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WSOP Main Event - Hellmuth controversy

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12 hours ago, gianmarco said:

That's why you aren't supposed to discuss an ongoing hand nor act out of turn. You may influence a player to call or fold when they otherwise wouldn't.  That's why the rule is in place. If you are heads up, then it's fair game, but not with others in a pot.

THIS. Whether it's a home game or WSOP ME, it's just good poker etiquette to wait your turn before acting or somehow implying what your intentions might be (moving your cards towards the muck pile, etc.). 

Also agree that Helmuth almost certainly did this intentionally. 

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4 hours ago, Getzlaf15 said:

Phil's actually really good at razz and mixed games.  His razz record lately is pretty sick.  

It's odd that the guy he played heads up against last night quit shoving all in and started playing Phil small ball with him. 

My first wsop cash was ten years ago in a horse.  Phil finished third in that.  I've never played with him. He's been at the next table several times. I would love to 3 bet him to death and get him to tilt.  

awesome :) How many cashes do you have Getzlaf?

-QG

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I wonder if Phil actually paid this from his own pocket or if one of his sponsors paid it for him? Phil has been taking a lot of heat over his high pricing of his selling pieces of his action lately too, so he can use some good PR.

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2 hours ago, jvdesigns2002 said:

Do people think that Helmuth knowingly showed emotion before it was his turn to act on purpose or do most believe that he just brainfarted and reacted  forgetting (or not thinking) there was another live hand in front of him?   If it was a brain fart moment- I think people are piling on way too hard. Even professional athletes have brain fart moments and all they can do is their best to make things right. I think him paying for a buy in next year is plenty enough. 

Helmuth had no control in if the wsop should or shouldn’t punish him. I play lots of poker and I’ve accidentally acted out of line before. It’s not a common thing but I assure you that every poker player has done it.

This

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actually kind of surprised it doesn't happen to Phil more....he likes to think its all about him....especially if he is in a hand....everybody else are the back up dancers....

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2 hours ago, jvdesigns2002 said:

Do people think that Helmuth knowingly showed emotion before it was his turn to act on purpose or do most believe that he just brainfarted and reacted  forgetting (or not thinking) there was another live hand in front of him?   If it was a brain fart moment- I think people are piling on way too hard. Even professional athletes have brain fart moments and all they can do is their best to make things right. I think him paying for a buy in next year is plenty enough. 

Helmuth had no control in if the wsop should or shouldn’t punish him. I play lots of poker and I’ve accidentally acted out of line before. It’s not a common thing but I assure you that every poker player has done it.

It was a brain-fart, but it's really weird  that someone who has played that much poker had that strong of an emotional reaction to a pretty standard situation. 

Agree with all that it's gauche, but is there a concrete WSOP rule that pertains to this?

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Posted (edited)

16 minutes ago, Good Posting Judge said:

It was a brain-fart, but it's really weird  that someone who has played that much poker had that strong of an emotional reaction to a pretty standard situation. 

Agree with all that it's gauche, but is there a concrete WSOP rule that pertains to this?

:yes:

Here you go from the video I posted earlier.

Edited by gianmarco

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12 minutes ago, Good Posting Judge said:

It was a brain-fart, but it's really weird  that someone who has played that much poker had that strong of an emotional reaction to a pretty standard situation. 

Agree with all that it's gauche, but is there a concrete WSOP rule that pertains to this?

That's a pretty big reach. Maybe there's some editing for TV, but he insta min-raises Kuzmin's open. I find it highly unlikely that he forgot Kuzmin was in the hand, unless Campbell tanked for a very long time before the all-in. As shown on TV, I would say it's very unlikely this was a brain fart.

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2 hours ago, Getzlaf15 said:

If you look at the video link posted last night, he doesn't appear to acknowledge that the guy on the right is in the hand. Totally looking the other way at the all in guy.  Just Phil getting emotional.  In his rant, you can faintly hear something to the effect that this is the 15th time that guy has done that move.  

Agreed, but he also shut it down pretty quickly when he realized he screwed up.

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22 minutes ago, gianmarco said:

Aw thanks man I didn't get that far into the video because my parents were killed by a gang of dudes with faux-hawks and that makes it tough to look at Polk.

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I think it was a brain fart and he realized his mistake right away.  At least he was in the hand.  I hate it when guys who fold pre flop blurt out "can I have my cards back" or "why did I fold" after the flop comes out.  One time at my local casino I 4 bet pre flop with pocket aces and had one caller.  Flop was K-K-5 and some jackass at the table said "I can't believe I folded a king!".  I was pissed, but I wasn't sure if caller heard him so I didn't bring it up.  They guy beat me with Ace King, knowing I couldn't of had a King if he heard the guy.  Super bs

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7 minutes ago, Don't Noonan said:

I think it was a brain fart and he realized his mistake right away.  At least he was in the hand.  I hate it when guys who fold pre flop blurt out "can I have my cards back" or "why did I fold" after the flop comes out.  One time at my local casino I 4 bet pre flop with pocket aces and had one caller.  Flop was K-K-5 and some jackass at the table said "I can't believe I folded a king!".  I was pissed, but I wasn't sure if caller heard him so I didn't bring it up.  They guy beat me with Ace King, knowing I couldn't of had a King if he heard the guy.  Super bs

That stinks, but that other guy wasn't folding AK no matter what. 

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Posted (edited)

4 minutes ago, msudaisy26 said:

That stinks, but that other guy wasn't folding AK no matter what. 

true, he may of had king queen but still the same

Edited by Don't Noonan

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Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, QuizGuy66 said:

awesome :) How many cashes do you have Getzlaf?

-QG

5.    Six on Friday night.  They had 400 in this event last year.  Not sure what to expect this year with all the added tournaments after the Main. 

At the airport now. Expect to start right at the beginning of level 3 with 60 bb. 

Edited by Getzlaf15
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Now that there is a political forum, poker threads definitely in the running for the worst in the FFA.

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8 minutes ago, JuniorGong said:

Now that there is a political forum, poker threads definitely in the running for the worst in the FFA.

If only there was a way to avoid poker threads...

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4 minutes ago, JuniorGong said:

Now that there is a political forum, poker threads definitely in the running for the worst in the FFA.

So is your face. 

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7 minutes ago, JuniorGong said:

Now that there is a political forum, poker threads definitely in the running for the worst in the FFA.

All one of them?

Damn, I feel sorry for you

:(

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47 minutes ago, Getzlaf15 said:

5.    Six on Friday night.  They had 400 in this event last year.  Not sure what to expect this year with all the added tournaments after the Main. 

At the airport now. Expect to start right at the beginning of level 3 with 60 bb. 

Good luck :)  Somehow I have managed 2 cashes myself (Out of a total of 3 events ever played - blew my perfect record last year).  Both were minimal though.  Obviously there is also Assani who has a dozen cashes according to the WSOP site.  Anyone keeping a notebook?  Anyway win those $$$ :)

-QG

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Looked up myself on the site it shows my circuit event min-cash as a third - but that one don't count for my purposes.  All 12 of Assani's are in bracelet events.

-QG

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Just now, QuizGuy66 said:

Looked up myself on the site it shows my circuit event min-cash as a third - but that one don't count for my purposes.  All 12 of Assani's are in bracelet events.

-QG

I have 4 wsop. One circuit last December in LA.  I count it. All those guys are here in Vegas.  The winner in December won the 2500. Om8 stud 8 mix a few weeks ago. 

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13 minutes ago, Getzlaf15 said:

I have 4 wsop. One circuit last December in LA.  I count it. All those guys are here in Vegas.  The winner in December won the 2500. Om8 stud 8 mix a few weeks ago. 

Actually have a sick story from a circuit event I played (not sure if it's the one I min-cashed in).  Post-elimination I'm in the Harrah's food court thing and overheard this guy basically beating himself up over his play to the point where he said that he shouldn't even have the circuit ring he won he sucked so bad.  I can't remember if he was on the phone - I'm thinking he might have been, hell maybe we were talking - the mind gets foggy.  But the one detail I'll never forget - as I turned back to the counter to get/order my food I heard a very solid "THUD" from the direction of where he was standing which was over by the garbage can.  Pretty sure that he had actually chucked the ring.

-QG

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Posted (edited)

Hopefully I'll be in a better position financially next year to play one of the online bracelet events from home if I can't go all the way to Vega$.  Took a swing at many of the freerolls (as well as for their Sunday 100k games)  but couldn't do better than a 3rd.

As for Hellmuth - whether it's a free pub game or a $10k talking out of turn is definitely a foul and a penalty would be appropriate (and if others were weren't penalized for doing it so much the worse).  At least a warning - but given the point in the tourney and his own track record a straight penalty would be reasonable.  He did do his best to make good (he says he penalized himself by skipping the first level of the next day of the Main Event) but it would be best if he finally took that tool out of his toolbox. 

Overall he's good for the game - can't have everyone be a boring droid.  That's why he's always on feature tables.  On a related but different note was Hellmuth implying that Ivey was able to say no to being put on feature tables (whether by coincidence or for sake of appearances Ivey was on feature table the next day).  Ivey asserted that the tv tables hurt his game b/c players don't want to look like a fool calling him (whether it's true or not is debatable).  Him being able to say no is b.s. but I can see perhaps the WSOP allowing there to be a limit to how many times in the early days they can put someone on the tv tables.  There's enough personalities that they should be able to do something like that.

-QG

Edited by QuizGuy66

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I beat Assani heads up for $1.3mm. He's destitute now.

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No idea why people get those hair transplants. Just shave the thing.

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Posted (edited)

Flight was delayed a bit.  Started in middle of round 4 with 15000.  Have 17000 at the break.  Winning at stud high is new, exciting and promising. 

No one I know at my table. 

 

Edited by Getzlaf15
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15 minutes ago, Getzlaf15 said:

Flight was delayed a bit.  Started in middle of round 4 with 15000.  Have 17000 at the break.  Winning at stud high is new, exciting and promising. 

No one I know at my table. 

 

Good Luck!

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Man, what was Manion thinking there?

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25k

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Main final table is like 50 yards from me and it's crazy loud in here. 

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But it just got crazy louder.

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Went down to 18, back up to 24.   Son tells me Phil and Daniel just entered the tourney.  

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7 hours ago, Don't Noonan said:

I think it was a brain fart and he realized his mistake right away.  At least he was in the hand.  I hate it when guys who fold pre flop blurt out "can I have my cards back" or "why did I fold" after the flop comes out.  One time at my local casino I 4 bet pre flop with pocket aces and had one caller.  Flop was K-K-5 and some jackass at the table said "I can't believe I folded a king!".  I was pissed, but I wasn't sure if caller heard him so I didn't bring it up.  They guy beat me with Ace King, knowing I couldn't of had a King if he heard the guy.  Super bs

Probably my former roommate.

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 19100 after level six. 

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7 hours ago, Mr.Pack said:

Agreed, but he also shut it down pretty quickly when he realized he screwed up.

Right.  I actually think this was a genuine mistake on his part (not him whining, but him whining without realizing first position was still in the hand). 

 

A few years ago Phil Ivey mucked a one card flush for the winning hand. I remember thinking, "wow, even the pros make mistakes."

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Holy #### you're STILL talking about the Hellmuth thing?  :lmao:

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16600. Been card dead

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What an awful round that was. Stick card dead except for losing two close razz hands.  8k.  Time for a heater. 

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Posted (edited)

Stud high.  Ace high flush on 6th.   River 3 for opponent makes a boat and I'm out on a 20k pot. 

Edited by Getzlaf15
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Any updates Getzlaf?

-QG

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