey Poupon, meanwhile Trump eats his steak well done with ketchup and people are perfectly OK with that.
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Weebs210
Footballguy
Same. How long do you think you guys will be around for?I really can't wait until the mutants are gone and the rational people can go back to disagreeing about how government should serve the people. I think the country needs (at least) 2 healthy parties.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
People like Pelosi and Ryan need to ride off into the sunset and we need to get some people who actually have some principles back in there. As much as I don't agree with him on several points, the "post-IDGAF" Trey Gowdy has been refreshing. More people like that who simply aren't beholden to the talking points 110%.I really can't wait until the mutants are gone and the rational people can go back to disagreeing about how government should serve the people. I think the country needs (at least) 2 healthy parties.
Similarly, I’ve heard some liberals say that Clarence Thomas should never criticize affirmative action since he benefited from it. I think they’re wrong, too.
It’s okay to criticize what you perceive to be a stacked deck even if you think it’s stacked in your own favor.
KCitons
Footballguy
So, a
- rolling smile = not smart enough to post words.
- post a few words = not smart enough to understand facts.
- post analogies (my personal favorite) = stupid and doesn't apply to this topic
- post a lot of words = beating a dead horse.
Thunderlips
Footballguy
Maybe the Right needs to just come out and say it...... "we were irrational ##### to Obama.".....
Stealthycat
Footballguy
I connect the dots
After the election, nationwide chaos in the form of boycott's, marching in the streets, media blitz all against Trump who trounced Hillary in the election. Why? because the left lost - nothing more, nothing less
ever see the right behave like that? ever ?
the failure to approve Trump nominations time and time again, slowing Trump down as much as possible, even the tales of how Obama leaving was a trail of roadblocks for Trump and the new administration
it was income taxes, then Russia, then Stormy and I'm sure I've forgotten all the other things the left has used to create chaos and unrest
that's where I am with the Russia thing, if I'm wrong I'll admit it and join for calling Trump to be dismissed ... but so far, all i see is facebook selling slots for hackers to create chaos in America and dumb people flowing into the streets following a facebook following just because - not much else
Stealthycat
Footballguy
I was wrong and confused the Russia knifing with the US school knifing last week and the bad PA one all in one .... there wasn't a bad US mass knifing last week, I got things mixed on that
Weebs210
Footballguy
I mean he was a terrible president but yeah some people went over board(including Trump) with the birth certificate thing.
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TobiasFunke
Footballguy
I honestly can't recall a time when the right didn't boycott, march or throw hissy fits in the media.
McJose
Footballguy
Captain Cranks
Footballguy
Nope. Never. Great call.
Stealthy, you seem like you can at least put in the effort to have a dialogue, but use this as a prime example of how your bias has caused you to be blind to some pretty obvious facts. I'm willing to concede that both sides have their own versions of hysteria, but your memory can't be that short to have forgotten what kind of hysteria we just endured from 2008 to 2016.
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The General
Footballguy
Have you followed American politics outside of this last year? Not showing your income taxes, banging and paying off porn stars while of your 3rd marriage
These are kind of deal breakers until this dope.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
oh come on now
when Obama was elected the right had marches nationwide, asked for quiet spaces and cried on tv ? really ? no, they didn't do that, they didn't pour into the streets in the weeks after
Stealthycat
Footballguy
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
Was he really that terrible though? I hear some people say this but I honestly don't know what made him terrible. I can understand saying that he was not great or one of the best but I don't see him being terrible.
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TobiasFunke
Footballguy
They had marches. They weren't nationwide because the issues weren't as important to people. It turns out people care more about not being discriminated against, abused, assaulted and shot at than they do about having their health insurance premiums go up at a slightly higher rate than they did previously
As for the boycotts, conservatives have talked out of both sides of their mouth for a long time and have been hilariously hypocritical in this respect. It's harder to think of an American business a prominent conservative hasn't suggested boycotting in the last decade than one they have.
Anyway, if you can't acknowledge the incredibly obvious fact that an entire media cottage industry sprung up to meet demand for (and create more) Obama-related outrage there's really no reason to continue this conversation.
Stealthycat
Footballguy
Nope that video is cool on the soundbites from those 8 years. Obama is/was socialist and that administration killed it for debt increase. Trump might beat him, we'll see .... but that's 6 minutes of 8 years of GOP/conservative response to Obama.
Do you think there is a video of more than 6 minutes on the abuse of Trump in 18 months ?
Never On September 12 2009, we went to Washington DC to document the Tea Party protests against, well, a lot of things, including health insurance reform, the IRS, abortion, global warming, and our "socialist/communist/fascist/Nazi/Muslim" president, Barack Obama.
That wasn't the days after the election .... about what, 60-70,000 rallied for that? compare that Trump and the days after the election, not even close is it ? and these protests were NOTHING to do with Trump having done ANYTHING but be elected, whereas the Tea party rallies were in response to Obama administration policies, right ?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_Donald_Trump
Great Call - which signs offend you? some are offensive and uncalled for, some have great points too I think
You are right in that I don't remember those Tea Party rallies ..... not main stream media? Did I just forget? I dunno to be honest
Stealthycat
Footballguy
I'll agree there, I wish a conservative party would spring forth that gave me an option
Captain Cranks
Footballguy
The Commish
Footballguy
You don't get to project onto us things out of our control. If you are going to come here and converse with us as a community how about focusing on the things WE are saying? It's completely dishonest and disingenuous to be taking the position you're taking here. You blabber on and on and on and on and on and on about how people "don't want to discus......" and whine when people put you on ignore. This is why they do it. You don't want discussion. You want to attack by trying to make us, people here, justify positions other than our own and when people say "not interested" you throw out this "Hey guys, I'm here for the discussion, why all the sour ####es not wanting to talk?" shtick which is complete bull####.
As I've said....as soon as you're willing to step out from behind the talking points and engage with people here in a genuine manner, I'll be first in line to engage. You're going to have to show your work though and stop with the nonsense. There are many here willing to compromise. All you have to do is read THEIR words.
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Ditka Butkus
Footballguy
Divorce should be a deal breaker for the presidency?Have you followed American politics outside of this last year? Not showing your income taxes, banging and paying off porn stars while of your 3rd marriage
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
From the wife beater wearing guy that is perma-banned from another forum for wanting the president dead. Good times.
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