Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Sign in to follow this  
Mario Kart

What an embarrassment for our country. re: Immigration

Recommended Posts

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/year-old-baby-appears-in-immigration-court_us_5b4290e3e4b07b827cc1e76c

Quote

A 1-year-old boy in federal custody who appeared in immigration court without his parents in Phoenix briefly played with a ball, drank from a bottle, then “cried hysterically” as he was about to leave the courtroom Friday, according to The Associated Press.

But he was eventually granted a voluntary departure order so the government can fly him to Honduras, where his father has already been sent.

The little boy, identified in court only as Johan, was one of the children who appeared in the Arizona court Friday without parents. One boy held up five fingers when the judge asked him his age.

Judge John Richardson said he was “embarrassed to ask” if Johan understood the proceedings, AP reported. “I don’t know who you would explain it to, unless you think that a 1-year-old could learn immigration law,” he told Johan’s attorney.

Immigration advocates have complained about children going to court, calling it stressful and frightening. There are no physical accommodations for children, many of whom can’t even see over defense tables without booster seats.

“There are no booster seats ... no teddy bears. It’s a cold immigration court, and these kids are sitting in chairs that are too big for them; their feet don’t even touch the floor,” immigration attorney Lindsay Toczlowski told CNN last month.

Johan, who was separated at the U.S. border from his dad under President Donald Trump’s zero tolerance immigration policy, is one of the more fortunate children because he at least has a court-appointed attorney. Not all of the children separated from their parents do.

Trump countermanded his own separation policy with an executive order he signed June 20. But now his administration is under court order to reunite children with families. 

Some 3,000 migrant children remain in government custody after being separated from their parents, and about 100 of them are under the age of 5, according to the Department of Health and Human Services. The New York Times has reported that some records on the separated families have been lost or even destroyed, raising the possibility that some children may never be reunited with their families. In addition, the U.S. has already deported at least 19 parents of children under the age of 5 and in federal custody.

A federal judge in San Diego ordered the Trump administration to reunite children under 5 with their parents within 14, and within 30 days for older children. The first deadline is July 10.

Lawyers for HHS asked for an extension last week — and argued that federal officials shouldn’t be required to reunite children with parents who have already been deported. Judge Dana Sabraw, who set the deadlines, is set to hold a hearing Monday on the extension request, but only in specific cases where the government can demonstrate that it’s necessary. He said Friday that the government must reunite children with their parents, even if the parents have already been deported.

A one-year old baby goes to Immigration Court.

I don't see how anyone can defend this kind of action.

Edited by Mario Kart
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Mario Kart said:

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/year-old-baby-appears-in-immigration-court_us_5b4290e3e4b07b827cc1e76c

A one-year old baby goes to Immigration Court.

I don't see how anyone can defend this kind of action.

ZERO TOLERANCE.

HE'S A CRIMINAL BECAUSE HE CROSSED THE BORDER ILLEGALLY.

IT'S ALL THE DEMOCRATS' FAULT!

FAKE NEWS.

MAGA.

HILLARY.....something.

I think that should about cover the list of arguments/defenses they've been provided.

Edited by Bayhawks
  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, jomar said:

the one year old isn't one of 'our' kids (read: white)

dammit!  How did I miss that one?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Godsbrother said:

I think Bayhawks and Jomar have it covered.

Let's assume they have the "excuses" covered. What will it Take for people to realize the Idiocy of these excuses? What will it take for People (mostly Repubs) to see the error of their ways?

The world is laughing at us and wondering how this, and other things, could happen. It's truly an Embarrassment and many Republicans relish in this. It's crazy.

Edited by Mario Kart
to capitalize random words so my writing looks more familiar to some readers.
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Mario Kart said:

Let's assume they have the "excuses" covered. What will it Take for people to realize the Idiocy of these excuses? What will it take for People (mostly Repubs) to see the error of their ways?

The world is laughing at us and wondering how this, and other things, could happen. It's truly an Embarrassment and many Republicans relish in this. It's crazy.

Trump represented the worst in our country. As a wise woman once called them - the deplorables.

Unfortunately, the deplorables now run this country. Their intolerance, hatred and ignorance are what propels our country's ideals. I still believe we will rise out of this muck someday but it's going to take a long time to recover from all the damage that's been done. 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think a lot of these children will end up in the hands of pedos. 

Very sad. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here are the responses I’ve gotten when discussing this issue with Trump supporters and Orange County conservatives: 

“Should we just let them all in then? Just have no borders at all?” 

“Trump’s methods are tough but it’s a tough situation. At least he’s trying something.” 

“These people come here and get free benefits from the government. We can’t afford it.” 

“Democrats want to get rid of ICE; they’re the extremists.” 

“What about that Steinle girl that was killed by an illegal? She was separated from her family- only permanently!” 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, timschochet said:

Here are the responses I’ve gotten when discussing this issue with Trump supporters and Orange County conservatives: 

“Should we just let them all in then? Just have no borders at all?” = Sad!

“Trump’s methods are tough but it’s a tough situation. At least he’s trying something.” = Sad!

“These people come here and get free benefits from the government. We can’t afford it.” = Sad! (we can most certainly afford it)

“Democrats want to get rid of ICE; they’re the extremists.” Sad! (ask them how long ICE has been around to see what answer you receive)

“What about that Steinle girl that was killed by an illegal? She was separated from her family- only permanently!” = Sad! (what about American murders just in the OC? And, they're worried about one incident with an illegal? Bigly Sad!)

This is a one-year old we're talking about. An infant! To see the excuses above answered in regards to infants/toddlers in immigration court... does not compare at all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
41 minutes ago, Gachi said:

I think a lot of these children will end up in the hands of pedos. 

Very sad. 

They’re already in the hands of an openly misogynistic sexual assaulter and his cronies. And 60 million Americans put them there.  

But at the same let’s not lose sight of what’s most important here: being civil towards the assaulter, his cronies and the 60 million Americans who put the fate children in their hands.  I’m sure if we politely serve them enough farm-to-table meals they’ll stop being horrible.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

They’re already in the hands of an openly misogynistic sexual assaulter and his cronies

It's not like the President consistently supports sexual assaulters.

Oh wait.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, The General said:

Greatest nation?

Getting greater everyday 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, packersfan said:

By making toddlers go to court?

PDFTT

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Trump is a terrible person and undoubtedly made this worse BUT - 

this has been going on for a while. Including during the Obama administration. Its disgusting.

Link

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Trumpers only care that these kids parents brought him here illegally and they have no concerns what happens to the kid as long as he gets taken out of the country.

It's the parents fault, end of story.  These people are so black and white in their thinking that reasoning with them is impossible.  I don't see very many people like that on this board (even among Trump supporters), but they flourish on other boards comprised of like minded individuals. 

SAD

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

illegally coming to the United States isn't a good thing - if the parents wouldn't do it, there would be no problems

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know how any human, no matter how much you believe in Trump, can support this. This isn't political; this is about right and wrong as people and what's being done to these children is criminal. It would be nice if Trump supporters could at least acknowledge that even while maintaining the belief that our immigration policies need to be improved (which is a completely valid position).

Sadly ...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

illegally coming to the United States isn't a good thing - if the parents wouldn't do it, there would be no problems

It’s a free country. People get to express differing opinions. No matter how appalling. 

I have to keep reminding myself of this.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, whoknew said:

Trump is a terrible person and undoubtedly made this worse BUT - 

this has been going on for a while. Including during the Obama administration. Its disgusting.

Link

:goodposting:

Don’t hate the playa , hate the game. So many just want to hate on Trump. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, James Daulton said:

Trumpers only care that these kids parents brought him here illegally and they have no concerns what happens to the kid as long as he gets taken out of the country.

It's the parents fault, end of story.  These people are so black and white in their thinking that reasoning with them is impossible.  I don't see very many people like that on this board (even among Trump supporters), but they flourish on other boards comprised of like minded individuals. 

SAD

 

These illegally here people have created the situation, and its a very difficult one that every administration has promised to fix and all have failed and its cost US taxpayers billions and the impact on US citizens is significant.

The solution is to 100% stop people from coming here illegally. We allow more than 1 million legal immigrants every year, I think that number can increase

“America is a nation of laws, which means I, as the president, am obligated to enforce the law. I don't have a choice about that. That's part of my job,”

Obama said that FYI, not Trump and read what Democrats have said about Illegally here people and immigration - tough talk, they just never actually delivered on any of it

 

https://gop.com/flashback-democrats-talked-tough-on-immigration-rsr/

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, rude classless thugs said:

It is not illegal to ask for asylum.

This is the problem at the border, they’ve been instructed to ask for asylum and that sets a chain of events in motion besides the :moneybag: asylum seekers get if approved 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, HellToupee said:

:goodposting:

Don’t hate the playa , hate the game. So many just want to hate on Trump. 

There's plenty of room to hate the system and hate Trump. He's a terrible, awful human being. 

But that doesn't mean this wasn't going on before Trump was President.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, rude classless thugs said:

It is not illegal to ask for asylum.

they could do that in Mexico or in any central American country too ... many children are muled 2,000 miles through harsh conditions that the left would call abuse in any other cases ............ the more I read, the more I blame Mexico for encouraging human trafficking as a business

its horrible and unacceptable and continuing to allow the southern border and illegally here people to be as it is, only encourages MORE human trafficking and the many issues that come from it

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

 

These illegally here people have created the situation, and its a very difficult one that every administration has promised to fix and all have failed and its cost US taxpayers billions and the impact on US citizens is significant.

The solution is to 100% stop people from coming here illegally. We allow more than 1 million legal immigrants every year, I think that number can increase

“America is a nation of laws, which means I, as the president, am obligated to enforce the law. I don't have a choice about that. That's part of my job,”

Obama said that FYI, not Trump and read what Democrats have said about Illegally here people and immigration - tough talk, they just never actually delivered on any of it

 

https://gop.com/flashback-democrats-talked-tough-on-immigration-rsr/

 

 

 

 

So I guess this is where we congratulate the GOP for being as bad as (at minimum) the party you vilify on a daily basis?  :oldunsure: 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Stealthycat said:

they could do that in Mexico or in any central American country too ... many children are muled 2,000 miles through harsh conditions that the left would call abuse in any other cases ............ the more I read, the more I blame Mexico for encouraging human trafficking as a business

its horrible and unacceptable and continuing to allow the southern border and illegally here people to be as it is, only encourages MORE human trafficking and the many issues that come from it

 

This is false. And you've been told previously that it was false. Yet you continue to state it. Why?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, whoknew said:

This is false. And you've been told previously that it was false. Yet you continue to state it. Why?

Doesn't fit the talking points :shrug: 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

Just now, whoknew said:

This is false. And you've been told previously that it was false. Yet you continue to state it. Why?

You've been told that it it absolutely ture - why do you continue to say it isn't?  You can go ANYWHERE illegally. That's 100% true.

Now, what is also true, is central American countries and Mexico etc have pretty hard immigration policies and they don't take kindly to people being in their country illegally, am I right ?

example

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/may/31/belize-central-america-refugees-immigration

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, HellToupee said:

This is the problem at the border, they’ve been instructed to ask for asylum and that sets a chain of events in motion besides the :moneybag: asylum seekers get if approved 

If approved. It is not automatic just because they ask for asylum at the border as you seem to suggest.

Asylum seekers in the UK, Germany and France all receive some sort of financial assistance if granted asylum, so the US policy is in line with these other nations.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Stealthycat said:

 

 

You've been told that it it absolutely ture - why do you continue to say it isn't?  You can go ANYWHERE illegally. That's 100% true.

Now, what is also true, is central American countries and Mexico etc have pretty hard immigration policies and they don't take kindly to people being in their country illegally, am I right ?

example

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/may/31/belize-central-america-refugees-immigration

Perhaps I misunderstood. I thought you were saying they could ask for asylum from the US at a US embassy in Mexico or Central America. If that's not what you were saying, then I apologize.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, whoknew said:

Perhaps I misunderstood. I thought you were saying they could ask for asylum from the US at a US embassy in Mexico or Central America. If that's not what you were saying, then I apologize.

well they can ask for whatever other countries give sure - but being in other countries illegally is what I meant

and it is a problem for other countries - they just have much harsher penalties, no sanctuary cities, and the benefits of being in those countries doesn't match what the US gives

 

come here legally or don't come here - the core problem is that

can the US have a better immigration system? yes - however we do allow over a million ever year to legally immigrate, that's a big burden we as taxpayers and citizens absorb and I think it could be more

but unlimited illegally here? no country does it, for good reasons

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, whoknew said:

Trump is a terrible person and undoubtedly made this worse BUT - 

this has been going on for a while. Including during the Obama administration. Its disgusting.

Link

No, it hasn’t. The “this” here is obviously proceedings for and deportation of small children who were brought across the border by their parents and have no idea what’s going on, not 15 year olds who crossed the border alone and were detained. The article in the OP is about a one year old.  That sort of thing is a consequence of recent policies like zero tolerance and family separation, not longstanding practices.

That doesn’t make either process ok and I think it’s great to bring light to both problems. But to compare and conflate the two and is way, way off.  All it does provides cover for the monsters who dictated the family separation policy and the [insert your choice of obvious adjective I can’t use in this forum] people who enable and support the monsters.  Just look at all the [insert adjective] people liking and citing to your inaccurate comparison.

Edited by TobiasFunke
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

instead of a hearing or proceedings would ya'll rather Trump's administration handle it like Obama's did ?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

instead of a hearing or proceedings would ya'll rather Trump's administration handle it like Obama's did ?

I guess you missed what was posted, which is copied below. Obama didn't separate the young children of asylum seekers from their parents pending the review of the asylum request.

Quote

The “this” here is obviously proceedings for and deportation of small children who were brought across the border by their parents and have no idea what’s going on, not 15 year olds who crossed the border alone and were detained. The article in the OP is about a one year old.  That sort of thing is a consequence of recent policies like zero tolerance and family separation, not longstanding practices.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, rude classless thugs said:

I guess you missed what was posted, which is copied below. Obama didn't separate the young children of asylum seekers from their parents pending the review of the asylum request.

please watch this - thoughts ?

https://www.facebook.com/WhiteHouse/videos/1719760358111690/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, rude classless thugs said:

I don't have time to watch every link to a YouTube and Facebook video. Summarize what the video says and the point the Facebook poster is trying to make.

it explains the process

 

look, Obama's administration arrested a LOT of illegally here people, didn't they ? and if they had kids with them .... what do ya'll think happened? you think those kids were sent to jail with the parents?

this issue of separating kids is what happens - it happens to the US citizens when CPS says the parents are abusing or unfit, it happens when parents / guardians break the law and are jailed - that's how it works

its also how it worked under Obama

this news about it being new with Trump is all lies - it IS new that Trump has a zero tolerance policy and if you're illegally here,  you're going to go to jail and be processed until the authorities know the situation and if you have kids with you? then you knew the risk dragging them 2,000 miles and all the dangers and abuse and such which probably in many cases warrants the Child Abuse stamp in and of itsself

please, PLEASE come here legally and all the problems with illegally here disappear

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, TobiasFunke said:

No, it hasn’t. The “this” here is obviously proceedings for and deportation of small children who were brought across the border by their parents and have no idea what’s going on, not 15 year olds who crossed the border alone and were detained. The article in the OP is about a one year old.  That sort of thing is a consequence of recent policies like zero tolerance and family separation, not longstanding practices.

That doesn’t make either process ok and I think it’s great to bring light to both problems. But to compare and conflate the two and is way, way off.  All it does provides cover for the monsters who dictated the family separation policy and the [insert your choice of obvious adjective I can’t use in this forum] people who enable and support the monsters.  Just look at all the [insert adjective] people liking and citing to your inaccurate comparison.

It didn't happen on this scale for sure. But it did happen. Immigration courts are ####ed up. Trump has certainly made it way, way worse. But it was bad before him too.

Can a 3 year old represent herself in immigration court? This judge thinks so.

From far down in the article - 

 

According to Justice Department figures, 42 percent of the more than 20,000 unaccompanied children involved in deportation proceedings completed between July 2014 and late December had no attorney. It is unclear how often children 5 or younger are forced to defend themselves, but attorneys and advocates for immigrants said it does happen.

Senate Minority Leader Harry M. Reid (D-Nev.) and other Democrats this month introduced a bill mandating government-appointed counsel for children in immigration court who had crossed the border alone or are victims of other duress such as abuse, torture or violence. In a Feb. 11 speech on the Senate floor, Reid said he was told about one case in which a 5-year-old girl was brought before an immigration judge.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Stealthycat said:

illegally coming to the United States isn't a good thing - if the parents wouldn't do it, there would be no problems

So I take it that if you committed a crime, you'd be okay with your 1-year old child having to represent himself/herself in court, with regards to his/her placement in the child services system?

Edited by Bayhawks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Stealthycat said:

 

These illegally here people have created the situation, and its a very difficult one that every administration has promised to fix and all have failed and its cost US taxpayers billions and the impact on US citizens is significant.

The solution is to 100% stop people from coming here illegally. We allow more than 1 million legal immigrants every year, I think that number can increase

“America is a nation of laws, which means I, as the president, am obligated to enforce the law. I don't have a choice about that. That's part of my job,”

Obama said that FYI, not Trump and read what Democrats have said about Illegally here people and immigration - tough talk, they just never actually delivered on any of it

 

https://gop.com/flashback-democrats-talked-tough-on-immigration-rsr/

 

 

 

 

So, if as POtuS, Trump is obligated to enforce the law, why does he continue to tweet about breaking it by saying we should deny due process?

no Judges or Court Cases

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

it explains the process

 

look, Obama's administration arrested a LOT of illegally here people, didn't they ? and if they had kids with them .... what do ya'll think happened? you think those kids were sent to jail with the parents?

this issue of separating kids is what happens - it happens to the US citizens when CPS says the parents are abusing or unfit, it happens when parents / guardians break the law and are jailed - that's how it works

its also how it worked under Obama

No, Obama never separated asylum seekers from their children pending review of their claim for asylum. That is a new policy Jeff Session, under Trump, implemented.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, HellToupee said:

This is the problem at the border, they’ve been instructed to ask for asylum and that sets a chain of events in motion besides the :moneybag: asylum seekers get if approved 

So, if they come across the border without asking for asylum, that's the problem b/c they are breaking the law; but at the same time, if they request asylum at the border and follow the law, that's also the problem?

OK.:rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, whoknew said:

This is false. And you've been told previously that it was false. Yet you continue to state it. Why?

ETA-Never mind, someone else beat me to it.

Edited by Bayhawks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
44 minutes ago, Stealthycat said:

this news about it being new with Trump is all lies - it IS new that Trump has a zero tolerance policy and if you're illegally here,  you're going to go to jail and be processed until the authorities know the situation and if you have kids with you? then you knew the risk dragging them 2,000 miles and all the dangers and abuse and such which probably in many cases warrants the Child Abuse stamp in and of itsself

please, PLEASE come here legally and all the problems with illegally here disappear

 

The lack of empathy in this passage is astounding.  You also keep ignoring that seeking asylum qualifies as coming here legally.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.